Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Kingcreek on November 25, 2019, 09:35:48 AM
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Stuck saw, stuck jeep, no injuries yet version.
I haven't cut serious wood for 2-3 years and I really need to cut split and stack for next winter. I have 2 oak trees down on pasture ground owned by my cousin and 1 down on a neighbors pasture within 2 miles of me. I can get to them with the tractor and grapple. All are on hilly pasture.
Yesterday I came home from a 2.5 day conference in Chicago and I thought I would start one just to get outside and get some activity and fresh air. I went with the jeep and trailer and didn't think I would need the tractor yet. In case you didn't know, a storm downed tree is one big collection of energy, tension, compression, like springs and you can't always read the forces within.
I was doing pretty well breaking it down and cutting what I could on the outer parts working in toward the almost 40" trunk when I stuck the saw partway into a 24" cut. I pounded a wedge into it and it wasn't bad until it settled some more. Took the saw motor off and freed the bar BUT then I dropped a bar nut that bounced off my boot and skittered under the log (which is about 4' off the ground). Thought I had a spare in the case but apparently not. Lost in saw chips and leaves somewhere under a log that is popping and creaking and threatening to come down on me at any moment. I tried raking stuff around with a stick but the nut that I need to mount the bar with a spare chain to finish cutting and recover my first chain is gone forever.
I decided H with it, I'll come back another day. Had to turn the jeep and trailer around and there is a spring water seep that spreads out in 3 directions. I broke through the little bit of frost and sunk right there. Even with both diffs locked I had no movement, none. I had to call one of my only friends after walking to a hill top to get a cell signal. The cattle that were lounging happily in the feed lot on the south end all got curious and came to hang out around the stuck jeep while I was calling for help. 2 of them wanted to rub the mirrors off the jeep and I had to keep running them off while waiting. He eventually got there and got me out, mud to my knees, a very muddy jeep and an empty trailer and a saw in pieces.
I'm not going back until the ground freezes. And maybe I'll have a winch by then.
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If I'm cutting more than a 5 minute walk from the shop I take 2 saws. I'll sometimes even take a bow saw. That's in addition to axes, wedges, splitting maul, chain, rope and a come-a-long.
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In case you didn't know, a storm downed tree is one big collection of energy, tension, compression, like springs and you can't always read the forces within.
As a firewood new guy, man am I learning that. I haven't had any close calls yet, but I've definitely read some limbs wrong, even after watching bunches of youtube videos. I'm really learning to take my time, and wedges are my friends. There's been a few times now where I didn't want to take a chance, so wedged it, then instead of using the saw all the way, cut a little more and then used a chain + tractor power to bust off the rest of the limb.
I've got a Russian olive I'm taking all the way down to the stump that has a funky "double trunk": Two limbs coming out of the ground, both around a foot in diameter, and as customary with Russian olives, way twisty to where it'll be hard to figure out where gravity benefits me. I'll probably use the tractor on them as well.
We've got snow coming in over the next few days, then we're dropping down to a low of zero, high of 30 at the end of the week, so I want to get some some downed and dried stuff cut today and tomorrow to help supplement my meager supply for this year. I've got about a half cord of live stuff cut and split (by hand - great exercise! :laugh: ) for next year done already, but I'd like to work on getting up to two cords seasoning.
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It's trickier than it sometimes looks. This is a big heavy oak on a side hill with the top tangled in another standing oak.
I have a tool box on the trailer and I had an axe and a 14" trim saw with me. Had several chains and a come along hanging in the shed at home.
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My forays for firewood are to the local Lowe's to grab 8 to 10 40-lb. bags of wood pellets... Haven't gotten stuck in their parking lot yet. :rofl:
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If I get one hung up I'll hook on to it and try drag it free with come-a-long, tractor or truck. Trying to cut free a hung up tree is some risky stuff.
But always, 2 saws. One is none, two is one.
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The only danger I face in heating the house is snagging my slipper on something as I approach the thermostat to turn it up. :rofl: :old:
I do appreciate all of those who heat with wood as it provides more natural gas for me to use.
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Detcord.
No one has said detcord...
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The only danger I face in heating the house is snagging my slipper on something as I approach the thermostat to turn it up. :rofl: :old:
I do appreciate all of those who heat with wood as it provides more natural gas for me to use.
Glad to know you want more natural gas. I'm making chili tonight, I think...
