Post by: cosine on December 24, 2006, 04:56:01 PM
Post by: Twycross on December 24, 2006, 05:01:33 PM
If you really want to watch the whole series, then I would probably do it in the order of their storyline.
Post by: Ron on December 24, 2006, 05:02:30 PM
VI
II
V
I
III
IV
Let us know how that works
Post by: Preacherman on December 24, 2006, 05:29:29 PM
Post by: Standing Wolf on December 24, 2006, 05:36:49 PM
Shoveling snow has more intellectual content.
Post by: zahc on December 24, 2006, 06:14:39 PM
Post by: Sindawe on December 24, 2006, 06:36:35 PM
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The most benefit you'll get out of is not being lost in conversations with the worshippers.
I find your lack of faith disturbing.
Watch 'em in the order they were produced. IV, V & VI, followed by I, II & III. Original versions if you can get 'em, not the "reworked" rereleases of original films. Unless you've been living under a rock for the past 30 years, you already know the storyline. The movies are entertaining, but as others have noted, no great truths about life will be found in 'em.
But Vader's Blog is interesting.
Post by: gunsmith on December 25, 2006, 12:19:57 AM
Post by: lee n. field on December 25, 2006, 03:38:49 AM
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ou should watch IV, V, and VI in that order. I-III were just silly.
Ditto. 1 to 3 are very flashy, but story leaves something to be desired. #1 starts out w/ the Jedi as tax enforcers -- give me a break.
Post by: Iapetus on December 25, 2006, 01:43:42 PM
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ou should watch IV, V, and VI in that order. I-III were just silly.
Ditto. 1 to 3 are very flashy, but story leaves something to be desired. #1 starts out w/ the Jedi as tax enforcers -- give me a break.
They were sent to help negotiate an end to the blockade that the Trade Federation had imposed against Naboo. Somebody's tax policy was the cause of /excuse for the dispute (which in fact was just a pretext for putting an invasion force in position), but as far as I can remember, the Jedi were not there to make anyone pay taxes.
(If you want to start on the politics of the Star Wars prequels, a better criticism might be that despite the original trilogy being a story of a rebellion against an overbearing regime, the prequels didn't even entertain the idea that the Separatists might have had valid reasons for their actions. Of course, that doesn't change the fact that as a story concept, trade disputes hardly has the same excitement as an Evil Empire with the power to destroy a planet).
Post by: Cosmoline on December 25, 2006, 02:07:43 PM
The Empire Strikes Back is probably the only one of the series that's actually a good movie. It's also the one Lucas had the least control over. Jedi is fun but mired by Lucas' purile manchild visions. The prequels are among the worst movies ever made. Avoid them at all costs.
Post by: Sindawe on December 25, 2006, 02:15:59 PM
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the prequels didn't even entertain the idea that the Separatists might have had valid reasons for their actions.
Of course not, since there was no valid reason for the Trade Federation to blockage Naboo. The whole thing was a plot by Darth Sidius to weaken the already faltering Galatic Republic so that he could further his plans to seize power and put The Sith in charge of everything.Quote
Avoid them at all costs.
Eh, I've seen worse movies. Notably some bit of dren about a frozen British Agent with bad teeth and an overactive sex drive. : puke : The visuals of II and III are at times stunning, and the saber fights are spectacular.
Post by: cosine on December 25, 2006, 05:09:05 PM
*looks around warily* Does it seem like the Star Wars geeks have come out of the woodwork?
Post by: Cosmoline on December 25, 2006, 06:08:25 PM
The visuals of II and III are at times stunning, and the saber fights are spectacular.
Only to the weak minds
The visuals are mired in too much reliance on CGI, which looks flat and distant no matter how much money you pour into it. The model and matte based originals may have more seams, but they also have more heart. The saber fights in the prequels are mostly between actors and loopy CGI characters, so there's no drama to them. The ONLY good one, and indeed the only good part of any of the prequels, was the excellent fight between Qui-Gon Jinn and Darth Maul, played by two real human beings. But Lucas, true to form, wrote almost no dialog for Maul and edited the fight down to a very short sequence so he could give more time to Jar Jar and the trade federation. The final fight between Anakin and Obi-Wan could have been good, but Lucas had the whole thing transposed onto an absurd CGI lava landscape. I get the sense that Lucas would prefer to make films with no human actors or real landscapes at all. Here's a test I encourage everyone to run for themselves. Rent Ep. III and Patton or Ep. II and Lawrence of Arabia and watch them back to back. Then tell me you think the CGI makes for better action sequences.
