Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: Ben on June 27, 2017, 07:51:30 PM
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Are you kidding me? Is there anyone at APS that buys lumber ever that doesn't know that 4x4s are 3.5x3.5s? I'd actually be kinda pissed if If I bought some to use that were actually 4x4, because then all my measurements would be screwed up. I mean, this is common knowledge, right?
I hope whoever is bringing the lawsuit has to pay all court costs when they lose.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/nation-now/2017/06/21/home-depot-menards-lumber-size-lawsuit/415874001/
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To be fair, I know a fair number of folks who wouldn't have any idea this was the case.
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“Defendant has received significant profits from its false marketing and sale of its dimensional lumber products,” the action against Menards contends.
I'm sure they made all kinds of dishonest gain by selling 4x4s the exact same size as everyone else's.
Does Menards' packaging disclose that 130-volt, 60-wattt bulbs use less than 60 watts? Have they been deceiving us all this time?!
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If they want actual 4" x 4" then they should have bought it rough sawn. Legally, a 3 1/2" x 3 1/2" is a 4x4.
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On their website they also clearly state their actual measurements.
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I know a lawyer/law firm that needs to lose licenses...
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I'll say the same thing I've said elsewhere about this.
The lawyer that filed this should be disbarred, the judge that doesn't summarily dismiss it with prejudice should be tarred and feathered.
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I did not know this, of course I haven't exactly done a lot of wood buying. Calling it a 4x4 when they aren't sounds deceitful. ???
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I did not know this, of course I haven't exactly done a lot of wood buying. Calling it a 4x4 when they aren't sounds deceitful. ???
Totally the case until you own a house. I didn't know a 2x4 wasn't until I measured one when the math didn't work for some project.
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I know a lawyer/law firm that needs to lose licenses...
Or just a good old fashioned beat down
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Not that I have micrometer-click eyeballs, but there was an old WPA (Works Projects Administration) outhouse on my farm.
Poking around in there when we first moved into the property, the studs somehow looked "funny." Couldn't put my finger on it, but after a while I realized the studs were actual, honest-to-gawd, full 2 whole inches by 4 full whole inches. So said my good ole Stanley tape measure.
Told Wife1 about it. She wasn't as excited about this amazing discovery as I was.
A modicum of research indicates that what with seasoning shrinkage, sawmill saw kerf widths, sanding for smoothness, etc, etc, lumber sizes weren't really standardized until 1969 AD.
Maybe that suit should have been filed before then.
Terry
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As stupid as this whole thing is can't they just claim its an industry standard and push the blame.
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I did not know this, of course I haven't exactly done a lot of wood buying. Calling it a 4x4 when they aren't sounds deceitful. ???
Okay, I'll step back my initial outrage and make allowances for those that haven't worked with lumber much. :)
But the lawyers still need a beat down.
Also, to be clear for those not familiar, it's not just about 4x4s. Most all construction lumber is measured like that. 2x4s are 1.5x3.5 for instance.
Heck, you even have (depending on the region of the country probably) "8' studs", which are not to be confused with 2x4x8s. They are 2x4x92 1/4. When I was a young buck working construction, the younger guys (and me to this day) just called them 92 1/4 studs, but everyone knew they were what you used for an 8' wall. A lot of the older guys called them "8 foot studs", and if they told you to go to the lumber yard to get a bunch, you'd better not come back with actual 8' 2x4s.
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As stupid as this whole thing is can't they just claim its an industry standard and push the blame.
Or fix the industry standard to match the vastly older standard called "inches."
The industry is welcome to continue making 1-1/2x3-1/2s, and all other sizes. Hell, they can make 1-63/128x3-91/184s if the want. Just don't call it what it's not and claim "industry standard" as a justification.
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As stupid as this whole thing is can't they just claim its an industry standard and push the blame.
It is an industry standard and has been since Jesus was an apprentice carpenter. Ive known it since I was about 12, family full of carpenters though. Dimension lumber size is rough cut size and finished size is after planing.
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It is an industry standard and has been since Jesus was an apprentice carpenter. Ive known it since I was about 12, family full of carpenters though. Dimension lumber size is rough cut size and finished size is after planing.
This. You may as well complain that the rib-eye you ordered doesn't come out to the full 14 oz that it said on the menu.
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Well, maybe not since Jeebus, but it's been this way for a LONG time.
Interesting PDF of an article on the subject from 1964.
https://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/misc/miscpub_6409.pdf
Size standards started developing after the Civil War.
