Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Monkeyleg on August 26, 2010, 11:20:52 PM
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I know that the subject of guns and movies has been discussed a zillion times. I guess this makes a zillion + 1.
I was watching "Street Kings" tonight. In the opening scene, Ludlow (Keanu Reeves) wakes up, picks up his 1911 from under a blanket, inserts a loaded magazine, then does a press check that shows a round already in the chamber. Why remove the magazine when the gun is already cocked and locked?
"Goodfella's" was a movie with a pretty substantial budget. Yet they screwed up a few times. In the scene when Henry Hill wakes up to find his wife Karen sitting on top of him and pointing a S&W snubby at him. I've read on a couple of websites that it's a blued gun that only looks like stainless because of the lighting, but I've played and replayed that scene several times. It's blued in one shot and stainless in the next.
Also in "Goodfellas" is the scene when Tommy goes to Stack's apartment to execute him with a suppressed 1911. When the shooting is repeated in slow motion, you hear the thunder of the .45 unsuppressed. Probably just for effect, but it's a little silly.
In the movie "Marathon Man," Dustin Hoffman is thinking back to the time he found his father dead on the floor from suicide, with a 1911 lying by his head. The hammer is down, meaning that the gun was either unloaded or didn't have a magazine in it (I'll have to watch the scene again to see if there's a mag in it).
How much would it cost to have someone who knows guns say, "hey, don't do that"?
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My wife hates it when I pick up on that stuff when we watch movies or TV together. Any kind of gaffe, whether firearms related, something technical, an out of period prop, a continuity error, whatever it is. She says it's annoying when I point it out.
But those things just grab my attention and often detract from my enjoyment of the program. It's a character flaw, I suppose.
Competent technical advisors are a good thing. Producers and directors that actually listen to them are better.
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In the movie "Marathon Man," Dustin Hoffman is thinking back to the time he found his father dead on the floor from suicide, with a 1911 lying by his head. The hammer is down, meaning that the gun was either unloaded or didn't have a magazine in it (I'll have to watch the scene again to see if there's a mag in it).
Wait, what? Shouldn't the hammer still be back anyway? After all, the gun is still going to cycle even sans magazine, it won't lock open but the hammer should still be cocked.
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Wait, what? Shouldn't the hammer still be back anyway? After all, the gun is still going to cycle even sans magazine, it won't lock open but the hammer should still be cocked.
Duh! Yes. I remember thinking there were two possible explanations for the hammer not being back, but I'll be damned if I can remember the second. Maybe there isn't a second explanation (other than the father took the time to lower the hammer before he died to keep his son safe from a cocked gun).
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I was banned from watching movies with the wife years ago.
Maybe hammer follow?
jim
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I don't tend to catch those kinds of things the first time I watch a movie, unless they're really blatant (or the movie is just really dumb and has already shattered my suspension of disbelief). The second time through I usually pick out a lot more of them.
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How much would it cost to have someone who knows guns say, "hey, don't do that"?
Exactly; they spend milions of dollars making movies. What's the excuse?
I feel the same way about translation and grammar mistakes. Science researchers receive millions of dollars in research funds, but can't seem to find $5 to give to an American middle-schooler to check the very basic grammar of the resulting research paper.
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The sad thing is that most of them probably DID have some sort of firearms adviser and they were either ignored for the sake of some directors ego or "artistic effect" or they just plain missed the goof.
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Several ARMA colleagues went to audition as extras for a film involving swordplay. These are folks who study technique from historical texts. None were selected, because they couldn't bring themselves to execute the silly sword manipulations the audition stipulated. Either the director won't see anything but what is in their mind's eye, or they insist on catering the the perceived expectations of the audience.
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The sad thing is that most of them probably DID have some sort of firearms adviser and they were either ignored for the sake of some directors ego or "artistic effect" or they just plain missed the goof.
This.
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Biggest for me is when someone pops out the cylinder of a revolver and spins it and you hear a clicking sound. That and the sound of a hammer being chocked back when the the person on screen is preparing to shoot their Glock.
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My pet peeve is people involved in a gunfight - sometimes indoors or in a tunnel! - that take time to whisper to one another and plan strategy.
Sure . . . like anyone's going to hear a whisper after long strings of gunfire, grenades, etc. going off at arm's length with no ear protection.
The only movie that comes to mind where they did mention hearing problems after a gunfight was Blackhawk Down.
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(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fa.imageshack.us%2Fimg833%2F8338%2Fewen050202401x450.jpg&hash=926ba6f7f0c9797abd940aa83def1524c007bf0a)
=D
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There was a Steven Segal movie (can't remember the name) where he was using Glock. When he pulled the trigger you could see the slide rack, once, each time he pulled the trigger. What you heard with each trigger pull, though, was the distintive b-r-r-rappp of something firing off 3-5 rounds on full auto.
Brad
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What you heard with each trigger pull, though, was the distintive b-r-r-rappp of something firing off 3-5 rounds on full auto.
That's just the sound his pony tail makes when it shakes.
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1911 hammer down: Pulled the trigger from a muscular spasm when the bullet hit?
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1911 hammer down: Pulled the trigger from a muscular spasm when the bullet hit?
Must be one of those double action 1911's nobody buy Hollywood has ever heard of.
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That's just the sound his pony tail makes when it shakes.
Not the jiggle of his multiple chins?
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Must be one of those double action 1911's nobody buy Hollywood has ever heard of.
Para LDA.... :-*
BHD was a freaking fantastically great movie, but they even had gun foopahs in there. During the scene where the saw gunners are being chased and trying to reestablish contact, you can clearly see blanks being fed into the gun.