Post by: Sindawe on December 25, 2006, 07:45:45 PM
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The visuals are mired in too much reliance on CGI, which looks flat and distant no matter how much money you pour into it. The model and matte based originals may have more seams, but they also have more heart.
Matter of opinion I think. I *like* good CGI, and some of work in the latter SW movies was pretty good. Not on par with, say "Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within". And it WAS a space opera, so reality is sorta out the airlockPatton: The "German" tanks are not German tanks at all, nor even reasonable fakes. Stuff like that ruins a movie for me, as it did when Hollywood reused the Zulu war chants from the move Zulu for the war chants of the Germanic tribes in the opening of the movie Gladiator. WTF?
LofA was better, since I think more effort went into authenticity of the sets.
I dunno, personally I think the action sequences in Babylon 5 - The Fall of Night + Endgame, as well as DS9-Fortune Favors the Bold were pretty good.
All a matter of taste.
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Does it seem like the Star Wars geeks have come out of the woodwork?
Well, some folks DO let their fandom run to excess. Poor souls, really frelled in the head. 
Post by: Cosmoline on December 25, 2006, 09:29:10 PM
Not on par with, say "Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within". And it WAS a space opera, so reality is sorta out the airlock
You mean the biggest bomb in motion picture history? I remember that one. Face it, Lucas' prequels would have failed completely if it hadn't been for the enormous impact of the originals. For all the hype, most people simply can't warm up to pure CGI. It's a useful tool, but it can't make up for reality. It can be used to help augment real actors, such as Andy Serkis in the LOTR or Bill Nighy in the lastest Pirates movies. But those are both excellent character actors, and they're really interacting with the other actors in their scenes. The CGI just makes the skin look funkier or the tentacles move more realistically. I was just watching "Dead Man's Chest," and it's interesting to note how much real swordfighting and old-school stunt work there was in that film. The CGI is used to smooth out edges and add details to real sets and real actors, it doesn't stand in place of them. Nighy wears the CGI like an electronic mask, and it works well. And I think that helped make it one of the biggest blockbusters in recent memory. People don't want to see some CGI Yoda leap around while a live actor tries hard to pretend he's fighting him with an imaginary blade.
Post by: Perd Hapley on December 25, 2006, 09:31:24 PM
Post by: Cosmoline on December 25, 2006, 09:45:54 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy:_The_Spirits_Within
Post by: Waitone on December 26, 2006, 09:48:35 AM
Star Wars IV was a glorious return to the good ol' days entertainment. Matter of fact, the discerning viewer would say Star Wars IV was merely a western in space. You know, good, evil, black hats, white hats, horses, rugged individuals, pretty girls, unfulfilled romance, no-reload guns, villains falling down in heaps, good guys are bullet proof, twisting plots, etc. IV,V, and VI are faithful to the original message. I, II, and III's message is obscured by excessive use of CG.
Consider Star Wars to two epics roughly related. Look at them in sequence regardless of which epic you view first.
Post by: cosine on December 26, 2006, 03:33:17 PM
Maybe I'll watch I first, just 'cause my dad has it. (well, watch it that is if I ever get off this forum.
)
Post by: mustanger98 on December 26, 2006, 04:58:50 PM
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Star Wars IV was a glorious return to the good ol' days entertainment. Matter of fact, the discerning viewer would say Star Wars IV was merely a western in space. You know, good, evil, black hats, white hats, horses, rugged individuals, pretty girls, unfulfilled romance, no-reload guns, villains falling down in heaps, good guys are bullet proof, twisting plots, etc. IV,V, and VI are faithful to the original message. I, II, and III's message is obscured by excessive use of CG.
