Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: T.O.M. on January 19, 2016, 04:07:22 PM
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Been looking around, and haven't seen much new and improved coming out of Shot Show this year. Kimber's revolver looks to be the biggest news maker. Colt has some new 1911s, including the rebirth of the Lightweight Commander. Smith has variations on the M&P theme. Glock has some optic-ready variations. H&K and Beretta...nothing major. I've been watching my YouTube channels and haven't seen any booth reviews or anything really exciting.
Anyone seen anything worth looking at? Links appreciated.
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.50 BMG AK
https://www.facebook.com/TheAKGuy
Another funny looking AR15
https://www.cobaltkinetics.com/
Kriss handguns
Kimber revolver
TAVOR X95
Springfield Armory is making a tactical XD. Without a threaded barrel. And an LCP knockoff. Or whatever you wanna call the tiny pistol with built in laser.
Kalashnikov USA is making a US AK that is tacticool. Rumor is it almost destroyed a town in upper Michigan.
http://www.gunsholstersandgear.com/2016/01/19/ak-alpha-rifle-from-kalashnikov-usa/
Another 12 gauge AR. Plenty of new colors that claim to be new guns but aren't.
Sig is releasing a weird MP5 knockoff 9mm carbine. MPX, original.
New priming tool from Lee Precision. I'm not sure if the internet gun folk jihad is still called on them or not?
CZ Scorpion carbines
https://youtu.be/58-JsN0AGWk
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Gun Talk Radio was a replay last Sunday. I am expecting to hear more this Sunday.
Springfield Armory had a bunch of new product emails going out daily, but I haven't see one for a few days. I need to check my spam folder when I get home.
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Been looking around, and haven't seen much new and improved coming out of Shot Show this year. Kimber's revolver looks to be the biggest news maker. Colt has some new 1911s, including the rebirth of the Lightweight Commander. Smith has variations on the M&P theme. Glock has some optic-ready variations. H&K and Beretta...nothing major. I've been watching my YouTube channels and haven't seen any booth reviews or anything really exciting.
Anyone seen anything worth looking at? Links appreciated.
The Kimber snubby is about the only thing I've seen that's interesting. But, I've got that pretty well covered.
New priming tool from Lee Precision. I'm not sure if the internet gun folk jihad is still called on them or not?
Huh? I'm unaware of anything like that.
Springfield Armory had a bunch of new product emails going out daily,
Nothing SA revealed over the past week's promotion struck me as all that revolutionary.
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Were the SA emails just over the last week? I thought I remember it was 19 new products. I guess I misread. I agree that none of what I saw was really new. Just a couple variations and old guns with lasers.
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.50 BMG AK
https://www.facebook.com/TheAKGuy
Another funny looking AR15
https://www.cobaltkinetics.com/
Kriss handguns
Kimber revolver
TAVOR X95
Springfield Armory is making a tactical XD. Without a threaded barrel. And an LCP knockoff. Or whatever you wanna call the tiny pistol with built in laser.
Kalashnikov USA is making a US AK that is tacticool. Rumor is it almost destroyed a town in upper Michigan.
http://www.gunsholstersandgear.com/2016/01/19/ak-alpha-rifle-from-kalashnikov-usa/
Another 12 gauge AR. Plenty of new colors that claim to be new guns but aren't.
Sig is releasing a weird MP5 knockoff 9mm carbine. MPX, original.
New priming tool from Lee Precision. I'm not sure if the internet gun folk jihad is still called on them or not?
CZ Scorpion carbines
https://youtu.be/58-JsN0AGWk
If I had won it big on the lottery, I would probably have to build a warehouse size gun storage area. That AK looks really good.
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Huh? I'm unaware of anything like that.
He's talking about how Lee always plays second-fiddle in reloading circles to Dillon.
Lee Dies - awesome.
Lee Single stage presses - awesome.
Lee Progressive presses - Fussy, so-so reputation.
Looks like ELCAN is stepping into the space left by the huge L3-EoTech recall in the holographic sight market. It'll probably cost at least 2x as much as a comparable EoTech (the milspec temperature thing that got them in trouble not withstanding) and it's unclear if the back looking like the Tim Burton Batmobile, and the front like a droopy scrotum will hurt it's market acceptance.
http://soldiersystems.net/2016/01/19/shot-show-elite-defense-debuts-specter-holographic-combat-optic-by-elcan/
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Anyone seen anything worth looking at? Links appreciated.
