Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: makattak on August 25, 2010, 02:53:12 PM
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Or maybe not:
http://www.nssfblog.com/epa-considering-ban-on-traditional-ammunition-take-action-now/
All Gun Owners, Hunters and Shooters:
With the fall hunting season fast approaching, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) under Lisa Jackson, who was responsible for banning bear hunting in New Jersey, is now considering a petition by the Center for Biological Diversity (CBD) – a leading anti-hunting organization – to ban all traditional ammunition under the Toxic Substance Control Act of 1976, a law in which Congress expressly exempted ammunition. If the EPA approves the petition, the result will be a total ban on all ammunition containing lead-core components, including hunting and target-shooting rounds. The EPA must decide to accept or reject this petition by November 1, 2010, the day before the midterm elections
I'm going against the policy, but I think the NSSF will approve of posting a snippet. Please click the link for more information.
Looks like the Democrats have decided if they can't ban guns, they're going after ammunition.
How shocking, they haven't given up their quest at all, they're just trying to hide it.
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Well, at least we have a choice: the Second Amendment or "the environment." But then that's been the choice for a long time now. The 2A is about individual liberty, the "environment"--as the movement has evolved beyond pragmatic health protection--is about a collectivist future.
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Not only will they dare, they HAVE to. They NEED to disarm their enemies, and they know that. One way or another they will push 2A-supporters to the wall.
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One way or another they will push 2A-supporters to the wall.
It won't be pretty. [popcorn]
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On the heels of their moves toward a lead ammo ban:
http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/15150.html#more-15150
The EPA has created a new set of regulations that is as stringent as they can make them.
Instead of setting pollution regulations for industrial boilers based on the minimum they can get from their sources, they are basing the minimum off of what the best that could possibly be for each pollutant.
In other words, the EPA is looking at what the minimum pollution could be for each pollutant seperately by looking at technology based to reduce that one pollutant and creating regulations for every pollutant in that way without looking at what is possible when the industry has to deal with multiple pollutants.
In other words, they created a "best possible boiler" that cannot exist in the world and based their regulations off of that.
This is the democrats plan. Give as much power to regulators so that those who write the laws cannot be held accountable.
November will be a start. Replacing the legislators must happen. Then was must dismantle the bureaucracy.
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Not only will they dare, they HAVE to. They NEED to disarm their enemies, and they know that. One way or another they will push 2A-supporters to the wall.
But if I have 20k bullets stockpiled with those nasty lead cores and they make it illegal to use those bullets, I won't be able to join the Revolution when it starts because my ammo would be illegal... :angel:
I guess I need to buy some of that fancy Barnes solid copper stuff. The ones that don't expand at all and are meant for African big game. Rhino, African Wild ass and such. Or maybe they'd prefer I stocked up on tungsten cores.
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Interesting. I wonder if they would extend that to process heaters as well as "boilers". I also wonder if they will dump it on pre-existing boilers when they renew air permits or just new boilers.
I know on NOx, the max technology is pretty low, but the newest burners are expensive. When you include catalysts with ammonia injection, you can drive it near to zero in many cases. You just need more catalyst and more ammonia. We don't burn a lot of solids or chemicals so we mainly worry about NOx and CO.
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Run amok indeed.
The EPA is also trying to kill farming with their dust and water regulations.
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I guess I need to buy some of that fancy Barnes solid copper stuff. The ones that don't expand at all and are meant for African big game.
Clearly, you've never dug a Barnes .308 out of the cave it leaves in the berm.
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Fleep.
:mad:
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Walter Williams was hosting Rush yesterday and talking to another guy about the recovery from the Great Depression at the outset of WWII. One thing mentioned was that in addition to the increase in manufacturing brought on by the war, the Roosevelt administration quietly replaced a lot of the more-govt-more-regulation New Dealers with people from the business world in order to get better cooperation from business for the war effort. It was basically said that this had a big impact that is not talked about.