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I do woodworking, a lot. A lot of people were in a huff and saying "these people are morons, everyone knows 2x4's aren't two by four inches!"
To which I respond, "Why the hell does it seem normal to you to intentionally give false measurements? They SHOULD be properly called inch and half by three and a half inches. IT MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE TO INTENTIONALLY GIVE DIMENSIONS THAT ARE INCORRECT." I do 'fine woodworking'. By that I mean, stuff that is not construction work. In non-construction wood stuff, you need actual real measurements for everything. Accurate measurements, even.
Then I get a lecture about kilning, sanding, etc. Which I know. Because I do it myself. To get accurate dimension wood, you have to buy oversized and plane down to correct sizing. Because "industry standard" is friggin stupid. I have no problem with the dimensions actually used in the real world. Just the incorrect dimensions being used as an intentionally misleading description.
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Slightly interesting, I took this picture in a hardware store in England around two years ago.
The dimensions are true dimensions for a 2x4, and in metric. 38 x 89 x 2400mm
And that piece of wood cost (at that time) about USD $7.
(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FueEVqGm.jpg%3F1&hash=405cf975daf70da9db2c4165ffa2a24cbee3f228)
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Slightly interesting, I took this picture in a hardware store in England around two years ago.
The dimensions are true dimensions for a 2x4, and in metric. 38 x 89 x 2400mm
England has no 2x4s. They have "fourbeetwos."
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I'll say the same thing I've said elsewhere about this.
The lawyer that filed this should be disbarred, the judge that doesn't summarily dismiss it with prejudice should be tarred and feathered.
The lawyer that is defending, you mean. ;)
Industry standards can be wrong and misleading. Often are. They can and should be updated if they contain inaccurate information. Which they do.
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The lawyer that is defending, you mean. ;)
Really? If we want to have a discussion on specifying exact measurements, which, as pointed out earlier, including by government documents, is a complete cultural change, that's fine.
However, saying these attorneys and their clients have a legitimate claim? They are in it for nothing but money. If they truly wanted to sue for "honesty", they wouldn't have chosen to just sue HD and Menards. That's classic ambulance chasing. You want to make a change? Take it up with the timber and lumber industry, and also the government, who wrote the regulations on lumber description. These lawyers aren't looking for a change in lumber description, they are looking for a couple of big retailers to throw money at them to make this go away.
I guarantee that when HD orders lumber from their supplier, they don't order 2 1/2 x 3 1/2 -- they order 2x4.
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I do woodworking, a lot. A lot of people were in a huff and saying "these people are morons, everyone knows 2x4's aren't two by four inches!"
To which I respond, "Why the hell does it seem normal to you to intentionally give false measurements? They SHOULD be properly called inch and half by three and a half inches. IT MAKES ABSOLUTELY NO SENSE TO INTENTIONALLY GIVE DIMENSIONS THAT ARE INCORRECT." I do 'fine woodworking'. By that I mean, stuff that is not construction work. In non-construction wood stuff, you need actual real measurements for everything. Accurate measurements, even.
Then I get a lecture about kilning, sanding, etc. Which I know. Because I do it myself. To get accurate dimension wood, you have to buy oversized and plane down to correct sizing. Because "industry standard" is friggin stupid. I have no problem with the dimensions actually used in the real world. Just the incorrect dimensions being used as an intentionally misleading description.
All of that is well and good, but that's no reason for a person to sue two home improvement stores or a lawyer to accept such a suit when the stores are using government-accepted standards of nomenclature
I've not read the complaint, but I really have to wonder how the individuals in the suit think that they were harmed by a confusing, but STANDARDIZED, system of nominal measurements?
Holy *expletive deleted*it, could you imagine if people in the shooting sports tried this crap?
My .300 Savage actually uses .308-diameter bullets! That 0.008 difference has irreparably harmed my life and I demand to be made whole with copious amounts of compensation!
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My .300 Savage actually uses .308-diameter bullets! That 0.008 difference has irreparably harmed my life and I demand to be made whole with copious amounts of compensation!
I was thinking about comparable examples. That's an excellent one.
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$7 for a something by something?
Holy something!
:rofl:
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How about another one...
My .30-30 Winchester does NOT contain 30 grains of powder! There was only 26.8 grains of powder in each shell!
I demand millions of dollars of compensation for the missing 3.2 grains!
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Standards exist for (usually) good reasons. And they are descriptive enough if one takes the time to read them.
