Children banned from shooting events in 2012 ticket giveaway

[MicroBalrog]

London schoolchildren are eligible for 125,000 Olympic tickets but these will not include any featuring guns, as Games organisers and City Hall fear a backlash from the anti-gun lobby.

Ladies and gentlemen, the Eloi Breeding Program enters its final phase. After we have prohibited our youth from handling guns, we will now prohibit them from actually looking at guns.

[P5 Guy]

How much longer will shooting sports be tolerated in Olympic Competition?

[AZRedhawk44]

Nevermind that the Olympics are a primitive martial competition to begin with.  Javelin, shot put, discus, wrestling, archery, tae kwon do, judo, boxing, fencing, et cetera.

[Monkeyleg]

Are children allowed to watch war, cop or action movies? Are gun scenes cut?

My guess is that the answer is no, so they're allowed to see guns used in violence, but not in civilized competition.

[MicroBalrog]

Well, Monkeyleg.

Reasonable people will suggest some forms of violence should be encouraged and accept-

Who am I kidding?

[birdman]

Ladies and gentlemen, the Eloi Breeding Program enters its final phase. After we have prohibited our youth from handling guns, we will now prohibit them from actually looking at guns.

Shhh....don't let them know about the breeding program.

[RoadKingLarry]

don't let them know about the breeding program.

As long as they get their TV programs and their social services aren't cut too deeply they won't care.
If a bunch of them decide they need more "stuf" they just work up a flash mob and go take what ever they want.
Since the government won't/can't stop them it probably may be a viable alternative to increasing social services and handouts anyway.

[HankB]

Nevermind that the Olympics are a primitive martial competition to begin with.  Javelin, shot put, discus, wrestling, archery, tae kwon do, judo, boxing, fencing, et cetera.

And what of the subjectively-judged activities (I WON'T dignify them with the label "sports") such as figure skating, synchronized swimming, ski jumping (which has "style points"), rhythymic gymnastics, diving, etc.?

Silliness.

Many of the participants display genuine athleticism,  but they're certainly not competitive sports in any rational sense.

[MicroBalrog]

THe Olympics is nothing but a traditionalized sports event, brought down almost to the level of ritual by the participants. There's no point about arguing whether event X or event Y should have been included.

You've all should have seen this coming when they refused to include IPSC as a demonstration event a few years back.

[T.O.M.]

Back when I was in college, a friend wrote an essay about how someday, the PC-types would rule the world, and even gun-related language would be banned.  Phrases like "going off half-cocked,"  "the whole 9 yeards", and such would be banned as offensivly violent language.  The lib prof flunked him on the paper, of course.  Now...maybe a prediction for the future?

[wmenorr67]

Heaven forbid that the children realize that guns can be and are used to do things that aren't criminal and don't hurt people.

Now is this ban just for Brits or will all children be banned from attending live?

But Danny Bryan, founder of Communities Against Gun and Knife Crime said: "I agree with Boris. It is good kids should enjoy the Games but there's no way we should glorify guns."

So they can't go to the fencing competitions either.  That would just glorify swoards.

And I see it just pertains to the "free" tickets.

[AZRedhawk44]

Back when I was in college, a friend wrote an essay about how someday, the PC-types would rule the world, and even gun-related language would be banned.  Phrases like "going off half-cocked,"  "the whole 9 yeards", and such would be banned as offensivly violent language.  The lib prof flunked him on the paper, of course.  Now...maybe a prediction for the future?

How is "the whole 9 yards" a violent phrase?

[Perd Hapley]

How is "the whole 9 yards" a violent phrase?

Yeah. Last I knew, it referred to a mix-truck-load of cement.

[HankB]

How is "the whole 9 yards" a violent phrase?

There are a couple of explanations of the origin of this phrase dating back to the age of sail, but the most common explanation today is that nine yards was reputedly the length of the ammo belt in a WWII fighter . . . IIRC, a P-51 Mustang.

[AZRedhawk44]

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/the-whole-nine-yards.html

Interesting read.

[freakazoid]

I've always heard it explained as the ammo belt one.

[birdman]

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/the-whole-nine-yards.html

Interesting read.

Interesting read, but the author (being a literary person) looked for the instances in print, rather than an obvious method which was to see if any of the possibilities (e.g. Ammo belt) actually WERE 9 yards.