This article sort of reminded me of that. If the govt keeps putting its foot down on business and business growth/expansion, there won't be a recovery.
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Hey! No problemo. We'll just de-fund it.
See, problem solved.
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http://www.statesmanjournal.com/article/20100803/UPDATE/100803020
The Toxic Substances Control Act dates from the mid-70's and IIRC specifically exempts ammunition from the law.
No problem, we don't have to repeal the law. We can just de-fund it.
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Hey! No problemo. We'll just de-fund it.
See, problem solved.
I think that is already starting to sound like "It's Bush's Fault.".
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With the fall hunting season fast approaching, the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) under Lisa Jackson, who was responsible for banning bear hunting in New Jersey, is now considering a petition by the Center for Biological Diversity (CBD) – a leading anti-hunting organization – to ban all traditional ammunition under the Toxic Substance Control Act of 1976, a law in which Congress expressly exempted ammunition. If the EPA approves the petition, the result will be a total ban on all ammunition containing lead-core components, including hunting and target-shooting rounds. The EPA must decide to accept or reject this petition by November 1, 2010, the day before the midterm elections
EPA does not write the laws. Congress does. EPA cannot overrule Congress. Ergo, EPA can entertain any bloody petition they like. They cannot ban lead ammunition.
Title 15, Chapter 53, Subchapter 1, Section 2602 "Definitions", paragraph 2, item 5
(v) any article the sale of which is subject to the tax imposed
by section 4181 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 [26 U.S.C.
4181] (determined without regard to any exemptions from such tax
provided by section 4182 or 4221 or any other provision of such
Code),
And 26 U.S.C. 4181?
There is hereby imposed upon the sale by the manufacturer, producer, or importer of the following articles a tax equivalent to the specified percent of the price for which so sold: Articles taxable at 10 percent - Pistols.
Revolvers.
Articles taxable at 11 percent - Firearms (other than pistols and revolvers). Shells, and cartridges.
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If the govt keeps putting its foot down on business and business growth/expansion, there won't be a recovery.
Which is what they want. They couldn't smother the economy by massive spending, so they are going for legal strangulation.
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Prediction:
This will go nowhere.
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Prediction:
This will go nowhere.
Or the EPA declares revolution and throws a coup against the US Congress. I know the entire DoD has been praying for that to happen for thirty years. You have no idea how many Generals would love to order every single A10 in the entire US military to drop every bomb and round of ammo (hell, the gods damned aux fuel tanks too) on the EPA.
"So, General, you say you intercepted communication that the EPA was going to revolt against Congress and override them."
"Yes, Congressman. Your safety was our highest concern, of course."
"So... How many bombs did you drop on EPA offices?"
"Well, we figured out how many we dropped on both the Taliban and Saddam, doubled it, and figured that'd be almost good enough."
"Anything else, General?"
"Oh. Uhm. Alternating A10's inbetween the B-52's. Had some Guard artillery units lay down suppressing fire. Afterwards, our Chemical guys put on MOPP suits and heavily salted the ground. They used 4,000 metric tons of salt. Just in case."
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A good start, RevDisk, a good start.
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Makes me feel better about all my Russian steel-core 5.45.
To the point - why wouldn't this pass? Just because it's illegal, pfft. Hasn't stopped them before. After all, they're going to save the planet, one bullet(excuse me, LIVE AMMUNITION CARTRIDGE) at a time.
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To the point - why wouldn't this pass? Just because it's illegal, pfft. Hasn't stopped them before. After all, they're going to save the planet, one bullet(excuse me, LIVE AMMUNITION CARTRIDGE) at a time.
Oh, the whole bit about the most pro-gun Congress in the last century or so.
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When Pelosi and Co. arbitrarily considers bills "passed" and the Obama Administration takes actions w/o Congressional approval, it makes stuff like this quite possible.... =|
It may come down to how committed the enforcing agencies are in enforcing these blatantly unconstitutional acts.....esp. in the face of public "resistance"....
