Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: dogmush on January 05, 2024, 02:02:54 PM
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I know we have some fans of the foldy boi Sub2000 in here, so I thought I'd share when this popped up on my YouTube Shorts list.
Looks like a Gen 2 Sub2k with a twist ( ;) ), so that optics can be mounted easily and retain zero. Kind of a neat idea, and a good answer to S&W's foldy gun. Bag guns are all the rage now, and if you're good with a PCC, Kel Tec has some history of these working.
Of course, it's Kel-Tec, so Gods know they probably made an initial run of 6 of them, and they'll be out of stock till 2025, but at least they exist somewhere.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EBvDxXmgJg
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Nice.
I picked up a Sub2000 primarily for use as a car gun.
It's strange feeling from a firing position with that tubular buttstock, but man is it handy.
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Fixes the biggest flaw in the gun. This be fair when the S2K first came out red dots weren't really that big of a thing.
Waiting on tests to see how well it holds zero.
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I didn't know they were that cheap. That's a handy little carbine. Sportsman's Warehouse has them in stock for $450.
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I didn't know they were that cheap. That's a handy little carbine. Sportsman's Warehouse has them in stock for $450.
That's the Gen 2. Harder to put Optics on. Put if that's your jam, PSA has them on sale for $379, plus the $100 rebate so $279 plus transfer and shipping all in.
https://palmettostatearmory.com/kel-tec-gen2-sub2000-glock-17-9mm-rifle-black.html
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I didn't know they were that cheap. That's a handy little carbine. Sportsman's Warehouse has them in stock for $450.
That's the Gen 2. Harder to put Optics on. Put if that's your jam, PSA has them on sale for $379, plus the $100 rebate so $279 plus transfer and shipping all in.
https://palmettostatearmory.com/kel-tec-gen2-sub2000-glock-17-9mm-rifle-black.html
Gen 3 $450
https://www.sportsmans.com/shooting-gear-gun-supplies/modern-sporting-rifles/kel-tec-sub2000-gen3-9mm-luger-1615in-black-semi-automatic-modern-sporting-rifle-151-rounds/p/1865725
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I stand corrected. Clicked on the wrong link on their website.
ETA: When I click that link it says "Pre-Order ships in Mid Jan." So Kel-Tec has to keep up with production demand. A task they are famously just great at.
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I stand corrected. Clicked on the wrong link on their website.
ETA: When I click that link it says "Pre-Order ships in Mid Jan." So Kel-Tec has to keep up with production demand. A task they are famously just great at.
When I click on it, I get the add to cart button, pickup [my local store] 16JAN. Do you have a Sportsman's near you, or does it ship to FFL? Maybe they're reserving in stock ones for in-store purchases.
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When I click on it, I get the add to cart button, pickup [my local store] 16JAN. Do you have a Sportsman's near you, or does it ship to FFL? Maybe they're reserving in stock ones for in-store purchases.
Says the same for me
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Yeah, I have a store here. The ship to store button says the "Pre-order ships in Mid Jan" and if I add to cart it says "estimated pick-up Jan 16"
Not a huge deal, I'm full up on foldy rifles anyway, but it's neat that they seem to be trying to get these out in a hurry. I bet the Gen 2's see a street price under $250 by Feb if these actually hit stores and work. I see the Gen 3 has a threaded barrel too.
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After SW came out with theirs that can fold with optics I figure KT would follow.
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I am seriously considering getting one now. I don't have any PCCs, and this seems like a good price for what it is and for an initial dip into the PCC realm. Could be a good tuck away truck carbine for me, given my ccw gun uses the same mags.
The question is, wait for reviews, or be an early adopter? :laugh:
I wish stupid Cabelas sold them - I have just about $400 in cabelas bucks right now.
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The question is, wait for reviews, or be an early adopter? :laugh:
I wish stupid Cabelas sold them - I have just about $400 in cabelas bucks right now.
I'm waiting to find out how well they hold zero.
Wait a little, Cabelas will probably have them before too long.
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Wait a little, Cabelas will probably have them before too long.
They don't appear to sell any Keltec at all.
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They don't appear to sell any Keltec at all.
Well poopy poop
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I know we have some fans of the foldy boi Sub2000 in here, so I thought I'd share when this popped up on my YouTube Shorts list.
Looks like a Gen 2 Sub2k with a twist ( ;) ), so that optics can be mounted easily and retain zero. Kind of a neat idea, and a good answer to S&W's foldy gun. Bag guns are all the rage now, and if you're good with a PCC, Kel Tec has some history of these working.
Of course, it's Kel-Tec, so Gods know they probably made an initial run of 6 of them, and they'll be out of stock till 2025, but at least they exist somewhere.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EBvDxXmgJg
saw that. Wonder if there's going to be a way to upgrade the Gen 2 guns. Wasn't there an aftermarket front end for the Gen 1 that did the same thing? (Red Lion. https://www.redlionprecision.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=R11 (https://www.redlionprecision.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=R11) )
That's one of them scary guns I'm not supposed to have now, anyways. OIoops.
