Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: vaskidmark on September 12, 2012, 05:59:37 AM
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This has got to stop! Pretty soon there will be nowhere safe to go visit.
stay safe.
http://tinyurl.com/9dnkrbz
While biologists may be rejoicing over the recent discovery of a rare spider that was thought to be extinct, not everyone is elated -- particularly commuters around San Antonio, Texas.
Workers found the Braken Bat Cave Meshweaver (Cicurina venii) spider, which hasn't been seen in three decades, in the middle of a $15.1 million highway construction project in northwestern San Antonio. The eyeless arachnid is on the endangered species list—since construction would disrupt the spider's natural habitat, the project has been halted for the foreseeable future.
Jean Krejca, a biologist and President of Zara Environmental who was consulting on the project, made the extraordinary discovery after a downpour of rain revealed a 6-foot deep spider hole. After dissecting the spider, a taxonomist later confirmed that the distinct-looking arachnid was, in fact, the Meshweaver, named for its pattern of webbing.
The Meshweaver was placed on the federal endangered species list in 2000, along with eight other spiders found only in the Texas county. George Veni first identified the spider in 1980 in a location five miles away from the construction site.
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Like I'm going to click that link. Puh-lease.
I knew there was something I didn't like about San Antonio. Liberals who would put a bug that was already thought to be extinct (and yet in the 30 years since anyone has seen one, the world hasn't ended, so clearly we can live without it) ahead of a $15 million dollar road project - and IIRC, the roads in San Antonio need all the help they can get. Ridiculous.
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6 foot deep spider hole?
Styrofoam, gasoline, stir well. Pour and ignite.
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Funny, it was the Texans in Texas that kept me from visiting.
Chris
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Anyone that can't read the context of "Dissected" and is afraid of a dead spider needs to stay out of Texas anyway. There are other things there that might scare you....a live bunny or something.
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Pave the
rainforest caves.
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Since I have only a few spots in my yard that turn brown, I have been spot-watering those areas to save water keeping my grass green. To reduce evaporation losses, I go out after dark with a flashlight to set my little sprinklers.
So I was out in my yard in bare feet shining my flashlight and saw the yard looked like it was wet, because of all the little points of light reflecting back. I was confused until I realized it was thousands of wolf spiders all sitting on top of the grass, and the little points of light were their beady little eyes. There was probably at least 1 per square foot. I don't know why they like my yard so much.
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Since I have only a few spots in my yard that turn brown, I have been spot-watering those areas to save water keeping my grass green. To reduce evaporation losses, I go out after dark with a flashlight to set my little sprinklers.
So I was out in my yard in bare feet shining my flashlight and saw the yard looked like it was wet, because of all the little points of light reflecting back. I was confused until I realized it was thousands of wolf spiders all sitting on top of the grass, and the little points of light were their beady little eyes. There was probably at least 1 per square foot. I don't know why they like my yard so much.
Please post close-up pix.
Use Spoiler wrap.
I live in an area where this phenomenon is possible. Need to know what it looks like.
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I'm confused.
VA has crossed Tejas off the list of places to visit because of the dime-sized, blind spider that dig 6 foot holes or the flaming libtard, enviro-wackos that halted a road construction project?
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VA has crossed Tejas off the list of places to visit because of the dime-sized, blind spider that dig 6 foot holes or the flaming libtard, enviro-wackos that halted a road construction project?
Precisely!
stay safe.
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I don't know why they like my yard so much.
It's your bare feet that they like :lol:
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Well I think it pretty cool they found an animal that was thought to have been extinct.
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Well I think it pretty cool they found an animal that was thought to have been extinct.
Yeah, I remember twenty-something years ago there was some plant in Utah that was thought to be virtually extinct, and then someone found a whole field of it growing right across the road from the state environmental office :facepalm:
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Jean Krejca, a biologist and President of Zara Environmental who was consulting on the project, made the extraordinary discovery after a downpour of rain revealed a 6-foot deep spider hole. After dissecting the spider, a taxonomist later confirmed that the distinct-looking arachnid was, in fact, the Meshweaver, named for its pattern of webbing.
