Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Hawkmoon on September 24, 2017, 11:35:09 AM
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President Trump suggests that fans boycott the NFL until players stop disrespecting the U.S.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/24/us/politics/trump-calls-for-boycott-if-nfl-doesnt-crack-down-on-anthem-protests.html
In response, more players take the knee, and now baseball players are getting in on the action. Unfortunately, I don't watch television and I couldn't afford a ticket to an NFL game even if I wanted to go to one (which I don't), so I can't join the boycott any more than I already have. I'm curious how the rest of y'all feel.
I get that players have a right to their opinions. I even get that they have a right to use their fame to promote their opinions. I don't accept that disrespecting the flag that hundreds of thousands of men (and some women) have died for is in any way an appropriate expression of their opinions. Plus -- these players make a big deal over their "right" to violate federal law (the Flag Code), yet they don't seem to think that the President has a right to suggest that the fans exercise their right to not buy tickets to the games.
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In some ways I think the best thing would be to ignore them (I ignore all team sports anyway) and I'm not sure Trump lowering himself to celebrity pissing contests is worthwhile.
On the other hand, I saw the statement from the NFL about how their "great organization is being disrespected" as if they were at all important, and I have a hard time having any sympathy for the stance of millionaire SJW one percenters that the NFL also says, "...have great influence in our society".
Maybe they have great influence over the bread and circuses crowd that can't think for themselves. Personally, I have a thousandfold more respect for my plumber than I do for a millionaire that throws a ball around. My plumber has useful skills and contributes directly to society, and frankly, I also respect his general knowledge and outlook over that of these privileged dbags. His salary and theirs should be reversed if we're paying based on if the person is worthwhile or not. Same goes for loudmouth celebrities in general.
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I have said all along the only way to deal with this is to take away the publicity. Don't show them kneeling, don't talk about them kneeling, just act as though it is another day at the field. Once they realize the publicity over they will either stop or not. But no one will care because no one will know. I'm just waiting for the Nascar drivers to start. >:D
bob
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I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me why playing the National Anthem before a sports balling game is necessary at all. I've come to believe that the frequency of our exposure to it has watered it down to a meaningless gesture. Why not save it for gatherings for Memorial Day, Independence Day, Veteran's Day, and at 0800 on military installations?
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I agree with both Ben and Bob.
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We can ignore them, but the liberal media including much of the sports media would keep reporting and celebrating it. So as a society ignoring isn’t really an option. I completely stopped watching football last year to a great extent over owners allowing this behavior. There are other reasons including over paid whiners, but this was the proverbial straw for me. I haven’t watched a game this year yet either. I was never a watch all day Sunday and Monday night and whatever games; but I used to catch at least one game a week, sometimes more. Now I don’t bother at all.
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I don't goto professional sports events and seldom watch them on teevee, so boycotting them would be a meaningless gesture for me.
The way I see it, they are embarrassing the boss on company time. (they can sit during the National Anthem when they attend a NASCAR race, etc, as a spectator on their own time) I'm not sure why the NFL or the team owners haven't sanctioned them somehow. Maybe they have with one or two, the name Kaepernick comes to mind but I don't know much about him.
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We can ignore them, but the liberal media including much of the sports media would keep reporting and celebrating it. So as a society ignoring isn’t really an option. I completely stopped watching football last year to a great extent over owners allowing this behavior. There are other reasons including over paid whiners, but this was the proverbial straw for me. I haven’t watched a game this year yet either. I was never a watch all day Sunday and Monday night and whatever games; but I used to catch at least one game a week, sometimes more. Now I don’t bother at all.
True, and it may be splitting hairs, but I would call what you (and many sports fans) are doing more akin to "actively ignoring" versus "boycotting". You're not out picketing or writing social media screeds - rather, the more they do this crap the more disinclined you are to watch a game simply because the political blatherings* cause you to lose interest into what the experience of watching sports is supposed to be about. The more the media focuses on it, the more people will "actively ignore", because they just wanted to sit down with a bag of doritos and a beer and watch a game.
*Blatherings, because most of these guys have no idea what they are protesting. Also, it's hard to sympathize about "justice" when a guy is wearing police pig socks. How is that taking an honorable stand? They have no business criticizing Trump's name calling when they are basically doing the same thing in their call for "justice and equality". Michele Malkin had an interesting point today regarding the people that kneeled for the US anthem but stood for the British anthem, which perfectly makes my point about these guys not knowing what they're protesting:
Moron multi-millionaire @NFL players sit for USA...but stand for British monarchs & empire that colonized Africa. #NoFansLeft
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One school of thought is that Trump has taken control of the issue, by making "the Knee" an anti-Trump gesture, and obscuring whatever it was intended to mean. And at the same time, he's associated himself with patriotism.
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One school of thought is that Trump has taken control of the issue, by making "the Knee" an anti-Trump gesture, and obscuring whatever it was intended to mean. And at the same time, he's associated himself with patriotism.
Whether he's doing that or not, I would argue these players don't know their audience. The kind of people sympathetic to shows of "resistance" like this are in general not sports fans, while I would guess a majority of sports fans are "USA fans". Barring perhaps some segment of none-white sports fans (but I would argue certainly not all) they are simply alienating most of their base while appealing to people who never watch sports. Hence the half filled stadiums.
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In some ways I think the best thing would be to ignore them (I ignore all team sports anyway) and I'm not sure Trump lowering himself to celebrity pissing contests is worthwhile.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: You realize this is a guy who has been a WWE villian and made a TV career out of celebrity pissing contests right? That said, I hope they all get stupid, and no one watches.
I also hopes Nascar does it, be the final nail in that coffin.
Confession time, I realize I have kneeled for the national anthem. Last night even. Fixing my wrecked race car, heard it about halfway thru. Thinking maybe we play the thing before people start wrecking their stuff.
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:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: You realize this is a guy who has been a WWE villian and made a TV career out of celebrity pissing contests right? That said, I hope they all get stupid, and no one watches.
Sure, but that was before he was POTUS. I still sigh a good bit when he goes off on these name calling twitter tirades that are in fact more suited to WWE than to his current position.While some of his twitter stuff is effective, I continually wish he would leave the junior high stuff behind.
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. . . I have a hard time having any sympathy for the stance of millionaire SJW one percenters that the NFL also says, "...have great influence in our society".. . .
Sports figures DO have a HUGE and lasting influence on our society - after all, without the sleazy antics of current sport stars, what kind of questions would be asked in sports trivia games circa 2040?
In any case, the owners and the commish by their reaction have shown they deserve no more respect than the unpatriotic players who dishonor this country while on the clock.
<expletive> all of them.
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I read that the NFL had a game in London and out of the article came this gem:
The players then stood up for “God Save the Queen,” the British anthem.
http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2017/09/24/ravens-jaguars-players-kneel-during-national-anthem-after-trumps-attacks-on-nfl.html
That right there tells me they aren't really protesting oppression or injustice. They are protesting because it is fashionable or they are showboating. If you want to protest oppression British soil would be a good place to start.
bob
Of course it could also mean their understanding of history only goes back 150 years or so. ;)
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I read that the NFL had a game in London and out of the article came this gem:
http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2017/09/24/ravens-jaguars-players-kneel-during-national-anthem-after-trumps-attacks-on-nfl.html
That right there tells me they aren't really protesting oppression or injustice. They are protesting because it is fashionable or they are showboating. If you want to protest oppression British soil would be a good place to start.
bob
Of course it could also mean their understanding of history only goes back 150 years or so. ;)
Maybe they just watched this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSnJSUU_7q0
Most likely, they're just typical Leftists. They believe America invented slavery, racism, and every other form of bigotry and oppression. And their understanding of history goes back to about 2001, if that far.
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Of course it could also mean their understanding of history only goes back 150 15 years or so. ;)
FIFY
Do you think any of them has any idea what was going on, in the U.S. or elsewhere, in 1867?
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I also hopes Nascar does it, be the final nail in that coffin.
I guess NASCAR heard you: http://thehill.com/homenews/news/352164-nascar-owners-say-they-wouldnt-tolerate-national-anthem-protests-at-races
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Already "boycotting" through indifference. The most terrifying thing for the government, media, or advertising (which is what Big Sports is) is to be unneeded and ignored, so I ignore mightily. Disappointed I even had to hear about it on APS; interferes with my ignoring. Does anyone know of any good recipes for pemmican?
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https://amgreatness.com/2017/09/23/kaepernick-and-curry-pop-the-sports-bubble/
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https://amgreatness.com/2017/09/23/kaepernick-and-curry-pop-the-sports-bubble/
Precisely. NFL Commissioner Goodell said Trump has created divisiveness. Sorry, Commish -- Trump called it out, he didn't create it. Obama and Black Lives Matter created it, Kaepernick brought it to the NFL, and look where it got him.
