Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: MechAg94 on September 20, 2016, 10:25:14 PM
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/video-of-tulsa-police-shooting-terence-crutcher-sparks-outrage-171856828.html
Yahoo news had this on there news headlines. The video is a partial video from a helicopter. It does not show the entire incident from what I saw. Whether this turns into another spark for protests I have no idea.
The NYT link has dashcam footage, but it has no sound from the officers so you can't see what happened.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/20/us/video-released-in-terence-crutchers-killing-by-tulsa-police.html?_r=0
http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/20/us/oklahoma-tulsa-police-shooting/index.html
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In an interview, Officer Shelby’s lawyer, Scott Wood, said the officer had thought that Mr. Crutcher had a weapon. Mr. Wood said Mr. Crutcher had acted erratically, refused to comply with several orders, tried to put his hand in his pocket and reached inside his car window before he was shot.
Okay question for the group: if they already had him at gun point near the one police cruiser, why would they walk him back to his own vehicle? Just have him put his hands on the cruiser and cuff him there.
On the other side, none of the video shows clearly what is happening at the time he was shot so none of the questions are answered. The reports keep saying he had his hands up before being shot, but I am not sure how relevant that is.
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I believe I read somewhere it might have been an ND I think?
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Well, so far no
riots Peaceful protests in Tulsa.
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Heard a "report" on it.and watched the video.
My opinion from info from the report and video.
Guy was non-compliant, had shook off a Taser, was walking away from cops who were ordering him to stop. Guy reaches or attempts to reach into his vehicle. Game over.
Messed up deal either way.
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First officer on the scene was a female, who fired the fatal shot.
Officers were actually responding to another call when this guy was found to be "broke down" in the middle of the road.
Window to the SUV was up, PCP was supposedly found in the SUV.
As RKL stated, so far all the protests have been non-violent.
The more interesting situation is now in Charlotte.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/09/21/at-least-12-charlotte-cops-injured-in-protests-following-officer-involved-death-black-man.html
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I'm kind of interested to see if we hear more about the failed TASER use.
I'd kind of like to know if it was a case of the TASER malfunctioning, improper deployment or if the guy simply shook it off because he was seriously hopped up.
Or, if the early report of the TASER use was an error.
so far all the protests have been non-violent.
I heard this morning that "Big Al" is coming to town to correct that problem.
I also heard that The mayor of Tulsa, P.T. Barnum G.T. Bynum is anxious to meet with the good Reverend.
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I'm with you on this.
The other thing that TPD is going to get beaten up on is that they still haven't purchased body cams. They are supposed to have a federal grant to purchase them but just haven't seemed to find the "right" one to buy. The first officer on the scene, the one who fired the shot, also didn't turn on her emergency lights, therefore her dashcam wasn't on, which might have given some idea of what went on prior to the first back up and helicopter arriving.
Another twist in all of this is that the helicopter pilot is her husband.
Another story that gives more information on this one.
Two 911 calls described an SUV that had been abandoned in the middle of the road. One unidentified caller said the driver was acting strangely, adding, "I think he's smoking something."
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/09/20/man-ignored-oklahoma-officers-commands-before-shooting-attorney-says.html
I heard this morning that "Big Al" is coming to town to correct that problem.
I also heard that The mayor of Tulsa, P.T. Barnum G.T. Bynum is anxious to meet with the good Reverend.
Oh goody.....
As for the Charlotte issue, there are two stories that are floating around. I got this info from a former classmate that now lives there.
The guy that was shot apparently was sitting at a bus stop waiting for his son reading a book. So either there is a bigger story here than is being told or two separate incidents happened.
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The more interesting situation is now in Charlotte.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2016/09/21/at-least-12-charlotte-cops-injured-in-protests-following-officer-involved-death-black-man.html
From the link:
The protests broke out Tuesday after 43-year-old Keith Lamont Scott was fatally shot by a black officer at an apartment complex on the city's northeast side. They continued into early Wednesday morning, when TV footage showed dozens of protesters on Interstate 85 apparently looting semi-trucks and setting their contents on fire on the highway....
Tuesday night, a larger group of demonstrators gathered near the scene of the shooting. The Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Department tweeted that demonstrators were destroying marked police vehicles and that approximately 12 officers had been injured, including one who was hit in the face with a rock. Photos and TV video showed police firing tear gas to break up the crowd. Some officers were in riot gear.
