Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: MillCreek on January 07, 2011, 08:56:56 AM
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I need a new gun like I need another hole in my head, but my collection of 28 long guns/hand guns is missing something: a single-action revolver. I am thinking that a nice stainless SA revolver may be just the ticket.
Does anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? The Taurus Gaucho got some good press, but apparently is no longer made. I have been giving the Ruger Vaquero a long look.
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I have a Vaquero in 45LC. I have the ~4 3/4" barrel and I find the gun very ergonomic and fun to shoot. I got it over ten years ago, and a quick check of the Ruger site doesn't show any of the new ones looking like mine. I have the case-hardened coloring on the cylinder and wooden grips.
I also have a Super Blackhawk that I got when I was a 19 year old kid who couldn't decide if he wanted to emulate Clint Eastwood as Dirty Harry or the man with no name. It's a very well made revolver, but after the initial 44mag-mania wore off, I began to find it and its 7 1/2" barrel a bit unwieldy. Doesn't sit in the hand as well as the vaquero either.
Edite: Case hardened look is on the frame, not cylinder. duh.
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A friend wants a Ruger single action they have that has cylinders for 45LC and 45ACP. Not sure how well it performs, but the model looks nice.
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The new stainless Ruger Blackhawks in 44special are nice. If I were going to buy a SA revolver it would probably be a Bisley model and either 44mag or 44special.
Chris
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BTW, there is also a 44special version of the Vaquero IIRC.
Chris
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My votes go to either a Ruger Vaquero in .44 special, or a USFA Rodeo in .45 Colt.
The Taurus Gaucho got some good press
So does The Judge, whenever Taurus greases the right palms at the gun rags. The Gaucho was short-lived because of quality problems, and SASS shooters are pretty hard on their gear.
If you don't want to spend USFA/Colt prices and Ruger is your top price point, then look into the Beretta Stampedes or the Cimarron/Uberti stuff. But steer clear of the Guano Gaucho.
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Mighty tempting...
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi27.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc170%2FRockyRaab%2FIMG_1483.jpg&hash=5b4f515314ec9e76c3af55afc56ca9363e7d335a)
Chris
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If I were buying a single action revolver, it would almost certainly be something from Freedom Arms. I've had a chance to handle and shoot some of their guns, and was very impressed with accuracy and workmanship . . . but the high bore line and handle configuration of SA revolvers makes them considerably less comfortable to shoot in any serious caliber than a DA revolver.
Hmmm . . . there's also someone making reproductions of the Colt SAA that are supposedly better than anything Colt ever made, in terms of both materials and workmanship . . . but I don't remember the manufacturer. (Maybe USFA?) If I really needed a single action, I'd look into one of these for a "non-Magnum" option.
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Freedom Arms are quite nice, but they're pricey. A good compromise between them and Ruger is Magnum Research's BFR. They're worth a look. If you shop around, you can get a BFR for $500-$900. They also go big bore with the 475L, 500AE, 500S&W Magnum, etc.
Chris
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There's some good general SA info here: http://singleactions.proboards.com/index.cgi
Chris
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I have one of the Uberti's in 4 3/4 .45 Colt. I tore it down and did a little smoothing and changed out the springs. It is a nice shooting revolver. A ton of fun with full black powder loads. And I think I only have about $400-$450 in it including tax and a spring set.
jim
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I know they're expensive, but I've had a couple of Colt SAA's (one first generation, and one second circa 1956). Absolute works of art.
Ben, the Colts have case hardening on the frame, not the cylinder. Why the "duh"?
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I guess it all depends on what you want.
For a working gun, a Ruger Blackhawk in .44 magnum would probably be best. (modern gun in modern caliber)
The Vaquero has fixed sights (groove in top strap) and the Blackhawk adjustable sights.
Or you could just get a Single Six if you just want to plink ???
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On revolvers, I have standardized calibers on .22 LR and .38 and .357, since I have Lee dies for that caliber. So I have a bias towards finding something in .357. Since I already have around six or so Ruger revolvers, they were my first thought in terms of a single-action. The Blackhawk sounds nice......
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Blackhawk .357 is my daily carry =)
OTOH, I sometime think I should have held out for a New Vaquero in stainless... =|
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Ben, the Colts have case hardening on the frame, not the cylinder. Why the "duh"?
The "duh" was because I hadn't had my second cup of coffee yet and said the reverse. :)
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My choice would be either another Vaquero or a Blackhawk but I'd look for one of the old models. Ruger trimed some heft off of the Vaqueros a few years ago to make them more "Colt Sized" IMHO they did a major disservice to a darned good revolver.
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My choice would be either another Vaquero or a Blackhawk but I'd look for one of the old models. Ruger trimed some heft off of the Vaqueros a few years ago to make them more "Colt Sized" IMHO they did a major disservice to a darned good revolver.
