Post by: HForrest on February 07, 2007, 04:17:04 PM
In addition, I'm not necessarily the model of a perfect teenager. I recently quit school (albeit with a legal diploma equivalent), and I'm sort of at a standstill in the "doing stuff" department at this point. It's a complex situation, though. Too complex for judgement by those who aren't close to me.
So, with this background out of the way- Today I was having a small trivial argument with my mom, and I said something along the lines of "You don't trust me at all". She then replied "Yes, I do, you don't know how many times I've defended you when people compare you to Dylan Klebold".
Apparently, several people who I don't even know or have possibly met once (she won't tell me exactly who's said this, only that I don't know them that well), feel free to evaluate my psychiatric stability and capacity for violence, based soley on their limited knowledge of my interest with weapons and academic situation. According to the ignorant Helen Lovejoy-esque speculations of my mom's jackass acquaintances, I should be on anti-depressants, and seeing a psychiatrist too. Interesting, because that's news to me, and anyone who knows me personally.
Obviously, I'm just a wee-bit irritated.
I'm peeved with my mom, because she just blathers away about her personal life, and thus, my life, to her friends. She has a poor sense of discretion, in my opinion, and this is exactly how rumors and overblown, outlandish, horse-*expletive deleted*it gossip spread. My personal issues are nobody's business but mine and, to a limited extent, my parents. My mom's friends don't need to know about my life. I'm further upset by the fact that I can't discuss the issue personally with the people who make these absurd statements, because she refuses to tell me who they are.
Has anyone else dealt with a similar situation, where prejudices and gossip are formed about a person based on something like guns?
Post by: Sindawe on February 07, 2007, 04:29:15 PM
Anti-psychotics and a haircut, now THATs a different story. : neener :
Not guns, but I dealt with a fair measure of crud in H.S. about being a "drug dealer" and a bomb throwing radical due to my propensity to hear my hair long, my beard uncut and be rather vocal about the ideas put forth by other radicals by the names of Jefferson, Franklin, Henry & Locke. It was a hassle at times, but it was just High School. I will grant that this was 16 years prior to the events perpetrated by Klebold & Harris here in Colorado. So YMMV
Post by: Standing Wolf on February 07, 2007, 04:39:29 PM
You write far too well to be a nut case. I've no doubt there are articulate psychotics and/or sociopaths, but have never heard of articulate nut cases who craft intelligible sentences and punctuate them reasonably well.
A surprisingly large percentage of people can tell you what they don't like much more easily than what they do.
Onweird, eh?
Regards,
Standing Wolf
Post by: Mabs2 on February 07, 2007, 04:44:20 PM
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You write far too well to be a nut case.
That's the first thing I thought.I just turned 20 and I've faced far simpler versions of the problems you've got before you (accused of being insane, paranoid, and other crud), but I'll go ahead and tell you my strategy. I think it works pretty well:
Ignore them until they bother you, then kill them all with as few attacks as possible (or run away).
Life's far too short to worry about those sorts of people (unless they bother you, then you kill them), plus you have much more important things to worry about, like the undead or those pesky Korean mobsters.
Post by: SpookyPistolero on February 07, 2007, 05:21:35 PM
People think what they want to think, and they like to believe they've got their own, personal 'litmus test' for others, such as thinking that owning firearms when you're young makes you unstable and violent. Ding, ding! Here comes the erroneous conclusion train!
I've found you can save some stress by 'zooming out' and focusing on nothing more than those things you can control. You can't control the nitwits or their gabbing, so let it go. You can advise your mother not to be so loose-tongued when it comes to your hobbies, but can't control it more than that.
Just think about what career paths you might be interested in, and how you can work towards your goals to eventually escape all the 'tards.
(Incidentally, I too am constantly irritated by the 'drop-out = failure' philosophy that's so prevalent. My stepdad barely got through high school and now owns a multi-million dollar contracting corporation. The other side of the coin is that I know people with advanced degrees who I wouldn't trust with a potatoe gun.)
Best of luck in the quagmire.
-Spooky
Post by: K Frame on February 07, 2007, 05:23:46 PM
Play to their fears.
Post by: Perd Hapley on February 07, 2007, 05:41:58 PM
Post by: gunsmith on February 07, 2007, 09:45:18 PM
The "adults" your mom has had these conversations with are probably
not even half as articulate as you are. I bet they are just plain jealous.
But I know how you feel, my last girl friend is really into "issues" and pop psychology stuff
and would blab personal info all the time, it is really annoying.