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Precisely. NFL Commissioner Goodell said Trump has created divisiveness. Sorry, Commish -- Trump called it out, he didn't create it. Obama and Black Lives Matter created it, Kaepernick brought it to the NFL, and look where it got him.
This a whole bunch. And don't forget ESPN politicizing everything for the past few years.
Whether he's doing that or not, I would argue these players don't know their audience. The kind of people sympathetic to shows of "resistance" like this are in general not sports fans, while I would guess a majority of sports fans are "USA fans". Barring perhaps some segment of none-white sports fans (but I would argue certainly not all) they are simply alienating most of their base while appealing to people who never watch sports. Hence the half filled stadiums.
The tinfoil-clad side of my head says that the Left has politicized sports in an attempt to reach those "non-whites" that aren't tuning in to politics from the usual channels.
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This a whole bunch. And don't forget ESPN politicizing everything for the past few years.
The tinfoil-clad side of my head says that the Left has politicized sports in an attempt to reach those "non-whites" that aren't tuning in to politics from the usual channels.
That does sort of go along with opinions of liberals who blame defeat on not getting their message out. Or assuming all the bad countries are bad because the "right" people haven't talked to them yet. However, I wonder how many of the media types just assume everyone that matters agrees with them. Or they are bucking for a news TV gig.
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Pete Rozelle would not have put up with it. (Anyone remember what he did to Walter Payton and Jim McMahon for wearing "unauthorized" gear...namely headbands??)
Anywho, Kapernick was the perfect storm. His antics would not have been tolerated in Pittsburgh, or Chicago, or Green Bay, or Dallas to name a few. Only in San Francisco would he and his "Protest" be allowed to happen. And like a cancer it has spread. And the NFL ("Not For Long), doesn't get it. They don't understand that their fan base isn't the guys in the skyboxes, but the guys that watch at home every Sunday, wearing NFL licensed jerseys with hundreds if not thousands of dollars in other NFL licensed merchandise. Lots of both Blue and White collar guys who can maybe afford a ticket or two every year to go see a game. But guys who love their country, imperfect as it may be.
They already get enough politics and diverseness, in the news, in the movies, and even at work. Come the weekend, they want to put put on the jersey of their favorite team, get together with their buds, drink some beers, and chow down while watching the game. Then comes along this multi-millionaire who says that the country they know and love is "bad". They just want to be entertained for a couple hours and leave all the politics and bushwa behind.
So, just like Hollyweird's box office receipts have tanked since they've gone full Trump Acceptance Rejection Derangement Syndrome (TARDS), so too has the NFL's. Viewership was down 11% last year. It's down a further 14% this year. Seats, in not just San Fran/Santa Clara and LA are going unsold, but in other cities as well. Even on the Secondary Markets. Especially in those cities that have allowed players to kneel.
The NFL thought it was above the fray and nothing could topple their empire... Well, it looks like there was a Trojan Horse. And like a cancer, once it wasn't stopped and allowed to spread, it's all over for the NFL. They continue to alienate their fan base and it's too late to do anything to prevent it.
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The WSJ seems to agree: https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-politicization-of-everything-1506291118
Another article, yesterday, said Kaepernick had burst the NFL bubble. Another apt comparison.
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In an unscientific poll of posts that hit my FB wall, it's running pretty much everyone, but one, boycotting/not watching the NFL. My veteran friends were not a surprise. However, many of my other friends (Including what could be called Die-Hard fans of the Steelers, Packers, Bears, Colts, and Patriots) have all sworn off the NFL. Several of them I was truly surprised by, as this time of year there posts are all Packer Green, Patriot Blue, or Yellow and Black. I was shocked that the Rooney's in Pittsburgh allowed the team to stay in the locker room during the anthem.
The backlash against the NFL is happening, and they don't know what's going to hit them...
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In an unscientific poll of posts that hit my FB wall, it's running pretty much everyone, but one, boycotting/not watching the NFL. My veteran friends were not a surprise. However, many of my other friends (Including what could be called Die-Hard fans of the Steelers, Packers, Bears, Colts, and Patriots) have all sworn off the NFL. Several of them I was truly surprised as this time of year there posts are all Packer Green, Patriot Blue, or Yellow and Black. I was shocked that the Rooney's in Pittsburgh allowed the team to stay in the locker room during the anthem.
The backlash against the NFL is happening, and they don't know what's going to hit them...
I'm reminded of all those comments we've made about people not caring about their rights being taken away, or other political issues, as long as no one messes with their sportsball. Have we reached that point?
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A fellow from another forum mentioned on my Facebook feed that to get into public arguments or public discussions about the Stupid that is going on with respect to the anthem is making you part of the Useful Idiot cadre; albeit the other side, but still contributing to the division. His implied meaning, and I agree, is to quietly go about your business and rather than saying anything rather do things. I agree. It's hard not to be snarky on Facebook, but I'm working on it.
Personally, I have little use for professional athletes. They've been coddled and praised and elevated to minor godhood since Jr. high. They've been getting away with dreck since being around 12 years old. Most of them have the intellectual acuity of a rock. There are exceptions, of course, but I would bet they are in the minority. I throw in TV/movie "celebrities" as well. They are as focused in their fame as much as athletes and historically they have proven to have the morals of monkey and the intellect of snake grass. So, I'm withdrawing from arguing with dolts who think they are being patriots by supporting things that have been inflamed by the leftist elements who have been laying the groundwork for this since the late 60's.
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It seems they are already spinning from the backlash. On the teevee right now there's an interview with a coach or something where he's saying "It's not about protesting the flag, it's about protesting Trump". Okay then - there's what - two hours to a football match? Then protest Trump anywhere on either side of the anthem.
I also just read how the coach of the team where the Army Ranger broke ranks was saying how bad it was that he "was not respectful to our football team".
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For awhile Kapernick & crew were getting exactly what they wanted by protesting during the anthem - people to take notice. If they did it during a different time as I've seen suggested, people wouldn't be upset, it would be ignored and that kind of defeats their purpose. Personally I'm not offended by some stranger on TV kneeling during the anthem, and it's a hell of a lot better form of 'protest' than burning things down and rioting. If it bothers people then they can (and should) not watch and eventually that will get through to the NFL, the networks, or the owners.
Trump has rather effectively inserted himself into the issue, becoming the center of attention and amplifying the "controversy". He'll almost certainly benefit from it politically in addition to feeding his attention addiction. The NFL seems to have stupidly accepted his framing and now it's them vs Trump? Dumb. I like watching football, I will continue to do so when I have some free time but I think it's in a decline that can't be stopped. If nothing else kills it, the concussion issue probably will.
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For awhile Kapernick & crew were getting exactly what they wanted by protesting during the anthem - people to take notice. If they did it during a different time as I've seen suggested, people wouldn't be upset, it would be ignored and that kind of defeats their purpose. Personally I'm not offended by some stranger on TV kneeling during the anthem, and it's a hell of a lot better form of 'protest' than burning things down and rioting. If it bothers people then they can (and should) not watch and eventually that will get through to the NFL, the networks, or the owners.
Trump has rather effectively inserted himself into the issue, becoming the center of attention and amplifying the "controversy". He'll almost certainly benefit from it politically in addition to feeding his attention addiction. The NFL seems to have stupidly accepted his framing and now it's them vs Trump? Dumb. I like watching football, I will continue to do so when I have some free time but I think it's in a decline that can't be stopped. If nothing else kills it, the concussion issue probably will.
This is another example of Trump's superior instincts/thinking that won him the election.
How do you choose to put yourself AGAINST the national anthem? In what way can you frame this so that it comes out looking like a winner for you?
The left is completely unhinged and Trump is playing them every single day. I'm absolutely astounded they can be this dumb. (I mean, I know they are incapable of introspection, but to be this unaware? Wow.)
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This is a good take on the situation:
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21472/trump-vs-nfl-6-things-you-need-know-about-ben-shapiro
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This is a good take on the situation:
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21472/trump-vs-nfl-6-things-you-need-know-about-ben-shapiro
Agree.
He highlighted a lot of valid points regarding both sides. Especially with the abortion and religion issues. The "right" really needs to be careful regarding hypocrisy. I also agree with him that the left will gain in their central base of EBT holders, SJWs, and one percenters, but lose a lot of flyover dems, likely in battleground states, either to R votes or staying home.
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I also just read how the coach of the team where the Army Ranger broke ranks was saying how bad it was that he "was not respectful to our football team".
I saw that an laughed... The coach forgot who was being disrespectful to whom first....