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I've never owned a Sub2K, but didn't the earlier versions come with iron sights? The Gen 3 appears to not have them.
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I've never owned a Sub2K, but didn't the earlier versions come with iron sights? The Gen 3 appears to not have them.
Yes and yes.
My guess is the idea is that if you want iron sights on the gen 3 you can mount a set of the many 1913 rail mount sight sets available
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A bunch of youts around here have been carrying some sizable messenger bags..
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Yes and yes.
My guess is the idea is that if you want iron sights on the gen 3 you can mount a set of the many 1913 rail mount sight sets available
Without having done a lot of research, it seems the new twisty thing was designed primarily to allow optic mounting, so they're doing what many AR makers are, selling it bare and letting the user do what they want.
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My CMR-30 came with a set of Magpul flip up sights and the Kel-tec web pages mentions them.
Don't see any mention of the same on the Gen 3 S2K page.
I was going to ask if they're still going to produce the Gen 2 (with sights) but I don't even see the Gen 2 listed on their website anymore so I guess that answers that although they still list the CQB which is basically a gen 2 at heart. Maybe they haven't got the Gen 3 version of the CQB going yet.
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I thought about trying to mount some sort of optic sight on my Sub2K, but after really thinking about it I figured... why?
The iron sights are more than enough for a 9mm carbine. They're actually very quick to acquire.
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Wish I kept either my G1 (Glock mag) or G2 (S&W mag) KTS2K... :facepalm:
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Bud's currently has the Sub2K 9mm for $299.99 with free shipping.
Edit in...
It's $399.99... but Kel-Tec has a $100 rebate.
Bit misleading there, Bud's.
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I thought about trying to mount some sort of optic sight on my Sub2K, but after really thinking about it I figured... why?
The iron sights are more than enough for a 9mm carbine. They're actually very quick to acquire.
That was always my thinking. For a sort of backup PCC, the iron sights do what is needed. Mounting a light would be my first option.
I guess it depends on what you want to use it for. AR-15's are selling pretty cheap these days and there are many other 9mm carbines for more money.
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I am seriously considering getting one now. I don't have any PCCs, and this seems like a good price for what it is and for an initial dip into the PCC realm. Could be a good tuck away truck carbine for me, given my ccw gun uses the same mags.
The question is, wait for reviews, or be an early adopter? :laugh:
I wish stupid Cabelas sold them - I have just about $400 in cabelas bucks right now.
You just hit all my points with the exception of the mag commonality. And I'm in the same boat as far as waiting for reviews vs. early adoption. Especially with the nonsense of Oregon's M114 still up in the air, I worry that if I wait I *won't* be able to get it.
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You just hit all my points with the exception of the mag commonality. And I'm in the same boat as far as waiting for reviews vs. early adoption. Especially with the nonsense of Oregon's M114 still up in the air, I worry that if I wait I *won't* be able to get it.
I've been looking into it more because of this thread, and it's really swaying me. It appears folded measurements would just about perfectly stow it in the get home ruck I keep in the 4Runner. For that use, I actually would want to mount an optic, even one of the cheap Primary Arms ones that I have laying around, and a cheap stowed sling.
I know there are plenty of better (but less foldy) PCCs out there, but I would just consider them as a house defense carbine, and I already have that covered with the more capable Canebrake.
I like the gen3 threaded barrel, which could take my Liberty Cosmic. I understand that the gen2 triggers are semi-atrocious (especially when compared to the S&W), but can be easily upgraded. I haven't seen anything on the gen3 trigger.
The S&W is likely a better gun for not a whole lot more money, but I don't own any other M&P products except for an AR, and wouldn't want a whole nother set of mags, especially for the "truck gun" thing, when I'm already carrying an extra 17 in my Tier1 for the carry pistol.
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I like the gen3 threaded barrel, which could take my Liberty Cosmic. I understand that the gen2 triggers are semi-atrocious (especially when compared to the S&W), but can be easily upgraded. I haven't seen anything on the gen3 trigger.
Gen2 barrels are threaded and I know someone who shoots his suppressed.
And yes the triggers are nothing to write home about. Not horrible but not great either. Usable, lets put it that way.
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One negative thing: Yikes - that is one pain in the ass to disassemble the gun to swap triggers. Maybe that's just part of keeping the gun cheap, but that's kind of a Rube Goldberg mess.
https://youtu.be/js6xBGR1RWQ
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I pulled the bolt on mine only once for cleaning. I didn't have fun with that at all.
