Author Topic: For the edification of the forum members  (Read 2856 times)

makattak

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For the edification of the forum members
« on: March 08, 2011, 11:49:19 AM »
http://www.thefiscaltimes.com/Columns/2011/03/08/Social-Security-5-Enduring-Myths-that-Must-Go.aspx

Social Security myths that need to be faced.


Of course, looking at the comments of that article, plenty of people are quite willing to believe the lies errr, myths.
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HankB

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2011, 12:45:57 PM »
Another viewpoint . . .

http://assetbuilder.com/blogs/scott_burns/archive/2011/02/18/making-things-right.aspx

Fed.gov has been borrowing SS funds for decades, and spending the money on other things.

But they've left IOUs behind. Now the IOUs are beginning to come due. In theory, from the viewpoint of SS, there are enough IOUs to be redeemed to keep paying contributors until 2037.

However, Fed.gov is finding it hard to pay back what they've borrowed.

So Fed.gov is blaming SS for their fiscal hardship, and wants to stiff the contributors. So they can keep spending on everything from the Rock & Roll museum to Obama's night on the town. Part of the strategy is to cut benefits so as to keep a positive cash flow in SS so they can keep borrowing funds they never mean to repay.

Makes perfect sense . . .  :facepalm:
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MechAg94

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2011, 06:05:10 PM »
Aren't there also a lot of money payouts that are rolled into Social Security in addition to just retired people? 

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Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #3 on: March 08, 2011, 06:50:31 PM »
Another viewpoint . . .

http://assetbuilder.com/blogs/scott_burns/archive/2011/02/18/making-things-right.aspx

Fed.gov has been borrowing SS funds for decades, and spending the money on other things.

But they've left IOUs behind. Now the IOUs are beginning to come due. In theory, from the viewpoint of SS, there are enough IOUs to be redeemed to keep paying contributors until 2037.

However, Fed.gov is finding it hard to pay back what they've borrowed.

So Fed.gov is blaming SS for their fiscal hardship, and wants to stiff the contributors. So they can keep spending on everything from the Rock & Roll museum to Obama's night on the town. Part of the strategy is to cut benefits so as to keep a positive cash flow in SS so they can keep borrowing funds they never mean to repay.

Makes perfect sense . . .  :facepalm:
Functionally, this works out as deferred taxation.  The IOUs held buy the SS "trust" fund aren't assets with real value, they represent a claim on the future income of working age taxpayers.  It's an accounting gimmick that lets the older generations enrich themselves at the expense of the younger generations.

Scout26

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #4 on: March 08, 2011, 08:05:28 PM »
I thought it was they took money out of the left pocket (and left an IOU), then put the money in the right pocket to pay for hookers and blow.

And Bernie Madoff is the one in jail ?
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sanglant

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2011, 12:56:31 AM »
he figured it out, and tried to run his own racket, mobsters hate having novices messing in they're turf. [tinfoil]

kgbsquirrel

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2011, 02:50:11 AM »
he figured it out, and tried to run his own racket, mobsters hate having novices messing in they're turf. [tinfoil]


HankB

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2011, 09:49:31 AM »
Functionally, this works out as deferred taxation.  The IOUs held buy the SS "trust" fund aren't assets with real value, they represent a claim on the future income of working age taxpayers.  It's an accounting gimmick that lets the older generations enrich themselves at the expense of the younger generations.
Makes one wonder how much of the funds contributed by older generations and "borrowed" by fed.gov were ultimately spent on programs (education, WIC, AFDC, CHIP, food stamps, etc, heck, even basic long-lived infrastructure like roads, bridges, and parks) that benefitted the younger generations.
Trump won in 2016. Democrats haven't been so offended since Republicans came along and freed their slaves.
Sometimes I wonder if the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on, or by imbeciles who really mean it. - Mark Twain
Government is a broker in pillage, and every election is a sort of advance auction in stolen goods. - H.L. Mencken
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it. - Mark Twain

longeyes

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2011, 10:56:23 AM »
Quote
Makes one wonder how much of the funds contributed by older generations and "borrowed" by fed.gov were ultimately spent on programs (education, WIC, AFDC, CHIP, food stamps, etc, heck, even basic long-lived infrastructure like roads, bridges, and parks) that benefitted the younger generations.

+1

The transfers work both ways.  The real problem is the government's arrogation to itself of the power and right to move all of the chips around the table at will.
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Headless Thompson Gunner

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Re: For the edification of the forum members
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2011, 11:09:21 AM »
Makes one wonder how much of the funds contributed by older generations and "borrowed" by fed.gov were ultimately spent on programs (education, WIC, AFDC, CHIP, food stamps, etc, heck, even basic long-lived infrastructure like roads, bridges, and parks) that benefitted the younger generations.

It's true that parents support their children while they grow up, just as their parents did for them, and their grandparents did for their parents.  Such is the usual order of things.  To the extent that these government programs you mention provide resources that would otherwise fall to parents to pay for, then the parents are the ones who benefit by not having to pony up.

If you (or anyone else) mean to imply that it's OK to "indebt" your children to pay for their upbringing, then I think you're mistaken.  First off because most of the money "borrowed" from the youngsters through SS went to stuff unrelated to their childhood, and thus isn't applicable.  But even if we assume that it is, that there's some magical system whereby children can pay their own way through childhood by borrowing against their future, this idea still falls flat.  To have your upbringing funded by your parents (as has happened from the beginning of time through the present) and yet demand that your children fund themselves (after the advent of this magical borrowing system) is to shirk your responsibility.

Mathematically, there must be one child rearing effort funded for each generation that lives.  Every generation is obligated to fund one round themselves. Whether we choose to pay it forward by paying for the rearing of our children, or pay it ourselves through some sort of borrowing scheme, it ultimately doesn't matter so long as each generation pays for one round of child rearing.  What this borrowing scheme represents is a way for the older generation alive today neither paying for themselves nor their children.  They will pay for none and leave it to others to make up their shortfall.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 11:27:43 AM by Headless Thompson Gunner »