Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: just Warren on September 28, 2018, 06:28:10 PM
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The Zip .22 (https://youtu.be/X9bULArrKs4)
Never heard of it before this. Too bad it took down a better gun with it.
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So that's why I can't find USFA revolvers any more. *expletive*
Forgotten Weapons also has a range video on the Zip 22:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3fd4goVs-4
Gun Jesus actually managed to get it to fire 9 times in a row. Miracle?
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I liked Ian's piece on the usual worst gun ever the chauchat. Turns out it was okay when used as designed and before government redesign demands.
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So that's why I can't find USFA revolvers any more. *expletive*
Forgotten Weapons also has a range video on the Zip 22:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3fd4goVs-4
Gun Jesus actually managed to get it to fire 9 times in a row. Miracle?
Only if he can do it while simultaneously walking on water.
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Kimber Ultra Carry II.
Hammer-following right out of the box, brand-new. Afraid it would go full-auto.
Sent back to Kimber.
Came back, Wouldn't feed.
Sent back
Still wouldn't feed.
Sold.
I will *never*, *EVER*, own another Kimber.
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I know, only a sample size of one but my Kimber Custom II has been stone cold reliable right out of the box.
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Kimber Ultra Carry II.
Hammer-following right out of the box, brand-new. Afraid it would go full-auto.
Sent back to Kimber.
Came back, Wouldn't feed.
Sent back
Still wouldn't feed.
Sold.
I will *never*, *EVER*, own another Kimber.
I could express similar sentiments about my Colt Mk IV Series 70 Government Model Jammamatic and Colt's laughable warranty NON-service . . .
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I know, only a sample size of one but my Kimber Custom II has been stone cold reliable right out of the box.
Yup, my Kimber Classic Custom has been darn near perfect. Maybe the full-size models have better reliability.
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Who cares about Kimber's pistols? I just hope the rifles are as good as they look, and that I can get about 87 of them.
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NEW RIA 1911 .45 15 years ago. Hammer following. Disconnector burred. Deburred it. Perfect since.
PF9. Two shots, third round would nosedive. Ammo brand, bullet style, weight, didn't matter. Nosedived third round. Sent back, they say they did stuff, tested it, all OK. Still would nosedive third shot, once again, ammo brand, bullet style, weight, didn't matter. Called it my two-shot derringer with a handy compartment for extra ammo. Full disclosure to next person, my son, but he says it worked perfectly. Too small for my big hands?
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NEW RIA 1911 .45 15 years ago. Hammer following. Disconnector burred. Deburred it. Perfect since.
I had a less severe problem with mine, but an even easier fix. No problems since.
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Kimber Ultra Carry II.
Hammer-following right out of the box, brand-new. Afraid it would go full-auto.
Sent back to Kimber.
Came back, Wouldn't feed.
Sent back
Still wouldn't feed.
Sold.
I will *never*, *EVER*, own another Kimber.
A sample size of one gun, of a design that is known to be finnicky, and you dismiss the whole company? Solid logic right there.
For the record, I own three Kimbers: a Pro Carry (series 1 in .40), a Custom in .45, and a 25th Anniversary edition in .45. Since they are all based on the 1911 design, they have all had teething issues, but generally run well after I found the right magazine and ammo combination. My Pro Carry was my first real pistol and that thing is awesome. I took it to my first, real gun school at Front Sight nearly 20 years ago and it ran like a top.
Even though I like all my Kimbers, I will not carry them as a CCW. I have better guns for that use. I do enjoy shooting those 1911s and would buy another Kimber if I was in the market for another 1911.
I also own two Springfield 1911s, although one is an EMP, so 1911-ish, and one S&W 9mm 1911, and finally one Nighthawk Talon II in .45. I wouldn’t carry any of those guns as a CCW either, but they are fun to shoot.
Kimber quality was really good before they got too big and busy with orders, then their quality dropped way down. I think they are back to building decent guns now.
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Any 1911 step one is do not buy if the barrel isn't five inches. The shorter they get the dumber the barrel geometry and recoil assembly has to get to make them sorta work. Step two for kimbers, does it say Oregon on the side of it? If so, buy them all, if not, pass.
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Compact 1911 designs are notoriously picky about ammo. I've personally witnessed someone spend more money on ammo than on the gun trying to find something his micro-pew would fire reliably.
Brad
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Compact 1911 designs are notoriously picky about ammo. I've personally witnessed someone spend more money on ammo than on the gun trying to find something his micro-pew would fire reliably.
Brad
My "solution" to that problem of spending a lot of money on testing the "best" ammo (200 rounds recommended) was a compromise. I keep a round of the "best" ammo in the chamber and the rest cheaper ammo which I have tested out. All that first round has to do is fire and eject, no "testing" for feeding necessary.
Hey, I'm a cheapskate and willing to compromise. This theory of operation might not be suitable for others.
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A sample size of one gun, of a design that is known to be finnicky, and you dismiss the whole company? Solid logic right there.
I sent it back to the factory twice and they couldn't get it right. Done. For something I wanted to depend on, to defend myself and my daughter, and it never worked properly...?
