Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Perd Hapley on October 19, 2018, 05:07:52 PM
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https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2018/10/19/no-big-deal-just-the-migrant-caravan-breaking-down-the-guatemala-border-fence-and-entering-mexico-video-photos/
Wait, wait, wait. Hold everything. Mexico has a border fence? Mexico? Bunch of frickin' white supremacist Nazis. :mad:
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https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2018/10/19/no-big-deal-just-the-migrant-caravan-breaking-down-the-guatemala-border-fence-and-entering-mexico-video-photos/
Wait, wait, wait. Hold everything. Mexico has a border fence? Mexico? Bunch of frickin' white supremacist Nazis. :mad:
Yes they have fences/walls. Just about Every country has better border control and/or stricter immigration rules than the US.
When they get here load them on buses drive them to the nearest airport, load them on Galaxy C5s or whatever we are using these days and fly them right back.
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They're already fighting with Mexican riot police.
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Yes they have fences/walls. Just about Every country has better border control and/or stricter immigration rules than the US.
When they get here load them on buses drive them to the nearest airport, load them on Galaxy C5s or whatever we are using these days and fly them right back.
Load them in old CONEX boxes, and just unload over their country of origin with cargo chutes.
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They're already fighting with Mexican riot police.
Glorious!
There is going to be a wall, Mexico is going to pay for it, but it’s not going to be placed where most people think.
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Glorious!
There is going to be a wall, Mexico is going to pay for it, but it’s not going to be placed where most people think.
I'm to the point where a part of me thinks invading and annexing mexico would make more sense than building a wall. We could then place our wall on the southern border.
Mexico is a broken country, has been for decades, that has allowed the unfettered flow of illegal immigrants and drugs into our country.
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So do I have this right?
Mexico talks big about stopping them at their Southern border.
They break down and overwhelm the border barriers.
Mexico folds like a cheap suit and tells them, "Okay, we give up. Come in, but just keep walking to the US border".
When they reach the US border, Mexico will start yelling about how terrible the US is for not giving them sanctuary.
Did Mexico even try stuff like pepper spray, bean bags, and water cannons? The video clips I saw just shows Mexican authorities kinda standing there waiting as these people violently attack various border barriers. I mean, these people are packed together like sardines. It's not like they're spread out over miles of the border. I'm no expert, but if you have a Thermopylae situation going on and you're on the Spartan side of it, it shouldn't be that hard to deploy non-lethal deterrents and keep them going for days if need be until these knuckleheads tire out.
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I sent an e-mail to the President last night, encouraging him to deploy the Army and the Marines. The real Army and Marines, not National Guard, with live ammo and on the front line, not in the rear as "support" for the Border Patrol. This is an invasion of our country, and if we don't use the Army to repel an invasion, why do we have an Army?
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I sent an e-mail to the President last night, encouraging him to deploy the Army and the Marines. The real Army and Marines, not National Guard, with live ammo and on the front line, not in the rear as "support" for the Border Patrol. This is an invasion of our country, and if we don't use the Army to repel an invasion, why do we have an Army?
And how do you think 1000 or so dead civilians bloating in the sun will play out in the media a couple weeks before the midterms?
Don't deploy the military unless you're ready to kill people. That's what we do.
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And how do you think 1000 or so dead civilians bloating in the sun will play out in the media a couple weeks before the midterms?
Don't deploy the military unless you're ready to kill people. That's what we do.
The very timing of this invasion is suspicious with midterms a few weeks away. Its almost as if there is a much bigger game at play.
I say let them into california and then build the border fence around california
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The very timing of this invasion is suspicious with midterms a few weeks away. Its almost as if there is a much bigger game at play.
I say let them into california and then build the border fence around california
I have seen footage come out showing guys paying them cash. Someone is funding this whole thing you can be sure of it. I wouldn't be surprised if bribes were given to key officials in Mexico to let them through. I guess we will see.
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And how do you think 1000 or so dead civilians bloating in the sun will play out in the media a couple weeks before the midterms?
Don't deploy the military unless you're ready to kill people. That's what we do.
The concern I always had was military members put into a position where they had to use their weapons and then the politicians turn around and see them prosecuted.
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I don't know quite what I'd look like if I was taking my family for a thousand miles walk and hitchhike, but I bet I'd have more stuff.
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Globalists: We must reduce the populations of people in 3rd world counties.
Also the Globalists: We must allow people from overcrowded 3rd world countries free access to 1st world countries with stable populations.
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There are way too many indicators pointing to this as timed, planned, and politically motivated. I only hope it backfires as spectacularly as the Kavanaugh debacle.
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I think this is going to backfire, politically, on whoever *cough* Soros *cough* is funding this. This may actually spur, not only funding of the Border Wall, but also provide more motivation to GOP and independents to the polls on 6 Nov to vote to stop this crap. .
https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2018/10/20/we-doubt-cnn-reporter-meant-his-photos-of-migrant-caravan-to-be-a-walking-gop-ad/
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The very timing of this invasion is suspicious with midterms a few weeks away. Its almost as if there is a much bigger game at play.
I was thinking the same thing. The latest news shows them about 1000 miles from the US border. So if they walk 20 miles a day, every day, and the hurricane doesn't get them, and they are supplied with food and water (no backpacks in the photos I saw) they will arrive three or four weeks after the election. Any bets that a group big enough for a "breaking news" report on CNN will arrive the weekend before the election?
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I was thinking the same thing. The latest news shows them about 1000 miles from the US border. So if they walk 20 miles a day, every day, and the hurricane doesn't get them, and they are supplied with food and water (no backpacks in the photos I saw) they will arrive three or four weeks after the election. Any bets that a group big enough for a "breaking news" report on CNN will arrive the weekend before the election?
that's a sucker bet.
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I think this is going to backfire, politically, on whoever *cough* Soros *cough* is funding this. This may actually spur, not only funding of the Border Wall, but also provide more motivation to GOP and independents to the polls on 6 Nov to vote to stop this crap. .
https://twitchy.com/brettt-3136/2018/10/20/we-doubt-cnn-reporter-meant-his-photos-of-migrant-caravan-to-be-a-walking-gop-ad/
That is my thought.
I am not sure Trump ordering JDAM's dropped on them would be too much but it would be a bit brutal and probably violet some law. Maybe just create some craters in their path to stop the vehicle support. Make Mexico happy that way also.
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Just did a little more looking and some are on trucks and there are shelters set up now to house them at night. So it seems pretty certain that our border will be front page before Nov. 6. At the risk of being called a bleeding heart here, it's a shame that there are thousands of people who are being used to make a political point. They may indeed get in, but I think many will suffer.
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Don't deploy the military unless you're ready to kill people. That's what we do.
Political issues aside, is it wrong that I'm not morally opposed to that?
You've got thousands of organized folks moving towards the border with every intention of forcing entry. Personally, I've perfectly ok with an armed military response.
Politically it'd be a nightmare, of course. And realistically troops at the border won't be allowed to do *expletive deleted*it but put on a bit of a show of being there for "support".
Maybe I'm just a cold bastard, but I'm having a hard time finding moral issue with the prospect of these folks being met with armed force to shut them down at the border.
Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
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Political issues aside, is it wrong that I'm not morally opposed to that?
You've got thousands of organized folks moving towards the border with every intention of forcing entry. Personally, I've perfectly ok with an armed military response.
Politically it'd be a nightmare, of course. And realistically troops at the border won't be allowed to do *expletive deleted*it but put on a bit of a show of being there for "support".
Maybe I'm just a cold bastard, but I'm having a hard time finding moral issue with the prospect of these folks being met with armed force to shut them down at the border.
I agree with the above, and that's what I wrote to the President. What's the point of having an Army if we won't use it to defend our borders against in invasion by a foreign force? And that's exactly what this so-called caravan is. It's an invasion force, with the avowed intention of violating our sovereign territory by force, in violation of our laws.
The stories keep talking about women with children, and families traveling together, but look at the photographs and you don't see many women or children. There are a few, but the vast preponderance of the people are young adult males.