For example, according to Wikipedia, the inner two M2's on a p-51D had 400 rounds of ammunition each, the outer four guns 270 rnds  The base diameter of a 50BMG is about 0.8" and in a belt they are 0.4" apart.  400 rounds is thus 480" and 270 rounds, 270-324".  Since 9 yards is 324", it seems REALLY FREAKIN COINCIDENTAL that the p-51's were carrying around 9 yards of ammo for 2/3rds of their armament, and since all the guns fired, the "whole nine yards" meant the outer guns would be dry. (btw, the spitfire used 303cal belts and 20mm drums, so that doesn't work).  Since none of the other explanations actually match up, why not conclude print is dumb and the most used explanation is actually the real one? 

[MicroBalrog]

Ban reversed.

[makattak]

Interesting read, but the author (being a literary person) looked for the instances in print, rather than an obvious method which was to see if any of the possibilities (e.g. Ammo belt) actually WERE 9 yards.

For example, according to Wikipedia, the inner two M2's on a p-51D had 400 rounds of ammunition each, the outer four guns 270 rnds  The base diameter of a 50BMG is about 0.8" and in a belt they are 0.4" apart.  400 rounds is thus 480" and 270 rounds, 270-324".  Since 9 yards is 324", it seems REALLY FREAKIN COINCIDENTAL that the p-51's were carrying around 9 yards of ammo for 2/3rds of their armament, and since all the guns fired, the "whole nine yards" meant the outer guns would be dry. (btw, the spitfire used 303cal belts and 20mm drums, so that doesn't work).  Since none of the other explanations actually match up, why not conclude print is dumb and the most used explanation is actually the real one? 

For the term not to appear in print for twenty years after it's supposed coinage is a rather damning critique of that theory.

With the myriad of reports, memoirs and books written about WWII, isn't it rather likely the term would have turned up in at least one of them?

[wmenorr67]

Ban reversed.

Looks like some Brits still have common sense.

[birdman]

For the term not to appear in print for twenty years after it's supposed coinage is a rather damning critique of that theory.

With the myriad of reports, memoirs and books written about WWII, isn't it rather likely the term would have turned up in at least one of them?

How many of the memoirs were written by p-51 pilots between 1946 and 1964?  It's entirely possible that they used the term among themselves, and their children or others picked it up and used it in the vernacular of the day much later...perhaps they felt it was inappropriate to use as a metaphor?  Who knows.  My point isn't that the p-51 answer IS the right one, but it, coincidentally is the only one of the explanations that actually matches the saying (unlike the spitfire one, the cement one, and the tailor one)...so rather than discount it's introduction by literary search, why not assume that the missing information is on the literary side, rather than on the origin.

[wmenorr67]

One thing that makes more sense is that back in the day sails were made of 3 yards of cloth and if all three sails were up you were giving it the "whole nine yards."

[RoadKingLarry]

One problem with the sail reference is that sails weren't exactly standard sizes. That, and a sail made from only 3 yards of canvas would be a pretty small sail.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yard_(sailing)

[makattak]

How many of the memoirs were written by p-51 pilots between 1946 and 1964?  It's entirely possible that they used the term among themselves, and their children or others picked it up and used it in the vernacular of the day much later...perhaps they felt it was inappropriate to use as a metaphor?  Who knows.  My point isn't that the p-51 answer IS the right one, but it, coincidentally is the only one of the explanations that actually matches the saying (unlike the spitfire one, the cement one, and the tailor one)...so rather than discount it's introduction by literary search, why not assume that the missing information is on the literary side, rather than on the origin.

Because a "just so" story that sounds good without any other evidence doesn't make for a likely explanation.

I'll bet there are P-51 pilots still alive. (Not many.) Someone should ask them if they used that phrase during the war.

Further, how many of the memoirs afterwards made use of that phrase? If they had coined it, wouldn't one of them have used the phrase in its intended usage in biographies or other accounts?

For example, I've read Joe Foss's biography, who flew the P-51 after the war. (He flew other planes in WWII.) No use of that phrase at all.   

[T.O.M.]

Okay.  I take it back.  They won't ban "the whole nine yards."  Didn't mean to start a debate as to the etymology of the phrase, just commenting on how stupid trying to ban anything relating to firearms is.