Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Desertdog on December 02, 2008, 10:31:33 PM
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I would be posting this on THR but they are down. They seem to be doing it right this time, one lady suing and now bombarding the idiots in the capital.
Texas gun law battle brewing over 'open carry' proposal
Anna M. Tinsley | Fort Worth Star-Telegam
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/104/story/56729.html
They're setting their sights on Texas and coming out firing.
More than a month before the legislative session starts Jan. 13, gun-rights supporters are asking state lawmakers to pass an "open carry" law to let Texans stop covering up the guns they carry and wear them openly.
They are putting their message on billboards, on banners on cabs and in radio ads, asking others to sign on to the cause.
"We are targeting Texas," said Mike Stollenwerk, co-founder of www.opencarry.org, a champion of the growing nationwide effort. "Texas is probably the most pro-gun state, but doesn’t have open-carry laws.
"As Texans realize how restrictive their rights are . . . there will be an awakening. Get ready for a showdown in Austin come January."
Texas is somewhat of an open-carry battleground because it is one of only six states where handguns cannot, in some form, legally be worn in plain view. Texas residents may carry concealed handguns if they have a permit.
More than 28,000 people have signed an online petition asking Gov. Rick Perry and the Legislature to make Texas an open-carry state.
"The only place we are spending money is Texas," said Stollenwerk, who owns a home in Killeen. "Who knows if we’ll be successful? But at least it’s on the agenda."
Some fear that pushing for open carry could bring more problems than solutions.
"What are they trying to do?" Richard Leal of Texans for Gun Safety Laws told the Star-Telegram earlier this year. "Go back to Texas gunslinger days?"
Upcoming battle
When lawmakers get back to work in January, it will have been 14 years since they passed a concealed-carry law.
Supporters say open carry is needed because under the concealed-carry law, gun owners can get in trouble for displaying their weapon even inadvertently, such as if a jacket covering it up blows back enough to show the gun.
"I want to be able to remove my suit jacket in the middle of a hot Texas August day without being labeled a criminal," said Ralph Carroll, who lives in Van Zandt County and works in Dallas. "I can drive east or west one state over, remove my jacket in the heat of the day and still be a perfectly legal citizen. But that same act in Texas will brand me a criminal — for no reason other than I live in Texas."
The other states that either don’t allow, or highly restrict, the open carrying of handguns in public are New York, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Florida and South Carolina, according to OpenCarry.org.
More than a dozen states require a license for open carry, and 11 more allow it but don’t require licenses. Other states generally permit it, but with various restrictions.
Stollenwerk said a draft of a bill to allow open carry in Texas has been prepared.
While several Texas lawmakers have said they’ll support such a bill, none have stepped up to carry it.
"This is crunchtime before the session starts," Stollenwerk said. "If no legislator steps forward, we will try to amend a bill midstream to get it in somewhere."
Reaching out
OpenCarry.org kicks off its Texas campaign Tuesday with the message "We don’t hide our colors, do we?" in Fort Worth, Dallas, Houston, San Antonio and Austin.
The ad encourages Texans to sign an online petition asking lawmakers to make Texas an open-carry state.
"We believe that law-abiding Texans should be free to proudly enforce their rights," the radio ad states.
Ian McCarthy of Dallas posted the online petition in November 2007. He said he forgot about it until www.opencarry.org picked up the effort this summer, and thousands of Texans began signing.
"It was just me trying to reach out to people," he said.
Carroll, a 48-year-old father of three, said many people’s fears about the concealed-carry law — shootouts at four-way stop signs, mayhem in the streets — haven’t come to pass. Similar fears about an open-carry law won’t either, he said.
"I just simply want to ensure I have self-protection if the need arises," Carroll said. "The same reason I wear my seat belt, carry a spare tire and have a working fire extinguisher."
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Open carry Learn more about open carry or sign a petition urging Texas lawmakers to consider it at http://www.opencarry.org
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Texas is probably the most pro-gun state
That should set off ManedWolf pretty good. :lol:
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Pity the honorable Suzanna Gratia-Hupp is not still in the legislature.