This... this whole thread, actually... reminds me of a couple of points. James Garner (aka Bret Maverick; yeah, I know who he is- I grew up watching him and I'm 32) did a documentary about Westerns called "Big Guns Talk". There at the first, he talking about how most folks like a good western and they're switching scenes between classic western movies and what looks a whole lot like the opening scene from Star Wars IV.
The other point is to consider when Luke Skywalker and Han Solo (who Harrison Ford said he wouldn't play again) and Chewbacca went in there, found out Princess Leah was there after her capture, got her out... you could see a classic case of the guys rescueing the damsel in distress. Remember how Han Solo said "better her than me" because Leah was marked for execution? Watch the next two and my how times have changed.
Oh, and ya'll remember all the gunfights Leia was in? I saw Episode 1 and she was just like her mama.
Post by: Iapetus on December 28, 2006, 03:02:38 AM
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the prequels didn't even entertain the idea that the Separatists might have had valid reasons for their actions.
Of course not, since there was no valid reason for the Trade Federation to blockage Naboo. The whole thing was a plot by Darth Sidius to weaken the already faltering Galatic Republic so that he could further his plans to seize power and put The Sith in charge of everything.I wasn't referring to Phantom Menace, where the Trade Federation were obviously nothing but villains (and pathetic ones at that).
I was thinking about the later prequels, where "thousands" of systems had joined the rebellion. I know the rebellion was orchestrated by Darth Sideous (but so was the Republic's response, so that can't be used to condemn one side without condemning both), and I know a lot of nasty, greedy people and power groups were involved in the plot. But I find it difficult to believe that all of the "thousands" of rebel systems were motivated purely by greed / Sith domination.
After all, it was acknowledged from Ep1 that the Senate was corrupt and useless. It just seemed odd to me, especially in light of the originals, that none of the good guys ever wondered "Maybe the Separatists have a point?" or "Is the Republic really worth saving?" They didn't even question it and conclude "Yes it is worth saving" - they just ignored the issue completely.
(Or maybe I'm just taking a kiddies' space opera far too seriously).
Post by: Silver Bullet on December 28, 2006, 05:03:21 AM
Star Wars Episode IV
Star Wars Episode V
Star Wars Episode VI
Star Wars Episode I
Star Wars Episode II
Star Wars Episode III
Firefly (episodes 1-14)
Serenity
Because:
1) Some of the interest or surprises in IV thru VI are given away by what you learn in I thru III.
2) If you watch Firefly/Serenity first, Star Wars will look like a cartoon. Better to watch Star Wars before you see Firefly; that way you can more easily maintain the illusion that what you're watching is really good.
Post by: Silver Bullet on December 28, 2006, 06:40:33 AM
Post by: InfidelSerf on December 28, 2006, 06:48:53 AM
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1) Some of the interest or surprises in IV thru VI are given away by what you learn in I thru III.
I disagree.
They really are two completely different trilogies.
Watching 4-6 will give you an understanding and appreciation for the story that the first 3 failed to achieve on their own.
1-3 basically filled in the blanks to a few backstory questions that 4-6 left.
However 4-6 stand on their own as films and really didn't need it.
But hey you make 3 movies that rake in one of the largest piles of cash you can imagine and see if you think making more isn't a good idea.
Lucas transformed the film industry with #4 So I have nothing but respect for the pioneering spirit he possesed.
He created the merchandising industry surounding movies.
Starwars basically broke up the classic good ol boy big studio environment. Opening the doors for alot of great films to be made.
I certainly don't agree with many of the choices and decisions he made since, but you have to admire the empire he created (no pun intended
) While you are going to enjoy the story, no matter what order you choose.
Personally I think it would be better to watch the original 3 in their order then the first 3.
Post by: cosine on January 03, 2007, 04:10:29 PM
See you dudes later.
Post by: BakerMikeRomeo on January 03, 2007, 04:44:33 PM
~GnSx
...
Who has no taste.
