Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Myself on August 04, 2009, 11:33:10 AM
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I was thinking back a few hundred years ago when I purchased my first car. It was a 1952 Chevy Deluxe that I paid 95 dollars for and needed 3 installment payments to swing.
A few weeks after my purchase I was horrified to learn that I needed auto insurance to own a car, (no one in the family had ever had a car before). I went to my local broker and learned it would cost me $350 for insurance on a $ 95.00 car.
So what happens to all the people who just traded their clunkers in on new cars? Did they get quotes on what the insurance difference would be? Did we just create another time bomb for the economically challenged?
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I was thinking back a few hundred years ago when I purchased my first car. It was a 1952 Chevy Deluxe that I paid 95 dollars for and needed 3 installment payments to swing.
A few weeks after my purchase I was horrified to learn that I needed auto insurance to own a car, (no one in the family had ever had a car before). I went to my local broker and learned it would cost me $350 for insurance on a $ 95.00 car.
So what happens to all the people who just traded their clunkers in on new cars? Did they get quotes on what the insurance difference would be? Did we just create another time bomb for the economically challenged?
These people are purchasing NEW cars. Although $4500 helps a lot towards a new car, it is extremely unlikely someone who is that economically challenged can purchase a new car even with the rebate. I doubt that is the time bomb we created.
We did, however, remove a number of perfectly good used cars from the market. As such, we will be raising the price of all used cars, especially those whose value was less than $4500.
Yep, just another way for the government to hurt the poor by claiming to help them.
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Auto insurance is a human right. We will create a government-mandated insurance system where everybody HAS to have insurance: If they don't then we will financially penalize them.
Drivers that have more money drive newer cars, so we will subsidize the poor among us by driving up the rates on new cars.
Oh... wait. =D We just screwed that one up with the cash for clunkers deal.
Hmm.
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These people are purchasing NEW cars. Although $4500 helps a lot towards a new car, it is extremely unlikely someone who is that economically challenged can purchase a new car even with the rebate. I doubt that is the time bomb we created.
Auto dealers can structure auto payment plans over many years to suck up all possible cash from those who can only marginally afford it. I just wander what the added impact of vastly higher insurance premiums will be on top of that.
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Here is what happens to the trade ins:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0IcIxhd8ks
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Seems so needlessly destructive.
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Seems so needlessly destructive.
It depends on how you define "destructive". I would guess their definition is vastly different from ours.
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I... can't watch that video. Not because the link doesn't work, but because I feel immense dread watching them pour that stuff into a perfectly good engine. :mad:
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These people are purchasing NEW cars. Although $4500 helps a lot towards a new car, it is extremely unlikely someone who is that economically challenged can purchase a new car even with the rebate. I doubt that is the time bomb we created.
We did, however, remove a number of perfectly good used cars from the market. As such, we will be raising the price of all used cars, especially those whose value was less than $4500.
Yep, just another way for the government to hurt the poor by claiming to help them.
Here's a kicker for ya. Neighbor in our complex is on section 8, food stamps, disability, and Oregon Health Plan (State run healthcare). They just went out, traded in significant other's perfectly functional older SUV type vehicle (don't exactly remember what it was) under the cash for clunkers program for a brand spanking new Pontiac. But then, to make matters worse....... They traded the brand spanking new Pontiac in on a slightly used Ford F-150 pickup that, since it's not a new vehicle, doesn't qualifiy for the rebate on the cash for clunkers.....
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Here's a kicker for ya. Neighbor in our complex is on section 8, food stamps, disability, and Oregon Health Plan (State run healthcare). They just went out, traded in significant other's perfectly functional older SUV type vehicle (don't exactly remember what it was) under the cash for clunkers program for a brand spanking new Pontiac. But then, to make matters worse....... They traded the brand spanking new Pontiac in on a slightly used Ford F-150 pickup that would likely NOT have qualified for the rebate on the cash for clunkers.....
/clap
BRAVO. Way to work the system. (Judging by your description, they are quite adept at that already).
Unintended consequences are often amusing.
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I recently looked at replacing a 12 year old Subaru with a new one, or a 3 year old one.
The change in my insurance wouldn't have been all that much.
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I recently looked at replacing a 12 year old Subaru with a new one, or a 3 year old one.
The change in my insurance wouldn't have been all that much.
I did the same with my 98 GMC Jimmy with a newer vehicle (F-150, Suburban and Outback) the price difference was negligible.
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Here is what happens to the trade ins:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0IcIxhd8ks
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Seems so needlessly destructive.
You've just defined leftism in general.
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Sorry, wasn't sure if this belonged here or in the Politics section as it's satire and not an actual news story. If I posted in the wrong place please feel free to move it.