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Texas is probably the most pro-gun state
According to whom? Texans? =D
Apparently a kicker needs to get out more. ;/
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That should set off ManedWolf pretty good. :lol:
No, that's just silly. They can't even open carry. They have to qualify for their CCW. How can they be a pro-gun state?
That's like calling New York City a pro-gun city.
Some Texans need to be sure they have some cattle in their field before putting on the big hat.
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Having grown up in Chicago, gone to grad school in New York, and worked in Minnesota, I have to say YES, Texas is a pro-gun state . . . though we are having problems with too many damnyankees and Kalifornians moving in. (Yes, I AM aware of the irony contained in that sentence! :laugh: )
The TX CHL law is generally good (not as good as Vermont, Alaska, Utah, etc.) and has been improved since its original passage. And if you're so inclined, you can own SBRs, full auto, suppressors, etc., with the Federal restrictions and cost being the big hurdles. We have a decent Castle Doctrine law on the books, and if a defensive gun use should occur, the law tends to favor the good guy rather than the bad guy . . . as do Texas juries, much to the dismay of the occasional DA with left-leaning political motives.
Unless you're legally prohibited (e.g., you're a convicted felon) or are involved in another crime, it's legal to carry a loaded, accessible firearm in your vehicle without a license.
The qualification for a CHL is an annoyance, as is the RE-qualification at renewal time . . . but as a small consolation, jumping through these hoops lets you skip the NICS check when you buy a gun from a dealer. And the CHL satisfies one of the requirements to buy a rifle through the CMP. (Take THAT, Alaska and Vermont!)
I'm licensed to carry concealed, and I support open carry, PRIMARILY because inadvertently breaking concealment MAY cause a problem, as stated earlier in this thread.
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I'm licensed to carry concealed, and I support open carry, PRIMARILY because inadvertently breaking concealment MAY cause a problem, as stated earlier in this thread.
How about:
I support open carry because concealing is physically discomforting, and when I'm hiking or backpacking anywhere within 100 miles of the border I am the only guardian of my own safety?
or,
I support open carry because hoplophobes oppose it?
or,
What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not get?
Breaking cover is one good reason to get rid of the penalties... but a Primary reason? Really?
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How about:
I support open carry because concealing is physically discomforting, and when I'm hiking or backpacking anywhere within 100 miles of the border I am the only guardian of my own safety?
When I do that in TX, I'm either on private land and/or carrying a long gun, so concealment isn't an issue.
or,
I support open carry because hoplophobes oppose it?
I generally don't state that I do something just to annoy someone else . . . in writing, at least.
or,
What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not get?
Breaking cover is one good reason to get rid of the penalties... but a Primary reason? Really?
I'm A-OK with open carry, but in & around town, I would still carry concealed, since I prefer to maintain a low profile. And if I'm somewhere away from home - bank, mall, wherever - and BGs decide to do something nefarious, I'd rather not be marked as the #1 target when they start their escapade.
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Breaking cover is one good reason to get rid of the penalties... but a Primary reason? Really?
In TN, the permit was specifically made as a handgun carry permit rather than a CC because of this issue. People were concerned that a brief exposure could result in an arrest, as is the case in some other states.
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I am not sure if this will pass this time around. I doubt there will be enough support. At least it is getting started though.
Hopefully, it will at least be the red herring to scare people so they won't notice other laws the TSRA wants to pass.
The law about employers restricting guns in parking lots didn't pass last time either. I am curious if that will be back.
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It certainly isn't uncommon to see a stainless snubbie in a nylon pouch holster on someone's backpack straps with the LED lights and other quick-to-reach items when hiking here. On public land, as well.
There can be a snake, a rabid animal, or a bad person. It's just one more piece of equipment. As well it should be.
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In TN, the permit was specifically made as a handgun carry permit rather than a CC because of this issue. People were concerned that a brief exposure could result in an arrest, as is the case in some other states.
You know, that may be the best way to get this started. Make open carry legal for CHL holders. At least they can't say they are criminals. 14 years of good history backs that up.