Post by: Perd Hapley on January 03, 2007, 04:52:43 PM
And now for something really stupid. In the middle of my One Station Unit Training (Infantry) at Fort Benning, GA, we somehow had the opportunity to go to the theater on base. Most of the guys went to see Starship Troopers, it being late fall in '97. As the main characters were "Mobile Infantry," they were all totally stoked about this movie.
Years later I saw it, and I couldn't believe anyone going through infantry training could get excited about the infantry of this movie. Great tactics, guys. Just swarm across the countryside, get right under the bugs and blast away until one of them picks you up and stuffs you in its mouth. Ah, the pain of being analytical about everything.
Post by: Iapetus on January 04, 2007, 09:46:38 AM
Starship Troopers: The Movie
And now for something really stupid.
And now for something really stupid.
Ah - I watched that movie not long after it came out, and it seemed quite good then.
I watched it again a couple of weeks ago, and - oh my!
I particularly liked the infantry tactics:
* We are small, slow, weak, useless in hand-to-hand combat, and have lots of long-range firepower.
* The bugs are big, fast, tough, deadly in close combat, but (mostly) have no ranged weapons.
So lets all run up to them and shoot them from point blank range!
Mind you, and to keep this Star Wars related, they were not really any worse than the tactics used by the Rebels when attacking the Death Star in Episode IV. ("This is Read Leader preparing to attack. Red 1 and Red 2 - I want you to be my
Post by: cosine on January 04, 2007, 09:48:31 AM
Plus, I think I'm in love.
Princess Leia - oh my! Lots of fortitude, courage, and spunk, and a pretty face too.
Post by: Perd Hapley on January 04, 2007, 11:06:52 AM
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I particularly liked the infantry tactics:
The first thing I really noticed was the way they swarmed around like a bunch of toddlers at recess. When my friends saw it, we were all being trained to walk in formation, keeping proper intervals, etc. And when you assault through the objective, you stay on line instead of masking each other's fire. I expect way too much, don't I?
Post by: cosine on January 04, 2007, 11:09:54 AM
Post by: cosine on January 04, 2007, 11:12:00 AM
Mind you, and to keep this Star Wars related, they were not really any worse than the tactics used by the Rebels when attacking the Death Star in Episode IV. ("This is Read Leader preparing to attack. Red 1 and Red 2 - I want you to be my disposable human shields wing men.")
It's a movie. Don't expect too much, and you won't be disappointed.
You may actually enjoy it.
Post by: Brad Johnson on January 04, 2007, 11:45:57 AM
As for the prequels, I can't stand them. Lucas may be a heckuva visionary and darned good producer, but he stinks as a writer and director, and even worse as an editor. The dialogue was awful, the acting wooden, the sequences too choppy, and there is a penchant for trying to put too much into each scene. They could have pared the whole thing back by a third, putting in more action and less dialogue, then cut about ten minutes out of each movie (not to mention each and every scene with Jar-Jar Binks).
Plus, re-edit the whole dang thing. And when I say re-edit I mean completel and totally s**tcan the whole thing as start over. The pod race in Phantom Menace could have been incredible, but they kept hopping back to other characters sitting around watching screens and making put-on "concern faces" as well as interspersing the race with horrendous Coselle-like dialogue from a screamingly fake two-headed thing that seems to wave it's heads around just because it could. I dunno, maybe Lucas got a two-for-one deal on the CG and didn't want to throw the bit away. Whatever it was, it ruined the entire race for me. I would just be getting into the action scene when they would cut to the character. A kick in the head would not have jarred me out of the movie harder. It was so bad I stopped watching the movie and just started noticing every incident of stupid editing. Two and three were no better.
Lucky that I picked up the old versions in the remastered laser disc editions before Lucas had a go at "fixing" them. Sorry, but no. His pal Spielberg may be pretty okay at Director's cuts, but they could both take lessons from James Cameron (ever seen his directors editions of T1, T2, The Abyss, or Titanic? The man flat-out knows how to re-edit a movie).