Now it's extinct!
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the Meshweaver, named for its pattern of webbing
Radiant! :lol:
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Texas is a big place. I hadn't even heard of this. 300+ miles away at least.
However, since the endangered species act is a federal law, there must be 49 states that you dont visit anymore.
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Well I think it pretty cool they found an animal that was thought to have been extinct.
To bad it wasn't something more interesting than a spider. [popcorn]
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Now THAT would be something to talk about!
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What puzzles me is that when the construction crews opened up the hole, someone apparently thought to call the Federal Spider Cops instead of getting a can of Raid and dealing with the problem the way any rational person would.
And with a $16,000,000,000,000+ national debt, it's rather upsetting to know that we're spending money on Federal Spider Cops. :mad:
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What puzzles me is that when the construction crews opened up the hole, someone apparently thought to call the Federal Spider Cops instead of getting a can of Raid and dealing with the problem the way any rational person would.
And with a $16,000,000,000,000+ national debt, it's rather upsetting to know that we're spending money on Federal Spider Cops. :mad:
Maybe you its just a blind spider but what if the next protected species is a bug that in 20 years science discovers it secretes a chemical that cures certain cancers?
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Maybe you its just a blind spider but what if the next protected species is a bug that in 20 years science discovers it secretes a chemical that cures certain cancers?
No juju in sky flower.
Sky flower home for bugs.
:lol:
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Maybe you its just a blind spider but what if the next protected species is a bug that in 20 years science discovers it secretes a chemical that cures certain cancers?
Does this ever happen outside of 1970s made-for-TV-movies? [popcorn] [tinfoil]
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Does this ever happen outside of 1970s made-for-TV-movies? [popcorn] [tinfoil]
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Or any movie at all? ? :facepalm:
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If a spider has ever saved mankind from any freakin' thing, I'll wear Monkeyleg's moccasins.
Yeah, I see y'all scurrying to research the topic. Let me just say, the Horseshoe Crab doesn't count.
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If a spider has ever saved mankind from any freakin' thing, I'll wear Monkeyleg's moccasins.
Yeah, I see y'all scurrying to research the topic. Let me just say, the Horseshoe Crab doesn't count.
Google: spider toxin impotence
I hope you like those moccasins.
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Does this ever happen outside of 1970s made-for-TV-movies? [popcorn] [tinfoil]
Google ecteinascidin
Comes from sea squirts that live in the West Indies coral reefs.
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Google ecteinascidin
Comes from sea squirts that live in the West Indies coral reefs.
Sea squirts is spiders? Since when?
stay safe.
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Maybe you its just a blind spider but what if the next protected species is a bug that in 20 years science discovers it secretes a chemical that cures certain cancers?
Then the spider truly will go extinct, for Big Pharma will kill it off. [tinfoil]
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Then the spider truly will go extinct, for Big Pharma will kill it off. [tinfoil]
No they will breed it and build confinments in Iowa and South Carolina to rear them.
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I don't see what it shouldn't receive any less study, preservation, and protection than panda bears or california condors. Yes its not charismatic megafauna , but we also don't know yet if its an evolutionary dead end like the other two either.
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Speaking of Federal Spider Cops. Listening to the radio yesterday there was a news item reporting that the "National Drought Mitigation Center" reported that this years drought was the worst in 50 years.
I blew Gatorade all over the dashboard and windshield (It was raining at my son's football practice). "National Drought Mitigation Center"?!?!?
And exactly WTF did they do to "Mitigate" the drought. Run around with watering cans?? They certainly didn't need to "raise awareness" as the nooz and weather people where harping on the subject constantly.
I saw no signs of "Mitigation" this summer other then my city banning watering of lawns.
If that's all we get a report saying "It was bad". (No *expletive deleted*it, Sherlock. All I had to do was go look at my yard.) Then that's one thing that can be cut from the budget. With extreme prejudice.
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Speaking of Federal Spider Cops. Listening to the radio yesterday there was a news item reporting that the "National Drought Mitigation Center" reported that this years drought was the worst in 50 years.