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And the Neil Degrasse Tyson POV on it. How did this guy ever get a degree?
https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2017/09/25/like-the-porno-universe-neil-degrasse-tyson-claims-kneeling-is-a-good-thing-in-got-hilarity-ensues/
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The Steelers' head coach Mike Tomlin may have found the magic button. Fans will generally tolerate a team even when ticked off by a few protesting players. The separation is subtle but significant. When a team's leader orders the protest the dynamic shifts to an all-inclusive mindset. Now, rather than being pissed at specific players but only miffed at the organization, fans are directing 100% of their ire at the organization as a whole. This is reflected in a lot of the comments and feedback I'm seeing. People are no longer singling out players for tongue lashing. They're putting the entire organization under direct scrutiny and are being neither shy nor diplomatic about it. I'm surprised the Steelers' Facebook page hasn't been locked down considering it's beginning to smoke.
The overwhelming majority of football fans are solidly blue collar 'Muricans so I can easily see this being a tipping point. I won't be the least bit surprise if (or more likely, when) game ratings begin directly reflecting fans tuning in to teams for mirroring personal patriotism rather than watching teams for long-time fanbase reasons.
Brad
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(https://scontent-ort2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/21768088_1638224686224213_4879302981214212980_n.jpg?oh=49f99cc2b6c5adcc3f5a3e39f1f6740d&oe=5A3FE3D3)
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The Steelers' head coach Mike Tomlin may have found the magic button. Fans will tolerate a team in general even when they are ticked at a few protesting players. The separation is subtle but significant. When the team leader orders the protest the dynamic shifts to an all-inclusive mindset. Now, rather than being pissed at specific players but only miffed at the organization, fans are directing 100% of their ire at the organization as a whole. This is reflected in a lot of the comments and feedback I'm seeing. People are no longer singling out players for tongue lashing. They're putting the entire organization under direct scrutiny and are being neither shy nor diplomatic about it. I'm surprised the Steelers' Facebook page hasn't been locked down considering it's beginning to smoke.
The overwhelming majority of football fans are solidly blue collar 'Muricans so I can easily see this being a tipping point. I won't be the least bit surprise if (or more likely, when) game ratings begin directly reflecting fans tuning in to teams for mirroring personal patriotism rather than watching teams for long-time fanbase reasons.
Brad
I was a Steelers fan back in the Chuck Noll/Terry Bradshaw days. I would love to hear what Rocky Bleier has to say about this. Anyways, I went and took a gander at their FB page. Looks like it's running about 95+% against Tomlin and the team. Nice job of pissing off your customer base. They forgot who "really" signs their paychecks...(Hint: It's not Art Rooney or his son). My prediction is that they double down on the stupid.
Next Sunday will be interesting to read about how many empty seats there will be at the games... #NotForLong
[popcorn] [popcorn] [popcorn] [popcorn] [popcorn]
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I just love how people are talking about this like it's something new.
1968 called...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Olympics_Black_Power_salute
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Dana Loesch nails it:
https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2017/09/25/straight-boom-dana-loesch-drops-a-big-rights-reality-check-on-the-nfl-players-union/
And a cautionary example for the NFL. But it may be too late...
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21480/update-two-years-after-embracing-racial-protests-james-barrett?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social&utm_content=062316-news&utm_campaign=dwbrand
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Old, but seemed appropriate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5P_GqS30xg
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I just love how people are talking about this like it's something new.
1968 called...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Olympics_Black_Power_salute
Since you've drawn the comparison, what real or imagined injustices, abuses, or oppresions are each set of athletes protesting? What repercussions did they face for their activism?
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There's just never any doubt that Mattis is The Man. Short and to the point (translation: get your dumb ass away from me):
https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2017/09/25/daaaamn-general-mad-dog-mattis-shuts-down-journo-asking-him-for-nfl-statement/
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I also just read how the coach of the team where the Army Ranger broke ranks was saying how bad it was that he "was not respectful to our football team".
I was just skimming FB a bit ago and I believe I saw an article that said that guys jersey has apparently has been flying off the shelves since he refused to kneel with the rest of the team.
The way I see it is this. If they want to make a statement, they should have probably figured out a statement that didn't insult and offend a majority of their fan base. From what I'm seeing from the FB sportzing balls fans, nobody gives a flying *expletive deleted*ck about what the statement is. All they see is disrespect for the country, the flag and veterans.
It's the same as all the other "protests" happening in the past few years. These idiots are just alienating the people they should be reaching out to if they actually wanted to fix something. Which means they must not want to fix anything, instead they just want to have a temper tantrum.
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I was just skimming FB a bit ago and I believe I saw an article that said that guys jersey has apparently has been flying off the shelves since he refused to kneel with the rest of the team.
The way I see it is this. If they want to make a statement, they should have probably figured out a statement that didn't insult and offend a majority of their fan base. From what I'm seeing from the FB sportzing balls fans, nobody gives a flying *expletive deleted*ck about what the statement is. All they see is disrespect for the country, the flag and veterans.
It's the same as all the other "protests" happening in the past few years. These idiots are just alienating the people they should be reaching out to if they actually wanted to fix something. Which means they must not want to fix anything, instead they just want to have a temper tantrum.
Who y'all talkin' about? ???
Nevermind. Figured it out. Alejandro Villanueva
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http://thefederalist.com/2017/09/25/nfl-protests-are-the-dead-end-of-resistance-culture/
To give you an idea of how far the Resistance has disappeared up its own backside, several prominent left-leaning figures are now suggesting that “The kneel will now become a sign of opposition to Trump.” But kneeling, of course, is an ancient sign of submission, not resistance. So you get suggestions like this, and I honestly can’t tell whether it was meant ironically or not.
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Aw man...
Villanueva apologized. I'm guessing his shirt sales will be declining.
https://twitchy.com/sd-3133/2017/09/25/my-fault-only-alejandro-villanueva-apologizes-for-throwing-steelers-under-the-bus/
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Aw man...
Villanueva apologized. I'm guessing his shirt sales will be declining.
https://twitchy.com/sd-3133/2017/09/25/my-fault-only-alejandro-villanueva-apologizes-for-throwing-steelers-under-the-bus/
Maybe, maybe not. I wouldn't be surprised if there are a lot who think he got bullied into that apology and end up supporting him even more.
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Isn't he supposed to be a Ranger and a vet? And they bullied him?
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Maybe, maybe not. I wouldn't be surprised if there are a lot who think he got bullied into that apology and end up supporting him even more.
I don't support him more, but I have no doubt that he's been taking a lot of heat in the locker room. He can claim it was a screw-up, and that his teammates would have been there with him if not for coincidence -- but we all know that's a lie. He wasn't just lounging around out there -- he was standing at attention, with his right hand over his heart, every inch the Army Ranger. So good for him, and to hell with the rest of the team.
The whole idea of staying in the locker room (or in the tunnel) to "avoid the controversy" is bullshit. The league rules say all players shall stand on the sidelines during the playing of the national anthem. Whether you're taking a knee on the field or hiding out in the locker room, it's still a violation of the league's rules, and it's still disrespectful of the flag and the anthem.
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I don't support him more, but I have no doubt that he's been taking a lot of heat in the locker room. He can claim it was a screw-up, and that his teammates would have been there with him if not for coincidence -- but we all know that's a lie. He wasn't just lounging around out there -- he was standing at attention, with his right hand over his heart, every inch the Army Ranger. So good for him, and to hell with the rest of the team.
The whole idea of staying in the locker room (or in the tunnel) to "avoid the controversy" is bullshit. The league rules say all players shall stand on the sidelines during the playing of the national anthem. Whether you're taking a knee on the field or hiding out in the locker room, it's still a violation of the league's rules, and it's still disrespectful of the flag and the anthem.
when did those rules start?
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I don't support him more, but I have no doubt that he's been taking a lot of heat in the locker room. He can claim it was a screw-up, and that his teammates would have been there with him if not for coincidence -- but we all know that's a lie. He wasn't just lounging around out there -- he was standing at attention, with his right hand over his heart, every inch the Army Ranger. So good for him, and to hell with the rest of the team.
The whole idea of staying in the locker room (or in the tunnel) to "avoid the controversy" is bullshit. The league rules say all players shall stand on the sidelines during the playing of the national anthem. Whether you're taking a knee on the field or hiding out in the locker room, it's still a violation of the league's rules, and it's still disrespectful of the flag and the anthem.
IDK. I kind of applaud the ones who are avoiding it and don't want to get involved. They are football players. They are there to play football, not engage in political statements of any kind.