IMNSHO, describing lumber by its finished size would be stupid, not to mention monumentally inefficient. I sure as hell don't want to tell the guy at HD I need a pallet of 2 1/2 x 3 1/2s.
This is ambulance chasing lawyers wanting a big payout, nothing more.
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What's a two by four?
Going Oompah Oompah.
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The lawyer that is defending, you mean. ;)
Industry standards can be wrong and misleading. Often are. They can and should be updated if they contain inaccurate information. Which they do.
I'm reminded of an incident that took place at a previous job.
I had used a common term associated with electronic circuits and one of the lady office wanks overheard it and made a sexual harassment complaint to HR.
My bosses backed me up fully but HR still thought it would be a good idea for me to apologize to the offended individual.
I told her I was sorry that her poor education and low level of literacy caused her to be offended by an innocuous technical term.
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Did you ask for a pair of Dikes?
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I'm reminded of an incident that took place at a previous job.
I had used a common term associated with electronic circuits and one of the lady office wanks overheard it and made a sexual harassment complaint to HR.
My bosses backed me up fully but HR still thought it would be a good idea for me to apologize to the offended individual.
I told her I was sorry that her poor education and low level of literacy caused her to be offended by an innocuous technical term.
Distressingly all too common.
I've also heard of the same people getting written up because the idiot was offended by the truth of the apology.
Probably the most famous incident like this was some years ago in DC in which a white bureaucrat used the term 'niggardly' in a written communication. He used it correctly, but a number of his coworkers went berserk. The memo writer was forced to resign his position.
http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jan/29/news/mn-2884
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This really has nothing to do with any industry standard. If the aggrieved party were humans, or knew any humans, they would know that language is very often inexact, and fine print is often so fine that it's invisible.
I have every bit as much ground to sue Wal-Mart for failing to include the sales tax on every price label on the shelves.
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Distressingly all too common.
I've also heard of the same people getting written up because the idiot was offended by the truth of the apology.
Probably the most famous incident like this was some years ago in DC in which a white bureaucrat used the term 'niggardly' in a written communication. He used it correctly, but a number of his coworkers went berserk. The memo writer was forced to resign his position.
http://articles.latimes.com/1999/jan/29/news/mn-2884
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oc1zGRUPztc
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Never underestimate the ease with which someone can be offended by non-offensive things.
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Or just a good old fashioned beat down
With a 2x4...sorry a 1.5x3.5.
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....
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With a 2x4...sorry a 1.5x3.5.
Soon to be a 38mm x 89mm
Seriously. I've asked why, if the lumber industry wants us to go metric, they don't round 2x4s off to even numbers like 40mm x 90mm. The answer I got was that the building trades couldn't manage the difference in size between a "real" 2x4 and a 40x90. But I'm old enough to remember that, when I was growing up, a 2x4 was 1-5/8 x 3-5/8. The carpenters somehow survived the downsizing to 1-1/2 x 3-1/2, so I think that would handle a difference of 2mm x 1mm.
The world is insane.
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This really has nothing to do with any industry standard. If the aggrieved party were humans, or knew any humans, they would know that language is very often inexact, and fine print is often so fine that it's invisible.
I have every bit as much ground to sue Wal-Mart for failing to include the sales tax on every price label on the shelves.
Ah but the state department of theft taxation does not require that.
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This really is stupid. You're not buying a 2x4 board. Your buying a 2x4 chunk the the tree that has been made useful.
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http://www.foxnews.com/food-drink/2017/06/28/dunkin-donuts-sued-over-claims-that-steak-sandwich-doesnt-contain-steak.html
First they came for the 2x4, then they came for the fast-food steak sandwich.
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I'm reminded of an incident that took place at a previous job.
I had used a common term associated with electronic circuits and one of the lady office wanks overheard it and made a sexual harassment complaint to HR.
My bosses backed me up fully but HR still thought it would be a good idea for me to apologize to the offended individual.
I told her I was sorry that her poor education and low level of literacy caused her to be offended by an innocuous technical term.
In a motorcycle shop I used to work at a long time ago, a customer called the parts department to ask if they had a petcock in stock. The parts girl hung up on him.
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the worst of this story is that such a frivolous law suit even makes it onto a court docket.
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the worst of this story is that such a frivolous law suit even makes it onto a court docket.
The size of the wood is very important to some people.
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In a motorcycle shop I used to work at a long time ago, a customer called the parts department to ask if they had a petcock in stock. The parts girl hung up on him.
During World War II a number of companies, and even the government, had to produce written material aimed at women entering the work force to initiate them into terminology that might sound as if the men were behaving badly.