Why would I put any trust in one?
Corollary - I have two Springfield 1911's one 9mm 4" one .45 ACP 4", not a single failure after thousands of rounds of ball and hp ammo from many different manufacturers. Granted, the Kimber was 3" barrel (IIRC).
Buy whatever you want, I'll do the same.
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Charter arms ar7. I bought it when I was in college and doing a lot of camping and canoeing on weekends.
I bought it as a cheap .22 plinker and because it would float.
I only sold it because I couldn't throw it in the river and watch it sink.
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I bought a NIB AR7, took it to the range, aimed and slowly squeezed the trigger like I was taught to. Brarararararp! WTF??? Reload and retry. Same result. Snatch trigger back all the way next mag. Bang! Release trigger. Bang! HOLY HELL! Back to the store before I'm arrested with this dang thing! Swapped it for another one. It functioned as designed. Didn't keep it real long before I sold it as it did NOTHING well.
Later years, I acquired the pistol version of it. TOTAL CRAP. never again. Horrible ergonomics and other than looking "kinda" like a C-96, it had NO redeeming features!
Having said that, the worst functioning "gun" I ever owned was that Mac-10 looking .22 (Scorpion?). May as well have been a single shot and even THAT wasn't 100% reliable!
Intratec "Tec-22" Scorpion 22lr, I looked it up.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn2.armslist.com%2Fsites%2Farmslist%2Fuploads%2Fposts%2F2013%2F01%2F18%2F876452_01_intratec_tec_22_scorpion_22lr_640.jpg&hash=e5b464e8e9e6340917555d3aa4a2169ccd061b0c)
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Charter arms ar7. I bought it when I was in college and doing a lot of camping and canoeing on weekends.
I bought it as a cheap .22 plinker and because it would float.
I only sold it because I couldn't throw it in the river and watch it sink.
Since it has been brought up, I had a Charter AR7 for a few years in the '80s. That was actually the first gun I ever bought. (From Pennys' local retail location, believe it or not.) Kind-a neat in the way it stowed, but didn't work real well. It's long gone, and I don't really want the Henry version either.
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Here's my nomination, the RG .22 revolver:
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjohn1911.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F06%2FRG-Revolver-A-Cheap-Gun-IMG_9437.jpg&hash=ccc484021eeec332b319bdf3a2d8afe0441e8b8f)
I actually shot one of these once... it actually did function, but the trigger pull was incredible.
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Ok, y'all convinced me to not judge a book by it's cover. Just bought a Kimber Custom 1911 govt size .45 ACP.
If it fails *once*, out the door it goes. No second chance.
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Ok, y'all convinced me to not judge a book by it's cover. Just bought a Kimber Custom 1911 govt size .45 ACP.
If it fails *once*, out the door it goes. No second chance.
It's gorgeous, though!
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Ok, y'all convinced me to not judge a book by it's cover. Just bought a Kimber Custom 1911 govt size .45 ACP.
If it fails *once*, out the door it goes. No second chance.
New or used? Do you have decent mags and ammo?
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New or used? Do you have decent mags and ammo?
New Kimber Custom. Wilson Combat mags, Remington Golden Sabre.
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*chuckle* I learned to shoot on a Charter Arms AR 7. It was the only .22 Dad had when I was seven. We never had too many problems with ours, other than the standard it's a semi auto rimfire issues. I think that one finally crapped out on something. No big loss.
We got another one a few years ago, mostly for sentimental value. It's not like they're expensive or take up a lot of room in the cabinets. I honestly don't expect perfection out of something like that.
I've never owned a Kimber and have never been all that interested in them. The attitude of the company and a lot of the fanboi types owners puts me off. I had heard the quality went down when they started really marketing on PD guns. IDK, they always came off with a little of the current HK vibe which is you're paying more for the 'Kimber' etched on the slide than you are for the gun. I'll tolerate that with some things, but not a mid range 1911.
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I paid "mid range" for this Kimber Custom.If it doesn't perform, it's gone. Considering my previous experience with Kimber, I went out on a limb for Kimber. One last chance. If it fails...done with Kimber.
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I will say that the Kimber K6 has been very well received in the revolver world. It looks as though a Colt Cobra and a Ruger SP-101 had a baby.
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What gun do we make grisly buy next?
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What gun do we make grisly buy next?
I have never had a failure with a Bersa.
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I should have bought a buddy's Jennings .25. It was everything a Jennings is known to be, but when it fed? Hugely accurate, convinced I could have made money betting with that thing. Maybe a sucker that wanted to shoot for pink slips. :D
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I would never buy a non-Colt 1911, full stop. They’re not perfect but that’s the only brand I’ve ever seen run out of the box with no “break in” or tweaking. They tend to come out looser (with a little click in the slide) but for whatever reason they work.
A relative of mine once got a Taurus 22, it was a beretta pocket pistol knock off. In shot one it threw a chunk off of the back slide rail, on the frame - looked like a jagged rock. No thanks for Taurus either.
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Speaking of the RG, my BIL gave me a RG .38spl. Total POC! It worked, that is as long as you THOROUGHLY cleaned it after EACH use. I'm talking take of the side plate, clean and oil the guts cleaning.