And if they go out on the field during the anthem, they end up embroiled in the whole mess, regardless of their personal views on the subject. They stand and they're screwed by the rest of the team, the media and the big wigs at the NFL. They kneel and they're screwed by everyone else. There is just no middle ground. Even if whatshisface had said "Look, I was an Army Ranger. I have a personal stake in standing for the National Anthem that has nothing to do with football or politics" he'd still have been pilloried by the Left and by his team. Because none of them care about anything but their narrative.
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IDK. I kind of applaud the ones who are avoiding it and don't want to get involved. They are football players. They are there to play football, not engage in political statements of any kind.
And if they go out on the field during the anthem, they end up embroiled in the whole mess, regardless of their personal views on the subject. They stand and they're screwed by the rest of the team, the media and the big wigs at the NFL. They kneel and they're screwed by everyone else. There is just no middle ground. Even if whatshisface had said "Look, I was an Army Ranger. I have a personal stake in standing for the National Anthem that has nothing to do with football or politics" he'd still have been pilloried by the Left and by his team. Because none of them care about anything but their narrative.
Even by avoiding it you are making a statement.
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Even by avoiding it you are making a statement.
I think "I don't want to touch this subject with a fifty foot pole. Please, leave me out of it." is a perfectly valid statement to make.
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The league rules say all players shall stand on the sidelines during the playing of the national anthem. Whether you're taking a knee on the field or hiding out in the locker room, it's still a violation of the league's rules, and it's still disrespectful of the flag and the anthem.
Its not the NFL league rules. It's actually in the NFL Game Operation Manual.
"The National Anthem must be played prior to every NFL game, and all players must be on the sideline for the National Anthem.
During the National Anthem, players on the field and bench area should stand at attention, face the flag, hold helmets in their left hand, and refrain from talking. The home team should ensure that the American flag is in good condition. It should be pointed out to players and coaches that we continue to be judged by the public in this area of respect for the flag and our country. Failure to be on the field by the start of the National Anthem may result in discipline, such as fines, suspensions, and/or the forfeiture of draft choice(s) for violations of the above, including first offenses."
It's important to note the use of the word "may" here. The NFL is not considering punishing fines on players or teams who choose to kneel or stay in the locker room during the national anthem, the spokesperson says.
The bold part is where the hypocrisy in the NFL is. They have chosen not to discipline.
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So I just saw a photo of some old white dude "kneeing" with the entire Cowboys line-up (I think it was the owner of the team), and it occurs to me that the "the knee" has become the furthest thing from edgy, or brave, or anything it may have been called a few months ago. Now that it is apparently the rule in the NFL, and not the exception, is the NFL just going to keep doing this, game after game? What is their exit strategy? Are they waiting for Trump to be impeached, or what?
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The biggest issue isn't if they kneel, stand on their tip-toes, or any other form of "protest", what has anyone of them done that has actually made a damn difference.
You can bring attention to any damn problem you want, but if you don't have a plan to help fix the problem all you are is a whiny little bitch.
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They can't even agree on what problem they're on about.
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So I just saw a photo of some old white dude "kneeing" with the entire Cowboys line-up (I think it was the owner of the team), and it occurs to me that the "the knee" has become the furthest thing from edgy, or brave, or anything it may have been called a few months ago. Now that it is apparently the rule in the NFL, and not the exception, is the NFL just going to keep doing this, game after game? What is their exit strategy? Are they waiting for Trump to be impeached, or what?
That was Jerry Jones. They knelt before the National Anthem, and then stood with linked arms during it.
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I think "I don't want to touch this subject with a fifty foot pole. Please, leave me out of it." is a perfectly valid statement to make.
And wouldn't just following federal law (the U.S. Flag Code) and the league rules [okay, the NFL Game Operation Manual] be a good way of not making a statement?
How about Tom Brady, the hypocrite? He linked arms with his teammates to show that he was with them -- but he stood on the right end of the chain, so he had his right arm free to put his hand over his heart. There's nothing like playing both sides in a controversy ...
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It's either rampant hypocrisy, or a massive cognitive disconnect. Steelers star was on the teevee this morning:
http://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2017/09/26/steelers-ramon-foster-we-didnt-ask-for-this/
“I was kind of pissed at how people reacted to it,” said Foster. “In a sense, that we didn’t ask for that. We were thrown into this by some comments outside of the business and the sport of football. To see the backlash that I’m getting from back home, from people in my hometown on something I had no idea was going to go over like this or to have to warn my kids about certain stuff that hey, if somebody says something at school you have to let me and your mom know. We didn’t ask for that, we didn’t ask for this whole situation.”
You didn't? Who did? The fans certainly didn't ask the entire Steelers team (except for Alejandro Villanuevo) to cower in the tunnel during the national anthem, so if you didn't ask for it, and the fans didn't ask for it ... then who, exactly, DID ask for it?
“For the fans that criticize us, bring it back to football. Take your political views somewhere else,” said Foster. “If you choose not to watch it, we hate to lose you but we want to play football right now. We’ll deal with everything else when we can.”
It wasn't the fans who brought politics into the stadia -- it was a bunch of players "making a statement" by disrespecting the flag and the national anthem. That's not football, Ace -- that's bringing politics into the football environment. Don't blame the fans. Blame that idiot, Kaepernick, and the other players who followed his lead.
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Blame that idiot, Kaepernick, and the other players who followed his lead.
And those that followed his lead....like you. All you had to do was stand on the sideline during the anthem. Not all that hard to do. By not doing that, you brought the backlash upon yourself and your team.
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https://twitter.com/KrisParonto/status/912530159625936896
"Average @NFL salary, 2.4 million. Average @USArmy Private salary, 35k. Tell me whose[sic] oppressed?"
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Well this is an interesting site: The Database of NFL Arrest Statistics (http://nflarrest.com/)
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Well this is an interesting site: The Database of NFL Arrest Statistics (http://nflarrest.com/)
How did the Raiders get so far down the list???? I always thought they were the hit leaders in the National Felon League. Don't pay attention for a few decades and everything changes. =|
bob
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How did the Raiders get so far down the list???? I always thought they were the hit leaders in the National Felon League. Don't pay attention for a few decades and everything changes. =|
bob
They outsourced to their fans.
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And those that followed his lead....like you. All you had to do was stand on the sideline during the anthem. Not all that hard to do. By not doing that, you brought the backlash upon yourself and your team.
The other interesting part of all this is 1) how few of these players really know what the hell they are kneeling for, and 2) how little they actually do for those causes beyond just kneeling. I heard it mentioned today that Kaepernick has never been registered to vote.
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The other interesting part of all this is 1) how few of these players really know what the hell they are kneeling for, and 2) how little they actually do for those causes beyond just kneeling. I heard it mentioned today that Kaepernick has never been registered to vote.
I wonder if he ever registered for the [non-existent] draft. Is it still a requirement for males to register when they turn 18?
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https://twitter.com/KrisParonto/status/912530159625936896
"Average @NFL salary, 2.4 million. Average @USArmy Private salary, 35k. Tell me whose[sic] oppressed?"
Neither of them ???
This seems like a really dumb argument to try to make. Lower salary = oppression. :facepalm:
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DirecTV posted a FB ad promoting NFL Sunday Ticket. After scrolling through the comments I'm guessing DirecTV wishes they'd posted an ad for something, anything, else. A fair number of respondents specifically mentioned getting a refund on the NFLST package. Anecdotal evidence suggests the number of folks dropping the package is significant. At $300 (or more) a pop that quickly translates into serious money.
Brad
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http://babylonbee.com/news/amazing-took-years-tebowing-finally-taken-nfl/ :rofl:
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Neither of them ???
This seems like a really dumb argument to try to make. Lower salary = oppression. :facepalm:
He actually didn't say that anyone was oppressed. If there's a weakness in his argument, it's that the kneelers are not, ostensibly, protesting their own, personal oppression, so their salaries aren't relevant.
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He actually didn't say that anyone was oppressed.
I thought it was implied. If not, I don't see how the Private's salary is relevant.
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I thought it was implied. If not, I don't see how the Private's salary is relevant.
He didn't imply that anyone is oppressed, either. The kneelers are the ones claiming that someone is oppressed.
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Apparently David Duchovny and Gillian Anderson of The X-Files have gotten in on the knee, https://www.cnet.com/news/x-files-gillian-anderson-david-duchovny-take-a-knee-nfl-colin-kaepernick-donald-trump/
:facepalm:
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Hey, what does it mean if we're "tea-baggers," and the Left are all on their knees? ???
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Apparently David Duchovny and Gillian Anderson of The X-Files have gotten in on the knee, https://www.cnet.com/news/x-files-gillian-anderson-david-duchovny-take-a-knee-nfl-colin-kaepernick-donald-trump/
:facepalm:
Cigarette-Smoking Man must have something on them. [tinfoil]
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Has The View taken a knee yet? Because they're the bellwether of righteousness in our society.