My suggestion would be to really watch the original trilogy - good movies, even with the Ewoks. The prequels? Well.. you might as well watch them just to say you did but be advised that the only thing worth seeing in any of them is Natalie Portman in a shredded skin-tight costume. If you see Hayden Christensen coming on screen go ahead and fast forward until you can't see him any more to spare yourself the misery. I guess he's trying to come off as menacing, but all he does is end up looking like a life-sized statue being moved around the set. IMHO the only real acting in the whole movie is Ewan McGregor, who absolutely nails Alec Guiness's character from the original right down to the mannerisms and tonal qualities in his voice.
Brad
Post by: mustanger98 on January 04, 2007, 11:46:26 AM
*In the vernacular I learned, "dude" is a synonym for a fop, a dandy, someone who dresses foolishly and especially while trying to be something they're not.
Post by: mustanger98 on January 04, 2007, 11:52:17 AM
I knew I, II, and III wouldn't be like IV, V, and VI. To be honest, I really hated to see them even talk about starting that project. But I still say Princess Leia was just like her mom.
Post by: cosine on January 04, 2007, 11:57:56 AM
Post by: Perd Hapley on January 04, 2007, 12:01:41 PM
Post by: cosine on January 04, 2007, 12:05:11 PM
Jar Jar was comic relief, and was also there for the kiddies.
In my opinion, there then was too much comic relief in the movie.
Post by: Brad Johnson on January 04, 2007, 12:07:30 PM
Jar Jar was comic relief, and was also there for the kiddies.
In my opinion, there then was too much comic relief in the movie.
I kinda looked at the whole movie as comic relief, except there was no comedy and no relief...
Brad
Post by: Felonious Monk/Fignozzle on January 04, 2007, 12:30:41 PM
The later trilogy (I, II, III) was very disappointing. I don't think I saw either of the final two in the theater.
Lucas/Spielberg did a good job and cutting edge effects when the originals came out in the '70's.
For any of us who thought that the subsequent trilogy would push the state-of-the-art in the same way as, say, the Tolkien/Peter Jackson films, Lucas really struck out.
I admit to having been a Tolkien/Hobbit geek back in the day, but I honestly don't ever again expect to be as impressed by a film (or series) as Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings films.
Another opportunity came when they decided to do C.S. Lewis' Narnia series. All seven (?) books have been optioned, but after LotR, I felt the first Narnia film was so poor that I wonder if they'll even DO more than one or two more.
All art is subjective. YMMV.
Post by: cosine on January 04, 2007, 09:08:08 PM
I still like Princess Leia.
Post by: Perd Hapley on January 05, 2007, 03:02:14 AM
I just finished watching Episode V, The Empire Strikes Back. Not bad at all! I liked it better than Episode I and Episode IV, they keep getting better and better. I especially enjoyed the plot and storyline. The plot and storyline of Episode V had more intricacies than that of Episode I and Episode IV.
I still like Princess Leia.
I still like Princess Leia.
Would you like her more in a metal bikini and alien harem garb?
Post by: cosine on January 05, 2007, 05:01:33 AM
Would you like her more in a metal bikini and alien harem garb?
Don't know yet. If I have time I'll watch Episode VI tonight and we'll soon find out.
Post by: Ben on January 05, 2007, 05:04:10 AM
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Jar Jar was comic relief, and was also there for the kiddies.
NO. STOP. CEASE and DESIST. I don't care if this is Oleg's forum. I absolutely forbid conversations involving Jar Jar Binx that don't involve theorizing on his prolonged and gruesome death.
Post by: Twycross on January 05, 2007, 05:37:27 AM
Post by: Perd Hapley on January 05, 2007, 06:48:00 AM
Post by: Ben on January 05, 2007, 06:50:07 AM
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Ben, may Jar Jar be chained to the throne of Rosie O'Donell the Hut and slowly smothered to death over the course of a thousand years.
That's more like it!
Post by: Ron on January 05, 2007, 07:06:27 AM
That Jar Jar just ruined the movie.
I am really bummed the original three have been re edited, I would like some time to re watch them but I would prefer to see the original edits. The general consensus seems to be the re edited versions aren't as good.
Post by: mustanger98 on January 05, 2007, 10:14:45 AM
Would you like her more in a metal bikini and alien harem garb?
Don't know yet. If I have time I'll watch Episode VI tonight and we'll soon find out.
