Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Perd Hapley on July 17, 2010, 01:05:47 AM
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I've been meaning to have another go at the Linux thing, and since I now have a mostly-empty 250 GB hard drive on my system, I figure I may as well install Ubuntu on it. My main question is whether I should use the 9.04 disk I already have, or is it worth it to download 10.04?
As background information, I will be using this Linux installation for my own educational experimentation. The hardware is an hp dx2300, with a P4 531 (3 GHz) and 4 GB DDR2. I have two Windows operating systems on the first physical hard drive, and I plan to put Ubuntu on the secondary, larger physical drive.
Thanks for your advice,
fistful
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Get 10.04. It's worth it.
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Get 10.04. It's worth it.
This.
I'm using Xubuntu FWIW.
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My main question is whether I should use the 9.04 disk I already have, or is it worth it to download 10.04?
Go with 10.04. No particular reason to go with 9.04.
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Try sticking VirtualBox on your machine, then just try any old flavor(s) of Linux you want. With 4gig of physical RAM, you can dedicate 1gig to the Linux guest and not affect Windows performance at all, while running both simultaneously.
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You can also try Wubi. Very painless. 4 clicks and you have a dual boot; don't even need to burn a CD. Easy to completely erase the Linux too. I've done it a couple times; the downside is your linux is running on NTFS which 1)sucks and 2)can't be fsck'd by linux.
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I don't see the niche for wubi. Virtualization allows the same thing, without any rebooting, and with more flexibility - no messing with the windows bootloader, and you can install whatever guest OS you want directly from any install CD you have.
+1 on virtualbox, and if you want linux as your primary OS in the future, VMware has a converter (http://www.howtoforge.com/vmware_converter_windows_linux) and ovf exporter (http://www.vmware.com/support/developer/ovf) (to get it into an image virtualbox can read)
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Fistful, are you using HDMI on that system?
If you are and it works out for you let me know.
jim
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VGA.
I downloaded Lucid Lynx and installed to that second drive. I know I could have gone with a virtual machine, but for whatever reason I'm just happier with dual booting.
The odd thing is, when I boot Windows, it keeps setting my clock five hours ahead, even though the time zone stays the same. ???
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The odd thing is, when I boot Windows, it keeps setting my clock five hours ahead, even though the time zone stays the same. ???
Switch to Linux.
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I hurt you now.
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The odd thing is, when I boot Windows, it keeps setting my clock five hours ahead, even though the time zone stays the same. Huh?
Somewhere there was a question about whether BIOS time was set to GMT. You answered wrong, or the question was hidden and the answer assumed.
"https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuTime (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuTime)" -- See the section "Multiple Boot Systems Time Conflicts"
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Thanks. That page must have been for an earlier version, but I found the answer on Ubuntu Forums.
I have kept the Windows 7 boot loader (choice of 7 or XP) on the first hard drive, and put Ubuntu and grub on the second hard drive. That way, if I want to load Ubuntu, I press F9 for the hp boot menu and select the second hard drive. From there, I would like this to boot straight into Ubuntu. How do I keep the grub boot menu from appearing? Should I just edit grub.cfg, so it has a timeout value of 0?
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On the subject of linux distributions, if you want something more similar to windows, I highly recommend DVL (http://www.damnvulnerablelinux.org/index.html) over Ubuntu. (link courtesy of slashdot)
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On the subject of linux distributions, if you want something more similar to windows, I highly recommend DVL (http://www.damnvulnerablelinux.org/index.html) over Ubuntu. (link courtesy of slashdot)
;/
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DVL (http://www.damnvulnerablelinux.org/index.html) over Ubuntu. (link courtesy of slashdot)
Ohh. Me wants.
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what about just running ubuntu on a flash drive, or cant you install it and run it inside windows 7?
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How do I keep the grub boot menu from appearing? Should I just edit grub.cfg, so it has a timeout value of 0?
I just tried that on my Eeebuntu 9.something install and setting tiimeout = 0 in the grub config did the trick.
Now I need to figure out how to interrupt it so I can actually chose what OS I boot again! :)
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Virtualization allows the same thing
It's not the same thing. Virtualization uses more resources...two operating systems running instead of one. Also, twice the boot time. Also, possibly not the same access to low-level system resources (serial ports etc). Also, virtualization sucks for graphics.
Wubi is the same thing as dual boot, just easier to set up, and easier to get rid of. No partitioning, and no disk-burning. I used Wubi on windows computers at my old job when I needed linux for a certain task. They didn't have CD burners and were old, so I just ran Wubi, went to lunch, and when I came back I rebooted. If they ever want to get rid of linux it's about two clicks and it's like it was never there.