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When Pelosi and Co. arbitrarily considers bills "passed" and the Obama Administration takes actions w/o Congressional approval, it makes stuff like this quite possible.... =|
It may come down to how committed the enforcing agencies are in enforcing these blatantly unconstitutional acts.....esp. in the face of public "resistance"....
Pelosi and Co. have no intention on touching firearms whatsoever. They're too busy with easier things, namely gutting the United States financially. They read the firearm/ammo sales reports from the BATFE from over a year ago, and saw the writing on the wall.
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Reminds me of the quest for Gasoline that was better for the air. They decreed that a particular oxidizer be blended in because it gave more oxygen in the exhaust. The only problem is the stuff is a hazardous before it is burned, and since small amounts of gas get spilled all the time, we have a pretty nasty poison in our ground water now.
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EPA does not write the laws. Congress does. EPA cannot overrule Congress.
IIRC bond holders are first in line when a company goes into bankruptcy. Didn't work for GM real well when those at the bottom of the stack got first dibs and those at the top got nothing. No law allowed it to happen. It just did. A law that is not enforced might as well not exist.
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I've got another idea...EPA institutes regs restricting all these "pollutants," and creates a fine structure for violators. They carefully draft this fine system so that it's less expensive to pay the fine than it is to actually fix the problem (which, as described above, is prohibitively expensive, or impossible). EPA collects millions, maybe billions in fines, and Obama and Co. waive the income as a sollution to all problems, thus fixing the budget deficit and saving the economy. [barf]
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The main toxin in the U.S. today is big government, with big business close behind.
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I've often wondered . . . exactly what enforcement power does EPA have over states? Can they actually do anything beyond - maybe - having certain Federal funds cut off?
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I've often wondered . . . exactly what enforcement power does EPA have over states? Can they actually do anything beyond - maybe - having certain Federal funds cut off?
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/aug/25/texas-fights-global-warming-power-grab/?page=1
Now Washington is trying to federalize the air-permitting process and force Texas to ignore our state laws and the plain language of the Clean Air Act in order to allow an illegal rewriting of the federal statute.
The article is about the EPA's fight with Texas over allowing the EPA to regulate carbon-dioxide.
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If lead bullets are banned, then I guess I will need to send all mine to the govt for disposal ;)
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All they need to do is bury a law change for the EPA in the next mega bill that gets sent to the president, just like all the new taxes in the health care bill. Let's say, one half of page 21,501 in a 27,000 page bill says that the sale, manufacture or possession of all lead products is banned. Then they "find" this little nugget 6 months to a year after passage of the bill. Then what? The damage is done and it will take another 18+ months to remove that piece of tripe, if it can be removed. After all, who wants to be known as the senator that removed a law that protected the children from the dangers of lead poisoning? Remember, the "Assault Weapons Ban" only went away because nobody made a move to make it permanent. If the Senate and Congress had to create legislation to make it go away we would still have it, not enough of them would have had the backbone to get rid of it.
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All they need to do is bury a law change for the EPA in the next mega bill that gets sent to the president, just like all the new taxes in the health care bill. Let's say, one half of page 21,501 in a 27,000 page bill says that the sale, manufacture or possession of all lead products is banned. Then they "find" this little nugget 6 months to a year after passage of the bill. Then what? The damage is done and it will take another 18+ months to remove that piece of tripe, if it can be removed. After all, who wants to be known as the senator that removed a law that protected the children from the dangers of lead poisoning? Remember, the "Assault Weapons Ban" only went away because nobody made a move to make it permanent. If the Senate and Congress had to create legislation to make it go away we would still have it, not enough of them would have had the backbone to get rid of it.
Yep. The bureaucrats in the EPA can custom craft what they want for legislation and send it to Congress, which in the rush to enlarge government, will rubberstamp it and pass it into law.
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I've often wondered . . . exactly what enforcement power does EPA have over states? Can they actually do anything beyond - maybe - having certain Federal funds cut off?
The problem I bet is the law is so vague and general that it might allow too much interpretation.