You just want photos of booth babes, don't you?
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Magpul is coming out with a mag for the AK74s.
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Also apparently Kalishnikov USA is coming out with some 9mm AKs.
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Were the SA emails just over the last week? I thought I remember it was 19 new products. I guess I misread. I agree that none of what I saw was really new. Just a couple variations and old guns with lasers.
It was a giveaway.
I didn't win anything. =(
Like Lee said, nothing really new, just redressing on their old stuff. The M1A is about as silly as silly can be with it's tacticooliness.
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Huh? I'm unaware of anything like that.
President of Lee Precision called someone at THR a liar when UPS had no proof they delivered a second unordered package to a customer. Guy posted on some forums. Basically Lee acted rudely. Mixed thoughts on the apology.
Dear Folks on the High Road:
I have spent the whole weekend thinking about the firestorm I created with four simple words. Sunday evening I read your comments with my daughter Steph. After reading your comments she asked what can you do and I had to answer I don’t know.
A sleepless Sunday night gave me ample time to reflect on the mess I created. It brought back a memory of a local sport shop owners story years ago. I asked him why he sold his shop and his story was this. He remembered an old sport shop in town that had an ornery old guy that ran the place, he swore to himself he would never be like that to customers. Then one day after yelling at a customer he realized he was becoming the ornery old shop owner and it was time to make good on his pledge and move on.
I also remember shortly before my dad retired coming to his office while he was on the phone with an unruly customer. After he hung up he commented he was too old for this expletive and from that point on let me deal with the problems.
My point in mentioning this is that owners of small businesses are the ones that take the calls from customers that have been worked up into froth and want to “speak to the manager†I think we burn out and get the attitude I’ll treat you as badly as you treat me.
I am in total agreement with many of your comments and am afraid I am becoming the ornery old shop owner. Thank you for bringing this to my attention. It is too early for me to move on as I thoroughly enjoy coming to work and love building the most affordable reloading equipment on the planet. I still enjoy talking to customers and speak to them daily. Chances are if the phone rings more than three times at Lee the male voice answering the phone is me; if one of our two full time technicians is busy it is I again
What I said to “Stinger†was inexcusable and I am sorry. I am sorry because it was not a Christian thing to do and it fails my rule I preach to my kids that “ if you can’t say anything nice don’t say anything at all†I also apologize to “Stinger†for my unnecessary and rude comment.
I apologize to our loyal Lee Customers for giving them concern and pledge to count to 10 before engaging my vocal cords and promise to get out before I become the ornery owner.
Sincerely
John Lee, President
Monday, June 21, 2004
A viewer or participant from your site has asked that Lee Precision address a matter with Mr. Justin Newman. He asked that his name not be used.
I have listened to both sides of the discussion: that is our customer service people and Mr. Newman. I have reviewed the relevant documents indicating delivery.
The problem was created entirely by Lee Precision and for that I apologize. Lee Precision inadvertently sent a package to Mr. Newman. We asked that the package be returned and that we would send a UPS call tag to retrieve. This did not work out because Mr. Newman now claims that the package was never received. For clarification his credit card was never charged and no bill was rendered. A balance for the miss shipped package was applied to his account so if an order was placed in the future it would flag our order entry people that this account needs attention.
I did offer Mr. Newman to send his requested service parts for his Load Master and in the conversation I expressed my opinion that I did not trust him based on the information that has been presented. At that he refused my offer for service parts and let me know that the whole world will hear of his problem with Lee Precision customer service.
We bend over backwards to provide the best possible product at competitive prices and our repair and customer service people know that I want them to treat customers like they would want to be treated themselves. Broken Lee parts can be returned to the factory and are replaced no questions asked.
If Mr. Newman really did not receive the package he has my heartfelt apology.
Sincerely
John Lee, President
Friday, June 18, 2004
Afterwards:
They have my phone number and address, if they want to make it right for me, they know where to reach me. A sincere apology and an end to this ludicrous charge is all that I ask. I'm not holding my breath.
Otherwise, it is merely an apology for P.O.ing the readers of this forum, nothing more, nothing less. It is a CYA, so as not to lose more business. But it is certainly not an apology to me. Although I am glad that he apologized to my distinguished fellow members, I, however, am the one who was wronged. If they want to apologize to me, I expect it "man to man," not over the internet.