Petcock, nipple, stud, you name it.
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It would be better for measurements to be accurate instead of merely descriptive, but to behave as if nominal measurements in this case are actually deceptive is dishonest on the part of the lawyers filing the suit. As per usual, this is a class action lawsuit designed to enrich the law firms and will not improve things for anyone else. Sure, you might end up with a check for $0.34 if you are lucky, but the cost to the businesses (which will be passed along to customers, I guarantee) will be much, much higher.
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My house was built in 1959. Imagine my surprise and delight in discovering that it was built with actual, by-G_d, 2x4's, 2x6's, and 2x8's. =D =D =D =D =D
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It would be better for measurements to be accurate instead of merely descriptive, but to behave as if nominal measurements in this case are actually deceptive is dishonest on the part of the lawyers filing the suit. As per usual, this is a class action lawsuit designed to enrich the law firms and will not improve things for anyone else. Sure, you might end up with a check for $0.34 if you are lucky, but the cost to the businesses (which will be passed along to customers, I guarantee) will be much, much higher.
Same as when Subway was sued because one of their footlong sandwiches was less than one foot long. It was a class action suit, the lawyers got half a million, the nine or ten "victims" got I believe $500 apiece. Legal extortion.
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This really is stupid. You're not buying a 2x4 board. Your buying a 2x4 chunk the the tree that has been made useful.
So why not call it a tree?
Maybe I could market some burgers as 25 pounders because the original package of beef was that size, or 1200 pounders because the cow had to be "made useful."
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So why not call it a tree?
Maybe I could market some burgers as 25 pounders because the original package of beef was that size, or 1200 pounders because the cow had to be "made useful."
More like selling a burger by its pre-cooked weight. Oh, wait, they do that.
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More like selling a burger by its pre-cooked weight. Oh, wait, they do that.
Except that generally, burgers aren't cooked to a precise weight, so only the precooked weight can be an accurate measure. Nor is anyone really planning anything based on the weight of a burger patty, whereas the size of lumber is critical to properly building with it.
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More like selling a burger by its pre-cooked weight. Oh, wait, they do that.
Yes. Yes they do.
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Except that generally, burgers aren't cooked to a precise weight, so only the precooked weight can be an accurate measure. Nor is anyone really planning anything based on the weight of a burger patty, whereas the size of lumber is critical to properly building with it.
There are good reasons for the restaurant industry choosing to sell a burger by its precooked weight, just as there are good reasons the lumber industry sells a rough-sawn 2x4 that has been surfaced as a 2x4 even if is no longer 2x4. And why we still call a .38 a .38.
Reasons aside, in none of the above examples are the sellers attempting to defraud the end-user.
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Except that generally, burgers aren't cooked to a precise weight, so only the precooked weight can be an accurate measure. Nor is anyone really planning anything based on the weight of a burger patty, whereas the size of lumber is critical to properly building with it.
If the size is that critical, there's a thing a couple of aisles over called a tape measure. Or just change the design a bit to accommodate the whole half inch that's not there. Or do what Revdisk does and buy big and fit it. Or sue the stores instead of the lumber industry because one does not actually care about any of the above and is just looking for a payout.
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If the size is that critical, there's a thing a couple of aisles over called a tape measure.
You know what, because I just don't do plumbing enough to always remember what's OD and what's ID, before I go to the plumbing aisle, I measure what I need at home, clip the damn tape measure to my pocket, drive to the store, then measure the part I'm gonna buy. Or even take the old part, or what the old part is supposed to fit into (if portable) with me and check fit in the store.
Personal responsibility. I'm not familiar enough with plumbing measurements so I doublecheck them. If someone isn't familiar with lumber and how lumber is measured, doublecheck the measurements.
Also why, even though I know my calibers, I still have calipers sitting on my reloading bench.
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My house was built in 1959. Imagine my surprise and delight in discovering that it was built with actual, by-G_d, 2x4's, 2x6's, and 2x8's. =D =D =D =D
To be honest, I am mildly shocked. My house was built by (okay, "for") my parents in 1950. The wall framing sticks are 1-5/8 x 3-5/8. I haven't seen a real 2x4 in anything bult since about 1940 -- and those were rough-sawn.
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During World War II a number of companies, and even the government, had to produce written material aimed at women entering the work force to initiate them into terminology that might sound as if the men were behaving badly.
Petcock, nipple, stud, you name it.
Back when Mike was a young lady. :rofl:
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Or just change the design a bit to accommodate the whole half inch that's not there.
