Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: AZRedhawk44 on September 19, 2013, 02:28:31 PM
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http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/09/18/bill-would-require-michiganders-to-work-for-welfare/
Another bill requires drug testing, and makes a potential recipient ineligible for welfare if he or she tests positive.
I think a time-lapse implementation would be good.
The first month, you don't have to do any welfare. Get out and find a job quick, because the second month you'll have to do 10 hours a week to remain eligible. The 3rd month it raises to 20 hours a week. It levels off at 29.5 hours a week on the 4th month. That way you're not "full time" and don't have a claim for any "full time" employment gobbledygook regarding insurance while working the "volunteer" job.
Also, if you're 4 months in, we still want you to have enough time to interview or pound the sidewalks looking for a job so you can get off the dole. So 29.5 hours leaves you 10+ hours a week to accomplish that.
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Probably won't do any good, they'll just figure out how to work the system, or a community organizer will come along and show them the way.
I get pretty jaded about these things.
Especially since its still fresh in my mind where I was shopping at Walmart last night.
The only checkout line open was the baby formula/cigarette aisle.
I was sixth in line.
out of the 6, I was the only one that had more than 2 of the below qualities:
1: Didn't have tattoos/piercings on arms/neck/face
2. Didn't buy cigarettes.*
3. Spoke English.
4. Paid entire bill without some form of .gov assistance.*
5. Had any indication of being married.
*There were two hispanics males in line that bought cigarettes with cash, but they looked like bad hombres, facial/gang tattoos.
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This bill does not touch food stamps. To fix welfare you need to tackle all entitlement forms. I say get rid of it all. Work or starve. I don't care. I hate the Walmart line as well. Food stamps or EBT card for food stuff, but the have enough $$$$ for cigs or booze. I'm tired of subsidizing these idiots. Work or starve. Learn to budget. If you can budget for that next tattoo or rims on you car you can budget to pay your own way.
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5lb bag of Rice and 5lb of Beans per person per week for welfare. The goal is to get people back to work not to use the safety net as a hammock.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_o7TScTlWI
*Hat Tip to AJ for reminding me of that old Schoolhouse Rock commerical.
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It was unconstitutional the times before when they tried this. What makes anybody think it wiull not be unconstitutional this time?
Apparently that "promote the general welfare" clause is the only part of the Constitution that everybody will agree on.
stay safe.
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Probably won't do any good, they'll just figure out how to work the system, or a community organizer will come along and show them the way.
Pretty much yep.
This bill does not touch food stamps. To fix welfare you need to tackle all entitlement forms. I say get rid of it all. Work or starve. I don't care. I hate the Walmart line as well. Food stamps or EBT card for food stuff, but the have enough $$$$ for cigs or booze. I'm tired of subsidizing these idiots. Work or starve. Learn to budget. If you can budget for that next tattoo or rims on you car you can budget to pay your own way.
This
When you see, repeatedly, a nice fit 20 something old purchase a cart full of brand name foods, only pay their money for the beer and smokes, and push it out to a brand new Lexus or Escalade with rims that cost more than my truck did, and that bitch is parked in the handicapped spot, you too will develop a burning hatred.
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Are welfare recipients required to look for jobs to get them off of welfare?
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Are welfare recipients required to look for jobs to get them off of welfare?
No.
Do not get us startedd on what they have to do.
stay safe.
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No.
Do not get us startedd on what they have to do.
stay safe.
Do tell what they have to do, or not have to do, as the case might be.
I know that here, the majority of welfare recipients are required to actively pursue employment.
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I doubt many places would want "volunteers" from the dole.
I know a handful of folks that went on welfare, usually women with kids whose husbands or other form of male companion tended to be less than a stellar provider. That I have less of an issue with, contrary to the popular opinion here. I don't consider it honorable to let women with children starve in the streets. Men without children or significant health problems? Absolutely. I realize it's not the most gender equality attitude, which I have pondered on.