If I had natural gas at the house I never would have bought a pellet stove.
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Detcord.
No one has said detcord...
Now that I live in a place where I can do it, I'm seriously thinking of getting one of those black powder stump splitter things just for fun. I have like 20lbs of BP that I was buying in CA when I thought they might ban import, so I have a lot of "boom" to experiment with. :laugh:
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"I'm seriously thinking of getting one of those black powder stump splitter things..."
I have never heard of such a device.
But now that I have, SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!
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Our region of NW Illinois has the highest rate of dying or down hardwood in the country. Lot of people going to wood furnaces and outside wood fired boilers and such that they are passing ordnances in cities and towns.
I have several offers of free wood for the cutting but I'm staying close enough to home that I can drive the tractor to it and handle it with the grapple loader and then trailer the logs home. I can cut split and stack it at home when it's convenient for me and the weather is decent.
And I can take a break anytime and go inside for coffee.
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I sold my black powder with my muzzleloader but I might take some firecrackers with me next time just to keep the cattle away from my rig.
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As a firewood new guy, man am I learning that. I haven't had any close calls yet, but I've definitely read some limbs wrong, even after watching bunches of youtube videos. I'm really learning to take my time, and wedges are my friends. There's been a few times now where I didn't want to take a chance, so wedged it, then instead of using the saw all the way, cut a little more and then used a chain + tractor power to bust off the rest of the limb.
I've got a Russian olive I'm taking all the way down to the stump that has a funky "double trunk": Two limbs coming out of the ground, both around a foot in diameter, and as customary with Russian olives, way twisty to where it'll be hard to figure out where gravity benefits me. I'll probably use the tractor on them as well.
We've got snow coming in over the next few days, then we're dropping down to a low of zero, high of 30 at the end of the week, so I want to get some some downed and dried stuff cut today and tomorrow to help supplement my meager supply for this year. I've got about a half cord of live stuff cut and split (by hand - great exercise! :laugh: ) for next year done already, but I'd like to work on getting up to two cords seasoning.
wait until you get your first barber chair
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wait until you get your first barber chair
Had to look that up...
https://youtu.be/9O7H9qWdquk
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Had to look that up...
https://youtu.be/9O7H9qWdquk
That tree should of been dynamited instead of being cut.
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Had to look that up...
https://youtu.be/9O7H9qWdquk
They can let go a lot faster than that; the piece that springs up can take your head off. As charby said, it should have been dynamited. If that's not an option, wrap a logging chain around the trunk a foot or so above where you're about to cut.
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Stuck saw, stuck jeep, no injuries yet version.
I haven't cut serious wood for 2-3 years and I really need to cut split and stack for next winter. I have 2 oak trees down on pasture ground owned by my cousin and 1 down on a neighbors pasture within 2 miles of me. I can get to them with the tractor and grapple. All are on hilly pasture.
Yesterday I came home from a 2.5 day conference in Chicago and I thought I would start one just to get outside and get some activity and fresh air. I went with the jeep and trailer and didn't think I would need the tractor yet. In case you didn't know, a storm downed tree is one big collection of energy, tension, compression, like springs and you can't always read the forces within.
I was doing pretty well breaking it down and cutting what I could on the outer parts working in toward the almost 40" trunk when I stuck the saw partway into a 24" cut. I pounded a wedge into it and it wasn't bad until it settled some more. Took the saw motor off and freed the bar BUT then I dropped a bar nut that bounced off my boot and skittered under the log (which is about 4' off the ground). Thought I had a spare in the case but apparently not. Lost in saw chips and leaves somewhere under a log that is popping and creaking and threatening to come down on me at any moment. I tried raking stuff around with a stick but the nut that I need to mount the bar with a spare chain to finish cutting and recover my first chain is gone forever.
I decided H with it, I'll come back another day. Had to turn the jeep and trailer around and there is a spring water seep that spreads out in 3 directions. I broke through the little bit of frost and sunk right there. Even with both diffs locked I had no movement, none. I had to call one of my only friends after walking to a hill top to get a cell signal. The cattle that were lounging happily in the feed lot on the south end all got curious and came to hang out around the stuck jeep while I was calling for help. 2 of them wanted to rub the mirrors off the jeep and I had to keep running them off while waiting. He eventually got there and got me out, mud to my knees, a very muddy jeep and an empty trailer and a saw in pieces.