The biggest complaint about the sub2000 for me is it has a pretty heavy bolt and the recoil with 9mm is worse than I expected. I still have a Gen 1 in 40 S&W. I expect some recoil with that. I didn't expect it with 9mm. But it is simple, small, and lightweight so that is what you get.
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I pulled the bolt on mine only once for cleaning. I didn't have fun with that at all.
The biggest complaint about the sub2000 for me is it has a pretty heavy bolt and the recoil with 9mm is worse than I expected. I still have a Gen 1 in 40 S&W. I expect some recoil with that. I didn't expect it with 9mm. But it is simple, small, and lightweight so that is what you get.
Get a bolt buffer and add a foam cheek pad. It helps!
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The recoil isn't light, but it is still shootable. It stays parked in a small gym bag with a magazine pouch. I don't shoot it very often. =)
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Apparently the gen3 has a better trigger than the gen2. Though I'm not sure if this guy's trigger scale is accurate. Trigger comparison begins at 6:50.
https://youtu.be/wDQCSZjS8HQ
Also the sportsmans warehouse link seems to have gone 404. I see that most of the gen2 models have a $100 rebate now.
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Just found this video by Othias from C&Rsenal about his Sub2k.
Kinda fun! That rotating forearm? Never found anything about it when I was searching upgrades for mine. That is VERY interesting. $180? Not so much.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-f83a17LBY
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Apparently the gen3 has a better trigger than the gen2. Though I'm not sure if this guy's trigger scale is accurate. Trigger comparison begins at 6:50.
https://youtu.be/wDQCSZjS8HQ
Also the sportsmans warehouse link seems to have gone 404. I see that most of the gen2 models have a $100 rebate now.
The rebate's been around for a while. They started that fter S&W brought out their folder.
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SHOT Show is next week. I am sure a couple dozen videos will appear after that.
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I pulled the bolt on mine only once for cleaning. I didn't have fun with that at all.
The biggest complaint about the sub2000 for me is it has a pretty heavy bolt and the recoil with 9mm is worse than I expected. I still have a Gen 1 in 40 S&W. I expect some recoil with that. I didn't expect it with 9mm. But it is simple, small, and lightweight so that is what you get.
I once bit many years ago into the PCC concept, when I was carrying a Colt LW Commander. Got a Marlin Camp 45. The bolt was crazy heavy on that too. I didn't like the feel of it at all.
The only PCC that interests me any more is a .357 or .44 lever gun.
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I had a 9mm Camp Carbine. I wanted to love it, but I HATED the stock on it. It was so thick through the wrist that I couldn't wrap my hand around it.
I ended up selling it to someone here.
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SHOT Show is next week. I am sure a couple dozen videos will appear after that.
We often see videos pop up the same or near enough the same day a new gun is released due to the manufacturers sending out samples to many of the YT channels. Haven't seen any pop up on the Gen3 yet. I don't think KT plays the free samples for good reviews game.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWHz1_YUQng
This PCC *really* interests me. I have a straight blowback 9mm PCC, and as you guys pointed out the bolt (and in my case buffer and spring) are heavy and annoying. I'm leaning towards changing it around and trying to get a delayed PCC of some kind. Either something like that^^ or one of the MP5 clones hitting the market these days.
(Personally I like the CMMG delay system, because my current 9mm is already SBR'd, so If I swap an upper, I'll use that lower, where a new to me MP5 will require two new stamps.)
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I have a K-USA KP9 and I like it a lot. I hear good things about the PSA AK in 9mm also. Not a lot of recoil, but the gun is a little bigger. They are more expensive.
I wouldn't mind trying one of the B&T 9mm carbine/pistols, but I usually have something else I want to spend that money on.
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A couple of videos popped up.
Note I have not watched them nor have I ever heard of these guys before
https://youtu.be/wDQCSZjS8HQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3XedcJZjxs
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That first video is the one I posted, and I'm not sure about that guy's trigger scale. My reading tells me that the gen2 trigger is like 8lbs. Is that true? Because he's getting 6lbs on gen2, 4lbs on gen3, which is not bad for either of them, given what they are.
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That first video is the one I posted, and I'm not sure about that guy's trigger scale. My reading tells me that the gen2 trigger is like 8lbs. Is that true? Because he's getting 6lbs on gen2, 4lbs on gen3, which is not bad for either of them, given what they are.
Ah, so it is.
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A couple of videos popped up.
Note I have not watched them nor have I ever heard of these guys before
https://youtu.be/wDQCSZjS8HQ
Thread drift,
The first video. What accent is that?
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So SHOT is at an end, and I have yet to see a review on this gen3 from any of the "name" guntubers. Have any of you seen anything? I found a couple unboxing videos, but that was it.
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I thought I saw mention of it, but no new reviews. Honest Outlaw has a first shots video from November getting ready for a 1000 round review, but that was a Gen 2.