Anywho, from what they've told me, you would not want anyone from the welfare office (on either side of the desk) even as an unpaid volunteer. The staff are generally as bad or worse than the clients. Friend of mine lost her husband, and went on public assistance for her two kids. There was mandatory "job training". She showed up in a suit. The er, "instructors" showed up looking like People of Walmart material.
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I doubt many places would want "volunteers" from the dole.
I know a handful of folks that went on welfare, usually women with kids whose husbands or other form of male companion tended to be less than a stellar provider. That I have less of an issue with, contrary to the popular opinion here. I don't consider it honorable to let women with children starve in the streets. Men without children or significant health problems? Absolutely. I realize it's not the most gender equality attitude, which I have pondered on.
Anywho, from what they've told me, you would not want anyone from the welfare office (on either side of the desk) even as an unpaid volunteer. The staff are generally as bad or worse than the clients. Friend of mine lost her husband, and went on public assistance for her two kids. There was mandatory "job training". She showed up in a suit. The er, "instructors" showed up looking like People of Walmart material.
I'm starting to think it is honorable. The problem is that when you reward something, you get more of it.
Reward people for not having a job and having more and more children? Surprise! You get more of that!
I think the government needs to stop all welfare. (I'm willing to make it a slow weaning, as tossing people off is unnecessary.)
Then, private entities that can better judge the deserving poor can step in. Don't want to work and just sit around collecting charity? You can starve. (And we'll take your kids and give them to someone who will feed them.)
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Do tell what they have to do, or not have to do, as the case might be.
I know that here, the majority of welfare recipients are required to actively pursue employment.
Quick anecdote, even if anecdote =/= data.
I was having a drink with my Dad a few months back when he told me about a young girl in her early 20s who worked in the same factory as he does. She already had 2 fatherless kids and was pregnant with her 3rd.
During a smoke break, she had told my Dad that she was due in 3 months, and after that she was 'retiring' because she wouldn't need to work anymore (implying that the state was going to take care of her).
He wa a bit pissed since he had 40 years in busting his ass as a tool and die maker paying the way for people who's only skill in life is not keeping their legs together.
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5lb bag of Rice and 5lb of Beans per person per week for welfare. The goal is to get people back to work not to use the safety net as a hammock.
Agree with this concept. While I would be fine with more than rice and beans, I simply cannot understand why EBT cards are not HIGHLY restricted to basic foodstuffs. Certainly some people will find a way around it, just like people "enhance" the currently overly-liberal EBT allowances now. Mrs Obama wants everyone in the country to eat and live healthy. Why doesn't she start here?
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I think the government needs to stop all welfare. (I'm willing to make it a slow weaning, as tossing people off is unnecessary.)
The problem is that it cannot be shut off, the genie is out of the bottle and can't be put back in.
Cities would burn if the money stopped flowing.
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Certainly some people will find a way around it, just like people "enhance" the currently overly-liberal EBT allowances now. Mrs Obama wants everyone in the country to eat and live healthy. Why doesn't she start here?
Don't give them ideas.
The more recent 'problem' is 'food deserts.'
The liberal solution to that is going to be forced integration of poor into wealthier suburbs.
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The problem is that it cannot be shut off, the genie is out of the bottle and can't be put back in.
Cities would burn if the money stopped flowing.
That would disrupt the entrenched interest groups. (Much like it did to Japan and Germany when we bombed there cities, which was a factor in their rapid growth after WWII.)
I'm failing to see a downside...
(For clarity, I'm not serious, people burning other people's homes and killing people is always bad. And we clearly don't have the backbone to do what would be necessary to put down a riot.)
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Don't give them ideas.
The more recent 'problem' is 'food deserts.'
The liberal solution to that is going to be forced integration of poor into wealthier suburbs.
With HHS grants to then begin "urban renewal" in the abandoned inner-city zones, because that's worked so well in the past.