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Has The View taken a knee yet? Because they're the bellwether of righteousness in our society.
Or if they do, could they get back up without help?
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https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2017/09/28/its-wednesday-goober-charlie-daniels-gets-dragged-over-thursday-night-football-tweet/
:lol:
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https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2017/09/28/its-wednesday-goober-charlie-daniels-gets-dragged-over-thursday-night-football-tweet/
:lol:
Eh, that happens when you get old. I ended up getting my dad one of those "day of the week" clocks. Frankly, since I've retired, I don't always keep track of days either and could use one of those myself. :laugh:
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You could use one of what things?
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You could use one of what things?
See what happens when you get old?
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My dad could only tell that it was the weekend because the programs on Fox News "sucked".
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
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https://twitter.com/RyanAFournier/status/913470494061600769
BREAKING NEWS: The Chicago Police Dept has replaced all sirens with the National Anthem, to force suspects to stop running and take a knee.
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https://twitter.com/RyanAFournier/status/913470494061600769
:rofl:
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BREAKING NEWS: The Chicago Police Dept has replaced all sirens with the National Anthem, to force suspects to stop running and take a knee.
Heh. I had the same thought, since the kill-whitey protests are still going on around here. If I start singing the anthem, will they all take a knee? If I start with a verse they've never heard before, will they even know it's the anthem?
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Heh. I had the same thought, since the kill-whitey protests are still going on around here. If I start singing the anthem, will they all take a knee? If I start with a verse they've never heard before, will they even know it's the anthem?
You mean the missing fourth verse?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0fQd858cRc
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You mean the missing fourth verse?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0fQd858cRc
That is the one I had in mind, yes. It's one of the three verses we sing at church. (And no, we don't sing the "slave" one.)
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That is the one I had in mind, yes. It's one of the three verses we sing at church. (And no, we don't sing the "slave" one.)
That complaint really irks me. The verse isn't talking about black slaves.
Apparently, anytime anyone anywhere mentions the word "slave" it means black people. Without exception.
Take Britney Spears to the racist jail.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk
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At my age it doesn't matter what day of the week it is. I just always call each day Friday so we can go out to dinner and have cocktails. Works for me.
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Eh, that happens when you get old. I ended up getting my dad one of those "day of the week" clocks. Frankly, since I've retired, I don't always keep track of days either and could use one of those myself. :laugh:
I work nights. My "day" is the previous calendar date for 6 hours of my shift and I'm working 2 days ahead. I'm never really sure what day it is.
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I have a new anti-hero.
I mostly lost all interest in professional football (along with all other professional sports) at least 20 years ago, but from what little contact I've been unable to avoid I thought very highly of Aaron Rodgers of the Packers. He seemed to be the kind of stand-up athlete a kid could look up to, like the way we though our heroes were (whether or not it was true) back when I was a kid.
Until tonight.
https://www.sbnation.com/2017/9/28/16381646/packers-fans-linking-arms-national-anthem
Earlier in the week, Aaron Rodgers made a request that fans join the team.
"This is about equality," Rodgers said Tuesday. "This is about unity and love and growing together as a society and starting a conversation around something that may be a little bit uncomfortable for people.
“But we've got to come together and talk about these things and grow as a community, as a connected group of individuals in our society, and we're going to continue to show love and unity, and this week we're going to ask the fans to join in as well and come together and show people that we can be connected and we can grow together."
How about the team remembering that it's the fans, ultimately, who pay their outrageous salaries. So how about the team joining the fans, and respecting the flag and the national anthem? You don't promote unity by engaging in divisive behavior. And for the black players, especially, who are promting this crap: If you want to do something about what you perceive as unfair treatment of black people by the police, how about not acting like thugs when you're off the football field? How about setting good examples for young men (and women) of color so they can learn that they don't have to be thugs to be "cool," and maybe if you can inspire them to act like decent human beings they won't have to worry about being hassled by "the man."
I am now officially out of heroes.
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Kapernik (sp? who cares?), like Black Lives Matter before him, chose a most divisive way to highlight a cause that should have united us. Instead of calling out police for real abuses (https://www.aclu.org/issues/criminal-law-reform/reforming-police-practices/asset-forfeiture-abuse), against people of all ethnicities, they chose to make it a black problem, and an anti-white grievance. Instead of pointing to examples of not only blacks, but also whites (http://www.dailywire.com/news/7274/cops-shoot-white-guy-fresno-nobody-pays-attention-hank-berrien), Asians (https://www.rawstory.com/2012/05/student-abandoned-in-dea-holding-cell-drank-own-urine-to-survive/), and even white Hispanics (http://www.investors.com/politics/editorials/evidence-emerging-zimmerman-railroaded-under-political-pressure/) that had been mistreated by law enforcement; they chose to push the false narrative that police are tools of white supremacy, and that it is white people who de-value black people. Obviously, it is overwhelmingly black people that tend to place a low value on the lives of black people. Typically, they do this by committing violence against other black people (even if you don't include abortion). Occasionally, they do it by bringing fists to a gun (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Trayvon_Martin) fight that they started (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shooting_of_Michael_Brown). Instead of making poor police work, or poorly-crafted laws, the enemy; they chose to pit "black lives" against white people, minority-owned businesses, a non-racist Hispanic (and there are signs that George Zimmerman is among those who've now been pushed into anti-black racism by BLM, and its fellow travelers), all police, regardless of their job performance, and now American patriotism, and all things associated with patriotism.
Oh, and here's another interesting take on things.
http://www.dailywire.com/news/21723/how-trump-defeated-nfl-nba-and-media-ben-shapiro
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Neither of them ???
This seems like a really dumb argument to try to make. Lower salary = oppression. :facepalm:
One could make the argument that the lower salary leaves one open to oppression by an employer; assuming neither spends anything, after 4 years, the average NFL player will have earned $10M, while the private will have $140k total: the private could live well for a year before having to go back to work, while the NFL player could retire and pull $140k/yr out from under his mattress for over 70 years.
The private is also highly unlikely to "retire" his way into a pile of celebrity appearances and product endorsements before he gets his first gray hair.
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Maybe we should all start singing the Marine Corps hymn in public. Talk about imperialism and whitey oppressing the natives, hell, we sing about it! Get the protests started, then sit back and watch former Marines vs. snowflakes championship bout scheduled for twelve rounds, not expected to go the distance.
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One could make the argument that the lower salary leaves one open to oppression by an employer; assuming neither spends anything, after 4 years, the average NFL player will have earned $10M, while the private will have $140k total: the private could live well for a year before having to go back to work, while the NFL player could retire and pull $140k/yr out from under his mattress for over 70 years.
The private is also highly unlikely to "retire" his way into a pile of celebrity appearances and product endorsements before he gets his first gray hair.
Also, let's start protesting the relatively low pay of linemen and other journeyman footballing positions vs the multi-million contracts for the star skill players. Might make football more interesting as a bunch of blocks get "accidentally" missed.
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Might make football more interesting as a bunch of blocks get "accidentally" missed.
Supposedly, the Raiders' offensive line did just that last weekend, because their quarterback would not take a knee during the National Anthem.
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http://www.dailywire.com/news/21744/heather-mac-donald-slams-nfl-kneeling-narrative-frank-camp
Oh no she didn't.
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Supposedly, the Raiders' offensive line did just that last weekend, because their quarterback would not take a knee during the National Anthem.
I think that is why Aaron Rodgers and Tom Brady were running their suck in support. Abject fear of linebackers.
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https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2017/09/30/lol-espn-zinger-spotted-at-college-gameday-needs-to-be-on-a-billboard/
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Some people don't get it.
http://dailycaller.com/2017/09/30/high-school-football-players-kicked-off-team-for-protesting-during-anthem/
The take the knee madness has infected a high school football team in Texas -- a Christian high school team, in fact. After the coach told his players not to do so, one of his players took a knee and another raised a fist in a black power salute. The coach (who is a pastor and a former Marine) booted the two players from the team. The coach said, "They chose to do that and they had to pay for the consequences.”
Sounds reasonable.
The mother of one of the two former football players (note that her last name isn't the same as either of her son's hyphenated last names) then said:
Rhonda Brady, Ingram-Lewis’ mother, was angry with the coach’s reaction.
“I don’t want them back on the team,” said Brady. “A man with integrity and morals and ethics and who truly lives by that wouldn’t have done anything like that….For [the coach] to do what he did, that really spoke volumes and I don’t want my kids or my nephew to be around a man with no integrity.”
I don't think Ms. Brady understands what integrity, morals, and ethics mean ... Maybe her son will get a clue.