Anyway...thought it was funny.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thepeoplescube.com%2Fimages%2FCash_for_Clankers_Medicare.png&hash=89717974c372a3446ded17032e2f8b416c2672e8)
"In the cold-hearted, uncaring capitalist society of the past, where every man was for himself, people often reached advanced age without any government help. It is a shame that in the richest country in the world, old people were abandoned by society and survived on their own, sometimes until they were 117 years old. No one knew or cared about how long they lived because everyone paid their own medical bills. But those dog-eat-dog days are over. In the caring, collectivist America, no one will be allowed to live without government care. And since we are paying for you, we decide how long you can be a drain on the collective wallet.
The full entry (http://www.thepeoplescube.com/red/viewtopic.php?t=3817&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=&sid=d34d1d042bc519ed03e2ba3bb92fcfd8)
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Reality is apeing art. :|
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000PE0FDI/ref=pd_lpo_k2_dp_sr_2?pf_rd_p=304485901&pf_rd_s=lpo-top-stripe-1&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=0446579815&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=0XFF3FRAB8JEJEQPWQEQ
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Looks like a prequel to Logan's run.
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Looks like a prequel to Logan's run.
Or Soylent Green
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Similar topics, merged.
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Here is what happens to the trade ins:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X0IcIxhd8ks
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Seems so needlessly destructive.
The was almost as bad as seeing the pictures of thousand of Tokarevs, Maks, and Ak's being steamrolled. ;_;
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Time bomb? I don't know.
I think it will depend a lot on what's getting traded in and just how much. For used auto dealers, this could suck big time in a few years. The same goes for those who buy used parts or can only really afford a used car. In a few years what do those people do?
I think time will tell if we have another credit bust on those one, allbeit a smaller scale. If you have a vehicle with no payments and trade it in under cash for clunkers, you now have a payment and likely higher insurance.
Not nearly as predictable as the housing market crash was though, and certainly nto to the same scale if it does happen.
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I have an old pickup truck that I rarely drive any more (its our #3 car). It might be worth all of $300 in the condition its in- it runs but it has holes rusted clean through it. I'm considering listing it on Craigslist for $1500 for someone to trade in as a clunker. Its been registered and insured continuously for the last 15 years, so it should qualify.
Unintended consequences indeed. :angel:
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Because destroying value is so good for our ecomony. Yes, our ecomony.
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I swear it was a matter of minutes after I heard about the cash for clunkers program that I figured some folks would be scamming it. Just turn in an old clunker, get a new car, sell the new car, and pocket some taxpayer dollars.
Obama should know that. He was around Chicago long enough to learn criminal ways.
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And just where, exactly, is this cash for the clunkers coming from, hmmmm? :rolleyes:
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It doesn't come from anywhere, it's free money 'cause it's from the Gubbermint.
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And just where, exactly, is this cash for the clunkers coming from, hmmmm? :rolleyes:
The clunker fairy? :laugh:
Somebody's got a way different concept of clunker than I do. I'd love to have many of the cars on the list. How is a 2002 Tundra a clunker? Where are people going to be able to find a decent old beater 4x4 to drive on the farm or deer lease?
I have a feeling the city bus system better start adding routes and planning for a lot of new riders. There are plenty of people around here who are never going to be able to afford more than a $2500 used car, and I haven't found a part of Texas where it's easy to live without wheels.
The automakers better start contemplating the potential market for much less expensive, stripped down models.
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The clunker fairy? :laugh:
Somebody's got a way different concept of clunker than I do. I'd love to have many of the cars on the list. How is a 2002 Tundra a clunker? Where are people going to be able to find a decent old beater 4x4 to drive on the farm or deer lease?
I have a feeling the city bus system better start adding routes and planning for a lot of new riders. There are plenty of people around here who are never going to be able to afford more than a $2500 used car, and I haven't found a part of Texas where it's easy to live without wheels.
The automakers better start contemplating the potential market for much less expensive, stripped down models.
I haven't the heart to look at the list, as all three of our vehicles have 120K+ miles on the odo and two are more than 12 years old.
I suspect every auto I own is a "clunker." Two are definitely worth less than $4500 and one is borderline.
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The automakers better start contemplating the potential market for much less expensive, stripped down models.
I wish...
I'd love a new Ford F-150 with vinyl floor mats, lockout and a manual tranny. Kind of how pickup trucks used to come.
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The new expanded proposal includes money going to folks who are paid to vandalize and destroy their neighbors car.
They are paid in cash that can be used in the purchase of new higher mileage cars than the ones they are currently driving. The more anti patriotic vehicles they destroy the better the ride they can afford.
The other part of the program provides cash assistance to those who have had their cars destroyed by this new novel program. The money can only be spent on higher mileage cars than the one destroyed in the government program.
The final part of the program taxes car companies at a higher rate. This should bring in much needed tax revenue to offset the costs of the program.
According to the Dems this is a win win win all around...
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The new expanded proposal includes money going to folks who are paid to vandalize and destroy their neighbors car.
They are paid in cash that can be used in the purchase of new higher mileage cars than the ones they are currently driving. The more anti patriotic vehicles they destroy the better the ride they can afford.
The other part of the program provides cash assistance to those who have had their cars destroyed by this new novel program. The money can only be spent on higher mileage cars than the one destroyed in the government program.