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Cut the entitlement let the riots start and give me an M240 and I will happily solve your problem. I am sick and tired of these worthless *expletive deleted*s sitting on their asses and recieving more money and benefits than I make for working my *expletive deleted*ing ass off.
Do tell what they have to do, or not have to do, as the case might be.
I know that here, the majority of welfare recipients are required to actively pursue employment.
In my state, SC, unemployment benefits recievers have to halfassedly look for a job and meet with a counseler on a regular basis. The other forms of welfare, no.
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I'd love to see EBT/foodstamps restricted to the perimeter of the grocery store. Fresh produce, bread in the bakery, meats from the butcher, and house cleaning supplies. That's it. Nothing that comes in a cardboard box or cellophane packaging or the freezer section. Or even in a can.
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The problem is that it cannot be shut off, the genie is out of the bottle and can't be put back in.
Cities would burn if the money stopped flowing.
Mostly the fires would be in the parts that would benefit by a good blaze. And if the pyros tried to torch areas beyond the 'hood, in a lot of places they'd run into some serious ballistic discouragement.
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Nothing that comes in a cardboard box or cellophane packaging or the freezer section. Or even in a can.
I would still include some of those items. While they could certainly buy crap in a can, they can also buy a case of something like Cambell's soup, which is perfectly nutritious and uses less of my tax dollars than fresh food only. I'd be more upset at seeing someone buy Rib Eye with an EBT than I would seeing them buy a box of Cocoa Krispies.
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I doubt many places would want "volunteers" from the dole.
I know a handful of folks that went on welfare, usually women with kids whose husbands or other form of male companion tended to be less than a stellar provider. That I have less of an issue with, contrary to the popular opinion here. I don't consider it honorable to let women with children starve in the streets. Men without children or significant health problems? Absolutely. I realize it's not the most gender equality attitude, which I have pondered on.
Americans are so enamored of equality that they would rather be equal in slavery than unequal in freedom.
Alexis de Tocqueville
The problem is that it cannot be shut off, the genie is out of the bottle and can't be put back in.
Cities would burn if the money stopped flowing.
The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money.
Alexis de Tocqueville
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I'd love to see EBT/foodstamps restricted to the perimeter of the grocery store. Fresh produce, bread in the bakery, meats from the butcher, and house cleaning supplies. That's it. Nothing that comes in a cardboard box or cellophane packaging or the freezer section. Or even in a can.
How does that work for folks li sro housing or otherwise without a means to cook. Or the folks who can't cook? Disabled etc
damn phone
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How does that work for folks li sro housing or otherwise without a means to cook. Or the folks who can't cook? Disabled etc
damn phone
Hunger is as powerful of a motivator now as it was 15,000 years ago.
Before the free stuff started, people who wanted to survive figured out how to cook/prepare food.
There is a young lady who lives 10 minutes south of me who was born without legs or arms. She drives, has a job, can swim, cooks for herself, and lives alone. Short of being deathly ill, too young (as in pre teen or younger), or having severe mental handicaps, I have very little sympathy for those who won't prepare their own food.
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How does that work for folks li sro housing or otherwise without a means to cook. Or the folks who can't cook? Disabled etc
damn phone
Raw fruits and veggies are very good for you.
And can be quite motivational to acquire resources so that one can join the negative 150th century and master fire.
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In my state, SC, unemployment benefits recievers have to halfassedly look for a job and meet with a counseler on a regular basis. The other forms of welfare, no.
Sort of like here for unemployment benefits. Although officially, no halfassedness about it. Search for jobs, apply for anything that you're remotely qualified for, be prepared to move anywhere within the country or even anywhere inside the EU if absolutely necessary, the former presents a problem considering the lack of available apartments in Stockholm and Gothenburg, which unfortunatly happens to be where a majority of the jobs are available. Trying to find a place to live in either of those cities myself. Get in line and wait, or pay ridiculous amounts of money for a rental contract, which also happens to be illegal, but hey, everyone does it...