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It's the new age of tribalism; in this case, writ small. Instead of seeing coaches or teachers as fellows in your community, whom you entrust to help you raise your children, you see them as accessories for your children. And they'd better treat your little snowflake like the princeling he is, because of course your kid could never be wrong.
I'm not one of those social conservatives that frets about rampant individualism, and loss of community, but there are times...
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President Trump suggests that fans boycott the NFL until players stop disrespecting the U.S.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/24/us/politics/trump-calls-for-boycott-if-nfl-doesnt-crack-down-on-anthem-protests.html
In response, more players take the knee, and now baseball players are getting in on the action. Unfortunately, I don't watch television and I couldn't afford a ticket to an NFL game even if I wanted to go to one (which I don't), so I can't join the boycott any more than I already have. I'm curious how the rest of y'all feel.
I get that players have a right to their opinions. I even get that they have a right to use their fame to promote their opinions. I don't accept that disrespecting the flag that hundreds of thousands of men (and some women) have died for is in any way an appropriate expression of their opinions. Plus -- these players make a big deal over their "right" to violate federal law (the Flag Code), yet they don't seem to think that the President has a right to suggest that the fans exercise their right to not buy tickets to the games.
My opinion?
1) The opinions of football players mean *expletive deleted*it to me. Go out and hit each other, it's what we're paying you for.
2) Mouthbreathing screeching from facebook by people who talk, text, and sit on their asses at home during the national anthem...means equally nothing to me. I don't care if they're boycotting football.
3) Trump should shut his yap. He's got *expletive deleted*it to get done, we've got real problems and real crisis-es that need to be solved.
4) I'll continue to watch football whenever I feel like it and anyone that assigns any kind of ulterior motives to me can kiss it.
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I'm not one of those social conservatives that frets about rampant individualism, and loss of community, but there are times...
It's much like the First Amendment and freedom of religion.
Economic Conservatives, Libertarians, individualists will all freely agree that there's nothing wrong with voluntary collective action to promote community values and cohesion, merely that it must not come from a place of government coercion. Economic, personal, and cultural coercion (within reason, namely that it doesn't interfere in freedom of association between third parties,) is all fair game.
Muddies the thing for public schools a bit, but generally speaking, whether it's corporate/economic pressures from the fans and the NFL pushing at the players, or a school kid's participation in optional, elective, extra-curricular sports, that's not "censorship".
And I'd say these kinds of things always work better when they come from a genuine place where they arise as an emergent property of the culture at large, and not imposed by the state. So I wouldn't feel worried or bad over advocating "conservative" social values especially as it pertains to community and public life, just so long as nobody's saying: "There oughtta be a law.."
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It's much like the First Amendment and freedom of religion.
Economic Conservatives, Libertarians, individualists will all freely agree that there's nothing wrong with voluntary collective action to promote community values and cohesion, merely that it must not come from a place of government coercion. Economic, personal, and cultural coercion (within reason, namely that it doesn't interfere in freedom of association between third parties,) is all fair game.
Muddies the thing for public schools a bit, but generally speaking, whether it's corporate/economic pressures from the fans and the NFL pushing at the players, or a school kid's participation in optional, elective, extra-curricular sports, that's not "censorship".
And I'd say these kinds of things always work better when they come from a genuine place where they arise as an emergent property of the culture at large, and not imposed by the state. So I wouldn't feel worried or bad over advocating "conservative" social values especially as it pertains to community and public life, just so long as nobody's saying: "There oughtta be a law.."
No, what I meant is that we don't have as much of a sense that we live in a community of people that are like us, and the teachers in the school are a part of the community, helping us raise our children. There's more of a sense that we're on our own, and we have to defend our family against the impersonal world that doesn't care about us. So the teacher is The Man, and he's trying to mess with your tribe. So your instinct is to stick up for your tribe, instead of thinking of you, your kid, and the teacher as all being part of the same tribe.
Does that make sense?
On the other hand, I don't play well with others, and the conservative (or the leftist) angst about scary individualism usually irks me. That being said, I don't think it's "white nationalist" or "alt-right" to question whether multiculturalism is too corrosive of a sense of community.
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Annnnnnnnd ... the NFL cops out.
https://ca.reuters.com/article/canadaSportsNews/idCAKBN1CI24Y-OCASP
Goodell:
“What we don’t have is a proposal that changes our policy, we don’t have something that mandates anything. That’s clear. If that was the case I doubt the head of the NFLPA would have put a joint statement out with us.”
What does this mean? The league's established policy IS that all players should stand for the National Anthem. But it's only a policy, not a rule -- yet the policy includes provisions for sanctions against those who violate it. Goodell hasn't sanctioned anybody, and he's doing everything he can to pretend there's no issue -- while the league is hemorrhaging spectators and viewers over the players' disrespect for the flag and the anthem.
I encourage everyone to totally boycott the NFL, both live and on the boob toob. They want to send a message? Send THEM a message. (Unfortunately, I can't. I cancelled my DirecTV subscription two years ago, so I can't quit any more than I already have.)
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The liberal NFL owners are trying to play both sides because enough advertisers put their foot down and their fans are not shelling out as much money or watching broadcasts. Their billion dollar investment is threatened. What was the dominant sport in the nation a few years ago is now declining and they still don't want to do anything concrete about it. Sad.
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Annnnnnnnd ... the NFL cops out.
https://ca.reuters.com/article/canadaSportsNews/idCAKBN1CI24Y-OCASP
Goodell:
What does this mean? The league's established policy IS that all players should stand for the National Anthem. But it's only a policy, not a rule -- yet the policy includes provisions for sanctions against those who violate it. Goodell hasn't sanctioned anybody, and he's doing everything he can to pretend there's no issue -- while the league is hemorrhaging spectators and viewers over the players' disrespect for the flag and the anthem.
I encourage everyone to totally boycott the NFL, both live and on the boob toob. They want to send a message? Send THEM a message. (Unfortunately, I can't. I cancelled by DirecTV subscription two years ago, so I can't quit any more than I already have.)
I'm decades ahead of you.
I honestly cannot remember ever having sat and watch an NFL game, ever.
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End the NFL's tax exempt status ASAP.
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This weekend was the first time since I was a teenager that I didn't watch a single minute of a single game.
I literally no longer care about the NFL.
My brain finally broke when I heard some idiot describing NFL players, who are in many cases paid tens of millions of dollars, as slaves. But, only the African American players, obviously.
So, that's it. *expletive deleted*ck the NFL, *expletive deleted*ck professional football.
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I see Hillary Clinton is speaking out for the kneeling players, and wrapping it into a whole "resist" thing. I'm sure she'd agree with her "resist" philosophy if she were POTUS.
Also, side note, this "dog whistle" thing is stupid. If it were aimed at the "resistors", it would be tagged as racist. As it is, when you throw every white person between the coasts into a "dog whistle" group, that's how you get Trump term #2, just because I want to piss you off, you jackasses.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/10/16/hillary-clinton-defends-kneeling-nfl-players-says-thats-not-against-our-anthem-or-flag.html
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Ah, the infamous "dog whistle" accusation. When you want to claim someone's a racist, but you have no justification for doing so. Works every time. Well, until you use it every time.
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Ah, the infamous "dog whistle" accusation. When you want to claim someone's a racist, but you have no justification for doing so. Works every time. Well, until you use it every time.
If you can hear the whistle, you're the dog.
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Kaepernick has just confirmed that he's an idiot.
https://sports.yahoo.com/colin-kaepernicks-grievance-ends-shot-qb-playing-nfl-065652122.html
He has filed a formal grievance with the NFL, claiming that there's a conspiracy (but he left out "vast right wing") among league owners to prevent him from playing. Good luck with that. He's going to have a very hard time proving any conspiracy, when his own actions have made him such a pariah that an owner would have to be crazy to sign him. How many teams are there in the league now? 32? 32 owners each individually deciding against hiring a washed-up quarterback that fans hate doesn't equate to a conspiracy. It equates to 32 individual owners deciding on their own not to hire a toxic, washed-up quarterback.
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I see Hillary Clinton is speaking out for the kneeling players, and wrapping it into a whole "resist" thing. I'm sure she'd agree with her "resist" philosophy if she were POTUS.
Also, side note, this "dog whistle" thing is stupid. If it were aimed at the "resistors", it would be tagged as racist. As it is, when you throw every white person between the coasts into a "dog whistle" group, that's how you get Trump term #2, just because I want to piss you off, you jackasses.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/10/16/hillary-clinton-defends-kneeling-nfl-players-says-thats-not-against-our-anthem-or-flag.html
As if we needed yet another reason to be glad she's not the president.