The final part of the program taxes car companies at a higher rate. This should bring in much needed tax revenue to offset the costs of the program.
According to the Dems this is a win win win all around...
WTF? Details, please.
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WTF? Details, please.
Pretty sure it's a joke. The program is rewarding folks that destroy working vehicles, just not as obviously as the scenarios he presented.
Wife wanted to get in on this deal. I've got a 2000 Jeep Cherokee that's barely used because I work from home most of the time. I was all excited until we saw what was out there in our price range after the $4500 incentive. A quick computation of what we'd be paying in sales tax and interest on top of the loan for a car we don't really need and only getting about $1000 more than market value for the existing car that just had a bunch of repairs done on it I nixed the idea.
Part of me wonders what'll happen to the value of my car after we've gotten done destroying about 700,000 vehicles right around the same price range. Can't hurt the value any!
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The top-selling brands under the cash-for-clunkers program are Ford, Toyota, Honda, and one or two other Japanese brands. Government Motors and Chrysler didn't make the cut.
These guys couldn't run a lemonade stand.
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Pretty sure it's a joke. The program is rewarding folks that destroy working vehicles, just not as obviously as the scenarios he presented.
Wife wanted to get in on this deal. I've got a 2000 Jeep Cherokee that's barely used because I work from home most of the time. I was all excited until we saw what was out there in our price range after the $4500 incentive. A quick computation of what we'd be paying in sales tax and interest on top of the loan for a car we don't really need and only getting about $1000 more than market value for the existing car that just had a bunch of repairs done on it I nixed the idea.
Part of me wonders what'll happen to the value of my car after we've gotten done destroying about 700,000 vehicles right around the same price range. Can't hurt the value any!
I hope to god it's only a joke. Nothing, however, is implausible with the nuts that are in charge now. Every day something I find out gives me heartburn.
I guess Cash for Clunkers isn't much different than the gov't buying up surplus crops and livestock and destroying that to keep prices up.
Part of me wonders what'll happen to the value of my car after we've gotten done destroying about 700,000 vehicles right around the same price range. Can't hurt the value any!
I just hope I can get parts for ours. We don't buy new vehicles, and the ones we have are running as long as possible.
Government Motors and Chrysler didn't make the cut.
I know my family will never buy another GM, nor will we buy a Chrysler.
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I guess Cash for Clunkers isn't much different than the gov't buying up surplus crops and livestock and destroying that to keep prices up.
Precisely. Destroying wealth, to make us all prosperous again.
Up next: the Change the Laws of Physics bill.
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Precisely. Destroying wealth, to make us all prosperous again.
Up next: the Change the Laws of Physics bill.
My first thoughts exactly.
I don't know, this is always the logic versus emotion argument. Emotion says, get people buying cars again, so Timmy OverPaidUnionWorker can feed his family. Logic says, you're needlessly destroying wealth and artificially giving Timmy a job by giving him a cut of the wealth transfer.
Currently, emotion is in the driver seat and logic is in the back with his head tucked firmly between his legs.
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I'd love a new Ford F-150 with vinyl floor mats, lockout and a manual tranny. Kind of how pickup trucks used to come.
I like that idea, only with Jeep bringing back the CJ-5 or Toyota the FJ-40.
My idea of a clunker is a car with a broken automatic transmission and seized up engine. You could replace the transmission in an old car with a good engine and it may run for many more years with only routine mantinence, but it would cost alot and the engine would have to be replaced eventually. The solution would be to buy a sturdy vehicle with a manual and see if it would be cost effective to replace the engine after it dies (this is assuming the frame or unibody isn't heavily rusted at the time.) I should learn to drive a stick before my father dies.
The top-selling brands under the cash-for-clunkers program are Ford, Toyota, Honda, and one or two other Japanese brands. Government Motors and Chrysler didn't make the cut.
These guys couldn't run a lemonade stand.
Which is precisely why they should have failed. Now they cost all of us money.
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I recently looked at replacing a 12 year old Subaru with a new one, or a 3 year old one.
The change in my insurance wouldn't have been all that much.
How much would it be if you were going from minimum liability on a paid off car to full coverage while making payments on a new car?
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I ran my cars through the clunker website. My 1986 Mazda pickup did not qualify because the combined MPG was too high. My 2005 Ford Escape would. Interesting that the five year old car is a clunker yet the 23 year old vehicle is not.
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How much would it be if you were going from minimum liability on a paid off car to full coverage while making payments on a new car?
If you can't afford the new insurance, then you probably couldn't afford the new car payments.
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How much would it be if you were going from minimum liability on a paid off car to full coverage while making payments on a new car?
For some odd reason from time to time I am a deer magnet when driving, so I have full coverage on everything I drive no matter how old it is. I'm married, over 25, good credit score and have only had one moving violation in the last 14 years so my insurance is pretty cheap. I think we pay $100 a month for two vehilces with a $250 deductable and a pretty high liability coverage, I think $500k. One is a 04 Vibe and the other is a 98 Jimmy.
-C