One time, instead of keeping her mouth shut , she told a homeless guy (that was merely annoying) that I was carrying a gun and pepper spray ...totally setting the guy off and exacerbating the situation.....
Come to think of it, you know, your mom could inadvertantly(sic) letting the neighborhood druggie/thief know that he could get a gun at your house when you guys are/are not home.
Post by: Vodka7 on February 07, 2007, 10:39:22 PM
So, while you're at home, just work on saving money and getting in to school somewhere, and like gunsmith said, enjoy the free heat, electricity, cable, food, and rent for as long as humanly possible
. And lighten up on your mom a bit, it could be something as simple as her mentioning the reasons she's proud of you. "Son got me involved in a new hobby, cares about my well being, and just got his GED at age 16" = "my son is a nutzo gun owner who dropped out" to some people. Nothing you can do to change their minds.It all gets better in college, especially if you go to a big one--it's a lot easier to find someone with similar interests in a college of 20,000 than in a high school of 1,000.
Post by: Mannlicher on February 08, 2007, 01:50:07 AM
Post by: Nick1911 on February 08, 2007, 02:35:40 AM
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It all gets better in college, especially if you go to a big one--it's a lot easier to find someone with similar interests in a college of 20,000 than in a high school of 1,000.
Quoted for truth.
Things will improve, heck at Purdue we have a shooting club filled with gun nuts!
Post by: 280plus on February 08, 2007, 02:49:54 AM
Post by: Bob F. on February 08, 2007, 03:24:57 AM
Conversly: I am very visually oriented. If you look like a thug, I assume you are, although I can be dissuaded in time.You write well and seem good enough. You're young, but you'll get over that, we all do.
Sounds as if you're stuck at the moment, too young for a good job without some special talent.
Consider a trade school or communtiy college. Flip burgers or whatever to pay your way and be the best employee the joint has. Don't know what you look like but you may have to make some concessions and "clean up" a little.
Read the graduation speech Bill Gates gave a couple years ago, I think in the Carolinas. Speaking of looks, have you seen what he looked like in his HS/college days?
Good luck, hang in there and don't let 'em drag you down to their level!
Bob
Post by: HankB on February 08, 2007, 03:50:44 AM
According to the ignorant Helen Lovejoy-esque speculations of my mom's jackass acquaintances, I should be on anti-depressants, and seeing a psychiatrist too.
What, do they WANT you to go off the deep end???Don't they realize that virtually all of the school shooters WERE taking psychoactive drugs like Luvox, Prozac, or Ritalin?
Don't they realize that school shootings were unheard of before the pill-pushing quacks of modern psychiatry began their wholescale drugging of minors?
Post by: client32 on February 08, 2007, 03:59:40 AM
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I got a lot of that myself, and (to my own peril) I was a little too well behaved growing up. People found out that shooting was a hobby of mine, and suddenly it didn't matter in the slightest that I spent half the week at church and the other half maintaining grades, blah, blah...
I am glad I grew up in a small town where I did. Shooting being a hobby was simply expected from boys and a good thing for girls.
Post by: SteveS on February 08, 2007, 04:12:38 AM
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Don't they realize that school shootings were unheard of before the pill-pushing quacks of modern psychiatry began their wholescale drugging of minors?
Crime didn't exist either...or mass murder. If we could only return to those days? Those shooters were so messed up to begin with that giving them drugs would be like trying to put out a house fire with a squirt gun. This is a different subject, though.
There will always be armchair psychologists that will read all sorts of things into your hobbies/interests. This will happen in plenty of settings and does not just involve firearms. Most of it, IMO, seems to have little basis in reality, but I have met people that don't help their situation. I had an acquaintance that was into shooting and would talk about it all the time. It didn't matter if the people he met had no interest in what he was saying, he would go on and on. I don't think it made him a sociopath, just socially retarded.
I am not suggesting that you never talk about your interests, but you will get a better feel about how much as you get older.
Post by: Bogie on February 08, 2007, 05:08:18 AM
Determine what you want to do with the rest of your life.
Get a job that isn't fast food.
Are you dressing like something that would lead people to think that you are like those nuts? Don't dress like "oh, I'm so depressed that I'm a disaffected youth, so I'm going to display my depression." The goth thing is b o r i n g. It's gonna irritate adults, which may get you off short-term, but long-term, well, it is a life-limiting situation.
Also, many of us adult-types have already been there, done that, and your situation is actually somewhat normal, so STFU, and get with the program. Yeah, you're smart. And you're different. So are a buncha other folks.