For the minimum welfare (the one that kicks in when you aren't qualified for unemployment benefits and in some other cases), you're still generally expected to look for employment.
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The urban myth of welfare queens is just that.
First of all, TANF only pays 90% of the federal poverty line (food stamps, Medicaid, and Section 8 Housing are supposed to make up the difference). Second, the increase in grant amount stops at the 3rd kid - dropping more gets you no additional money and uses up more of what you get for free. At one time there was "Work to Welfare" that made you go to job training and when your youngest started school you had to look for work - at least one interview per week. Folks started interviewing for jobs they were obviously under-qualified for, as well as an industry of those who would sign off on the intereview card for a dollar or two without ever intending to hire anybody. The program ended when someone finally realized it was not producing the desired results - perhaps the only example of a federal program doing so.
It is too bad that there are no longer "welfare/man in the home" checks allowed - while by far not my favorite activity there were a few incidents that gained widespread noteriety when the welfare recipient was prosecuted for welfare fraud. Maybe the best was the young lady who met us at the door wearing nothing but a scowl and told us to come back in half an hour because she and her visitor would have to start all over again. She was busted because we found two of his shirts hanging in the closet.
Those folks getting welfare and driving around in this year's Caddilac land yacht are obviously not playing by the rules. It just seems nobody cares any more.
stay safe.
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Don't give them ideas.
The more recent 'problem' is 'food deserts.'
The liberal solution to that is going to be forced integration of poor into wealthier suburbs.
Former Cook County Board President was all over the "food desserts" issue.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DOXOyI_ZWk
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The urban myth of welfare queens is just that.
Mmmmm, I met quite a few when I was doing taxes this past year. (EITC is mo' Free Money!!) They had Section 8, a whole Passel of kids (that they brought with), talking to their friends on the latest IPhone, complaining about how they weren't getting the extra $$$ on their EBT card and how their live-in boyfriend/baby daddy was spending all his time playing video games and using her welfare $$ to put new rims on his ride. Baby Daddy sometimes was there and they want to "divide" the kids so that each could claim EITC. Both generally had "Self-Employed" jobs and absolutely no paperwork to prove that they did home daycare. Like you know a licence from the state, cancelled checks, receipts, ledger, an Ad offering their service. Or cab driver that did all cash, and magically just made enough to nail the peak of the EITC curve. Some of the males worked at Temp jobs, until they managed to hit that EITC peak and then get unemployment. The best ones were the one that also took a community college class or two to get some grant and then claim college costs to get that credit.
And every single one drove a much nicer/new car than I did.
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Former Cook County Board President was all over the "food desserts" issue.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DOXOyI_ZWk
Wow, just wow.
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Those folks getting welfare and driving around in this year's Caddilac land yacht are obviously not playing by the rules. It just seems nobody cares any more.
They are a valuable, steady voting bloc for a certain political party hence no one is going to dare to enforce the rules that they are breaking.
The urban myth of welfare queens is just that.
Bullshit. I've seen plenty of 'em just like Scout has.
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I think his point was that the welfare queens are committing fraud or other criminal activities, so it's not really a criticism of the system just of the wqay it's abused.
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And every single one drove a much nicer/new car than I did.
When I drive through the ghetto when commuting, I have the oldest car on the road that doesn't have gold rims or a neon paint job.
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Nope. Get a job. No welfare. I am willing to go 6 months or a year before the last welfare check goes out but no longer. Once it is done it's done. Why should welfare recipients get money for doing something that will not be real work. I guarantee you that if they're working for me they'll work harder than they do volunteering for the local community center - or they won't be working for me for more than 5 minutes.
Why should all these agencies that would get the volunteer labor, such as it would be, get labor paid for by my tax dollars? More welfare. Now we could get double the welfare out of our welfare dollars.
Get a paying job. Period. Charities that offer real value - as determined by potential donors - will get donations of dollars and labor.