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Also, twice the boot time.
???
I run computers with both native and guest Linux. Guest Linux takes half the time to load compared to native Linux.
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Typically you have to boot the host OS before you can even start booting the host OS. That's the 'twice the boot time' I was talking about.
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I just tried that on my Eeebuntu 9.something install and setting tiimeout = 0 in the grub config did the trick.
Now I need to figure out how to interrupt it so I can actually chose what OS I boot again! :)
Uh, you might want to set that timeout to 1 instead of 0. Just in case you ever need to actually modify any of your boot parameters for whatever reason. With a timeout of 0 I can't do anything with the menu anymore. It just boots into my default OS. Nothing I do (left shift, smashing escape, holding any key whatever) is helping me get to the grub menu.
Food for thought.
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I've often set the grub timeout to 0, and never had a problem. You just have to hold down the right key to get it to show. I think it used to be escape, but now with grub 2 it's shift. When I installed the latest ubuntu, the grub timeout was automatically set to 0 (they don't want noobs to get scared by the boot screen I guess), and since the install was setting a video mode that turned my monitor off, the system booted straight to a black screen. It took me a lot of googling before I found out that the grub menu secret key changed to SHIFT.
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Huh. I know I tried left shift. Maybe it's only the right shift key that works. I think LILO was specific about which one worked.
Oh well, no matter. I went and grabbed Ubuntu 10.4 netbook remix and tossed that overtop the old Eeebuntu install thanks to this thread. I'm liking it so far. Glad to see Chromium in the package list.
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Thanks for the advice on grub. My new, and actually serious, problem is that I installed lm sensors and was trying to bring fan speed under control. This box has had over-heating issues before, so I depend on Speedfan to monitor temps. But since Speedfan isn't Linux-friendly, I was doing things manually, and now the system fan just shuts down when I boot Ubuntu. Why do I try? ;/
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now the system fan just shuts down when I boot Ubuntu. Why do I try
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Now you know exactly what speed to fan is running. :P
jim
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I gave up on software fan control a long time ago. Now I just wire them to the power supply and use a fan controller or simple potentiometer in series with them.
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I gave up on software fan control a long time ago. Now I just wire them to the power supply and use a fan controller or simple potentiometer in series with them.
Try Windows. :P
Due to the fan issue, I figured the easiest fix was to re-install. And so long as I was re-installing, I figured I'd go back to 9.04, which was prettier, and easier to work with on a couple of points (probably more difficult on others).
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Well, I managed to get sensors-applet up and running on my panel. All the fans are running full-speed, full-time, but at least the temps look OK. Lower than when running Windows, but I suspect that's mainly from the fans being on ALL THE TIME.
Feeling better about the Penguinware now. =)
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I don't see the niche for wubi. Virtualization allows the same thing, without any rebooting, and with more flexibility - no messing with the windows bootloader, and you can install whatever guest OS you want directly from any install CD you have.
+1 on virtualbox, and if you want linux as your primary OS in the future, VMware has a converter (http://www.howtoforge.com/vmware_converter_windows_linux) and ovf exporter (http://www.vmware.com/support/developer/ovf) (to get it into an image virtualbox can read)
Primarily, wubi allows direct access to the PC's real hardware, virtualization really doesn't. For instance, in Microsoft Virtual PC, the sound card is a
Sound Blaster 16 whereas in the real machine, it's a Audigy. Linux will believe it only has a SB16 to play with and not the full featured real card.
Wubi is for testing to see how ubuntu will actually work on your real hardware but in an easily removable manner.
If it works great, you can always create a real partition for it later (but obviously, you can't migrate your wubi stuff to the real partition easily, IIRC)
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No argument that wubi makes a decent trial-run environment to check for hardware driver issues... but why not use the ubuntu livecd for that?
That doesn't make Wubi a superior learning environment. I do not see masses of linux newbies wanting to try out linux and getting fed up with virtualization because mysql performance sucks, or because Crysis under Wine is deathly slow, or because they don't get to enjoy their Avatar dvd or blu-ray in full 5.1 or 42.1 glory.
Virtualization allows newbie linux users to experiment without worrying about nuking X or networking or the entire filesystem. It's difficult to overstate the advantage of having a stable web browser and irc client open no matter what tragedy befalls you in an OS environment you're trying to learn about.