I'm not going back until the ground freezes. And maybe I'll have a winch by then.
And bring a magnet with you.
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I'd never heard of that term before, and have only ever seen one tree do that while being cut. Scary crap. Looks like, however, the biggest cause in this instance was that the tree was hollow.
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A barber chair split can be an exiting and scary event. Any tree with a hard lean can do it and some kinds of trees are more likely than others. Walnut and hickory in my experience. First one to educate me was a smallish mulberry and it shattered and rocketed past me so fast I thought it had exploded. Missed be but taught me a little lesson. Been cutting wood for almost 40 years.
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A barber chair split can be an exiting and scary event. Any tree with a hard lean can do it and some kinds of trees are more likely than others. Walnut and hickory in my experience. First one to educate me was a smallish mulberry and it shattered and rocketed past me so fast I thought it had exploded. Missed be but taught me a little lesson. Been cutting wood for almost 40 years.
Hackberry, green ash and silver maple have been my barber chairs.
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Hackberry, green ash and silver maple have been my barber chairs.
I've got a fair sized Hackberry, about 24" at.the base, I want to take down this season it has about 6' of corkscrew coming up.from the base and a hard lean. Textbook barber chair with a twist. I'm gonna study on it some more. Only goob part is nothing but a few scrub trees for it to fall on.
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I've got a fair sized Hackberry, about 24" at.the base, I want to take down this season it has about 6' of corkscrew coming up.from the base and a hard lean. Textbook barber chair with a twist. I'm gonna study on it some more. Only goob part is nothing but a few scrub trees for it to fall on.
Too bad dynamite isn't available over the counter at the hardware store. Cut your felling notch and drill and insert a stick from the backside.
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I helped cut a tree down with a belt-fed M60 once from about 60 yards away. Took a lot more rounds than you might think. approx 16" box elder IIRC
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Too bad dynamite isn't available over the counter at the hardware store. Cut your felling notch and drill and insert a stick from the backside.
I could probably persuade someone I know to do that for me but I want to try to saw a few boards out of the straight section above the twist.
And I don't know why I said Hackberry, it's a White Ash.
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White Ash.
Usually nice tight fibers, might drop just fine.
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I'm still figuring on a chain wrap and using a bore cut.
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I'm still figuring on a chain wrap and using a bore cut.
I'd be doing the same. Plunge cut that tree.
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Bore cut, plunge cut, I use the terms interchangeably. I'll take a pic of it next time I can see it in daylight. Might not be a challenge for a pro but I ain't one.
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Bore cut, plunge cut, I use the terms interchangeably. I'll take a pic of it next time I can see it in daylight. Might not be a challenge for a pro but I ain't one.
I knew what you were talking about.
For those who don't. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVH3ShnhMRA
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Jeez I’m about to cut my losses and leave the oak to rot.
I have been trying to get it out of the timber. Dealt with mud then decided to wait until ground is frozen. Ground finally froze but now 2.5” of snow on it. Tried again today with the tractor and no matter what I do I end up crabbing sideways down hill. I can’t seem to accomplish anything.
I moved some logs and brushy tops with the hydro grapple just enough to give myself room to work but barely got tractor out in 4wd with diff locked and a bunch of maneuvering. Had my ROP up and seatbelt on. Going back to retrieve my trailer with the Jeep and not a stick of wood out yet.
Now I’m thinking if the boggy area below it freezes hard enough I can work it from the low side and pull it out with chains if I have to. No telling when or if that spring fed area will become tractorable (is that a word?)
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Jeez I’m about to cut my losses and leave the oak to rot.
I have been trying to get it out of the timber. Dealt with mud then decided to wait until ground is frozen. Ground finally froze but now 2.5” of snow on it. Tried again today with the tractor and no matter what I do I end up crabbing sideways down hill. I can’t seem to accomplish anything.
I moved some logs and brushy tops with the hydro grapple just enough to give myself room to work but barely got tractor out in 4wd with diff locked and a bunch of maneuvering. Had my ROP up and seatbelt on. Going back to retrieve my trailer with the Jeep and not a stick of wood out yet.
Now I’m thinking if the boggy area below it freezes hard enough I can work it from the low side and pull it out with chains if I have to. No telling when or if that spring fed area will become tractorable (is that a word?)