Don't need all that heft for a .357. Even the New Vaquero is way over built for that caliber.
For the .45 the bigger frame can be nice. I have an Old Vaquero that is my "bear gun" =)
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Mighty tempting...
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi27.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc170%2FRockyRaab%2FIMG_1483.jpg&hash=5b4f515314ec9e76c3af55afc56ca9363e7d335a)
Chris
That.
Right there.
Keep the bbl 5" or less.
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I need a new gun like I need another hole in my head, but my collection of 28 long guns/hand guns is missing something: a single-action revolver. I am thinking that a nice stainless SA revolver may be just the ticket.
Does anyone have any suggestions or recommendations? The Taurus Gaucho got some good press, but apparently is no longer made. I have been giving the Ruger Vaquero a long look.
I've seen A-Merc ammo get good press too. :facepalm:
I have a Taurus Gaucho. There's a reason they don't make them anymore; they were POS's. (very pretty POS's) On mine, the firing pin was not fitted, and the base pin was not hardened (at all.) Those two things caused all kinds of weird problems. I've taken care of both of them and it didn't cost all that much, but I'm afraid the sear might also not be hardened and the gun has a very light trigger.
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On revolvers, I have standardized calibers on .22 LR and .38 and .357, since I have Lee dies for that caliber. So I have a bias towards finding something in .357. Since I already have around six or so Ruger revolvers, they were my first thought in terms of a single-action. The Blackhawk sounds nice......
I have a stainless New Blackhawk in .357. It's a great gun, and a lot of fun to shoot. Mine is a little long in the barrel, but has sentimental value. This:
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi11.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fa199%2Fdogmush%2FWeapons%2F0353.jpg&hash=7b7b7bff0a28d1caa685eac3f2abee2647fe16a6)
Is a fine revolver.
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^^^^ This makes my heart go pitter-pat. A beauty. I have to check and see if they come in the 4.5" barrel size.
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^^^^ This makes my heart go pitter-pat. A beauty. I have to check and see if they come in the 4.5" barrel size.
4.62" close enough?
http://www.ruger.com/products/newModelBlackhawkStainless/models.html
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For the life of me, all I could remember was the 5.5 and 6.5. A friend of mine has the .44 Mag Super Blackhawk with the 10.5 barrel, and it is a beast. It is heavy enough that if feels as if it should be crew-served. But boy, that barrel length and weight damp down the recoil right nice.
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For the life of me, all I could remember was the 5.5 and 6.5. A friend of mine has the .44 Mag Super Blackhawk with the 10.5 barrel, and it is a beast. It is heavy enough that if feels as if it should be crew-served. But boy, that barrel length and weight damp down the recoil right nice.
I have a 7.5" Ruger Bisley like that in .45 Colt. Unfluted cylinder, which adds even more to the weight. It's so heavy, it's hard to load it hot enough to hurt my hand. =D
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If you're only going to have ONE SA revolver, IMHO it should be either a Colt SAA or a S&W break-top. Both companies are making current models of their quintessential "old west" revolvers, so you don't have to spring for a collectible.
'Course, having said that, I guess I have to confess to owning a couple of Ruger Blackhawks and a Uberti SAA clone, but no Colt. "Do as I say and not as I do."
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I have been a big fan of the Blackhawks. Even though they are not as traditional looking as the Peacemaker and peacemaker clones, I like the adjustable sights.
Right now CDNN still has some of the Anniversary Blackhawks in .44 mag for $369. (They had the .357 mag version for the same price for quite a while, but they aren't' showing them in their catalog anymore.) That is a tremendous value.
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A friend wants a Ruger single action they have that has cylinders for 45LC and 45ACP. Not sure how well it performs, but the model looks nice.
I've got that model, and it works great for me. It is fun to just throw in my range bag with my 1911 and not have to worry about .45LC ammo.
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I have a stainless Taurus Gaucho. No problems, but I don't shoot it very much. I got just so I had a SA revolver. Seemed somehow wrong not to own one.
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OK, I am going to start going to the shows and keeping an eye out for a stainless New Blackhawk.
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A three screw Ruger Single Six (22-22mag) found me a few years ago.
I LOVE that gun.
I'd go Ruger (or Colt's, I suppose) on a SA big bore.
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OK, I am going to start going to the shows and keeping an eye out for a stainless New Blackhawk.
I used to hate stainless, but every carry gun I've had has lost most of the blue off the cylinder within a year. :(
The shortest barrel is something like 4 5/8" which is even with the end of the ejector tube. Back in the day these were "gunfighter models." This is what my .357 BH has and I like that length fine for everyday use.
I've got an old Vaq .45 in 5.5" and honestly I'm not sure I like that length now. If I had it to do over I think I would go with either the gunfighter version or the traditional original 7.5". I thought the 5.5" was a good compromise, but some compromises are the worst of both extremes.