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NEW RIA 1911 .45 15 years ago. Hammer following. Disconnector burred. Deburred it. Perfect since.
PF9. Two shots, third round would nosedive. Ammo brand, bullet style, weight, didn't matter. Nosedived third round. Sent back, they say they did stuff, tested it, all OK. Still would nosedive third shot, once again, ammo brand, bullet style, weight, didn't matter. Called it my two-shot derringer with a handy compartment for extra ammo. Full disclosure to next person, my son, but he says it worked perfectly. Too small for my big hands?
I have a PF9. Mine would have missed primer strikes. Not weak, just no strike at all. I don't know if I ever had more than 3 rounds in a row fire. I eventually sent it back do Keltec. It came back and works 100%. It is still too small and the trigger sucks, but as a pocket gun, it is okay.
I bought a used Keltec PMR-30 a couple years ago. My first one was very reliable. This one was not. Rounds were failing to feed all the time. On a whim, I bought a threaded barrel to get a flash hider. With that barrel swap, it has been very reliable just like my first one. I assume there was some dimensional flaw in the original barrel that screwed up the works.
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I should have bought a buddy's Jennings .25. It was everything a Jennings is known to be, but when it fed? Hugely accurate, convinced I could have made money betting with that thing. Maybe a sucker that wanted to shoot for pink slips. :D
I bought a Jennings 380 once mainly because it was cheap. It actually worked (cleaned and lubed it). However, it cut the web of my hand since it had not beavertail to protect the shooter's hand. It has been buried in a closet ever since. I haven't wanted to inflict anyone else with it and I figured it wasn't worth much.
In my first CHL class, one of the other students showed up to the class with a Jennings 9mm. He hadn't fired it or even cleaned/lubed it. The instructor took a 10 minute break with him getting it lubed up enough to function. I think the guy did pass, but the shooting requirement is pretty easy.
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My first centerfire pistol was a Springfield Loaded 1911. It was always a pretty good pistol provided I used the OEM magazines. I tried cheaper Govt pattern mags that never worked right.
I had a Remington R1 1911 for a couple years that also worked pretty well. I can't speak for anything else Remington is making right now, but the 1911's seem to be okay.
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Some of those ring of fire pistols are weirdly collectible these days.
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I had a pre-Kahr Auto Ordnance 1911A1 that was a pile of garbage. I worked on the extractor with no luck. Worst part was that I traded a perfectly good Norinco 1911A1 for it because I wanted an American 1911. Dumbest trade I ever made.
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Wish I kept my Norinco 1911A1. Great, dependable, gun. :old:
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fherohog.com%2Fimages%2Fguns%2FNorinco45ACP.jpg&hash=58eac37d64e1fdc532ec9f8411b71ac39f3d49c6)
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I have a Taurus TP-22 that I bought new in the mid 1990s.
I've fired over 2,000 rounds of Winchester Wildcat through it...
0 failures to feed
0 failures to fire
0 failures to eject.
The only problems I ever had with it were with CCI ammo, which apparently had harder cases and required two pulls of the trigger to fire most of the time. I simply switched back to Wildcat.
It's been so reliable that I've carried it on and off for years as my primary CCW.
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Taurus seems to be one of those companies with a lot of love/hate. Some will be very happy and other owners will be upset. I figured it was poor quality control and some people get the junk. That is one brand I have avoided over the years.
Thinking of Kimber, I have not heard about a lot of bad guns, just people not happy with triggers and such.
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Taurus seems to be one of those companies with a lot of love/hate. Some will be very happy and other owners will be upset. I figured it was poor quality control and some people get the junk. That is one brand I have avoided over the years.
My 605 snub, which I've praised here before, has a weird cosmetic issue. It's subtle, and I didn't notice it for years. Machining on the top strap and trigger guard is slightly askew. It's almost like the frame went into a mill for some finishing steps crooked.
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I have a Taurus TP-22 that I bought new in the mid 1990s.
I've fired over 2,000 rounds of Winchester Wildcat through it...
0 failures to feed
0 failures to fire
0 failures to eject.
The only problems I ever had with it were with CCI ammo, which apparently had harder cases and required two pulls of the trigger to fire most of the time. I simply switched back to Wildcat.
It's been so reliable that I've carried it on and off for years as my primary CCW.
How did the CCI figure into that zero failure to fire?
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Had a 4 inch Taurus 669 revolver in my safe for some time. No matter what ammo was used, shooting from a rest or off hand, single or double action, I could not get it to group less than 4-5 inches at 15 yards. Not at all and to see it go when my brother sold it.
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What gun do we make grisly buy next?
M14
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M14
Or a FAL.
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How did the CCI figure into that zero failure to fire?
:facepalm:
Jesus, did you really NOT understand that the 0/0/0 was specifically about the gun's performance with Wildcat ammo?
And that I called out its performance with CCI specifically, as well?
That they weren't all lumped together?
That was too difficult for you?
Apparently so, so here's a soft rubber ball to play with. Try not to hurt yourself too badly with it.
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Go eat a Snickers.
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And done. :mad: