Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: MillCreek on July 09, 2013, 08:47:06 AM
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http://www.epi.org/publication/ib368-basic-family-budgets/
An interesting analysis of what income is needed for a four person family to have a modest but adequate living standard. $ 70,000 in the Seattle area.
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I don't see utilities, clothing, school costs, etc. I checked for Ames, IA where I live and good luck finding a place to rent or purchase for $720 a month as they suggested. The transportation costs seem low, I spend $200 a month in gas driving less than 10K per year. Insurance is $100 a month for both vehicles. My wife drives closer to 20k a year and spends $250-300 a month in gas. Currently both vehicles are paid off, but wife is probably going to get a newer car, so probably $300 a month for a note payment.
I think their budget is off.
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I did a quick and dirty calculation because I thought it was a bit off...
All of our monthly expenses go on a C.C. except utilities, mortgage, and insurance, so its easy to pull the numbers off the top of my head.
Milwaukee-Waukesha-West Allis, WI MSA (WI)
Two Parents, Two Children
Item Cost
Monthly Housing $828 (~$1000)
Monthly Food $754
Monthly Child Care $1526
Monthly Transportation $607
Monthly Health Care $1496
Monthly Other Necessities $405
Monthly Taxes $495 (About right for property taxes alone)
Monthly Total $6111
Annual Total $73329
My estimates are around $76,000, excluding expenses for private schooling.
Monthly health care was listed much higher than we spend, but we spend quite a bit more on transportation when insurance, maintenance and fuel is all considered.
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Houston is considered one of the cheaper cities to live in. Under a thousand a month puts your family in a neighborhood either a long commute outside town, or in a neighborhood where you need to put bars on the windows.
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http://www.epi.org/publication/ib368-basic-family-budgets/
An interesting analysis of what income is needed for a four person family to have a modest but adequate living standard. $ 70,000 in the Seattle area.
I ran the numbers closest to what could. I've never made more than 2/5th of what this thing says.
Look at it later.
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I see things like this and I laugh at people's lists of what they "need to get by". Not all that long ago I was "getting by" on $1500 a month and did so for almost a year. It wasn't much fun, but I did it. And I did it without incurring any additional debt.
Brad
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We make about half that and we do fine... in particular, the amount for housing is way off. And we spend a 1/3 of what is says we should on food!
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I see things like this and I laugh at people's lists of what they "need to get by". Not all that long ago I was "getting by" on $1500 a month and did so for almost a year. It wasn't much fun, but I did it. And I did it without incurring any additional debt.
I thought the numbers were way high as well, until I added up the expenses. I've lived on the $1500/month range for several years and was happy as a clam, but that was before kids, and I was living out in the sticks where the cost of living for most things was lower.
The estimate I did was probably on the low end of the range for my neighborhood. We live in the smallest house in the neighborhood, drive the oldest vehicles (by far), don't have any debt beyond mortgage, and generally live pretty frugally. It would be cheaper living closer to or in the city.
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I did a quick and dirty calculation because I thought it was a bit off...
All of our monthly expenses go on a C.C. except utilities, mortgage, and insurance, so its easy to pull the numbers off the top of my head.
Milwaukee-Waukesha-West Allis, WI MSA (WI)
Two Parents, Two Children
Item Cost
Monthly Housing $828 (~$1000)
Monthly Food $754
Monthly Child Care $1526
Monthly Transportation $607
Monthly Health Care $1496
Monthly Other Necessities $405
Monthly Taxes $495 (About right for property taxes alone)
Monthly Total $6111
Annual Total $73329
My estimates are around $76,000, excluding expenses for private schooling.
Monthly health care was listed much higher than we spend, but we spend quite a bit more on transportation when insurance, maintenance and fuel is all considered.
No kids, so here's my numbers:
Mortgage $895 (including home insurance escrow)
Property taxes $52
Utilities $170
Car Insurance $103
Harley Insurance $35
Health Insurance $304
Groceries $180
Misc expenses $370
Total $2109
This is a lot less than what it cost me to live in Milwaukee, and a lot less than what it cost me to have a wife.
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I see things like this and I laugh at people's lists of what they "need to get by". Not all that long ago I was "getting by" on $1500 a month and did so for almost a year. It wasn't much fun, but I did it. And I did it without incurring any additional debt.
Brad
Pretty big difference between "getting by" and "having a modest but adequate living standard" there innit? The amount I make now would let me live like a king in some of the places I've lived before, but in Seattle it's on the lower end of middle class especially with some of the dietary restrictions my wife has driving up food bills.