I blew Gatorade all over the dashboard and windshield (It was raining at my son's football practice). "National Drought Mitigation Center"?!?!?
And exactly WTF did they do to "Mitigate" the drought. Run around with watering cans?? They certainly didn't need to "raise awareness" as the nooz and weather people where harping on the subject constantly.
I saw no signs of "Mitigation" this summer other then my city banning watering of lawns.
If that's all we get a report saying "It was bad". (No *expletive deleted*, Sherlock. All I had to do was go look at my yard.) Then that's one thing that can be cut from the budget. With extreme prejudice.
Being a student of forestry there is a few things one can do to mitigate a drought.
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Being a student of forestry there is a few things one can do to mitigate a drought.
Well, yeah, but just how much beer can you haul out to the woods before it becomes just another picnic site?
And doesn't taking all that water out of the lake to make the beer just make things worse till you put it back in the ground?
stay safe.
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Well, yeah, but just how much beer can you haul out to the woods before it becomes just another picnic site?
And doesn't taking all that water out of the lake to make the beer just make things worse till you put it back in the ground?
stay safe.
I'll write more tonight.
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Drought Mitigation.
Okay droughts happen, its part of the natural climate cycles, in North American much of it is tied to the El Nino/La Nina activity on the severity of the drought. Droughts and wet cycles have been happening for eons.
We have been tearing up landscape of the US for since the late 1500's and biggest changes probably happened 1800-1940's with agriculture and logging actions. The native vegitation was adpated to survive wet and dry periods and for the most part kept the soil covered and reduced water losses.
Modern agriculture goes from ditch to ditch, exposing the bare soil at least 7-8 months of the year. Also wetlands have been drained, rivers striaghten, aquifers depleated faster then they can recharge, mass population centers in arid areas, salination of soil and natural water areas, etc.
Now to the drought mitigaton.
With modern ag, many small practices to hold the soil and moisture in the soil have not been adapted, especially in the last few years of high commodity prices where producers are tempted to tear up every bit of land to squeeze as much produce out of the ground as possible.
Some ground should not be tilled, it either too dry or highly erodible. Some areas of the country shouldn't even been farmer/grazed, its so dry that even the native vegitation has a hard time growing. Large communities shouldn't happened in extreme arid areas when the basic resources to sustain them are brought in from hundred of miles away, such as potable water.
There is going to have to be a culture switch in different practices to save our resources, such as expanding water ways, establishing wetlands to store subsurface water and aquifier recharging. Taking some land out of row crop production, switching from water depended grains such as corn to ones that thrive in dryer climates such wheat. I could go on and on.
Were not going to stop the droughts but to help ease the damage/ pain from the drought measures are going to be needed to protect the enviroment and ensure we have ample clean water and food production for generations to come.
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Drought Mitigation.
Okay droughts happen,
....
TL,DR.
Now, how much beer are we gonna need to take out to the woods and whiz to restore the aquifer?
Details, man! We need specific details!
stay safe.
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That sounds like what Soil and Water Conservation Districts are already doing. (Such as no-till farming and CRP programs.)
I didn't read anything that they did to "Mitigate" the drought.
Useless Fed.gov entity. Kill with Fire.
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That sounds like what Soil and Water Conservation Districts are already doing. (Such as no-till farming and CRP programs.)
I didn't read anything that they did to "Mitigate" the drought.
Useless Fed.gov entity. Kill with Fire.
No till doesn't happen as much as you think and CRP contracts are not being renewed.
This is what drought mitigation is trying to prevent from happening.
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Not going to stop the drought but try to lessen the damage.
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Thier mission statement
The National Drought Mitigation Center (NDMC), established at the University of Nebraska-Lincoln in 1995, helps people and institutions develop and implement measures to reduce societal vulnerability to drought, stressing preparedness and risk management rather than crisis management.
Wow, an government agency trying to be proactive instead of reactive. Plus it appears to be a center at a University. This is fairly common to have governmental sponsored research centers at major universities where the scientific resources and talent are already at.
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TL,DR.
Now, how much beer are we gonna need to take out to the woods and whiz to restore the aquifer?