(Emphasis added)
Yeah...the press keep saying "protest{s,er}" or demonstrator....I think given the bolded text, you actual mean "riot" and "rioter"
Keep your powder dry...
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Bearing arms has two good pieces that are not following the narrative
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From the link:(Emphasis added)
Yeah...the press keep saying "protest{s,er}" or demonstrator....I think given the bolded text, you actual mean "riot" and "rioter"
Keep your powder dry...
That bugs the hell out of me too. I'm too lazy to search, but I bet the MSM hasn't used the term "rioters" for these domestic riots in thirty years or more. I wouldn't be surprised if they change terms to "unanticipated shoppers" at some point.
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http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/09/20/terence-crutcher-shot-hands-heres-definitive-proof/
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That bugs the hell out of me too. I'm too lazy to search, but I bet the MSM hasn't used the term "rioters" for these domestic riots in thirty years or more. I wouldn't be surprised if they change terms to "unanticipated shoppers" at some point.
So you're saying that the items the rioters looters protesters shoppers remove from the stores in these incidents are simply "uncompensated purchases"?
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Sounds like some "furtive movements" to me. I'm going to enjoy the folks freaking out about "ZOMG he didn't have his hands raised" who will ignore the "He was reaching through his (closed) window." Always nice to see which distortions destroy credibility and which don't eh?
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The Tulsa shooting seems somewhat dubious but until there's more investigation....
Not following police orders shouldn't be a death sentence. If you clearly are armed and threaten the police then by all means. How is it that I can't shoot someone for dropping their hands in a "furtive manner" but they can?
The other shooting?
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/police-chief-officers-warned-black-man-to-drop-gun/ar-BBwpBth?OCID=ansmsnnews11
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How is it that I can't shoot someone for dropping their hands in a "furtive manner" but they can?
Because they're allowed to assume that everyone they meet is Zombie Bob Munden. You're supposed to take a more realistic approach, and figure that being on target, finger on the trigger will allow you to wait until you actually see a weapon and still have time to fire.
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The Tulsa shooting seems somewhat dubious but until there's more investigation....
Not following police orders shouldn't be a death sentence. If you clearly are armed and threaten the police then by all means. How is it that I can't shoot someone for dropping their hands in a "furtive manner" but they can?
The other shooting?
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/police-chief-officers-warned-black-man-to-drop-gun/ar-BBwpBth?OCID=ansmsnnews11
If you can clearly explain the threat you perceived, you might be able to do that. The prosecutor and jury might not believe you though.
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https://gma.yahoo.com/tulsa-police-officer-shares-her-side-story-terence-225515468--abc-news-topstories.html
Most of what I am hearing since I posted this is the guy was ignoring commands to stay near the police cruiser so they could handcuff him, but moved to his car and reached in for something. The videos show most of this, but I thought the view was obscured at the point he reached into the vehicle and was shot. Yeah, he had his hands up prior to that, but it doesn't mean a whole lot.
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https://gma.yahoo.com/tulsa-police-officer-shares-her-side-story-terence-225515468--abc-news-topstories.html
Most of what I am hearing since I posted this is the guy was ignoring commands to stay near the police cruiser so they could handcuff him, but moved to his car and reached in for something. The videos show most of this, but I thought the view was obscured at the point he reached into the vehicle and was shot. Yeah, he had his hands up prior to that, but it doesn't mean a whole lot.
He reached in through the glass?
(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14370287_10210501630926544_6874232812427512640_n.jpg?oh=c0876e3c5280248e3c0c2299f6e7966c&oe=583B8782)
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He reached in through the glass?
(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14370287_10210501630926544_6874232812427512640_n.jpg?oh=c0876e3c5280248e3c0c2299f6e7966c&oe=583B8782)
Look at CSD's link:
http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2016/09/20/terence-crutcher-shot-hands-heres-definitive-proof/
Looks like the sunroof and front windows are open.
I can understand the LEO's concern, but (even assuming the window was down) this would likely land a non-LEO in prison.
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There are some screen grabs out there showing the guys hands were NOT up when he was shot and the window was NOT up. They also show his right hand at his waist or pocket area IIRC.
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He reached in through the glass?
(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14370287_10210501630926544_6874232812427512640_n.jpg?oh=c0876e3c5280248e3c0c2299f6e7966c&oe=583B8782)
I haven't seen the full report but they are saying that window actually was down. If the windows are tinted that is a rather clear view to the inside of the SUV, also it is possible the window was partially down.