Just keep in mind the .357 BH is way overbuilt (being on a .44 mag frame) but the new Vaquero somewhat less so.
I wish I could afford a dozen or so Ruger SA's so I could try out all the combinations :)
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Because I so often carry whilst doing outdoor activities in the very wet part of the Pacific NW, I prefer corrosion-resistant finishes whenever I can get them. This is not to say that I don't have some beautifully blued-handguns, but especially for a working gun, I really like stainless. And I am not opposed to the typical over-built Ruger revolver, having several of them already. If worst comes to worst, they do make a handy blunt object.
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At least look at Bowen Classic Arms. (http://bowenclassicarms.com/)
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Thread drift, but in going to the Ruger site, I see the new LC9 has been announced. Hmm. Put a stainless slide on it, and I will look at that, too.
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+1 on the medium-frame Blackhawk/Vaquero sixguns....they'll outlast you......
But, for a single-action .22lr for plinking, I'd lean more toward the Bearcats. They're a lot lighter and handier than the Single-Sixes for woods-wandering. One of my "one-of-these-days" projects will be to get a blued Bearcat and then obtain a stainless Bearcat cylinder to get bored out to .22Mag and fitted.
Be sure to post pics of your new purchase....
P.S.: The LC9 is impressing the heck out of me, too. Now I'll have to decide which of my compact 9's to trade for it.....the XDsc or the Firestar.... =|
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Thread drift, but in going to the Ruger site, I see the new LC9 has been announced. Hmm. Put a stainless slide on it, and I will look at that, too.
Even given the internal key lock, mag disconnect and a manual safety on a long and heavy DAO trigger?
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But, for a single-action .22lr for plinking, I'd lean more toward the Bearcats. They're a lot lighter and handier than the Single-Sixes for woods-wandering. One of my "one-of-these-days" projects will be to get a blued Bearcat and then obtain a stainless Bearcat cylinder to get bored out to .22Mag and fitted.
I prefer the Bearcat over the Single Six as well. I've owned the SS and currently own a Bearcat. After I finish some projects around the house, I'm going to send mine out to have the etching removed from the cylinder, cylinder fluted, j-frame adjustable sights installed, and a trigger job. I already have the quote, about $450 for everything. I also have stag grips on the way from Sack Peterson.
Kind of like this (but in 22lr, not mag):
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sackpeterson.com%2FHartonBC.jpg&hash=1aebce1015affbe5fcded04c2b93dd3c66e63928)
Chris
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missing something: a single-action revolver
Actually, now that I think about it more - you are missing several single-action revolvers.
Whatever made you think that you can stop with just one...? :lol:
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For plinking, I have one of the hard-to-find Ruger SP-101s in .22 LR, with the four inch heavy barrel. If Ruger was smart, they would bring that back.
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For plinking, I have one of the hard-to-find Ruger SP-101s in .22 LR, with the four inch heavy barrel. If Ruger was smart, they would bring that back.
Or release a 3-4" LCR in 22lr.
I don't know why Ruger is willing to chase recreational shooters with their SA guns but only develops DA guns for "serious business".
Chris
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Even given the internal key lock, mag disconnect and a manual safety on a long and heavy DAO trigger?
I have several pistols already with exactly that configuration, so it is familiar to me.
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Only single actions I'm familiar with and have shot a lot are Rugers- .357 blackhawk, Old model single six, and Bearcat. First two belong to my dad, the Bearcat belongs to me. I loved all three. And I agree with others, the Bearcat beats the pants off a single six for plinking, its tiny but still seems to fit perfectly in my big mitts. I'm really itching for a Super Blackhawk in .44 magnum- I'm really interested in getting a carbine/revolver combo in that chambering.
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Or release a 3-4" LCR in 22lr.
I'm all for that.....add a fiber-optic front sight/adjustable rear like the MkIII Hunter, and you've got a winner and a half....
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But, for a single-action .22lr for plinking, I'd lean more toward the Bearcats. They're a lot lighter and handier than the Single-Sixes for woods-wandering. One of my "one-of-these-days" projects will be to get a blued Bearcat and then obtain a stainless Bearcat cylinder to get bored out to .22Mag and fitted.
Bad idea.
Research the bullet diameters for .22LR and .22 WMR before commencing.
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Bad idea.
Research the bullet diameters for .22LR and .22 WMR before commencing.
22WMR conversions are fairly common (in groups that do that sort of thing). The picture I posted above is a 22wmr conversion.
Chris
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Bad idea.
Research the bullet diameters for .22LR and .22 WMR before commencing.
I had a Ruger Super Single Six with both .22LR and .22 Mag cylinders. It shot well with both.
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I had a Ruger Super Single Six with both .22LR and .22 Mag cylinders. It shot well with both.