Sounds like you need tire chains on your tractor
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Winch, extra cable, chains and snatch blocks.
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Winch, extra cable, chains and snatch blocks.
Yes to all.
A $4k wallenstein 3 point winch would be nice.
Or a track loader...
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Winch, extra cable, chains and snatch blocks.
SNATCHBLOCK!
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I keep telling you... 40 pound bags of pellets...
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I keep telling you... 40 pound bags of pellets...
I know. We just really like a nice hardwood fire in our 42” pass thru fireplace. Glass doors on both the great room and the master bedroom.
I haven’t really cut serious wood since before my knee replacement 3 years ago and my formerly very well stocked woodshed is not so well stocked anymore. I have this big oak (almost 40” at trunk) and 2 others a little farther away in another pasture that I would really like to haul home so I can cut split and stack at my convenience and have it for the next 2-3 winters.
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I keep telling you... 40 pound bags of pellets...
I just can't drive out into the woods with a chainsaw in the back of my truck and come home with a load of pellets.
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I got a guy one town over that brings me a a full level long bed full of hedge and will stack it for me for $60. I cut most of the close hedge and hackberry last year before I found him. I have a lot of wood here but it is just too much work for me these days without some help.
jim
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I knew what you were talking about.
For those who don't. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVH3ShnhMRA
Thanks, learn something every day. I had a hell of a time last year, 80 foot cherry uprooted and fell across dad's driveway and hung at about a 30 deg from vertical angle in similar sized poplar. I made a pretty safe cut but there was just no weight for it fall and break through the poplar. It just settled about ten feet and was more tree than our loader had ass for. Finally got it and we all lived. Next tree was the sycamore that heavily leaned and I could have used this bore cut I think, it was about 30" diameter where I cut though.
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A plunge cut is a wonderful trick with a leaner. You still have to make sure you notch it properly and come in right on the back cut. And when they go, they go fast.
Thankfully I’m just cutting storm down trees for firewood.
I have some pine trees to drop later this winter but nothing bigger than about 16”. We planted 600 hardwood and 400 pines over 20 years ago and we need to remove the pines to give the hardwoods room.
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I just can't drive out into the woods with a chainsaw in the back of my truck and come home with a load of pellets.
Apparently neither can Kingcreek... or a load of wood :rofl:
I think that at this point in my life, even if I had access to lots of wood, I'd still be using a pellet stove given their ease of use and flexibility. I helped fell, buck, and split a LOT of wood when I was a teenager. Everyone was heating with wood because of the oil issues in the 1970s and the gypsy moth tree kill had the state begging people to fell trees to reduce the fire hazard on state land.
I still wish I had a fireplace where I could actually build a crackling wood fire, as nothing beats that for ambiance, but the more I use it, the more I love my stove.
I used to say that when I'd retire and move back to Pennsylvania I'd get a coal stove, but the way it's looking, those plans have changed, so probably no coal stove in my future.
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SNATCHBLOCK!
Clearly someone else watches "Smarter Every Day" on YouTube.
ETA: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2w3NZzPwOM
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I've got to stop being so damned smug about my pellet stove...
I picked up 8 more bags of pellets on Saturday. While moving them into the house I pulled a muscle in my back under my right shoulder blade. Sore all yesterday, but last night trying to sleep? Holy crap I could not get comfortable. It kept waking me up every couple of hours, so this morning I feel like I've not really slept. It's starting to ease some, but is still annoying and spasms every once in awhile. That makes me know I'm alive...
On the plus side, I now have, I think, 23 bags of pellets stacked up in my dining room. That's over 7 million BTU worth of pellets.
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I picked up 8 more bags of pellets on Saturday. While moving them into the house I pulled a muscle in my back under my right shoulder blade. Sore all yesterday, but last night trying to sleep? Holy crap I could not get comfortable. It kept waking me up every couple of hours, so this morning I feel like I've not really slept. It's starting to ease some, but is still annoying and spasms every once in awhile. That makes me know I'm alive...
Heh - welcome to getting old, my friend. While I still have most of the strength I had 20 years ago, it just doesn't work the same way. I actually did something similar to you a few days ago. I was rolling a 300lb chain harrow into my tractor's loader bucket. I was handling the weight just fine until I moved my body what seemed to be very slightly, then OUCH and two days of Aleve.