Mr. Lee, you insulted me over the phone, why not apologize that way?
Regards,
Stinger
*I have received two notices regarding the $40ish that I "owe" Lee Precision.
One was a letter telling me that they could not send another order due to the balance.
The other was an INVOICE (yes that's right, I was sent a bill) for $41.96 for the package that I did not order. No, they have not charged my credit card, because they know it is illegal to do so, especially when the package was neither ordered, nor received by me. But I was billed, nontheless.
-out,
I do not plan to file a suit against anyone. They have caused me much frustration, confusion, irritaiton, and grief, but compensation is not my objective. My main goal in posting the thread is to let my fellow gunners and reloaders know about Lee's customer service (and possible illegal activities, ie being charged for something I did not order).
I notified the Better Business Bureau in Hartford, Wisconsin, and should receive a call back in about 3 weeks (I contacted them last week). What may come of that, I do not know. Probably nothing. But every complaint leaves its mark.
It was not my intent to bring Lee into the discussion on this forum, although I am glad they decided to chime in. It gave you all the opportunity to see both sides of the story. I let him know that I would be posting on this and other forums so that he might know that just because I am a little guy, I do have a voice.
I certainly do not appreciate my name being posted. That, in and of itself, goes beyond anything else they already have done. I do not appreciate it, and that just shows one more example of their poor businessmanship. They should never post customer names on public websites.
In my separate dealings with Lee, my objective was/is to resolve this issue. Apparently that will not happen. After speakng to Lee, I sent the company an email asking how I might go about getting the parts to fix my press, and have had no, zero, nada response. I will probably send another email again today or tomorrow asking about those parts.
Regards,
Stinger
td;lr - Lee Precision called a customer a liar, tried to bill them for goods allegedly not received (no proof they were), publicly apologized but allegedly never resolved the original issue. All of this over $40. I personally resolved unless I heard otherwise never to buy from them again.
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The Sig MPX has been out for awhile. I have one.
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You just want photos of booth babes, don't you?
Been married just shy of 19 years...what do you think?
Nah, I'm bored, got some fun money headed my way, and want to do some shopping, so want to do some research...
ON GUNS!
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It was a giveaway.
I didn't win anything. =(
Like Lee said, nothing really new, just redressing on their old stuff. The M1A is about as silly as silly can be with it's tacticooliness.
http://www.springfield-armory.com/new-products/
I didn't see a new M1A. I agree that the "tactical" SOCOM is odd. I like the polymer stock for the Loaded M1A.
Overall, the make good guns, but I thought they were making a big deal about nothing with the new products.
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That Cobalt Kinetics rifle looks like they are going for the Star Wars crowd. It is kind of neat, but a bit overboard.
I really like the new Kalashnikov USA AK. Looks like it has all the upgrades I would want on an AK is a good package.
The KRISS Sphinx pistols look a bit expensive for high cap polymer pistols.
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http://www.springfield-armory.com/new-products/
I didn't see a new M1A. I agree that the "tactical" SOCOM is odd. I like the polymer stock for the Loaded M1A.
Overall, the make good guns, but I thought they were making a big deal about nothing with the new products.
http://www.springfield-armory.com/m1a-series/ It's the CQB that's new, with the AR stock and the AK grip. I guess the website has gone funky or something.
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He's talking about how Lee always plays second-fiddle in reloading circles to Dillon.
Lee Dies - awesome.
Lee Single stage presses - awesome.
Lee Progressive presses - Fussy, so-so reputation.
Looks like ELCAN is stepping into the space left by the huge L3-EoTech recall in the holographic sight market. It'll probably cost at least 2x as much as a comparable EoTech (the milspec temperature thing that got them in trouble not withstanding) and it's unclear if the back looking like the Tim Burton Batmobile, and the front like a droopy scrotum will hurt it's market acceptance.
http://soldiersystems.net/2016/01/19/shot-show-elite-defense-debuts-specter-holographic-combat-optic-by-elcan/
Lee Classic Cast Turret press...
BEYOND awesome.
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President of Lee Precision called someone at THR a liar when UPS had no proof they delivered a second unordered package to a customer. Guy posted on some forums. Basically Lee acted rudely. Mixed thoughts on the apology.