Also, dressing like the latest fashion statement outta Hollywood is generally also a life-limiting move - Most of the "slaves to fashion" who I know tend to be from the left side of the bell curve.
Are you interested in the military? You ARE intelligent, which leads me to think that you could get into one of the fun areas. Hint: "combat arms" is NOT one of the fun areas. ROTC is also an option. The armed services is THE biggest fraternity, and will give you a leg-up throughout the rest of your life. Also, if you go in at age 17, and stay in, you can RETIRE at half pay after 20 years. That is nothing to sneeze at.
Also, consider your own business. Yeah, at your age, it'll probably need to start really small time - but if it looks like it is going to be successful, you will get support...
Post by: doczinn on February 08, 2007, 05:22:44 AM
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Hint: "combat arms" is NOT one of the fun areas.
It was for me!Subway (the sandwich shop, not the train) was started by a 17-year old to make money for college.
Post by: cassandra and sara's daddy on February 11, 2007, 04:53:57 PM
i supect some folks might not like ya cause you don't come off as being 16 that intimidates folks. good way to weed out the chaff. those that see past that uncomfortability or who are cool enough not to be scared are worth having in your life and the others are small loss. unless they are cute girls. i woulda never guessed your age from your posts. woulda been off at leat 5 or ten years with my best guess.
Post by: RevDisk on February 11, 2007, 05:47:57 PM
Has anyone else dealt with a similar situation, where prejudices and gossip are formed about a person based on something like guns?
Yes. Ironically mostly back in my Army days. I was seen as a very well armed psychopath, best kept very far from civilized folk. Perhaps wind chimes made out of mortar rounds wasn't the best decorative fashion... Or perhaps because I used Santa as a target for a Finnish Mosin Nagent sniper rifle. Belted .50 cal armor piercing incendiary silver tips for those smug reindeer too, courtsey of the Irish. Anywho. Less guns per se than aggression and intelligence back in high school. I was a bit different, and didn't care much for societal norms. Then and now.
People will form opinions of you based on anything they so choose. Being outside of societal norms will mark you as different. People do not generally like different. You have two choices, be part of the herd. Or not. Life will get better for you now that you are not in a state run prison mislabeled "education". Get a job to tide you over while you figure things out. Preferably get a job that will teach you something. Stocking shelves will pay the bills, but it won't teach you much useful for down the road. Figure out where you want to end up, and then figure out a way to get there. Improvise along the way to your goal.
Family is something you're born to, and don't have a choice in the matter. Your options depend on your financial situation. You're not like to change how much your mother chats with folks. That's part of her personality.
Seriously though, why put importance on the opinion of someone you don't know and probably could care less about? I can understand being annoyed at the misconceptions of others, but at the end of the day if they're not friends, family or employers, does it really matter?
Post by: Perd Hapley on February 11, 2007, 08:00:50 PM
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Or perhaps because I used Santa as a target
I've gotta try that.
Post by: mfree on February 12, 2007, 04:31:50 AM
I'll buy that. But young men and women are more than welcome.
There is a difference. A *huge* difference; much like the grown children running the anti-gun communities.
Post by: Winston Smith on February 12, 2007, 09:46:38 AM
Don't talk about your hobby, unless it directly comes up. Talk about sporting. Only divulge the fact that you firmly believe in self defense to the fullest to close friends.
It's urban camoflauge.
As far as "stuff" goes
Dress snappy. Observe trends. Firm handshake, ask how they're doing, listen, ask questions. Don't talk about yourself that much. Don't complain, show up on time. These habits will open many, many doors.
Seriously. I got through high school, but not college. I work now, two jobs, one I just got a 20% raise in and a lot more responsibility. I'm being groomed as the overall manager. I'm a couple years older than you.
Being into guns is like being gay, from what I hear. Most people just consider it plain wrong, and won't listen to logic. You won't change their mind, just like they won't change yours. So just don't talk about it except it very appropriate situations.
Dude. Seriously. My advice: Get a job, it doesn't matter what. I've known you for a few years, you're very verbal. Sell stuff. If you show up on time, don't complain, do what your told, don't argue, you will get noticed. Quick. Save some money and move to a city. Fall into the cracks and figure out what you want to do.
I've been considered a nut, and at the time I was. Maybe you're not. If you are, you're a benign one.
I'm pming you my number. call me if you want to talk about this stuff. I went through it.
