Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: zahc on August 04, 2009, 11:10:53 AM
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http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/08/03/new.york.jobless.graduate/
"It doesn't make any sense: They went to school for four years, and then they come out working at McDonald's and Payless. That's not what they planned."
She suggested that Monroe's Office of Career Advancement shows preferential treatment to students with excellent grades. "They favor more toward students that got a 4.0. They help them more out with the job placement,"
I learn new things everyday. Today I learned you can sue someone for things not working out the way you had thought they would.
This is a symptom of the beginning-to-moderately distended higher education degree inflation bubble. As it becomes normal for EVERYONE to go to college and become special and distinguished, it becomes normal for McDonalds to require a 4-year degree for flipping burgers. Colleges are nothing but degree mills that extort money from students in exchange for a piece of paper that the students feel they need. There is a grade inflation treadmill and a degree inflation treadmill hard at work and it's going to come crashing down right alongside other aspects of the economy.
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Wow.
More entitlement mentality.
However, I hope more of this happens. As it is our colleges teaching this entitlement mentality, I truly hope they are among those suffering for it.
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Stupid twit.
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Dear God.... 3 months? People with actual skills and experience have trouble getting a job that quick. Also, 2.7 GPA? I think that's what my GPA went down to after I flunked a couple classes by not showing up but not officially dropping them. What an idiot.
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I came out of a tough college with a 3.04 or 3.06 and I still had a tough time getting a job.
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Hey, Dubya was a C student and look what he accomplished!
=D
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Her degree is "Bachelor of Business Administration." Let's face it, that's just one step above degrees that end in the word "Studies."
I wonder if she has any idea of how many MBAs - that's people with a "Master of Business Administration" degree - she's competing with for a job?
She also seemed rather, well, indignant that the placement office was having more luck placing people with good grades (DUH!) which suggests hers were a bit less than exemplary.
Poor baby.
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On top of that she's looking for a job in New York. Here's some advice: if you're looking for a job right now New York is not the place to be. I know it's unthinkable for many New Yorkers to leave what they consider the greatest city in the world, but there are other places out there. Many with job markets that are GROWING.
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She suggested that Monroe's Office of Career Advancement shows preferential treatment to students with excellent grades. "They favor more toward students that got a 4.0. They help them more out with the job placement,"
She's right. It's impossible that students with good grades are easier to place. It's not like employers actually value intelligence and hard work. :rolleyes:
I graduated with a 3.9 GPA and had a very hard time finding a job. But I know why. It's because I'm not good at interviewing. I had to take a job for about $10K less than I was worth. But since I knew what I was doing, within a year I threatened to walk and got a $10K raise.
Beyond that, there are college degrees and then there are college degrees. A degree from Podunk Community College is not going to carry the same weight as a degree from MIT. A lot of students/recent graduates seem to have trouble understanding that.
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Hey, Dubya was a C student and look what he accomplished!
=D
I'm still not certain what he accomplished...
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He got some great jobs, didn't he?
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Beyond that, there are college degrees and then there are college degrees. A degree from Podunk Community College is not going to carry the same weight as a degree from MIT. A lot of students/recent graduates seem to have trouble understanding that.
Not to mention that a 2.7 GPA at a Podunk Community College looks even worse. If you can't scratch a 3.0 or higher at most community colleges, you might want to consider alternatives. Does a job utilizing Bachelor's of Business Administration skills even pay anything? Nursing or something like that would probably net better pay, though it would not likely be easy.
IMO, just the idea that she filed this lawsuit shows me that she wouldn't be someone I would want to hire.
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I'm still not certain what he accomplished...
Like I said, a C average at an Ivy league school is going to get you further than a 3.0 at Sam Houston State. If you come from that smaller school, you are going to have to work harder to get the same or equivalent job. That is why people want to go to the schools with the better reputations in the first place. (but you all know that)
I'd be curious if this girl has any internships or extra-curricular activities to brag about. Probably not. I had a Co-op job in school. I ended up taking a job with the same company at what was pretty good pay at the time.
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Wow, reading that article, I had to scroll up to see that it was from CNN and not The Onion :rolleyes:
My heart pumps purple piss for the woman- it only took me 1.5 years to find a job that was remotely related to my field of study, and even then it didn't pay more than the factory job I held up until that point. I should also mention some of my colleagues who have a decade or more of experience that have been out of work for more than a year already due to the economy hitting my industry hard.
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Poor baby. In the days when it seems like everyone and their brother gets a college degree, it looses some of it's importance. Just like the marketplace, more choices means tougher competition.
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Wow, reading that article, I had to scroll up to see that it was from CNN and not The Onion :rolleyes:
I had to do the exact same thing.