Details, man! We need specific details!
stay safe.
More beer than you could possibly imagine.
I don't think there is enough beer in the world that would be drunk and peed on the ground in North Dakota would even raise the level of the Ogallala aquifer more than a few mils.
Here is one way to look at it, you and I drink a 12 pack of beer in the woods, that should generate about a gallon of urine. As we pee it on the ground this what happens to the water. Some of it is suspended in the soil as bound water, some of it evaporates into the atmosphere, some of it is drawn up by the trees and then transvaporated in the atmosphere by cellular respiration, some of it binds into sugars (food for the plant) through photosynthesis (6C02+6H20+energy= C6H12O6+ 602) and some of is run off which means it will flow to a stream and eventually our pee will end up in an ocean somewhere. Maybe a single drop or less of that gallon of pee will inflitrate down into the aquifer.
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Charby,
Unless and until the NDMC can make it rain when it hasn't in a while, it's not "Proactive" and there's nothing you can say that makes it worth spending tax dollar one on it.
It is worthless agencies like this that cause our massive .gov debt.
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Charby,
Unless and until the NDMC can make it rain when it hasn't in a while, it's not "Proactive" and there's nothing you can say that makes it worth spending tax dollar one on it.
It is worthless agencies like this that cause our massive .gov debt.
I guess we can just carry on with business like usual tossing resources into the wind (kind of like spending more than we take in) until the Midwest resembles Wymoning from all the soil erosion and water is too expensive to purify for human consumption.
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As I pointed out, we already have Soil and Water Conservation Districts that work with farmers to prevent soil erosion and conserve water.
Yes, I read the NDMC mission statement. But. what. do. they. actually. do?
I spend a lot of time in Illinois farm county. They use no-till methods, There are strips of prairie grasses between fields (and ditches have gotten "larger").
I know. I spent a great deal of time working with our Soil and Water Conservation District when I was president of the Aurora Sportsman's Club. Because we had moved a lot of dirt to construct the ranges/berms and had to prevent both soil and water run-off (Why we have 3 ponds and 14 acre lake.)
And yes, commodity prices are inducing farmers not to renew their CRP contracts, but most Illinois CRP contracts are for 14 years. And once commodity prices fall next year (more than likely as farmers will over-produce because prices are high) much of that land will go back into CRP.
It's a worthless agency. One of thousands that need to be defunded and ended.
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As I pointed out, we already have Soil and Water Conservation Districts that work with farmers to prevent soil erosion and conserve water.
Yes, I read the NDMC mission statement. But. what. do. they. actually. do?
Soil and water districts take orders from NRCS, NRCS basically do whatever is in the current farm bill to work out cost share or CRP programs, they are a policy pushers for the most part. So they change from farm bill to farm bill.
What do they do, I think of them as a think tank, big picture type of acedemic+fed government organization. I really don't know how much money they are funded. I know that the center is at a Land Grant Univeristy. Its fits within means from the organic act establishing Land Grant Universities, where the knowledge learned at the University is to be shared to the masses via extension type services.
I'm pretty sure the amount of no till even in IL has reduced from the its hey day in the 1980's. Much of really good farm land in IL is developed from glacial till and developed under a prairie, similar to the good soil in Iowa. It is also easy compacted and does require tillage for row crops, perhaps not every year with a corn/bean roatation but corn on corn is going to require regular tillage or yeilds will decrease. Many farms don't till after beans but do after corn.
Also many famers have gotten bigger operations and have gone back to fall tillage because of the wetter spring cycles the Midwest have been experiencing which leaves bare soil over winter which gets carried away in the wind or eroded by snowmelt/winter rains due to lack of stuble on the ground.
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More beer than you could possibly imagine.
I don't think there is enough beer in the world that would be drunk and peed on the ground in North Dakota would even raise the level of the Ogallala aquifer more than a few mils.
Here is one way to look at it, ....
Gah! You try to make fun of glueing the soil down and end up with a scientific lecture on where water goes. Besides, thanks to the diabeetus I can't participate in any beer-to-aquifer improvement projects. Now if you want to talk about Lasix and non-nutrative sweetener-enhanced beverages ....
stay safe.