Knowing our legislature, they would probably figure out how to put in restrictions on what kind of holster you could wear.
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There will be blood in the streets!
WON'T SOMEONE THINK OF THE CHILDREN???
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I would have thought the weather would have obtained open carry for Texans. I was there for a class in April one year and nearly died of heat stroke in San Antonio before driving out to Kerrville.
At least in Texas the attitude toward guns is improving. I was less than 100% compliant with the dress code out there, but never caught any bother. In fact, my last class at TR there was a Sheriff's convention at Inn of the Hills in Kerrville while I stayed there. I walked over to the gun shop next to the hotel (Broken Arrow or something like that) in a $5 baja shirt which barely covered my 1911. Not a single cop said anything even when it was determined that I was not a Texican. =D
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Are you sure they weren't blinded by something else it barely covered? :lol:
I think rural Texas is very pro-gun. The major metropolitan areas have a lot of people and a lot of votes though. 3 of the top ten largest cities in the US by population and 3 more in the top 25.
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I'm (foolishly) involved in a blog discussion on the DMN Metro page, and it's obvious that a) many people are completely ignorant of the current CHL statutes in Texas b) blithely imply than anyone who wants to carry a sidearm openly is a nut or compensating for "shortcomings", and c) see no obligation to justify prohibing open carry beyond their feelings.
These points, combined with the wailing and gnashing of teeth which will emanate from our urban Representatives, notably Houston and Dallas, tell me that this movement may lay ground work for the next session, but I'll be very surprised (and pleasantly so!) if we see more than a bill dying in committee this year.
I would love to have the option, but living where I do, I would likely still carry concealed for the most part.
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Texas is probably the most pro-gun state
Not hardly....esp. when you have to pay the state $140 to exercise a Constitutional right. Texas is better than most, but not as good as some.
I'm supporting open carry as a step toward getting rid of the CHL and going to Vermont/Alaska-style CCW (if you can legally own a gun, you can legally carry it).... :cool:
These points, combined with the wailing and gnashing of teeth which will emanate from our urban Representatives, notably Houston and Dallas, tell me that this movement may lay ground work for the next session, but I'll be very surprised (and pleasantly so!) if we see more than a bill dying in committee this year.
You're probably right. But then....we do have elections in 2010...esp. for Governor....
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Mech, I was wearing pants (as surprising as that is). =D
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Mech, I was wearing pants (as surprising as that is). =D
But were you wearing pants in the way that most normal people wear pants, or?....
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fbrandfeature.net%2FBBB_Online%2Fassets%2Flarge%2FMaviJeans_634_img.jpg&hash=934da0ead7ebfd1b001fd895042b07e11b818567)
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No, but I want the girl on the right to tell about how to wear pants on my head. Slowly at first and then . . .
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You know, when I saw Seeker's picture, the first thing that flashed into my mind was original Star Trek series costume department refugees...
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Am I seeing things, or did Manedwolf just say that Texas is NOT a pro-gun state? ??? As compared to what?
Someone please tell me that was actually Microbalrog.
Sigh. Noooooooooooooo, I'm not saying Texas is the most pro-gun, either. I'm just sayin' - let's be realistic.
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"What are they trying to do?" Richard Leal of Texans for Gun Safety Laws told the Star-Telegram earlier this year. "Go back to Texas gunslinger days?"
Why not? Overall there was probably a lot less violence back then. :rolleyes:
Will this be open carry only with a CHL? =|
Seems like my native state still has a long way to go. :rolleyes:
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heh, they are more likely to get it then my home state.
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Texas is probably the most pro-gun state
*snort*
I moved here from OH, and the only differences I noticed were negative. Lack of open carry is a severe bummer when you are used to doing it. Seems positively draconian, especially given the heat.
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Will this be open carry only with a CHL?
Most likely. That would be the easiest way to get it passed, I suppose. It would be nice if they'd allow carry in colleges, too... but I don't know if that's even on the radar.
I hope they don't require another $100+ to get an open carry license...