This is just the logical and predictable outcome of the "snowflake" mentality. So many people in the education system are so fixated upon kids' "self esteem" that they're afraid to make the students work to earn good grades. That leads to kids who believe they should get high marks (and, consequently, sweet jobs) just because they showed up.
Corollary to this is the mistaken (yet rampant) belief the vast majority of people in our culture seem to have: That if something isn't "fun", you shouldn't have to do it.
-BP
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This is a symptom of the beginning-to-moderately distended higher education degree inflation bubble. As it becomes normal for EVERYONE to go to college and become special and distinguished, it becomes normal for McDonalds to require a 4-year degree for flipping burgers. Colleges are nothing but degree mills that extort money from students in exchange for a piece of paper that the students feel they need. There is a grade inflation treadmill and a degree inflation treadmill hard at work and it's going to come crashing down right alongside other aspects of the economy.
Agreed.
The only surprise for me is that it has taken so many people so long to begin realizing this.
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She also seemed rather, well, indignant that the placement office was having more luck placing people with good grades (DUH!) which suggests hers were a bit less than exemplary.
Obviously, you don't understand. It is the role of the college's placement service to REQUIRE prospective employers to interview graduates with a 2.7 GPA before they (the employers) are allowed to talk to the graduates with 4.0 GPAs.
Dontcha know nuttin'?
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Her degree is "Bachelor of Business Administration." Let's face it, that's just one step above degrees that end in the word "Studies."
I am sorry, no. In English Studies, you are at least supposed to learn things. That these are not marketable things is no fault of the universities teaching it. Not all knowledge is supposed to be marketable. History and Philosophy are not marketable either.
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I am sorry, no. In English Studies, you are at least supposed to learn things. That these are not marketable things is no fault of the universities teaching it. Not all knowledge is supposed to be marketable. History and Philosophy are not marketable either.
Fair enough, but don't spend 4 years and tens of thousands of dollars chasing unmarketable knowledge and then bitch because you can't get a job.
You can chase knowledge without going to college, but to spend money at college and not be able to get a job afterward is wasteful of both time and money.
Chris
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Not all knowledge is supposed to be marketable. History and Philosophy are not marketable either.
And when exactly did you discover that, MB? =D
I'd wager her degree might have been useful in the business world, but obviously the knowledge level she attained/retained at her 2.7 GPA isn't particularly marketable. Go figure.
She may as well have gotten a degree in underwater basket weaving and then sued the school.
Maybe Mommy & Daddy are putting the squeeze on her to make good on the money they sunk into her education, and she's got to deliver on it?
At least with a history degree, she could've sued the school for not keeping her well-fed and comfy forever after inside the vaunted halls of academia. :rolleyes:
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I am not in anyway claiming that this lady is not stupid (though I suspect she may succeed in her lawsuit!). I merely dispute the implication by some posters here that English Studies is somehow worthless.
The purpose of universities is not merely, and not even primarily, to provide people with professional knowledge that they can later use in getting jobs. In fact I would argue that the purpose of universities is not primarily related to job security in the firs place.
Furthermore, unless your place of education deliberately deceived you by claiming they guarantee job placement, I don't see how, in a proper universe, you should be able to sue them through being unemployed.
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History and Philosophy are not marketable either.
There's a reason I'm going Active Duty when I finish my Bachelors.
That or apply for one of the accelerated nursing school programs.
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I am not in anyway claiming that this lady is not stupid (though I suspect she may succeed in her lawsuit!). I merely dispute the implication by some posters here that English Studies is somehow worthless.
An English degree is worthless if your immediate purpose is to obtain a high-paying job. An English degree does indeed have value, but its value is not preparing one for a lucrative, in-demand career. For that you need training, not education.
(This assumes you live in an English-speaking country like the US, where there's no way to market an ability to speak English.)
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To be fair, my purpose in getting my English Studies major was for it to augment my History major with textual analysis skills and some knowledge of period literature. My plan was for it to help my research work for the History MA [commencing this year!] and the future glorious doctorate.
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2.7 GPA is still above average.
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I went into a History major knowing I'd probably never get rich with it. And I'm ok with that.
Anyone who goes into a History major or English or Philosophy with dollar signs in their eyes is totally delusional.
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Her degree is "Bachelor of Business Administration." Let's face it, that's just one step above degrees that end in the word "Studies."
Wow. Really? Because if you want to be a manager, accountant, etc. at my school, that was your official label of your major that was on your diploma. If you are planning on going into business, what major would you suggest people get? :rolleyes:
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There's a reason I'm going Active Duty when I finish my Bachelors.
That or apply for one of the accelerated nursing school programs.
Might want to talk to a recruiter now. The army has all kinds of neat programs that pay for college, especially medical field ones.