If fistful had chosen the virtualization option, he would be running 10.04 and wouldn't have been messing with manual control of fan speed under linux when he probably doesn't even know if he wants to run linux long-term yet. =(
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I just installed the wubi on my machine running win 7. Having problems installing AVG free. Anyone know of a better AV or how to install AVG free?
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If fistful had chosen the virtualization option, he would be running 10.04 and wouldn't have been messing with manual control of fan speed under linux when he probably doesn't even know if he wants to run linux long-term yet. =(
But virtualization simply doesn't interest me, and I might just as well tinker with fan speed as anything else. :cool:
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I just installed the wubi on my machine running win 7. Having problems installing AVG free. Anyone know of a better AV or how to install AVG free?
AVG for linux? If I'm honest here, and I may get slammed for this, I've been running Ubuntu without any sort of antivirus for about three years now.
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AVG for linux? If I'm honest here, and I may get slammed for this, I've been running Ubuntu without any sort of antivirus for about three years now.
There are no antivirus programs for linux, as there are no linux viruses to speak of.
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There are antivirus programs, or at least virus scanners, for linux. AVG, Avast, Clamav...
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There are no antivirus programs for linux, as there are no linux viruses to speak of.
http://www.mcafee.com/us/enterprise/products/system_security/servers/linuxshield.html
Chris
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As people have pointed out, there ARE programs which run on linux that look for known viruses in files being stored of that server, to protect your windows boxen.
For example, your linux-based email server might have a "virus scanner" preventing email-based viruses from passing through there.
As far as a desktop-based anti-virus scanner for protecting the linux system itself, I am oretty sure no such thing exists, and if it DOES I am even twice as sure that no such thing is warranted.
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From messing with Ubuntu the past couple of weeks, I have learned one thing - there are much quieter case fans at Micro Center, and they will make me happy.
So, yeah, since Ubuntu can't handle a garden-variety hp motherboard, I had to install a case fun that runs quieter at full speed. :P While we're on the subject, I upgraded twice to Lucid Lynx. It took away my pretty red mouse pointer. =(
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So, yeah, since Ubuntu can't handle a garden-variety hp motherboard, I had to install a case fun that runs quieter at full speed. :P While we're on the subject, I upgraded twice to Lucid Lynx. It took away my pretty red mouse pointer. =(
Maybe, or maybe ubuntu simply doesn't do fan control for your sensor chipset by default. `sensors-detect` will tell you what sensor chip(s) you have, and then you may be able to find information on setting up fan speed control for that chip.
As for your "pretty red" mouse pointer, all that stuff is configurable. They must have simply changed the default.
and this...
But virtualization simply doesn't interest me, and I might just as well tinker with fan speed as anything else.
...is like saying that roads don't interest you when all you want to do is drive to another city. You don't have to be interested in virtualization itself in order to find virtualization useful.
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Maybe, or maybe ubuntu simply doesn't do fan control for your sensor chipset by default. `sensors-detect` will tell you what sensor chip(s) you have, and then you may be able to find information on setting up fan speed control for that chip.
Yeah, I've been through that. It was able to find my case fan. And then it just shut it down, which is why I re-installed. In all fairness to the OS, I may have done something wrong.
As for your "pretty red" mouse pointer, all that stuff is configurable. They must have simply changed the default.
The funny thing is, when I first installed Lucid, and changed it to the pretty red mouse pointer, it was only red within my browser window (and maybe other applications, I don't remember). But when on the desktop, the pointer went back to the default white. When I reformatted the drive and installed Jaunty (due to the fan issue), I picked the red mouse pointer again, and it worked fine. As soon as I upgraded to Lucid, it went back to white on the desktop, red in the browser. ???
and this......is like saying that roads don't interest you when all you want to do is drive to another city. You don't have to be interested in virtualization itself in order to find virtualization useful.
But I don't find virtualization useful when all I want to do is run OSs natively. I have nothing against virtualization; but it's just not what I'm into right now.
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Ubuntu Eye Candy (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuEyeCandy)
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You velly funny Peggy Hill.
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fisty - with regards to the mouse pointer colour change issue, I'm pretty certain it's compiz that causes that. Try turning off desktop effects.
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Yup, that did it.
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Maybe it's the late hour, and I'm just not thinking straight, but I think I'm going to install PCLinuxOS next to Ubuntu. I'll give you all a day or two to talk me out of it. =)
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There (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_malware) are (http://www.linux.com/learn/tutorials/284124-myth-busting-is-linux-immune-to-viruses) indeed (http://www.desktoplinux.com/articles/AT3307459975.html) Linux (https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Linuxvirus) viruses. (http://www.geekzone.co.nz/foobar/6229)