The SS barrel was sized for 22wmr (.224). 22lr will "bump up" and usually fill the bore well enough to be accurate.
The Bearcat has the .222 barrel for 22lr. I don't know if the conversion jobs involve a barrel reaming or if it "just works".
Chris
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IIRC, Ruger uses the same rifiling cutter for the Bearcat and Single-Six Convertable barrels. This makes it a non-issue.
Ruger used to do a convertable Bearcat, but then stopped. Don't know why...never heard of any issues....
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IIRC, Ruger uses the same rifiling cutter for the Bearcat and Single-Six Convertable barrels. This makes it a non-issue.
I've heard both ways, but according to Iowegan on one of the Ruger forums, they don't.
Ruger used to do a convertable Bearcat, but then stopped. Don't know why...never heard of any issues....
IIRC, they were concerned with wear issues or something. So few of the convertible ones got out, and they're such collector's items today, I doubt any of them got shot enough with 22wmr for anyone in the public to find out.
The bore difference is pretty danged small though. .222 vs .224. You see the same level of difference between bore diameter and bullet diameter in typical chambers. I shoot .430 and .431 diameter bullets in my .429" 44mag barrels. I've shot .358" bullets through my .357 barrels. The higher pressure of the 22wmr might be a factor in long term wear and tear, but I doubt it'll be a short term issue wrt safety in any properly built gun.
Chris
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So I am heading down to the WAC show in a few hours. Anyone has an idea as to current reasonable pricing for a stainless New Blackhawk in .357, at any barrel length?
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Do they even make the Blackhawk in stainless? I don't recall ever seeing one =|
FWIW, I paid $400 for a blue .357/9mm in 10-2008.
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Yes, sir: http://www.ruger.com/products/newModelBlackhawkStainless/models.html
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Probably $550ish based on what I've seen recently.
Chris
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Yes, sir: http://www.ruger.com/products/newModelBlackhawkStainless/models.html
Must not be popular in MT ;)
Anyway, just my $0.02 again - I have the blue BH .357/9 4.62 and if I had it to do over I would hold out for the New Vaquero .357 4.62 stainless.
But I found the BH used for about a hundred bucks cheaper...
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I am back from the show where there was not a single stainless New Blackhawk to be had. The closest I found was a 6.5" blued .357 New Blackhawk, in NRA 'Good' condition for $ 475. I passed on it.
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Mill, I just came back from my local gunmonger and this is what they had...
A SS New Model Blackhawk in 44Special was $599, the blued one was right around $500. They didn't have any other calibers in a Blackhawk, but IIRC, the others aren't much cheaper. That said, around here, you can find 357mag Blackhawks for roughly $350-$400 in good shape. If you don't mind used, it might be worth your while to hit Gunbroker. It's not as if you could wear out a SS Blackhawk in 357mag and if you did, it wouldn't be hard to refresh it.
Chris
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Mill, I just came back from my local gunmonger and this is what they had...
A SS New Model Blackhawk in 44Special was $599, the blued one was right around $500. They didn't have any other calibers in a Blackhawk, but IIRC, the others aren't much cheaper. That said, around here, you can find 357mag Blackhawks for roughly $350-$400 in good shape. If you don't mind used, it might be worth your while to hit Gunbroker. It's not as if you could wear out a SS Blackhawk in 357mag and if you did, it wouldn't be hard to refresh it.
Chris
A very good point, and I will look on GB. The sticky wicket is that locally, the FFL transfer fees for a handgun are now running $ 50 or so. If I could find a good used stainless NB, I will be all over it. I agree that you can't hardly wear out a Ruger revolver with a stick.
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I found a couple stainless NB's on Gunbroker. One of them was at a range/gun shop in Puyallup about 65 miles south of me. $ 525 for the 4.62" .357 model, which is exactly what I am looking for. This would avoid a FFL transfer fee but would incur state sales tax. Hmmm. I might have to stop by the next time I am in south Puget Sound.
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I agree that you can't hardly wear out a Ruger revolver with a stick.
Except for the base pin which usuallly comes pre-worn out for some strange reason. ;/
Budget $25 for a new base pin from Belt Mountain.
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The SS barrel was sized for 22wmr (.224). 22lr will "bump up" and usually fill the bore well enough to be accurate.
The Bearcat has the .222 barrel for 22lr. I don't know if the conversion jobs involve a barrel reaming or if it "just works".
Yep, that's the issue. .22 LR and .22 WMR aren't really (exactly) the same caliber. I had an old, German-made copy of a Colt .22 LR six-shooter that I wanted to add a conversion cylinder to, and then I discovered that the barrel wasn't sized for .22 WMR. So I bought a Ruger Single-Six convertible instead. The cute little German pistol disappeared when I was moving in 1995. It was a sad day when I went looking for it and realized that I wasn't going to find it. I had had it for a long time and it carried some pleasant memories.