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Show me where the NDMC is listed as a required .gov agency in the Constitution.
It's worthless and needs to die. If the university(s) and/or state(s) think it's important, then let them fund it.
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Show me where the NDMC is listed as a required .gov agency in the Constitution.
It's worthless and needs to die. If the university(s) and/or state(s) think it's important, then let them fund it.
Legislature is in the US Constitution, they passed a bill of some sorts that included that center, a US President (also in the Constitution) signed off and now its legal.
Also universities normally don't fund themselves, its a mix of federal, state, private grants and tutition dollars, sometimes income from interest on their investments in their foundation accounts.
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Scout I see that you are wanting smaller governemnt, well I feel the same way also.I do too but I think there is other low hanging fruit that would be easier to cull.
Such as IRS (go to a flat tax of some sort reduce the size/power of the department), Homeland Security (bunch of paranoia propagandaist and reminds me too much of the Nazi SS), etc
Things like the a healthy and clean environment and sustainable food production to me are vital to national security so I feel are worth protecting to ensure that they both continue for generations to come. If you get bored sometime read about why the feds (and a push from private industry) decided to set aside forested and grass lands in the late 1880's. It wasn't to keep people from not using the timber but to reserve it for future generations and protect water quality. Progress at the time had burned through a lot of resources when a few decades easier people thought it was an unexhaustible resource.
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...
If you get bored sometime read about why the feds (and a push from private industry) decided to set aside forested and grass lands in the late 1880's. It wasn't to keep people from not using the timber but to reserve it for future generations and protect water quality. Progress at the time had burned through a lot of resources when a few decades easier people thought it was an unexhaustible resource.
Trouble is that now a lot of people think those same forests and grasslands should be preserved and/or used strictly for recreation instead of for harvesting timber and cattle grazing.
It's a mighty effort for the Forest Circus to even sell off fire-killed timber for harvest, because the wood rots beyond usefulness before all the litigation gets settled :facepalm:
Anyway, drought "mitigation" seems to be all about "adaption" to the drought cycles. ;)
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Trouble is that now a lot of people think those same forests and grasslands should be preserved and/or used strictly for recreation instead of for harvesting timber and cattle grazing.
It's a mighty effort for the Forest Circus to even sell off fire-killed timber for harvest, because the wood rots beyond usefulness before all the litigation gets settled :facepalm:
I don't disagree, forest policy changed from strickly timber reserves and water protection to multiuse purposes starting in the 1950's but some how the proponents of the recreation/wildlife habitat/environmentalist forget about the other two as part of the multiuse laws.
This seems to be more of a problem in the West, some in the East but the Northwood National Forests are usually left alone to be harvested/managed.
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And another example of how once you get the fed.gov involved the problem only gets worse.
Does the Forest Circus still have the stupid idea of fighting every fire instead of periodically allowing them to burn out the undergrowth and "litter" that's makes fires worse?
How about when it does sell timber, selling it for loss?
If the bunny-huggers want to "Preserve" land, how about buying it, instead of suing the owners and/or the fed.gov?
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Does the Forest Circus still have the stupid idea of fighting every fire instead of periodically allowing them to burn out the undergrowth and "litter" that's makes fires worse?
No, they normally let it burn unless it threatens residential areas or areas of significance.
Controled burns are hard because of legal battles and so forth.
The put it out before noon policy has been gone for many years.
How about when it does sell timber, selling it for loss?
I don't know how to answer this since most standing timber is sold on bids.
If the bunny-huggers want to "Preserve" land, how about buying it, instead of suing the owners and/or the fed.gov?
They do but land has to be for sale first. Groups like the Nature Conservancy already do this.
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How about when it does sell timber, selling it for loss?
