Armed Polite Society

Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: never_retreat on June 07, 2011, 05:58:48 PM

Title: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: never_retreat on June 07, 2011, 05:58:48 PM
So in this article they want to use an old catering hall and turn it into a mosque. The small road it is on would defiantly be substandard for the amount of people thought to come and go. I've been on it. Tight in a full size truck.
From other articles I have read the only people that want it are the Muslims.
The town also changed overall zoning ordinances last year that would only allow places of worship in areas already zoned a specific way. The area that essentially is left is already developed. So the only way that something could be built they would have to buy very expensive real estate that is mostly shopping malls and stuff like that. Level it and build there holy place.
ehttp://www.nj.com/messenger-gazette/index.ssf/2011/06/bridgewater_council_addressing_the_issues_in_mosque_lawsuit.html (http://ehttp://www.nj.com/messenger-gazette/index.ssf/2011/06/bridgewater_council_addressing_the_issues_in_mosque_lawsuit.html)
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on June 07, 2011, 06:10:47 PM
So basically, the only people who want it are a group that would eventually require the road to be improved?
Their only other option would be going broke to buy something in an area they don't want anyway?

Not to mention, the road could probably use some improvement anyway?

i'm thinking people has panties in a twist over cause they are stupid.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: seeker_two on June 07, 2011, 06:50:43 PM

i'm thinking people has panties in a twist over cause they are stupid.

Seems about right.....  ;/
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: BryanP on June 07, 2011, 09:12:12 PM
So in this article they want to use an old catering hall and turn it into a mosque.
....
From other articles I have read the only people that want it are the Muslims.

Think about that statement for a second.    ;/
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: GigaBuist on June 07, 2011, 10:39:41 PM
I've seen plenty of Christian churches in the area swamp a road that just isn't prepared to handle that kinda traffic on Sundays.  I've also seen it happen with a local greenhouse.

The quick and dirty solution is to have the church (or business) pay for traffic cops to keep things managed during heavy periods.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Perd Hapley on June 07, 2011, 11:22:31 PM
Quote
So what does APS think of relgious structures.

We don't like metal ones, apparently.  :lol:
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Azrael256 on June 07, 2011, 11:32:03 PM
Quote
So basically, the only people who want it are a group that would eventually require the road to be improved?

Yeah, read it again.  The council is willing to spend $100k fighting this.  It's not about a road.

This sure smells like "...prohibiting the free exercise...". 'Course the article is a bit lean, so there could be something we don't know.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Scout26 on June 08, 2011, 12:55:02 AM
Yeah, this ones going to go well.....  ;/
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Tallpine on June 08, 2011, 10:43:58 AM
Quote
So what does APS think of relgious structures.

People should worship outdoors and naked like the goddess intended  =D
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: BlueStarLizzard on June 08, 2011, 11:08:47 AM
People should worship outdoors and naked like the goddess intended  =D

*thinks of AJ's old avatar* no, not everyone.  [barf]
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: KD5NRH on June 08, 2011, 11:14:56 AM
I've seen plenty of Christian churches in the area swamp a road that just isn't prepared to handle that kinda traffic on Sundays.

The Prestonwood Baptist Affront to Good Taste does that to several roads in its area.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: roo_ster on June 08, 2011, 12:20:17 PM
The Prestonwood Baptist Affront to Good Taste does that to several roads in its area.

AKA, "The Baptidome."

http://goo.gl/maps/D6XH

(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3547.voxcdn.com%2Fphotos%2F11%2F45%2F188461_l.jpg&hash=8b04f597c5af680b16bda4fc9466aab2486d7102)
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Scout26 on June 08, 2011, 12:51:50 PM
AKA, "The Baptidome."

http://goo.gl/maps/D6XH

(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3547.voxcdn.com%2Fphotos%2F11%2F45%2F188461_l.jpg&hash=8b04f597c5af680b16bda4fc9466aab2486d7102)
Would it be wrong to wear a Lions shirt and wave a Lions pennant when attending their service?
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Sindawe on June 08, 2011, 01:25:43 PM
"The Baptidome" actually LOOKS like a church, with features that recall the Gothic structures built in Europe and later in the US. 

Unlike this archetexteral mis-mash eyesore a local church put up on the grounds of the old WalMart and Albertson's where I live.

(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fphotos.dailycamera.com%2FNews%2FFLATIRONS-COMMUNITY-CHURCH%2FFLATIRONS5%2F1244636674_XgTU5-L.jpg&hash=8df5f6e249cd4c5aa9829e4fda1d9380a323f11d)

That structure on the far end is a good four stories tall and completly dwarfs all the surrounding structures.  The congregation is so huge that traffic has become an issue when they meet, with parking use spilling over into adjacent commercial parking area.

*thinks of AJ's old avatar* no, not everyone.  [barf]

Come on, even the Gods need a good laugh now and again.  =D
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Stetson on June 08, 2011, 03:02:42 PM
^^^  Thats the church I go to, when I go to church.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: KD5NRH on June 08, 2011, 03:53:20 PM
"The Baptidome" actually LOOKS like a church, with features that recall the Gothic structures built in Europe and later in the US.