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It looks like the EPA backed down on the lead ammo hunting ban.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/08/27/epa-rejects-calls-ban-lead-ammo-fishing-tackle/ (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/08/27/epa-rejects-calls-ban-lead-ammo-fishing-tackle/)
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All they need to do is bury a law change for the EPA in the next mega bill that gets sent to the presiden
A game two can play.
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A game two can play.
...if we had anyone with the backbone to play it.... ;/
Fortunately, it may not come to that....
http://politics.usnews.com/news/washington-whispers/articles/2010/08/27/epa-surrenders-to-nra-on-gun-control-issue-epa-rejects-attempt-to-regulate-lead-in-bullets-after-nra-protests.html (http://politics.usnews.com/news/washington-whispers/articles/2010/08/27/epa-surrenders-to-nra-on-gun-control-issue-epa-rejects-attempt-to-regulate-lead-in-bullets-after-nra-protests.html)
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Seeker seems to have missed my post 2 posts down with a link already stating that the ban had been rejected...
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Seeker seems to have missed my post 2 posts down with a link already stating that the ban had been rejected...
Yes you did....but I said it with more style...... :cool:
=D
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...if we had anyone with the backbone to play it.... ;/
And why do you think is it that Republican politicians have less of a backbone than Dem politicians (if indeed that is true)?
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http://www.epa.gov/oppt/chemtest/pubs/Owens_Petition_Response.pdf
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And why do you think is it that Republican politicians have less of a backbone than Dem politicians (if indeed that is true)?
Because they're all politicians.....
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I guess I need to buy some of that fancy Barnes solid copper stuff. The ones that don't expand at all and are meant for African big game. Rhino, African Wild ass and such. Or maybe they'd prefer I stocked up on tungsten cores.
I see what you did there.
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A game two can play.
A game two can play but none should play.
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A game two can play but none should play.
That line has already been crossed.
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That line has already been crossed.
This.
It took parliamentary skulduggery to pass much of the architecture of the oppressive state. It will require more of same to restore some liberty.
The alternative to hardball (Congressional) is hardball (FMJ).
Personally, I'd prefer hurt feelings and disturbing the collegiality of the Senate to the alternative.
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http://politics.usnews.com/news/washington-whispers/articles/2010/08/27/epa-surrenders-to-nra-on-gun-control-issue-epa-rejects-attempt-to-regulate-lead-in-bullets-after-nra-protests.html (http://politics.usnews.com/news/washington-whispers/articles/2010/08/27/epa-surrenders-to-nra-on-gun-control-issue-epa-rejects-attempt-to-regulate-lead-in-bullets-after-nra-protests.html)
Headline: "EPA Surrenders to NRA on Gun Control Issue"
I'm so glad there's no bias in their reporting. ;/
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Headline: "EPA Surrenders to NRA on Gun Control Issue"
I'm so glad there's no bias in their reporting. ;/
I'm just surpised they were honest that it was a blatant attempt at gun control.
They slipped up there.
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Headline: "EPA Surrenders to NRA on Gun Control Issue"
I'm so glad there's no bias in their reporting. ;/
So, which part of it is not true?
And why is the EPA surrendering to NRA bad? I'd think you'd want them to be doing as much surrendering as humanly possible.
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So, which part of it is not true?
And why is the EPA surrendering to NRA bad? I'd think you'd want them to be doing as much surrendering as humanly possible.
It's not bad, but you'll notice the way they use words and such to make it seem as the Big, Evil NRA uses overwhelming force against the poor innocent little EPA, who was just tryin' to help the animals....
That's why they used the word "surrender". That's why they use gun cliches when writing "articles".
"
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It's not bad, but you'll notice the way they use words and such to make it seem as the Big, Evil NRA uses overwhelming force against the poor innocent little EPA, who was just tryin' to help the animals....
That's why they used the word "surrender". That's why they use gun cliches when writing "articles".
"
Oderint dum metuant.
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Oderint dum metuant.
Oooh, I like it.