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An English Psychology degree is worthless if your immediate purpose is to obtain a high-paying job. An English Psychology degree does indeed have value, but its value is not preparing one for a lucrative, in-demand career. For that you need training, not education.
Fixed it for me (and everyone else in my field)... :laugh:
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In English Studies, you are at least supposed to learn things. That these are not marketable things is no fault of the universities teaching it.
I merely dispute the implication by some posters here that English Studies is somehow worthless.
Hmmm . . . looks like I touched a raw nerve here. I was actually thinking of degrees in "Women's Studies" and "Black Studies" and so forth and so on, and didn't realize "English Studies" was distinct from "English" . . . though holders of English degrees have limited prospects outside academic circles.
BUT . . . since the worth of a person's labor is determined, in large part, by the value of the highest bidder for it in a free competitive market, looking at your posts I'd have to say that "Not Marketable" is very close to "Worthless." If you're going to assert that "Not Marketable" does not correlate with "Worthless" . . . then we'll just have to agree to disagree.
Wow. Really? Because if you want to be a manager, accountant, etc. at my school, that was your official label of your major that was on your diploma. If you are planning on going into business, what major would you suggest people get? :rolleyes:
Re-read my post - I noted that someone with a BBA is going to be competing with a lot of people who have MBAs out there. And I'll expand by noting that quite a few MBAs have degrees in law, science, engineering, accounting, etc., as well. A person with less than stellar grades and "only" a BBA is at a disadvantage.
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I went into a History major knowing I'd probably never get rich with it. And I'm ok with that.
Anyone who goes into a History major or English or Philosophy with dollar signs in their eyes is totally delusional.
I worked with a guy in the FAA who was a Herpetologist. And I quote
"Best I could have hoped for was changing snake #### out of cages at the zoo for ten bucks an hour. So I became a controller."
:lol:
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IMO, just the idea that she filed this lawsuit shows me that she wouldn't be someone I would want to hire.
Indeed. I think she has hurt her chances at future employment with this lawsuit. It's SOP at many HR departments to google people's names to look for some dirt.
2.7 GPA is still above average.
In today's culture of grade inflation, a C+ average is pretty pathetic. Especially in a BBA program.
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I was a history major, as well.
Contemplated law school.
Decided to become a writer/editor instead.
No, I'll never be rich, but I'm doing well for myself.
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Indeed. I think she has hurt her chances at future employment with this lawsuit. It's SOP at many HR departments to google people's names to look for some dirt.
I don't know about Google, but our company does an automatic background check on all new employees before they are hired. I certainly don't doubt that something like this would hurt her in the future.
It sounded like her family has been helping her get through college with student loans and such that are now coming due and they can't pay it unless she has a job. I just get the impression she picked the wrong major if she was looking for a good paying career.
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I just get the impression she picked the wrong major if she was looking for a good paying career.
Not really. Lots of people have done well with a BBA, myself included. I think it's more that she performed poorly and doesn't understand the job search process. Not to mention the entitlement mentality and apparent laziness.
Admittedly, in the current market, a BBA will have trouble competing against MBAs, but that's also true for other fields of study. Graduates with a BS in engineering are competing against more candidates with an MS.
No, her major is not the problem. She is the problem.
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2.7 GPA is still above average.
Anyone who thinks 2.7 is decent hasn't witnessed modern grade inflation. You have to work to do that badly. I got a 3.67 in undergrad in a hard major and spent most of my time working and skateboarding.
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Anyone who thinks 2.7 is decent hasn't witnessed modern grade inflation. You have to work to do that badly. I got a 3.67 in undergrad in a hard major and spent most of my time working and skateboarding.
Not all universities participate in the grade inflation fraud. I know mine didn't, and maybe hers didn't either.
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Not all universities participate in the grade inflation fraud. I know mine didn't, and maybe hers didn't either.
I don't believe mine did either because when my classes were hard, they were hard to everyone in the class. Quantitative Methods was a beyotch in undergrad and again in Grad school.
I did have some throwaway classes though. Every marketing class I took with a certain professor was a guaranteed "A" (for anyone who tried, those who didn't even bother to try got lower grades, Bs, Cs and such).
Chris
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she further proves her "worth" by not getting the clue when no lawyer will take your case on contingency its cause the case is a dog. smart she ain't
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Not all knowledge is supposed to be marketable. History and Philosophy are not marketable either.
I have my BA in Philosophy. I got a lot of interviews because, at the very least, recruiters wanted to ask me what I could do with a Philosophy degree. :lol:
And I told them the truth: "I learned that I know nothing, and that the key to learning is to ask the right questions, not to think you have the answers just because you have a degree. I have nothing I have to unlearn".
This has gotten me hired many times.