I don't know what the entire story is but things are going to be interesting around here for a few more days since the "beloved" Al Sharpton is going to be in town Tuesday. Just hope his partner in crime J.J. stays away. One of them here at a time is more than enough.
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Note the left arm through the window into the van:
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstatic.conservativetribune.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F09%2FTerence-Crutcher-Shooting-Screenshot.jpg&hash=ec2413cdb603bd799c33b4dba9a2d3b24ecd3fa4)
From: http://conservativetribune.com/terence-crutchers-shooting-is-not/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=JeffersonNewsletter&utm_campaign=BestOfDay&utm_content=2016-09-22
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It's not uncommon to have back windows tinted and front's clear. Many vehicles come from the factory that way.
And Balog's screen grab looks a whole lot like blood running down the window and side of the truck. I find it a little tough to think he got shot, rolled up the window, and then bled on it for a bit to better frame the cops. That's Zimmerman-esque level planning there. >:D
Which is not to say that C&Sd's video showing his hands were at his waist isn't also correct. He could very well have dropped his hands, moved around, leaned up on a closed window, done the hokey pokey, whatever and gotten shot.
ETA: HeroHog, I see what you're saying. and that's the problem with grainy video. That arm could be through a window, or it could be leaned on a closed window. I definitely see the sleeve of his shirt. But I couldn't swear either way, from that picture, that his arm was in that truck. Which is not to say he didn't do something to justify him getting shot. Just that there seems to be two main narratives being spun right now, and the available evidence seems to show inconsistencies in BOTH of those narratives.
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ETA: HeroHog, I see what you're saying. and that's the problem with grainy video.
It's also the problem with not having the street level audio. I'm wondering if the reason that hasn't been released is that we might find out something about the commands given, (possibly conflicting) deceased's statements, (maybe he said his hearing aid was in the car) or timing of the shot/tazer that's not good for the PD.
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http://www.newson6.com/story/33160895/press-conference-held-at-tulsa-county-courthouse
First degree manslaughter charges against the officer have been filed.
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http://www.newson6.com/story/33160895/press-conference-held-at-tulsa-county-courthouse
First degree manslaughter charges against the officer have been filed.
Imagine that; keep the protests actually peaceful and the proper process can get going.
Now, if the court does the usual "police are special and so endangered that they must be allowed to kill anyone who moves wrong in their presence" farce, I'll have little sympathy when the professional agitators start a daily nonstop bus line between Charlotte and Tulsa, but if they'll try the case reasonably, then this could be a great example for both sides.
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I will be surprised if this makes it to court within a year.
There is a case down here where an off-duty cop executed his daughter's boyfriend and he still hasn't been to trial and it has been over a year.
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I would put $$ that that is not blood on glass you see but the seatbelt because why would the blood go all the way to the top of the window? Why would it run down the window in a perfect stripe? Why, when it got to the door, would it suddenly start to splatter and spread?
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He reached in through the glass?
(https://scontent-sjc2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14370287_10210501630926544_6874232812427512640_n.jpg?oh=c0876e3c5280248e3c0c2299f6e7966c&oe=583B8782)
Dark strip in the window looks to me like a seat belt hanging from the b-pillar harness.
Brad
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I would put $$ that that is not blood on glass you see but the seatbelt because why would the blood go all the way to the top of the window? Why would it run down the window in a perfect stripe? Why, when it got to the door, would it suddenly start to splatter and spread?
It's about Crutcher's shoulder level, not an unreasonable place for a blood track to start. It would also be easy to disprove if false; surely there are some crime scene photos, or even just another frame of the video from the circling helicopter that would show the streak on the window not aligning with the one on the door. Also, it doesn't look to me like it spreads until below the door handle.
There's also a couple of frames of a specular reflection just about dead center in the window opening when one of the cops is swinging his flashlight around. Could be a video artifact, but it sure looks like window glass.
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Imagine that; keep the protests actually peaceful and the proper process can get going.
That's not what made the difference. The difference between Tulsa and Charlotte is that one shoot is bad, and the other good. Generally speaking, BLM outrage/crime correlates positively with the guilt of the deceased. Thus, although the facts are not yet in, the BLM reaction predicts the outcome in most cases.