Not always that easy, especially when dealing with a mix of dimensionally true stock (structural steel tubing) and lazy named stock. With steel 2x4s, I can stack two and perfectly match a 4x4. Two 2x2s exactly match a 2x4. With wood "2x4s" stacking two gives a 3x3-1/2 which doesn't even match a wood "4x4." When using a combination like a steel 2x6 outer frame with wood "2x6" inner joists, things end up having to be offset (or hope the steel vendor stocks something-by-5-1/2s which isn't always a good bet) so the flooring doesn't have half-inch waves in it. Dealing with crews that are used to working with only one material or the other, it becomes a mess.
Or sue the stores instead of the lumber industry because one does not actually care about any of the above and is just looking for a payout.
How does one sue a non-entity like "the lumber industry?" The retail stores are the only portion that most people would ever be able to deal directly with, and as such, the only part one might be found to have standing to sue.
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There are good reasons for the restaurant industry choosing to sell a burger by its precooked weight,
Not the least of which is that they'd have to either list five weights or keep five pre-cook measures around to account for the different loss of weight between rare, medium-rare, medium, medium-well and well. (And monitor the moisture content of the meat between lots, etc.) Maybe McDonald's could give a consistent cooked weight since they have central distribution and don't give an option on how the patty is cooked, but the local diner likely does well to have someone on staff who can figure out tax on the burger.
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Maybe they could sue the power company if they don't have exactly 120VAC at the wall socket.
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Has anyone checked their shotshells lately, to see if the dram equivalents are really equivalent?
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Sue ammo manufacturers if their measured velocities are not the same as that shown on the box. =)
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Back when Mike was a young lady. :rofl:
Masher
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^^,^^^,^^^^
:rofl:
I had to laugh when I saw the accuracy specs on an infra-red remote thermometer I bought recently:
Accuracy
+/- 2% above 32°F
+/- 4.5% below 32°F
Well, getting "technical" about it, and starting from no temperature at all, meaning absolute zero, that makes the freezing-point tolerance +/- 9.2°F, for a total of 18.4°F altogether. And it gets worse with higher temperatures! Hell, I want my money back or I'll sue, sue, sue!
And the below-freezing accuracy is even worse! Sue, sue, sue !
(But I'll listen to any out-of-court settlements.)
We all know what they mean, though, don't we?
:) Terry
REF (Might be worthwhile to look at this):
http://www.dictionary.com/browse/term-of-art
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New protest group...
Black Body Radiation Matters
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https://www.jsonline.com/story/money/business/retail/2017/10/06/lumber-lawsuit-against-menards-dismissed-judge-says-retailer-didnt-lie-its-4-x-4-s/739282001/
Judge threw it out a long time ago. Said it's industry standard, and they could have measured the lumber right there in the store. He didn't mention that they could have borrowed a tape from the tool department rack to do the measuring.
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https://www.jsonline.com/story/money/business/retail/2017/10/06/lumber-lawsuit-against-menards-dismissed-judge-says-retailer-didnt-lie-its-4-x-4-s/739282001/
Judge threw it out a long time ago. Said it's industry standard, and they could have measured the lumber right there in the store. He didn't mention that they could have borrowed a tape from the tool department rack to do the measuring.
Always double-tap on a zombie thread.
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Good one on the judge!
As Turin described it, all three men in the lawsuits wanted the lumber for home-improvement projects, got home and measured the pieces, felt they had been deceived and then turned to the law firm.
I can guarantee that the only construction experience these men had was watching some sort of home makeover show on tv.
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They should have hired the shed of doom (https://www.bcsportbikes.com/forum/showthread.php/146566-Build-to-Fail-Fail-to-Build-What-is-this-I-don-t-even) builder, then the dimensions wouldn't have mattered so much
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They should have hired the shed of doom (https://www.bcsportbikes.com/forum/showthread.php/146566-Build-to-Fail-Fail-to-Build-What-is-this-I-don-t-even) builder, then the dimensions wouldn't have mattered so much
=D
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It is an industry standard and has been since Jesus was an apprentice carpenter. Ive known it since I was about 12, family full of carpenters though. Dimension lumber size is rough cut size and finished size is after planing.
I started working as an architect (actually as a draftsman, as I hadn't gotten my degree yet) in 1966. Back then a 2x4 was 1-5/8" x 3-5/8". Then, some time in the early to mid-1970s, the industry standard shifted to 1-1/2 x 3-1/2, and there it has stayed. But it's not as simple as subtracting a half inch from the nominal dimension to get the actual dimension. Oh, no ... that would be too easy.