See my post on page one.
Post by: m1911owner on January 05, 2007, 11:39:27 AM
Post by: cosine on January 05, 2007, 10:05:54 PM
I still like Princess Leia.
The only point I noticed that disappointed me just a tiny bit was that she did not take as great a leadership role in Episode VI as she did in Episode IV and V. But that's just a very minor disappointment. I think I'll change my avatar for a while. It reflects the movie and the scene with Princess Leia I that liked the best.
Post by: Perd Hapley on January 06, 2007, 05:03:42 AM
Post by: cosine on January 06, 2007, 06:06:55 AM
It will also make people think you are a girl.
Oh well.
Post by: cosine on January 06, 2007, 08:43:04 PM
Post by: mustanger98 on January 06, 2007, 09:14:07 PM
I just finished watching Episode II, Attack of the Clones. It was an interesting movie. I didn't enjoy it as much as the original trilogy, so I don't really have anything else to say.
I didn't either. It only gave an insight as to where the imperial storm troopers came from... the originally, they were the good guys, but became the group used by the bad guys.
Post by: cosine on January 07, 2007, 08:54:19 PM
Now that my first Star Wars experience has been concluded through watching all six movies, here are my thoughts:
I like the original trilogy the best, and gained much more enjoyment out of watching those three movies than the three movies of the prequel trilogy.
I am glad I watched the original trilogy first. Many events in the prequel trilogy would not have made sense without watching the original trilogy first. For example, if I had not watched the original trilogy first, especially Episode V, were Luke undergoes his Jedi training under Yoda in which Yoda teaches Luke of the things which lead to the Dark Side of the Force (anger, hate, aggression, fear) I do not think I would have noticed through Episodes II and III Anakin's gradual fall to the Dark Side as those traits began to appear in him.
Of the three movies of the preguel trilogy, the last, Episode III, was the strongest. The first movie I thought was the weakest. It basically just documented from where Anakin Skywalker came. The second movie was a little bit better, but still wasn't great, for it only showed the very beginning of Anakin's inability to control those emotions which lead to the Dark Side as well as showing the viewer from where the many Imperial Stormtroopers came. Finally, the last movie of the prequel trilogy was the best of the three. You saw Anakin's fall to the Dark Side of the Force be completed, the destruction of most of the Jedi, and Palpatine's gain of complete control of the Senate and formation the Galactic Empire.
The original trilogy, the documentation of the Rebellion against the Galactic Empire, is the better set of movies. The prequel trilogy is interesting for gaining the background information of how the Galactic Empire was formed and how the Rebellion was needed to restore the Republic, but watching those three movies I don't consider essential. The original trilogy documenting the Rebellion stands just fine alone in its entertainment value.
In regard to the quality of the six Star Wars movies (taking into account which ones I liked the best and which provided the most entertainment for me), I'll probably watch the original trilogy again pretty soon, but not the prequel trilogy. I'll eventually watch the prequel trilogy again, but I probably will not watch the prequel trilogy as often as I do the original trilogy.
Thanks for your advice for the order in which to watch the Star Wars movies.Again, like usual, it was excellent. I am happy that you lead me down the path to watching the original trilogy first.
Post by: CAnnoneer on February 10, 2007, 03:24:47 PM
Post by: cosine on February 10, 2007, 06:45:53 PM
There is way too much teenager crap in the movie series. It is a bad idea to mix serious issues with kiddie stuff. It would have been significantly better without JarJar, the Ewoks, teenager puppy love, and various other excessive cuteness. As they are, the movies are horribly stylistically dissonant; it amazes me people do not see that and continue believing that Lucas is a great director. Lucas is a big freaking softie that nobody had the balls to reign in. But then they would not have made nearly as much money selling theme merchandise...
Whatever. I liked it; it's mindless entertainment and doesn't have to be logical or perfect. Geez, just enjoy it for what it is.
Sure, it could have been better. I've got a whole list of stuff I wish had been better in the series. But it wasn't, and won't be. There's nothing one can do about so just sit back, relax, and enjoy it for what it is...
(if you can.
)