Hillary Clinton on Sunday defended NFL players who knelt during the national anthem, saying kneeling is a “reverent” position that is not against “our anthem or our flag.”
Respect for the flag is not about reverence. The Flag Code (which is, after all, federal law) says to stand, with your hand over your heart. Kneeling is not an option. And, based on their own statements, their kneeling was NOT in any way intended to demonstrate "reverence" for the flag or the anthem.
Hillary needs to slither back into her cave.
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Hillary needs to slither back into her cave.
I'm torn between wanting her to shut her yap and go away....However, she's sucking all the oxygen out of the Democrat party...She's not letting them or (her) move beyond the loss. If she keeps it up the only one the Democrats can (and will) nominate is Hillary (Again !!) So we'll have Eisenhower v. Stevenson Part II al over again. And it will be epic because even more people will hate her and the Democrats by 2020...
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She's an albatross in a pants suit.
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based on their own statements, their kneeling was NOT in any way intended to demonstrate "reverence" for the flag or the anthem.
Not so sure about that...
After hours of careful consideration, and even a visit from Nate Boyer, a retired Green Beret and former N.F.L. player, we came to the conclusion that we should kneel, rather than sit, the next day during the anthem as a peaceful protest. We chose to kneel because it’s a respectful gesture. I remember thinking our posture was like a flag flown at half-mast to mark a tragedy.
It baffles me that our protest is still being misconstrued as disrespectful to the country, flag and military personnel. We chose it because it’s exactly the opposite.
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Not so sure about that...
Speaking as a Vietnam veteran who has actually read the Flag Code, I don't give a crap what they say their kneeling is. The fact is it's a violation of the Flag Code and it's using the flag and the National Anthem to make a political statement. Kneeling is NOT a "respectful gesture" when the written LAW says that respect for the flag shall be demonstrated by standing, with your right hand over your heart.
These clowns earn millions of dollars every year. Some of them earn millions of dollars every GAME. Instead of disrespecting the flag, why don't they reach into their pockets and take out a full-page ad in the New York Times? Why don't they join forces and hire an advertising agency or public relations firm to make their case by airing public service ads during commercial breaks? They do NOT have to disrespect the flag to make their point, they choose to do so because they're too cheap to do it another way. Trying to pretend that they don't intend to disrespect the flag when that obviously IS their intent just makes them liars and hypocrites on top of being morons.
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I'm torn between wanting her to shut her yap and go away....However, she's sucking all the oxygen out of the Democrat party...She's not letting them or (her) move beyond the loss. If she keeps it up the only one the Democrats can (and will) nominate is Hillary (Again !!) So we'll have Eisenhower v. Stevenson Part II al over again. And it will be epic because even more people will hate her and the Democrats by 2020...
(https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/600/1*EE9ddHLiwQYPEG-SrV4Zdw.jpeg)
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:facepalm:
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--AhAZtDD8--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/zzypmujoegofwxs2rukr.jpg)
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My brain finally broke when I heard some idiot describing NFL players, who are in many cases paid tens of millions of dollars, as slaves. But, only the African American players, obviously.
Didn't richyoung try to make pretty much exactly that argument here on APS a few years ago?
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Didn't richyoung try to make pretty much exactly that argument here on APS a few years ago?
Not a clue, but knowing him, very probably.
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She's an albatross in a pants suit.
Way I remember it, the albatross was a ship's good luck, 'til some idiot killed it.
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The NFL's implosion continues apace:
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2017/10/nfl-hell-several-stadiums-nearly-empty-anthem-protest-backlash-rolls-week-7-photos/
Goodell really blew it. Rather than requiring the players to stand for the anthem in accordance with pre-existing league policy, he tried to appease the militant players, with no regard for the fans who ultimately foot the bill.
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Goodell really blew it. Rather than requiring the players to stand for the anthem in accordance with pre-existing league policy, he tried to appease the militant players, with no regard for the fans who ultimately foot the bill.
Just means the fans will have more money to support local HS and college football...you know, where the players actually have some team loyalty and spirit.
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:facepalm:
(https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--AhAZtDD8--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/zzypmujoegofwxs2rukr.jpg)
Some things should be printed up like the flag.
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This weekend was the first time since I was a teenager that I didn't watch a single minute of a single game.
I literally no longer care about the NFL.
My brain finally broke when I heard some idiot describing NFL players, who are in many cases paid tens of millions of dollars, as slaves. But, only the African American players, obviously.
So, that's it. *expletive deleted*ck the NFL, *expletive deleted*ck professional football.
I was already a bit cold on the NFL since it seems to be run by a bunch of liberal idiots, but this whole business is well over that threshold for me. I could watch Texans games as none of them took a knee I think, but I find myself not watching any of the games and none of the ESPN coverage. It doesn't bother me. I was a rabid Oilers fan at one time years ago, but I never reached that point since.
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I watched a few minutes of the Dallas - 49ers game on Sunday because I was waiting for a friend to sign into his XBox so I could beat him like a drum on COD2, but that's it.
The Eagles (my former favorite team, until they picked up that dog abusing ahole bastard Michael Vick) and the Redskins played the Monday night game last night, and I could not have cared less.
One thing I have been watching, however, is the precipitous attendance decline this season.
Lots of wrangling back and forth about what the "real" cause is. Some people are quite vehement in saying that the "take a knee" controversy has nothing to do with the decline, but surveys are telling something of a different story.
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One thing I have been watching, however, is the precipitous attendance decline this season.
That's probably good news for some people. I know someone who's number is about 125,000 on the waiting list for Packers season tickets...
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When I first moved to DC the Redskins had season ticket waiting lists like that.
Now that they've sucked for the better part of two decades, no so much.
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Here's an interesting wrinkle...
https://sports.yahoo.com/maxwell-says-refused-over-kneeling-anthem-181006812--mlb.html?src=rss
White MLB player who took a knee during a game was recognized at a restaurant and the waiter refused to serve him.
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Here's an interesting wrinkle...
https://sports.yahoo.com/maxwell-says-refused-over-kneeling-anthem-181006812--mlb.html?src=rss
White MLB player who took a knee during a game was recognized at a restaurant and the waiter refused to serve him.
Bake the cake, garçon!
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The waiter is telling a much different story - says he didn't even know who the guy was.
http://www.dailywire.com/news/22774/waiter-mlb-player-bruce-maxwell-made-story-about-joseph-curl
Also, I didn't know the "victim" was claiming that being denied service for his behavior was a form of "racial profiling." :rofl:
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Hum... maybe the ballista was triggered by the barista not recognizing his fame...
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Hum... maybe the ballista was triggered by the barista not recognizing his fame...
"DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM!?"
"Since you didn't bring your ID, you're the guy not getting a beer."
<Self-righteous ball player goes to the media to talk down about those backward Alabama waiters>
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Oh for *expletive deleted*ck's sake...
The Oakland A's catcher who knelt for the anthem, and later claimed a waiter dissed him because of it?
He's been arrested on a firearms charge after allegedly pointing a gun at a female food delivery person...
http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2017/10/29/mlbs-bruce-maxwell-who-knelt-during-anthem-is-arrested-on-gun-charge.html?src=rss
This guy apparently has issues with the people who handle his food.
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This guy apparently has issues with the people who handle his food.
Heh. I'm willing to bet he's a gun control proponent as well.
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Heh. I'm willing to bet he's a gun control proponent as well.
If he wasn't I bet he is now.
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"DO YOU KNOW WHO I AM!?"
"Since you didn't bring your ID, you're the guy not getting a beer."
<Self-righteous ball player goes to the media to talk down about those backward Alabama waiters>
In fact, if I read the stories correctly he's the only one in his party who DID get a beer. His two companions didn't have valid IDs, so they were refused alcohol. They weren't refused service, they just weren't served alcohol.
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Veteran turns down award from New Orleans Saints because of their Anthem antics. The team's response?
“We will not allow Mr. Wells' decision and subsequent media appearances to distract our players and organization from continuing to honor and support our military and veterans. We, as an organization, have decided to move on from this sad and divisive discourse and focus our attention on supporting our military and veterans.”
It's all the vet's fault. He's the divisive one. ;/
http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2017/11/03/disabled-navy-vet-refuses-to-receive-award-from-saints-over-national-anthem-protests.html
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Veteran turns down award from New Orleans Saints because of their Anthem antics. The team's response?
It's all the vet's fault. He's the divisive one. ;/
http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2017/11/03/disabled-navy-vet-refuses-to-receive-award-from-saints-over-national-anthem-protests.html
That's an amazing amount of doublethink:
"We're going to honor veterans!"
<Veteran explicitly states that you are dishonoring him and can't accept your "honor">
"We won't let this divisive jerk stop us from honoring veterans!"