"Boards" and pieces of wood with a nominal thickness of one inch or less. A "one by" whatever is 3/4 of an inch thick. But a nominal 1-1/4" board ("five quarter") isn't 1-1/4" thick. They used to be 1-1/8" but now they're 1-1/16" thick.
Framing lumber, 2" or greater nominal thickness, is called "dimension lumber." A 2x4 is 1-1/2 x 3-1/2. A 2x6 is 1-1/2 x 5-1/2. But ... beyond 2x6 it gets even worse. A 2x8 is 1-1/2 x 7-1/4, a 2x10 is 1-1/2 x 9-1/4, etc.
Back in the heyday of "soft metrication" I once suggested to a lumber industry rep that we should just adopt standard metric dimensions for dimension lumber. A 2x4 would become 40mm x 90mm, for example. My suggestion was met with horror. Oh, no! That would mess up all the detailing in the field, he said. Never mind that lumber that was surfaced when green shrinks at least an eighth, maybe a quarter of an inch when it dries, so mixing "S-green" lumber with air-dried lumber with kiln-dried lumber results in a real mish-mash.
And never mind that I saw first-hand the change from a 1-5/8 x 3-5/8 "2x4" to the smaller version. In metric dimensions, the 1-5/8 x 3-5/8 "2x4" was 41.28mm x 92.08mm. The newer 1-1/2 x 3-1/2 version is 38.1mm x 88.9mm. My suggestion was to make a 2x4 40mm x 90mm. The industry had already undergone the change from the n-5/8 sizes to the n-1/2 sizes. My proposal would have fallen between the two, so very little adjusting would be needed, and that would have been less than what the industry had absorbed without a whimper in the 1970s. But no -- it was not to be.
So we still have idiot buyers and idiot lawyers who sue because industry standard, commodity-grade lumber is being sold at (oh the horror!) industry standard dimensions.
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Glad to see it got tossed. And that the judge used my comment a page back about personal responsibility and tape measures to make his decision. =D
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Also I've noticed at least in Lowe's that in addition to 2x4 or what have you, they also list true dimensions.
Wait till they actually get further into a project and realize that the damned things probably aren't straight. Ah the joys of picking through a lumber pile.....
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If they are straight at the store, by the time you bring them home and let them sit until next weekend, when you get around to using them ... they won't be.
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If they are straight at the store, by the time you bring them home and let them sit until next weekend, when you get around to using them ... they won't be.
I hate that. I know about that. I nevertheless have six warped 2x4s and a warped sheet of plywood sitting in my shop right now. ;/
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I hate that. I know about that. I nevertheless have six warped 2x4s and a warped sheet of plywood sitting in my shop right now. ;/
You mean you have six warped one-and-a-half by three-and-a-halfs, I'm sure.
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You mean you have six warped one-and-a-half by three-and-a-halfs, I'm sure.
WHAT?!? WHO DO I SUE???
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I've been buying rough saw lumber from my uncle*. He has a small bandsaw mill and I can get pretty much any native lumber cut to pretty much any dimension I want.
*The man is 86 years old, runs a small saw mill, builds houses and does cabinet work and has a pretty good size garden.
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"Boards" and pieces of wood with a nominal thickness of one inch or less. A "one by" whatever is 3/4 of an inch thick. But a nominal 1-1/4" board ("five quarter") isn't 1-1/4" thick. They used to be 1-1/8" but now they're 1-1/16" thick.
I recently bought a couple 5/4 boards from Home Despot, they were exactly 1" thick. Which was good because I needed exactly 1" - 1.5" would be too much, 3/4 not enough.
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I recently bought a couple 5/4 boards from Home Despot, they were exactly 1" thick. Which was good because I needed exactly 1" - 1.5" would be too much, 3/4 not enough.
I had a similar problem to solve last year when the bottom of one of my garage doors rotted out. I needed something exactly 6x2”... I went around measuring boards until I found treated 1x8s that were exactly 1” thick, and glued 2 of the together.
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I had a similar problem to solve last year when the bottom of one of my garage doors rotted out. I needed something exactly 6x2”... I went around measuring boards until I found treated 1x8s that were exactly 1” thick, and glued 2 of the together.
What? No lawsuit?
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"Also I've noticed at least in Lowe's that in addition to 2x4 or what have you, they also list true dimensions."
Ah, Lowes...
Land of the L-shaped Lumber...