Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Perd Hapley on October 02, 2015, 11:25:39 PM
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My furnace has automatic ignition, or electrical ignition, or whatever they call it. I just turned it on last night, for the first time this season. The inducer motor comes on. Something (I think it's the ignitor) is clicking over and over again. After it fails to ignite, the clicking stops. I've checked that the gas valves are in the on position, all the way back to the meter. I'm also trying to get the ignitor and flame sensor out where I can work on them, but haven't succeeded yet.
Is it more likely the sensor is dirty, or that the ignitor is just broken, or...?
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Make and model?
Is there a circuit board with an indicator light that will give you failure codes?
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Was the gas ever turned off at any point?
I had the same problem with the water heater a few years ago. Just a bunch of air that had to work its way out.
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They changed the gas meter some time back. May, I think. It's possible I haven't run the heater since then.
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You could crack a pipe open and see if you can force the air out. Easiest thing to do might be to loosen the drip leg cap.
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You can tell when you've vented the air by using a match to check for gas.
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You can tell when you've vented the air by using a match to check for gas.
Yep, when your eyebrows are gone, you've got gas.
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Yep, when your eyebrows are gone, you've got gas.
[popcorn]
:rofl:
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Make and model?
Is there a circuit board with an indicator light that will give you failure codes?
International Comfort Products
FBF075B12G1
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Name like that it sounds like a sex toy...
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On your furnac, the ignition electrode is the flame sensor . It needs to establish flame at the pilot before it allows the main gas valve to open. You gas meter was replaced last spring so there is an air pocket in there somewhere. If you have a gas stove you've been using that should have removed most of it. You can try cycling the furnace a few times but with only the pilot orifice as an outlet it could take quite a few cycles. Opening a fitting or cap may be your best option, just wait 10 minutes between any venting & trying to start your furnace.
To back up just slightly, you mentioned checking valves back to the meter but did you check the one on the automatic gas valve in the furnace. I've missed or misread that one once or twice.
You are hearing the click so you most likely have spark so I'm looking downstream from there.
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On your furnac, the ignition electrode is the flame sensor . It needs to establish flame at the pilot before it allows the main gas valve to open. You gas meter was replaced last spring so there is an air pocket in there somewhere. If you have a gas stove you've been using that should have removed most of it. You can try cycling the furnace a few times but with only the pilot orifice as an outlet it could take quite a few cycles. Opening a fitting or cap may be your best option, just wait 10 minutes between any venting & trying to start your furnace.
To back up just slightly, you mentioned checking valves back to the meter but did you check the one on the automatic gas valve in the furnace. I've missed or misread that one once or twice.
You are hearing the click so you most likely have spark so I'm looking downstream from there.
The valve inside the furnace was in the on position, along with the valve right outside the furnace, on the line itself.
I'm not sure about opening up a gas line and venting gas out into the basement. What is the correct, safe way to do this?
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Literally to NOT do it...
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Google it. There are a variety of instructions on line.
Check your furnace, some have a purge valve built into the gas valve that will bleed through the burner.
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"What is the correct, safe way to do this?"
Yeah, what Mike said.
You're not really venting gas as, as soon as you smell gas or see a density change in the vapor, you're done. You don't let a bunch of gas come out. Not on purpose anyway. Nat gas is lighter than air and with a couple of cross windows open it'll dissipate pretty quickly but there is still a possibility for an accident. Sounds like this is your first time ( insert virginity joke) so you may just want to cycle the furnace.
If you do decide to try venting, make double sure the water heater is turned off & the pilot is out.
ETA: the pressure on the line is about 4inches of water column or adout 1/4 PSI so it's not like anything is "shooting out" anyway. And make sure you've tested anything you've loosened & re-tightened with soapy water to avoid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDAyu_sR3W0
this
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I think fisty got his furnace working...
I'm pretty sure I just saw someone flying overhead, and he appeared to be on fire.
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I think fisty got his furnace working...
I'm pretty sure I just saw someone flying overhead, and he appeared to be on fire.
You saw a flying, flaming sock monkey? Did it leave a cool looking smoke trail?
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...a flying, flaming sock monkey...
This thought makes me sad. :'(
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On your furnac, the ignition electrode is the flame sensor . It needs to establish flame at the pilot before it allows the main gas valve to open. You gas meter was replaced last spring so there is an air pocket in there somewhere. If you have a gas stove you've been using that should have removed most of it. You can try cycling the furnace a few times but with only the pilot orifice as an outlet it could take quite a few cycles.