Post by: Perd Hapley on February 12, 2007, 11:30:49 AM
Post by: Winston Smith on February 12, 2007, 02:05:41 PM
Post by: HForrest on February 13, 2007, 11:55:49 PM
Thanks for the advice, Jack. You're definitely right- I learned long ago to keep quiet about my firearms interest... and aside from moving to the city (egggh... San Fran's nice, but I couldn't live there), your other suggestions are worth following too.
Fistful: Winston and Sindawe both met me, and they seem to think I'm fine. We should go get lunch or somethin' sometime so I can prove how un-sociopathic I am. I know a great place in this irrigation ditch off a Forest Service road...
Post by: Mabs2 on February 14, 2007, 02:53:58 AM
Normal sucks.
Come home everyday and watch American Idol the "Discovery" channel's "YOUR CLOTHES SUCK" shows, the cooking channels (eh, not so bad), and then bad reality shows and soap operas.
Post by: Perd Hapley on February 14, 2007, 05:02:08 AM
Fistful: Winston and Sindawe both met me, and they seem to think I'm fine. We should go get lunch or somethin' sometime so I can prove how un-sociopathic I am. I know a great place in this irrigation ditch off a Forest Service road...
Well, they're a little questionable themselves. Which road was it? Hey, wait a minute.
Post by: Bogie on February 14, 2007, 08:08:25 AM
Until you get firmly ensconsed on a job where they don't care that you're a shooter, do not wear BDUs or 511s to work.
Don't shop at the gap, or old navy, or the latest trendshop... Think Orvis or LL-Bean for your casual stuff, and think simple, and not too colorful/this year's trend. This stuff will last you for YEARS, not weeks or months (I swear, I think some people view clothing as disposable "accessories.")
Buy your business attire at better stores. Brooks Brothers is stodgy. But it works. Take a look at their stuff. Then hit a bargain suit chain, and see what they've got that's like it. You DO NOT want the latest style and fashion here either. If it looks like it belongs on a franco-italian pimp, that's a bad thing. If you do this right, it'll last you for years.
For shirts, avoid the silly collar styles - they go out of style. You want what you could have seen 20, 40, 60 years ago... And a nice white patternless HEAVY cotton shirt will go with anything. Get real cotton, and learn how to use an iron. If you're doing business casual, Levi's Dockers rule.
Get two _good_ pairs of leather dress shoes. When you break a few hundred dollars down over 10 years (or more...), it doesn't seem that bad.
When you have the chance, pick up a simple tux and some inexpensive but nice black dress shoes (surplus will work for them...). It'll come in handy.
You have to LOOK the part to GET the part.
Post by: Winston Smith on February 14, 2007, 08:44:29 AM
That's all there is to it.
Quote
Well, they're a little questionable themselves
WHATEVER fistful! At least we're not moral absolutists!
Post by: HForrest on February 14, 2007, 10:17:37 AM
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Until you get firmly ensconsed on a job where they don't care that you're a shooter, do not wear BDUs or 511s to work.
Oh, come on... khaki 5.11s hardly stand out at all. I've yet to find other pants that are as durable, comfortable, versatile, and utilitarian.Quote
Don't shop at the gap, or old navy, or the latest trendshop... Think Orvis or LL-Bean for your casual stuff, and think simple, and not too colorful/this year's trend. This stuff will last you for YEARS, not weeks or months (I swear, I think some people view clothing as disposable "accessories.")
Yup, that's the best way. I've never been in an Old Navy, and I think I went into a Gap once about eight years ago. Quote
If it looks like it belongs on a franco-italian pimp, that's a bad thing.
Well, that's where you and I disagree.
Post by: cassandra and sara's daddy on February 14, 2007, 07:38:47 PM
Post by: Caimlas on February 15, 2007, 06:39:15 AM
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Dress snappy. Observe trends. Firm handshake, ask how they're doing, listen, ask questions. Don't talk about yourself that much. Don't complain, show up on time. These habits will open many, many doors.
Depending on who you are, socially (in terms of social group/interests and degree of quietness) people will assume you're a psychopath. I was very mild-mannered my freshman and sophmore years of high school, but I was getting tired of teachers disciplining me for no apparent reason just to get me out of their classes. So, I started acting a bit 'crazy' and generally goofy, and jr/sr years everything worked out fine. I was a blip undetected by radar, and nobody really noticed me. weird, but it's the truth.
My observation is that if you're not a little rebelious these days, people will look at you funny. They think something is wrong with you - as indicated by the Columbine shooters both being good students and never getting in trouble, in part. They ignore the fact that neither kid had a good relationship with his parents, which was the whole problem to begin with.