Yeah, you're winning this fight, morons.
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Veteran turns down award from New Orleans Saints because of their Anthem antics. The team's response?
It's all the vet's fault. He's the divisive one. ;/
http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2017/11/03/disabled-navy-vet-refuses-to-receive-award-from-saints-over-national-anthem-protests.html
:facepalm:
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As usual, the lamestream media are in complete denial.
http://www.newser.com/story/250983/papa-johns-kneeling-nfl-players-hurting-pizza-sales.html
A Bloomberg analyst says it's possible to see where Schnatter is coming from: fewer people watching football means fewer people ordering pizza or seeing ads for Papa John's, which has been the NFL's official pizza sponsor since 2010. But, as Slate notes, there's no evidence protests—either by players or offended fans—have been behind the decline in NFL viewership.
Nope, no evidence at all ... if you ignore all the quotes and statements and tweets from [former] fans who have made it perfectly clear why they're not watching NFL football this year.
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As if we needed more bovine excrement from the media: http://www.desmoinesregister.com/story/news/local/columnists/kyle-munson/2017/11/02/iowa-cheerleader-id-rather-quit-team-than-stop-taks-dilemma-quit-protesting-national-anthem-quit-tea/823437001/
After much agonizing over the decision, Parker this week quit the cheer squad. She doesn't think peaceful protest should be confined to a time slot. She wanted to stick to her convictions.
“(Fighting) social injustice, standing up for what I believe in and using my voice for others who no longer have one: These are beliefs I hold to my core,” Parker wrote in a Facebook post announcing her move. “They are what make me Alyssa. I couldn't bring myself to give that up.”
Soldiers who fought and died for that flag no longer have a voice. What about them?
What quarterback Colin Kaepernick began last year in the NFL has since spread to colleges and high schools.
Cancers typically spread if not completely excised.
Other cheerleaders and athletes who knelt have since chosen to stand as required. Many of them enrolled in BVU specifically to join a team.
There's no one right answer for everybody.
But Parker weeks ago worried that the intended message of anthem-kneeling has been obscured in a din of misdirected outrage.
...
“Everybody’s talking about the action,” he said. “Nobody’s talking about the meaning. To me, I think that’s what continually lost around the country.”
Because the action, of itself, shows flagrant disrespect for the flag and the anthem. It doesn't matter what kind of costume you try to put on the pig, it's still a pig underneath. Kneeling rather than standing at attention during the playing of the national anthem IS disrespectful ... period.
Here comes the SJW editorial:
But letting Americans of conviction kneel during the anthem in silent protest is not a knock against the military. If anything, it’s a celebration of the freedom that our men and women in uniform fight to preserve.
...
But as a freedom-loving journalist, what would offend and worry (and scare) me more is when absolutely nobody is allowed to kneel at a game.
As a "freedom loving journalist," you should be aware that freedom carries responsibility, and actions carry consequences. The players and cheerleaders ARE free to kneel -- and the schools (and NFL employers) are free to remove them from the teams as a direct consequence of their actions, which (to put it bluntly) offend and piss off the fans.
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And now for some comic relief:
http://offthewire.com/california-naacp-calling-for-racist-anti-american-move-in-nfl/
The California NAACP wants Congress to abolish the national anthem because it's racist.
But ... what's this?
The resolution was passed as a measure of support for former NFL player Colin Kaepernick who is most remarkable as the inventor of the national anthem protest started at the beginning of the 2016 NFL football season.
“We owe a lot of it to Kaepernick,” said California NAACP President Alice Huffman, according to the Sacramento Bee.
Time out! I'm pretty certain Kaepernick claims he WASN'T protesting the national anthem, he was only protesting police thuggery against blacks. However, I'm quite certain that the California NAACP has much in common with the NFL -- I'd guess the NFL owes a lot to Kaepernick, too. >:D
And talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill:
The organization justifies its criticism of the anthem because of the song’s original third verse, which was never included as the version approved by Congress as the country’s national song.
The original third verse, written by Francis Scott Key in 1814, reads, “No refuge could save the hireling and slave/From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave.”
This, the NAACP claimed, is a celebration of slavery.
But, the claim has been ridiculed by many historians who say that the words actually referred the British Navy’s practice of impressing American sailors into serving the Crown, essentially making them slaves to the British Navy.
That practice, known at the time as impressment, was one of the main causes of the War of 1812, the war that inspired the writing of the song.
But, regardless of what the original third verse meant or didn’t mean, a further point tends to debunk the “slavery” claim about the national anthem.
The version of the song that was officially enshrined as our national anthem does not even contain the purportedly offensive verse.
Sounds like the California NAACP is playing political air guitar.
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The NFL owners are apparently contemplating keeping the teams in the locker rooms during the national anthem next year.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/sports/wp/2017/11/21/nfl-owners-weighing-change-to-anthem-policy-for-next-season-if-protests-continue/?utm_term=.f7973fef22e7
What do y'all think? Is this a solution, or a cop-out?
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The NFL owners are apparently contemplating keeping the teams in the locker rooms during the national anthem next year.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/sports/wp/2017/11/21/nfl-owners-weighing-change-to-anthem-policy-for-next-season-if-protests-continue/?utm_term=.f7973fef22e7
What do y'all think? Is this a solution, or a cop-out?
Yes.
What's funny about the whole stupid debacle is I just don't get the singing of the anthem before a sporting event. At best you could say the correlation is that we're a free(ish) nation and can therefore engage in frivolities such as sport for profit.
However, the equation is then that sporting events are patriotic, which I find idiotic. Sporting events are entertainment.
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The NFL owners are apparently contemplating keeping the teams in the locker rooms during the national anthem next year.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/sports/wp/2017/11/21/nfl-owners-weighing-change-to-anthem-policy-for-next-season-if-protests-continue/?utm_term=.f7973fef22e7
What do y'all think? Is this a solution, or a cop-out?
It's a cop-out. If they'd have done it BEFORE this became an issue, it never would have become an issue.
Doing it now, as a "compromise" means everyone who is already boycotting will see it as further disrespect and those who are supporting the morons kneeling will claim it's "SILENCING THEIR FREE SPEECH".
NFL is going to take significant hits and this compromise won't fix it. Apparently they don't understand their purpose: Sports are an ESCAPE. The Social Justice Wankers insist that "You will be made to care!" and will not allow anything to be a-political.
It will not be enough. Their slide will continue. Personally, I'm going to try following hockey more.
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Personally, I'm going to try following hockey more.
I'm going to try following high stakes ping pong table tennis.
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What's funny about the whole stupid debacle is I just don't get the singing of the anthem before a sporting event. At best you could say the correlation is that we're a free(ish) nation and can therefore engage in frivolities such as sport for profit.
Around here, the anthem, usually the Pledge of Allegiance, sometimes the Texas Pledge, and often a prayer are just part of starting any large gathering. Even quite a few outdoor concerts start that way.
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A friend from college days sent me a link to an excellent op-ed ... by a black woman:
https://barbwire.com/2017/10/01/enough-victimhood-millionaire-athletes-lost-cause/
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"Black victims these days, for the most part, are the product of decades of Black Americans being used primarily by white progressive leftists to advance an anti-American agenda."
The struggling sounds you just heard were those of her being forcibly thrown out of the tribe.
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"Black victims these days, for the most part, are the product of decades of Black Americans being used primarily by white progressive leftists to advance an anti-American agenda."
The struggling sounds you just heard were those of her being forcibly thrown out of the tribe.
Interesting intersect to that: I just read this on Twitchy. I'd never heard of this movie, or the term "sunken place" before, but as one of the commenters at the URL mentioned, just as with what Mike quoted above, it's actually more of psychological manipulation by progressives rather than "[conservative] whitey holding me down."
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2017/11/25/jordan-peele-tweets-at-tiger-woods-now-youre-in-the-sunken-place-after-golfing-with-potus/
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"Black victims these days, for the most part, are the product of decades of Black Americans being used primarily by white progressive leftists to advance an anti-American agenda."
The struggling sounds you just heard were those of her being forcibly thrown out of the tribe.
It's a tried-and-true approach to constituency building. It generally well-known in northeastern cities, for example, that Hispanic politicians don't want their Hispanic constituents to learn English and assimilate, because if they can read English the politicritters can't control what they read, so they lose control of what is essentially a captive population. In fact, it isn't limited to Blacks and Hispanics. There's a small but significant Russian population around these parts, and there are Russian ex-pats who have lived here for 30 years and who don't speak English.
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Went to a movie a couple of weeks ago at the theatre on Ft Bliss and before the movie started they played the National Anthem. Everyone in the theatre stood up.