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Notice where he lines up in relation to the car.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F2d0yaz2jiom3c6vy7e7e5svk.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F09%2Fcrutcher1-410x220.jpg&hash=b28faec8d673187c287ceb911388cef91075951c)
Notice where the shot was and relate that to that "stripe" on the window. There is no way that strip "on the window" came from that wound. (Click to see full size)
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcitizenslant.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F09%2FTerence-Crutcher-screen-grab2a-1170x500.jpg&hash=f9d2602e405ccc4924ea04c5350e1db3fa62e8a9) (http://citizenslant.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Terence-Crutcher-screen-grab2a-1170x500.jpg)
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It's not uncommon to have back windows tinted and front's clear. Many vehicles come from the factory that way.
ALL vehicles come from the factory that way, because many states have laws prohibiting deep tint on the front side windows.
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It's also the problem with not having the street level audio. I'm wondering if the reason that hasn't been released is that we might find out something about the commands given, (possibly conflicting) deceased's statements, (maybe he said his hearing aid was in the car) or timing of the shot/tazer that's not good for the PD.
I would be curious what you think that would be. If you have one then multiple cops facing you with guns drawn, do you turn back to your vehicle to go get your hearing aide? strange behavior IMO. It is just as plausible that he could have been baiting the cops to shoot him for some reason. It sucks the guy got shot, but I don't see what he did as normal behavior.
I figure charges were made on the officer to try to head off a repeat of what is happening in Charlotte. Unless something comes out that points to guilt, I figure the officer won't get convicted of anything. I bet her career as an officer is over though.
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I bet her career as an officer is over though
The very second a white cop shot a black man.
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The very second a white cop shot a black man.
In this case yes. However, this stuff happens more often without the officer's name and face plastered all over the news.
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It sucks the guy got shot, but I don't see what he did as normal behavior.
If not acting normal is justification for deadly force, then all of us are in trouble.
With multiple cops on scene, none within hand to hand range and at least one on target ready to fire, there was no need to start shooting without a visible weapon.
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With multiple cops on scene, none within hand to hand range and at least one on target ready to fire, there was no need to start shooting without a visible weapon.
Early on, I saw one article suggesting that the shooting was unintentional -- as in a nervous trigger press due to stress. That would indicate poor trigger finger discipline -- violation of Cooper's Rule Number 3 (the full version: "Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target and you're ready to fire").
I can't find that reference now -- I suspect the department has done their best to make it go away.
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If not acting normal is justification for deadly force, then all of us are in trouble.
With multiple cops on scene, none within hand to hand range and at least one on target ready to fire, there was no need to start shooting without a visible weapon.
So you are saying he has to grab a gun and shoot at the cops before they can fire? Abnormal behavior with guns pointed at you is a recipe for getting shot no matter what the situation is or who you are. You can't lay 100% of the responsibility on the police.
I heard one local police officer comment that police these days are trained to almost never lay hands on a suspect to subdue them. So they go from commands to taser to guns. It made me think that 60 years ago, the guy would have ended up getting hit with a nightstick before he made it back to his vehicle. I am not sure if that is better or not. If they had dog piled the guy and beat the hell out of him (or it looked like they did), there would still be a public mess over it and demands for charges against the cops.
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Refusing to follow a direction, in and of itself, is not a justification for being shot, tased, night sticked, or otherwise physically attacked.
As a country we need to get over this "obey at all costs!" Mentality.
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As a country we need to get over this "obey at all costs!" Mentality.
Unless it has to do with reducing emissions to prevent global warming, or paying more taxes to improve social services, or accepting single payer healthcare... Amiright? Right?
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Unless it has to do with reducing emissions to prevent global warming, or paying more taxes to improve social services, or accepting single payer healthcare... Amiright? Right?
These political issues are the same or even remotely close to "LEO shouldn't shoot you for disobedience alone" how???
Talk about a spurious attempt to make a discussion about law enforcement into a general "left vs right" bag of nonsense ;/
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Refusing to follow a direction, in and of itself, is not a justification for being shot, tased, night sticked, or otherwise physically attacked.
As a country we need to get over this "obey at all costs!" Mentality.
What's this "we" stuff, Counselor? IIRC you're not here, you're in Australia.
Refusal to comply with police commands IS justification for them to deploy the taser. That's what is. In most jurisdictions, that's policy. I happen to agree with you that the police in the U.S. -- generally -- have become much too "compliance" focused, with the emphasis on giving orders and demanding instant compliance rather than discussion and negotiation, but neither you nor I gets to wear a badge or make department policy.
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What's this "we" stuff, Counselor? IIRC you're not here, you're in Australia.
Refusal to comply with police commands IS justification for them to deploy the taser. That's what is. In most jurisdictions, that's policy. I happen to agree with you that the police in the U.S. -- generally -- have become much too "compliance" focused, with the emphasis on giving orders and demanding instant compliance rather than discussion and negotiation, but neither you nor I gets to wear a badge or make department policy.
You may not realise but according to the IRS I'm an American no matter where I live.
Sorry, but I don't agree that inflicting severe pain is justified unless a person demonstrates some sort of threat to others.
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You may not realise but according to the IRS I'm an American no matter where I live.
Sorry, but I don't agree that inflicting severe pain is justified unless a person demonstrates some sort of threat to others.
Like not paying taxes?
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These political issues are the same or even remotely close to "LEO shouldn't shoot you for disobedience alone" how???
Talk about a spurious attempt to make a discussion about law enforcement into a general "left vs right" bag of nonsense ;/
I brought them up because your usual response to those topics tends toward authoritarianism, so thus it's ironic you are recommending we "as a country" get over the obey at all costs mentality.
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Sorry, but I don't agree that inflicting severe pain is justified unless a person demonstrates some sort of threat to others.
I believe you have identified the crux of the issue. Refusal to comply with an officer's request order command IS a threat -- to the officer's ego, and to the entire police state mentality and system.
"You WILL respect mah aw-thaw-rih-tay!"
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I believe you have identified the crux of the issue. Refusal to comply with an officer's request order command IS a threat -- to the officer's ego, and to the entire police state mentality and system.
"You WILL respect mah aw-thaw-rih-tay!"
Actually, no. The police officer has very little to no background on you (other than wants and warrants, and perhaps priors.) We were taught to treat every stop as a felony stop simply because we don't know what happened. You could have just murdered your entire family, we don't know. You may have decided that you want to commit suicide by cop, or that you've decided to kill as many cops (and/or other people) as possible. Or you may simply be not paying a attention when you rolled through the stop sign, or late to pick up your kids from soccer practice which is why you weren't just pushing the speed limit but ignoring it.
Plus everyone want to be the person that makes the latest and most viral youtube video ever, so there are a lot of people that will attempt to goad police into action. Then bitch about when it happens. Guess what? Keep poking the bear there snowflake, but don't act surprised or all butthurt when the bear pokes back.
We don't know. And it takes very little time for things to go completely pear shaped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8oS1JuRxbQ
What we do know is that we have a job to do. And frankly De Selby, I am completely disappointed in you. I was taught that you argue your case in court and not by the side of the road. Sadly, in today's society it seems the entire special snowflake mentality has made it impossible for people to follow some simple directions for the safety of everyone. Why is that so hard? And it's only for a few minutes at the most.
Are there some egomaniac cops (and departments) out there. You betcha. And I believe that they should drummed out of police work and if appropriate prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. And sadly, that doesn't happen.
The rule of law is pretty much dead in this country, it's just too stupid to fall over. A hard rain is gonna fall, but I can only hope that people realize what was lost and reclaim it again.
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Scout, your post sounds a lot like "They had to shoot him because they didn't know whether he planned to kill everybody, and he wouldn't play Simon Says." I thought lethal force was only permitted when there is (or reasonably seems to be) an imminent threat.
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I brought them up because your usual response to those topics tends toward authoritarianism, so thus it's ironic you are recommending we "as a country" get over the obey at all costs mentality.
Uh, care to cite an example of me supporting authoritarian responses to anything???
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Actually, no. The police officer has very little to no background on you (other than wants and warrants, and perhaps priors.) We were taught to treat every stop as a felony stop simply because we don't know what happened. You could have just murdered your entire family, we don't know. You may have decided that you want to commit suicide by cop, or that you've decided to kill as many cops (and/or other people) as possible. Or you may simply be not paying a attention when you rolled through the stop sign, or late to pick up your kids from soccer practice which is why you weren't just pushing the speed limit but ignoring it.
Plus everyone want to be the person that makes the latest and most viral youtube video ever, so there are a lot of people that will attempt to goad police into action. Then bitch about when it happens. Guess what? Keep poking the bear there snowflake, but don't act surprised or all butthurt when the bear pokes back.
We don't know. And it takes very little time for things to go completely pear shaped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8oS1JuRxbQ
What we do know is that we have a job to do. And frankly De Selby, I am completely disappointed in you. I was taught that you argue your case in court and not by the side of the road. Sadly, in today's society it seems the entire special snowflake mentality has made it impossible for people to follow some simple directions for the safety of everyone. Why is that so hard? And it's only for a few minutes at the most.
Are there some egomaniac cops (and departments) out there. You betcha. And I believe that they should drummed out of police work and if appropriate prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. And sadly, that doesn't happen.
The rule of law is pretty much dead in this country, it's just too stupid to fall over. A hard rain is gonna fall, but I can only hope that people realize what was lost and reclaim it again.
How does arguing that people shouldn't be shot for non-compliance mean the rule of law is dead?
The court example is a good point. If the IRS or EPA goes after you, and you ignore them, they take you to court where you can argue the point and a judge or jury gets to decide what happens next.
The proper response to someone arguing a cop's direction on the roadside is most definitely not to bypass the legal option by shooting that person dead.
I also think policing should be based on realistic risk profiles. The odds that a budding cop killer is the person you just pulled over are vanishingly small. I don't agree that the citizenry deserve to be treated like budding cop killers on the basis of that infintesimal risk.
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Actually, no. The police officer has very little to no background on you (other than wants and warrants, and perhaps priors.) We were taught to treat every stop as a felony stop simply because we don't know what happened. You could have just murdered your entire family, we don't know. You may have decided that you want to commit suicide by cop, or that you've decided to kill as many cops (and/or other people) as possible. Or you may simply be not paying a attention when you rolled through the stop sign, or late to pick up your kids from soccer practice which is why you weren't just pushing the speed limit but ignoring it.
This is a perfect example of fear porn nonsense that gets lots of innocent people killed.
Anyone I walk by on the street could be a deranged serial killer about to try to kill me. That doesn't mean I get to shoot someone just because they appear to be looking at me and reaching into their pocket.
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Just remember -- there are two different (and basically mutually exclusive) mantras for police departments today. For the patrol cars, the mantra is "To Protect and Serve." For the officers, the mantra is "The only thing that matters is that I go home at the end of my shift."
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Just remember -- there are two different (and basically mutually exclusive) mantras for police departments today. For the patrol cars, the mantra is "To Protect and Serve." For the officers, the mantra is "The only thing that matters is that I go home at the end of my shift."
It doesn't say to protect and serve whom.
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"Protect and serve" was (is?) the motto of the LAPD. It's never been anything more than a slogan one department adopted that made it into the national consciousness.
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"Protect and serve" was (is?) the motto of the LAPD. It's never been anything more than a slogan one department adopted that made it into the national consciousness.
That slogan is painted (or decaled) on the sides of municipal police cars all across my state. If it has made it into the national consciousness, it's because the police themselves have put it there.
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That slogan is painted (or decaled) on the sides of municipal police cars all across my state. If it has made it into the national consciousness, it's because the police themselves have put it there.
I'd guess it was because popular tv shows put it there, actually.
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We don't know. And it takes very little time for things to go completely pear shaped.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8oS1JuRxbQ
That took frickin' forever to go all the way south, in the terms of any sort of active encounter.
Dancing a jig was all the time in the world to draw and come on target.
Entering the truck was time to make sure the safety is off and get a finger on the trigger.
Weapon was visible for plenty of time to take the shot.
Essentially, this was the opposite extreme of the Levar Jones shooting. It seems police have great difficulty finding a happy medium.
Early on, I saw one article suggesting that the shooting was unintentional -- as in a nervous trigger press due to stress. That would indicate poor trigger finger discipline -- violation of Cooper's Rule Number 3 (the full version: "Keep your finger off the trigger until your sights are on the target and you're ready to fire").
I can't find that reference now -- I suspect the department has done their best to make it go away.
Because you can't justify an accident. Can't remember the name or place off the top of my head, but way back, there was a case where a guy was very justifiably aiming and ordering an attacker to stop while retreating. He would have been fully justified in shooting under the circumstances, but he claimed the gun went off when he stumbled. He ended up losing the case because he claimed it was an accident, not a completely justified use of deadly force in self defense.