Does this mean I just turn up the thermostat and wait, or will I need to turn the thermostat to off, and then call for heat again?
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Does this mean I just turn up the thermostat and wait, or will I need to turn the thermostat to off, and then call for heat again?
I think you have to cycle the thermostat - otherwise after a while it just stops trying if it can't get ignition. Don't want to fill your house with gas, after all.
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Did you bleed the air from the gas line?
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I think you have to cycle the thermostat - otherwise after a while it just stops trying if it can't get ignition. Don't want to fill your house with gas, after all.
No filling the house with gas, got it!
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You need to cycle the start sequence. You can use the t-stat dial, the system switch from heat to off if it has one or the power switch that should be mounted on the side of your furnace. The T-stat dial is obvious. If you use either of the other switches, turn the T-stat up above room temp and with the other switches on, let the start cycle go till it times out. Turn whichever switch off & wait 2 or 3 minutes. Turn it back on & let it cycle through again. Like I said, it may take quite a few if you haven't bled the line.
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Is the pilot lighting but it isn't being sensed? If so then no gas is not the problem and you need to clean or replace the pilot sensor/assembly.
If you have a switch on the furnace you can just turn it off and back on to cycle the unit after it locks out on flame failure. Popping the filter panel on and off often works as there is frequently a door switch on it that kills power to the furnace.
You never mentioned whether there are indicator lights on the furnace/circuit board.
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http://www.columbiapipe.com/PIN_ASSETS/PIN_Data/parsed/ICP_Commercial/Owner's_Manual/44103260900.pdf
It looks like you have an ignition module separate from the circuit board.
Please confirm that there is no flame at the pilot assembly.
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Thanks for all the help, folks. After about 6 or 8 cycles, the thing just now started pumping out some heat. Looks like just a matter of air in the gas line.
Thanks again.
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Really weird that if the gas company came out and changed the meeter they did not make sure everything worked.
Out here is something happens the gas company won't turn it back on without checking everything works.
There was a line struck next town over last winter. When the gas company turned it back on they went house to house. There was one house with no one home. Idiots left it turned off. Froze the house up. Guy was suing the gas company because the never even went to the houses on either side that had keys to his house.
When I ran out of propane they will check the pilots if you have any and they do a pressure test.
I told they guy water heater was spark and the furnace was a glow bar. He said are you sure I said yes and he did not need to come in. But he hooked up the test gauge right at the tank.
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Really weird that if the gas company came out and changed the meeter they did not make sure everything worked.
Yeah, I figured they would. I think I may call them.
The furnace did come back on a couple of days ago, and then a couple of times after that. Since then, it's been a no-go. Fortunately (sort of) the weather warmed up.
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I finally had a proper technician come out to look at the thing. He determined that the little 1/4'' line feeding the ignitor was clogged. He also advised a new capacitor for the blower motor, but I decided to pass on the $200 capacitor. So, of course, I'm going to shock myself now. ;/
I was running out of time, as we're slated to have our first frost this weekend.
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Did he kiss you first? Did he say what was clogging that line? It's not like there's sediment in the gas that can settle out. I've occasionally seen the orifice at the pilot end of that line blocked by dust but if it was plugged it would not have lit the few times it did. And a 5 or 7 uf Cap is only 12 or so dollars & takes 10 minutes to replace. Caps either work or don't. To replace one on a SWAG is a waste of money.
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Did he kiss you first? Did he say what was clogging that line? It's not like there's sediment in the gas that can settle out. I've occasionally seen the orifice at the pilot end of that line blocked by dust but if it was plugged it would not have lit the few times it did. And a 5 or 7 uf Cap is only 12 or so dollars & takes 10 minutes to replace. Caps either work or don't. To replace one on a SWAG is a waste of money.
Gas lines can throw bits of rust and particulates from the pipe that can cause a clog. Changing the meter could also have resulted in a blob of pipe dope lodging in the line.
My guess would be a rust flake.
Gas lines should have a "drip" on them, either at the meter, at the first appliance, or both to catch stuff like that.
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I believe he said that the capacitor was reading 3.5 mF, and might harm the blower motor.
As for the clog, well, we'll see if it has any trouble running tonight.