Interesting. I use Lee dies and presses, but I was not aware of this incident. The "apology" was, IMHO, not an apology at all. "I apologize to "Stinger" IF he really didn't receive the package that he didn't order and that we screwed up and sent ... somewhere." That's not much of an apology.
Lee seems to be a lot like Joseph Arthur Ciener, the .22 conversion guy: good products, backed by the customer service attitude of an angry orangutan. But John Lee is (was?) the founder of the company. Is he still even alive? I believe he turned management over to his son several years ago. We seem to have forgiven Ruger now that Bill is no longer at the helm, perhaps Lee Precision deserves the same second chance.
Does anyone know if Lee finally cancelled the bogus invoice?
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http://www.gunsholstersandgear.com/shot-show-2016
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For a while there Ruger seemed to be angling for the status of sole supplier to assault weapon ban states. Since Bill Ruger died, they have turned that around quite a bit.
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http://www.gunsholstersandgear.com/shot-show-2016
Big Thanks. That's what I was hoping for.
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In Range TV (Ian McCollum of Forgotten Weapons and his buddy Karl) are putting up a bunch of short vids from the Shot Show range.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeUNM9NqJqZXfRNeuW4_2sg (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeUNM9NqJqZXfRNeuW4_2sg)
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What about the S&W Performance Center Shield with barrel ports? If that's not a blast from the past.....
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLY1kfofyVo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLY1kfofyVo)
:rofl:
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Korth 9mm Conversion Kit
I noticed about 3/4 of the way down that one link is a Korth 9mm conversion kit to convert an L frame S&W revolver to 9mm. I can see the link where I am so I can't look at any of the details.
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Chiappa released a three barrel shotgun. Looks like a drilling, but all barrels are the same. Standard 26" barrels. That's gotta be fun to carry around. The 12 gauge was apparently already out there, but I guess it was too heavy, because the new releases are 20 and 28. Two thousand clams.
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http://monsterhunternation.com/2016/01/25/correias-shot-show-report/
Larry Correia does his own report on Shot Show. He highlights some very interesting guns.
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Korth 9mm Conversion Kit
I noticed about 3/4 of the way down that one link is a Korth 9mm conversion kit to convert an L frame S&W revolver to 9mm. I can see the link where I am so I can't look at any of the details.
Do want...
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http://monsterhunternation.com/2016/01/25/correias-shot-show-report/
Larry Correia does his own report on Shot Show. He highlights some very interesting guns.
I would love a STG-44. I've been saving my pennies to get one of the .22 LR copies they are putting out these days. I've seen them for as low as $329 before Christmas. I want one with the wood crate. I hope the crate has a hasp for a lock, because I'm out of room in my safes... =D =D
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Richard Lee founded Lee Precision.
His son, John, took over a number of years ago.
Neither one of them, in my experience, was particularly warm and cuddly.
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Either Forgotton Weapons or it was InRangeTV has some videos from the Shot Show. They take a look at the STG-44.
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Forgotten Weapons did the STG-44.
And apparently a metric buttload of them are in use in Syria... I would love for them to be able to be imported. Alas, tis wishful thinking....
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Forgotten Weapons did the STG-44.
And apparently a metric buttload of them are in use in Syria... I would love for them to be able to be imported. Alas, tis wishful thinking....
Fly to Syria
Get fake ID and a tan
Become a refugee and bring your new toy with you
Problem solved.
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English bespoke gun makers Anderson Wheeler finally revealed their .357 "Webley", which I was beginning to wonder if it was vaporware. Sets you back atleast $10K if you want one. I for one intend to play the lottery because I simply must have
one several, I'll throw money at them to get them to my specs.
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http://www.realguns.com/articles/785.htm
WTF?
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Fake. Read the article.
To achieve one trigger pull to one discharge, Ruger Director of Engineering and Macro Aggression John McClane
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Fake. Read the article.
That's what I figured.
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Can you imagine the double action trigger pull to get the cylinder to go around in only 3 shots?
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Forgotten Weapons did the STG-44.
And apparently a metric buttload of them are in use in Syria... I would love for them to be able to be imported. Alas, tis wishful thinking....
InRangeTV, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwdNPQxL04E
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSsFiS2Voxg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCyD9hrqK84