Look at the whole thing. (Yes, the baseball field and other assorted stuff is part of the church)
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fk.b5z.net%2Fi%2Fu%2F2178320%2Fi%2FPWBC2.jpg&hash=bfc1861f25c8ab27b77d2e22f28cdd67f1d1b74c)
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: makattak on June 08, 2011, 03:57:10 PM
Look at the whole thing. (Yes, the baseball field and other assorted stuff is part of the church)
http://k.b5z.net/i/u/2178320/i/PWBC2.jpg

Although I don't care for mega-churches, it must be pointed out the the baseball field and track/football field are likely associated with the SCHOOL that is associated with the church.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: AJ Dual on June 08, 2011, 05:01:16 PM
When there's noises being made about using uh... "Baptista Law" to settle things like divorces, and minor community disputes, I'll get more concerned about the mega-churches.

My problem is that codified within Islam is the concepts of Hudaibiya and Taqiya which leaves me with a sinking feeling of being played for a fool for any tolerance or reasonableness I may show.

OTOH, they may both be extremely useful concepts by fundamentalist Islamists who wish to exactly foster such distrust within me of moderate Muslims who fully support American institutions and secular government.

My Libertarianism also comes directly in conflict at times with the notion that: "The Constitution was never intended as a suicide pact."

And, I've got worries that acceptance/tolerance of moderate Islam can provide fertile ground for the radicals. Even when you take it with a huge grain of salt, what's going on in Europe and the U.K. around this issue is deeply disturbing.

Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Tallpine on June 08, 2011, 05:05:20 PM
It just boggles my mind to think of all the people who are willingly donating to support those mega-churches  :O

They don't even have the IRS  ;)
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Viking on June 08, 2011, 06:10:04 PM


My problem is that codified within Islam is the concepts of Hudaibiya and Taqiya which leaves me with a sinking feeling of being played for a fool for any tolerance or reasonableness I may show.
You're not the only one.

Quote
And, I've got worries that acceptance/tolerance of moderate Islam can provide fertile ground for the radicals. Even when you take it with a huge grain of salt, what's going on in Europe and the U.K. around this issue is deeply disturbing.
Same here...
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Azrael256 on June 08, 2011, 09:44:50 PM
The wife and I turned down a good short sale in a nice neighborhood next to Prestonwood because of it.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: never_retreat on June 08, 2011, 10:35:43 PM
AKA, "The Baptidome."

http://goo.gl/maps/D6XH

(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3547.voxcdn.com%2Fphotos%2F11%2F45%2F188461_l.jpg&hash=8b04f597c5af680b16bda4fc9466aab2486d7102)
Where is this monstrosity located?
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: KD5NRH on June 09, 2011, 04:02:02 AM
Where is this monstrosity located?

6801 W Park Blvd
Plano, TX 75093
Bounded by Hebron, Marsh, Midway, and Plano Parkway.

Unfortunately, within view of the Arbor Hills Nature Preserve.  It provides a disturbingly industrial backdrop to 250 acres of walking and biking trails.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: roo_ster on June 09, 2011, 07:57:53 AM
IMO, the Baptidome is not ugly, just...large.  It is not the ugliest structure one can see from Arbor Hills NP.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: cordex on June 09, 2011, 01:13:03 PM
When there's noises being made about using uh... "Baptista Law" to settle things like divorces, and minor community disputes, I'll get more concerned about the mega-churches.
If both parties agree to resolution of a dispute using a particular moderator or set of rules - religious or not - I can't say I care a bit.
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: MicroBalrog on June 09, 2011, 03:26:08 PM
When there's noises being made about using uh... "Baptista Law" to settle things like divorces, and minor community disputes, I'll get more concerned about the mega-churches.


Like Halacha?
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: AJ Dual on June 09, 2011, 03:52:09 PM
Like Halacha?

Sure.

Now that you and Bridgewalker have opened my eyes to the underbelly of Ultra Orthodox Judaism, I'll throw that in the ring. Although they're a relatively small group as compared to Islam, even just the sub-set of Fundie-Islam, or much less, the Baptists. Nor do most flavors of Judaism have any evangelical/conversion mandates to them...  

Orthodox Jews - 1.8-2 million worldwide, with roughly half in Israel. (being generous, not even counting the subset of UOJ's)
Baptists - Roughly 40 million worldwide
Fundamentalist Muslims - 150 million worldwide (Based on a 10% estimate of the world estimate Muslim population of 1.6 Billion.)

So while I certainly understand that there are other extra-judicial religious legal traditions in existence, they have no impact beyond Israel, and exceptionally tiny pockets in other places in the world. And have no stated desire to see it spread or be put upon others. And outside Israel, I've not seen any backlash of note when confronted with the secular legal system of the region.

Baptists? A joke obviously, since I've not heard of any desire on their part to create a parallel religious/legal structure.

Muslims? Sharia? 150 million people who desire to see a world wide caliphate is not insignificant. I refuse to take them lightly, even if their battlefield performance is dismal, and they're getting blown up a lot. Nor will I make light of what's going on in Europe, even if I first take a healthy dose of skepticism to weed out hyperbole.

Leaving modern technology, disparities of force, and logistics out of it, and just focusing only on issues of religion and culture... From a purely pragmatic standpoint, and one of hindsight, I don't think anyone does not think now and again that in terms of their own best interests the (American) Indians, and the Aztecs etc. should not have fought balls to the wall at the first sight of Europeans.

Learning from history and all that...
Title: Re: So what does APS think of relgious structures.
Post by: Viking on June 09, 2011, 04:41:40 PM
From a purely pragmatic standpoint, and one of hindsight, I don't think anyone does not think now and again that in terms of their own best interests the (American) Indians, and the Aztecs etc. should not have fought balls to the wall at the first sight of Europeans.

Learning from history and all that...
There's a bumper/rear-window sticker that was popular over here some years ago, roughly translated to: "The American Indians didn't control immigration, and now they live on reservations"