That one is pretty sore for me :mad:
The whole "loss" thing is mostly accounting, and all the ridiculous administration overhead that they add to the process - thus making it "cost" more than what the timber was worth to begin with. ;/
Often timber is removed for some other purpose than "profit" such as fire danger reduction or disease control. Back in the 1980s in Colorado, the USFS was bulldozing areas of trees down and into piles and burning them, because they claimed that was cheaper than the administration costs of a timber sale :facepalm:
Back in the 1990s I did some research, and for many decades before that the USFS derived it's "revenue" from about 85% timber permits, 10% grazing and mining permits, and 5% recreation fees.
BUT - that money doesn't go to the USFS, it goes into the US general treasury and then the USFS gets an appropriation, which historically for that same time period amounted to only about 10% of total USFS receipts. Much of that appropriation was spent on recreational facilities, meaning that logging/grazing/mining were subsidizing the recreational industry.
So while there may have been "losses" on individual timber sales, the USFS as a whole made a great deal of money percentage wise for the us.gov - the profit margins were in excess of 900% :P
Since then, I'm guessing that the USFS has not brought in so much timber sale revenue because there have been so few timber sales compared to previous decades.
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How about when it does sell timber, selling it for loss?
Another one to get grumpy about is that BLM rents their land for grazing at a loss. Congress sets the rates by law but since cattle grazing on public land is popular in the western states the elected officals don't want to loose votes by upsetting the cattle producers.
BLM land is rented out by AUM (animal unit months) which is figured at enough land to support one cow and one calf for one month. The rate is low enough that the BLM looses money when figure out their income from rent and money spent to manage the land.
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. . . money spent to manage the land.
Most of this probably involves lardbutt desk warmers in the Civil Service shuffling papers rather than doing actual land management.
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If a spider has ever saved mankind from any freakin' thing, I'll wear Monkeyleg's moccasins.
Spidersilk has been used in wound treatment. Currently efforts are under way to either breed spiders for silk, or, preferably, to 'teach' some other species to make it.
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Most of this probably involves lardbutt desk warmers in the Civil Service shuffling papers rather than doing actual land management.
Every organization has those public and private.
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Another one to get grumpy about is that BLM rents their land for grazing at a loss. Congress sets the rates by law but since cattle grazing on public land is popular in the western states the elected officals don't want to loose votes by upsetting the cattle producers.
BLM land is rented out by AUM (animal unit months) which is figured at enough land to support one cow and one calf for one month. The rate is low enough that the BLM looses money when figure out their income from rent and money spent to manage the land.
Most of this probably involves lardbutt desk warmers in the Civil Service shuffling papers rather than doing actual land management.
This ... :(
Not to mention that the rancher leasing the land has to do most or all of the upkeep like fencing and maintaining water sources. I'm not sure what the hell the BLM does except annoy people - except for their fire fighting crews.
Also, BLM land out west is basically the leftovers that nobody would even bother to file a homestead claim on - IOW, mostly the worst and least productive land. You can't compare it dollar for dollar with prime private pasture.
And with the extreme fire danger we have been seeing lately, they should almost be paying the ranchers to graze their cows and reduce the fuel load :laugh:
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Spidersilk has been used in wound treatment. Currently efforts are under way to either breed spiders for silk, or, preferably, to 'teach' some other species to make it.
Leave it to Micro.
As to silk, that's what God made silkworms for.
There is nothing good or natural about a creature with 8 legs that releases a substance out of it's ass that it uses to hunt with, eat with, and dwell in. Just ain't natural I tell you.
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There is nothing good or natural about a creature with 8 legs that releases a substance out of it's ass that it uses to hunt with, eat with, and dwell in. Just ain't natural I tell you.
Not to mention depriving the world of perfectly good bacon :lol:
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I see what you did there.
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Yum, bananas!
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Note to self: never buy bananas again.
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Note to self: never buy bananas again.
Buy 'em loose, so 8-legged critters can't hide in the center of the bag.
Re: image - with the handily-sealed-closed bag, all you've got to do is swing the bag into, say, a column or table or something. Violently and repeatedly. Voila! No more spider!
No, *I* wont be buying that bunch of bananas afterwards. Why do you ask?
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Well, at least that bunch of bananas wouldn't have any flies in it :angel:
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Hmmm. Let's see. Fly vs. spider? I'll take flies.