I can still lift heavy stuff, but then again I can't, if that makes sense. I've been trying to be more and more thoughtful about how I do physical stuff, and taking the longer time it takes to place and use mechanical aids, but my macho all too often overrides my common sense.
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I've got to stop being so damned smug about my pellet stove...
I picked up 8 more bags of pellets on Saturday. While moving them into the house I pulled a muscle in my back under my right shoulder blade. Sore all yesterday, but last night trying to sleep? Holy crap I could not get comfortable. It kept waking me up every couple of hours, so this morning I feel like I've not really slept. It's starting to ease some, but is still annoying and spasms every once in awhile. That makes me know I'm alive...
On the plus side, I now have, I think, 23 bags of pellets stacked up in my dining room. That's over 7 million BTU worth of pellets.
If you buy them by the pallet (1 ton), the men who deliver the pallet will also stack them in your basement for you.
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I wanted to get my first full season under my belt to get an idea for how much I'll go through. Unfortunately, there's no really easy way to get a ton or 2 of pellets to my house. I don't have outdoor basement access, so the best I could do would be stack them on my patio and tarp the hell out of them.
But, to get them to the patio I'd have to wheelbarrow them from up at the street down along the back of my house and in through the gate. Delivering them in front of my house is a no go, as I'd go through hell trying to get them around the other houses in my row and it would take forever.
I've just been getting 8 to 10 bags at a time for now and have been stacking them in my dining room. Still a huge pain the butt because I have to carry each bag up several steps to get them into the front door. Not great, but doable for now.
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I finally got some logs out of the timber and the first load hauled home, split and stacked in the woodshed. Finally, some productivity. Now that I've cleared some of it, I can see where I need to do some more saw work.
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I've had a slow start to my firewood production this year, only about 1/2 a cord so far. Sore shoulder due to torn rotator cuff has cut into my productivity. I'm hoping to get at least another full cord cut, split and stacked before I go in for shoulder surgery on Jan. 20th.
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I've had a slow start to my firewood production this year, only about 1/2 a cord so far. Sore shoulder due to torn rotator cuff has cut into my productivity. I'm hoping to get at least another full cord cut, split and stacked before I go in for shoulder surgery on Jan. 20th.
I was starting to get productive on mine, then I don't know what the hell happened, but two weeks have gone by since I last ran the saw. I'm going to try and get a half cord cut, if not split, this week.
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Just for grins and giggles I decided to compare BTU per cord of hardwood (24 million or so, White Oak) with what I have in the pellets that I have stockpiled...
Pellets are about 8000 BTU per pound. 40 pounds to a bag = 320,000 BTU per bag. I have (I think) around 23 bags stockpiled right now, so 7.36 million BTU, which gives me... A little under 1/3rd of a cord equivalent.
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My stash is mixed hardwoods, white oak, ash, black cherry, persimmon, hackberry and black locust.ive got about a cord of white oak and black locust that I cut last year that wont be ready to burn till next season. The ash, hackberry and cherry I've cut this year will be good for next year. I'd like to be back to 2 years ahead but I'll probably have to buy a couple ricks this year to get there since I keep falling apart.
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Just for grins and giggles I decided to compare BTU per cord of hardwood (24 million or so, White Oak) with what I have in the pellets that I have stockpiled...
Pellets are about 8000 BTU per pound. 40 pounds to a bag = 320,000 BTU per bag. I have (I think) around 23 bags stockpiled right now, so 7.36 million BTU, which gives me... A little under 1/3rd of a cord equivalent.
Is that the BTU available in the wood/pellets or is that what you can expect to transfer to the house through burning?
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Available in the wood.
Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk
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For all you lumberjacks, give this trick a try.
http://imgur.com/gallery/hj5luvq
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For all you lumberjacks, give this trick a try.
http://imgur.com/gallery/hj5luvq
Pretty slick. First time I’ve seen it. But I would just pull it with a chain and tractor instead of going to the trouble of railing it.
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Just realized that I didn't fully answer your question, Fly...
8100 or so BTU per pound in pellets.
My stove is around 70% efficient, so I get a little over 5,600 BTU per pound of pellets burned. My Castle isn't the most efficient stove out there, but it's simple, reliable, is easy to clean, and looks good.
Some of the pellet stoves get as much as 86% efficient, I think, but the more efficient stoves tend to be a lot more complex and a lot more expensive.