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The IMFDB site also says that while the Delta operator is defending the pilot, his 1911 jams and the subsequent muzzle flashes are CGI.
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If you know much of anything about Any Particular Subject, you will notice that the movies almost always get it wrong ;/
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If you know much of anything about Any Particular Subject, you will notice that the movies almost always get it wrong ;/
+ Eleventy billion, sir!
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If you know much of anything about Any Particular Subject, you will notice that the movies almost always get it wrong.
Yep. One of the worst examples of that was in the Clint Eastwood move, "The Rookie." He and Charlie Sheen are in Eastwood's garage, and Sheen looks at what appears to be an old Harley.
"47 FLH," Sheen says.
Pretty amazing, considering that Harley didn't have an electric start until the 70's. The bike in the movie was a current production Heritage Softtail.
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During the scene where the saw gunners are being chased and trying to reestablish contact, you can clearly see blanks being fed into the gun.
Yeah, it's especially glaring with some movies when you watch Blu-Ray these days.
The overall visual and sound quality boost makes up for it though. =D
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Why can't we go back to the golden days of Hollywood when they used real bullets in the guns? At least more actors had a chance to get screen time, although it was often short. ;)
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If you know much of anything about Any Particular Subject, you will notice that the movies almost always get it wrong ;/
Yeppers. I've often wondered if technical advisors could be more of a generalist rather than a specialist, with a broad technical background and overall knowledge. They would also have to be skilled researchers, able to quickly look up and verify things they don't have direct experience with.
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If you know much of anything about Any Particular Subject, you will notice that the movies almost always get it wrong ;/
Yep pretty much. For example most musicians cringe whenever they see people "playing" musical instruments on screen. Also, most "conductors" on screen are pretty laughable too.
I think the problem is that to get things completely authentic you need a technical advisor at every single step of the production process. It may not add much to the cost of a movie to have a couple more consultants, but it costs a lot of money having a know-it-all step in to correct things every step of the way. This could really slow down a very tight schedule. And when costs are in the thousands of dollars an hour range, details necessarily get overlooked.
Whenever I go to see a movie I try to turn off my inner Cliff Clavin and just let my suspension of disbelief take over.
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If you know much of anything about Any Particular Subject, you will notice that the movies almost always get it wrong ;/
Which is the main reason I don't normally watch submarine movies.
I do like Up Periscope though.
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It shouldn't take a weapons expert to point out to some of these directors that standing in a circle around the target, with guns drawn, is inconvenient at best.
I can now say that Ultraviolet is the worst offender in this regard. But one must endure the first half hour of the film to understood just how badly they screw that up.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/172559/ultraviolet
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I think the problem is that to get things completely authentic you need a technical advisor at every single step of the production process. It may not add much to the cost of a movie to have a couple more consultants, but it costs a lot of money having a know-it-all step in to correct things every step of the way. This could really slow down a very tight schedule. And when costs are in the thousands of dollars an hour range, details necessarily get overlooked.
I get what you're saying, but it sure seems like in a room full of actors, staff, set people etc. SOMEONE should be equipped with the common sense to tell CSI that a 22.5" bus tire, being driven to destruction at high speed, does not go "pfft" when it fails... it sounds like a 12ga and can send rubber bits far and fast enough to penetrate your lab coat or knock your safety glasses off :P Ask me how I know.
Or to the firearms angle, isn't there SOMEBODY in the cast or crew who has fired a Glock or 1911 and knows a little about strikers and hammers?
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It shouldn't take a weapons expert to point out to some of these directors that standing in a circle around the target, with guns drawn, is inconvenient at best.
I can now say that Ultraviolet is the worst offender in this regard. But one must endure the first half hour of the film to understood just how badly they screw that up.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/172559/ultraviolet
At least Ultraviolet makes no claims or attempts at being anywhere near realistic.
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If you know much of anything about Any Particular Subject, you will notice that the movies almost always get it wrong ;/
As do most news shows.
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As do most news shows.
Too true =(
Is there some sort of process in journalism schools that sucks any possible particle of practical knowledge out of the students' brains ???
Or are journalists from an alien planet and grew up without any local knowledge of life here on earth...? =|
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Journalism is one of those fields young people go into because they can't design a widget, write a computer code, argue a legal case, diagnose a cold, fix a motor, or replace a faucet. If they didn't go into journalism, they'd have to become cops. ;)
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Journalism is one of those fields young people go into because they can't design a widget, write a computer code, argue a legal case, diagnose a cold, fix a motor, or replace a faucet. If they didn't go into journalism, they'd have to become cops. ;)
I don't know how to do any of those. I am also too honest to be a journalist. :P =| =(
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Journalism is one of those fields young people go into because they can't design a widget, write a computer code, argue a legal case, diagnose a cold, fix a motor, or replace a faucet. If they didn't go into journalism, they'd have to become cops. ;)
Or publik skool teechurs.
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Journalism is one of those fields young people go into because they can't design a widget, write a computer code, argue a legal case, diagnose a cold, fix a motor, or replace a faucet. If they didn't go into journalism, they'd have to become cops politicians. ;)
Fixed for reality....
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At least Ultraviolet makes no claims or attempts at being anywhere near realistic.
Let's hope it also makes no claims to being a good flick.
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Because safe firearms handling is boring onscreen. Simple as that.
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Or to the firearms angle, isn't there SOMEBODY in the cast or crew who has fired a Glock or 1911 and knows a little about strikers and hammers?
Even if there was, would they be able to bend the ear of a producer or a director/assistant director?