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Wow, we get by pretty cheap! :O
Only thing crimping us right now is our various building projects around the place.
Our plan is to get down under $18K in a couple years.
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Pretty big difference between "getting by" and "having a modest but adequate living standard" there innit? The amount I make now would let me live like a king in some of the places I've lived before, but in Seattle it's on the lower end of middle class especially with some of the dietary restrictions my wife has driving up food bills.
The sad part is that a fair number of people consider "getting by" to be a modest but adequate living standards. They've no idea what real hardship can be. Heck, even when I was stretched to make 11 cents out of every dime I wasn't in a real hardship. Most people would have considered my lifestyle at the time to be the epitome of bottom-scratching hard scrabble living, but I never considered it to be "just getting by" because I had a roof over my head, transportation for emergencies, and food in the pantry. (All of which could be attributed to a lot of pre-planning and contingency prep)
Brad
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In a country where even our poor people have flat screen TVs, air conditioning, cell phones, a car and far too many of them are morbidly obese how can anyone expect to have a comfortable living with less than $70K a year?
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The sad part is that a fair number of people consider "getting by" to be a modest but adequate living standards. They've no idea what real hardship can be. Heck, even when I was stretched to make 11 cents out of every dime I wasn't in a real hardship. Most people would have considered my lifestyle at the time to be the epitome of bottom-scratching hard scrabble living, but I never considered it to be "just getting by" because I had a roof over my head, transportation for emergencies, and food in the pantry. (All of which could be attributed to a lot of pre-planning and contingency prep)
Brad
I didn't add in the luxury costs for Beer, Internet, Directv or 2 cell phones.
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I didn't add in the luxury costs for Beer, Internet, Directv or 2 cell phones.
Whoa, whoa, whoa, beer a luxury?
Somebody better get their priorities straight :laugh:
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The sad part is that a fair number of people consider "getting by" to be a modest but adequate living standards. They've no idea what real hardship can be. Heck, even when I was stretched to make 11 cents out of every dime I wasn't in a real hardship. Most people would have considered my lifestyle at the time to be the epitome of bottom-scratching hard scrabble living, but I never considered it to be "just getting by" because I had a roof over my head, transportation for emergencies, and food in the pantry. (All of which could be attributed to a lot of pre-planning and contingency prep)
Brad
Yeah, aside from the homeless we don't have poor folks in America. And a lot of them have higher standards of living than medieval serfs.
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Although I'm not sure "Better off than a medieval serf" is really the standard we want to shoot for...
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Although I'm not sure "Better off than a medieval serf" is really the standard we want to shoot for...
Methinks thou misseth the point, knave...
Brad
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Median household income in the Midwest ranges from $41k to $50k. I really do wonder how people get by.
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we have an average monthly budget of $2000 for a family of 4. that includes taxes, food, utilities, home and auto insurance, gas, my daughters recreation programs, misc, and a very modest vacation budget. that doesn't include a house payment as we bought a $12,000 fixer upper and it is paid off. =D also, one of our 2 vehicles expenses are paid for by my business. although we eat more hamburger than steak, i think we live better than medievil kings.
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Here in Tulsa it is telling me I need just under $60K a year. Make around 2/3 that and get by. Not like I want but then my kids get the things they need and most of what they want.
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Back during the lean times a few years ago, we (2 + all the critters) were scraping by on < $1500 month including a ~$600/mo house payment.
That didn't leave much for repairs, etc.
Now that the house is paid off we could do pretty nicely at that.
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Debt is the killer of budgets. Debt comes from various things, but frequently from over indulging. Need that new flat screen TV for the family room even though the old TV works just fine.... the list can be quite long.
The last 12 months has been my worst income in 10 years. I keep hoping things are changing and I'm trying to make them change.
My sister's son is late 20's and does real well financially. He worked hard to get there. He just purchased a 1.1 million dollar home in CA. I wish... would hate to have that mortgage payment!
I used to consider myself middle class, now I'm not so sure.
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They're smoking crack on their housing estimates for Seatle. 5 years ago, when rentals were much easier to come by since everyone and thier half-brother was buying them, rent for a family of 4 (which we were at that time) was virtually impossible to find for under $1400/month. Now that so many were foreclosed on and the became renters by default I can't imagine it being any cheaper, and $1600+ would not surprise me.
Also, I'll note that with 4 kids, even with one still exclusively breast feeding, and another just a toddler,, and a gluten free requirement, it's not possible for us to hit their grocery estimate without some seriously creative shopping.