This is an emergency. How much hardened border wall can we put in place in the space of three weeks? Start NOW. Then plug the gaps with tanks, and ranks of riflemen.
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May be a case of Divine Intervention … ;/
It appears that the migrant caravan, which has been reported to upward of 10,000 strong, might run into some extra trouble on their march to seek American asylum. A massive hurricane (named Willa) is set to cross the path that the migrants will eventually cross.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3698839/posts?page=1
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May be a case of Divine Intervention … ;/
It appears that the migrant caravan, which has been reported to upward of 10,000 strong, might run into some extra trouble on their march to seek American asylum. A massive hurricane (named Willa) is set to cross the path that the migrants will eventually cross.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3698839/posts?page=1
Kamikaze...
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The next few days ought to go to identifying the addresses of all Democrat politicians and DNC employees. When the caravan gets to the border they should be loaded on an appropriate amount of Greyhound busses and escorted by the Marine corp in order that all of the Caravan folks can be properly dropped off at those Democrat politician and DNC employee residences. A squad of marines can be left at each residence to see that those poor folks are properly inducted into the families of the DNC employees and Democrat politicians. A double serving should go to Pelosi and Schumer.
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I don't hold out a lot of hope they will be stopped. Didn't most of the folks in the last caravan finally make it into the country once all the hoopla had died down?
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Horde of literal invaders?
Do we not have AC-130s anymore?
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http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3698839/posts?page=1
Kamikaze...
See also the Spanish Armada.
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I want them stopped by any means necessary.
I doubt that anything will be done.
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I want them stopped by any means necessary.
I doubt that anything will be done.
I agree. Turn a few of them back, news will get around, and they'll stop coming. Australia has demonstrated that it can be done.
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I agree. Turn a few of them back, news will get around, and they'll stop coming. Australia has demonstrated that it can be done.
Australia?
Who's been trying to walk to Australia?
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1. Pick them up in buses at border.
2. Take them to the nearest Airport.
3. Load them onto planes (large chartered A/C in not enough USAF Transports)
4. Fly them back to the airport in the capital city of their home country.
5. Return to the US with empty aircraft.
6. Repeat.
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1. Pick them up in buses at border.
2. Take them to the nearest Airport.
3. Load them onto planes (large chartered A/C in not enough USAF Transports)
4. Fly them back to the airport in the capital city of their home country.
5. Return to the US with empty aircraft.
6. Repeat.
I still favor dropping them in CONEX boxes attached to cargo chutes. Less chance of the native country declining to take them back.
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And, for the confirmed gang members, drug dealers, previously deported, or other criminal persuasion we could forgo the parachutes and conex boxes.
I think it's gonna get ugly.
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There is a process to apply for asylum and a process for legally entering the country.
All others should be turned away.
If some persist, refusing to follow our laws, then they should be arrested, jailed and deported once they have served their time.
Silly me, I forgot, I live in clown world where none of that happens even with the most anti illegal immigration President we’ve had in our lifetimes.
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There is a process to apply for asylum and a process for legally entering the country.
All others should be turned away.
If some persist, refusing to follow our laws, then they should be arrested, jailed and deported once they have served their time.
Silly me, I forgot, I live in clown world where none of that happens even with the most anti illegal immigration President we’ve had in our lifetimes.
I think the border patrol has their hands tied with a lot of miscellaneous laws on immigration that allow these people to play the system. Treating them as an invasion force may short circuit that but I don't know. Laws need to be changed (with Congress involved) in order to make a real change.
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I don't know how much stock we can put in the source but if it's accurate the *expletive deleted*it is gonna get real.
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2018/10/23/mexican-news-outlet-officials-say-14000-honduran-migrants-heading-to-u-s/ (https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2018/10/23/mexican-news-outlet-officials-say-14000-honduran-migrants-heading-to-u-s/)
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I think the border patrol has their hands tied with a lot of miscellaneous laws on immigration that allow these people get play the system. Treating them as an invasion force may short circuit that but I don't know. Laws need to be changed (with Congress involved) in order to make a real change.
Also the Border Patrol (through no fault of their own) are simply not capable of handling a mob this size. While I see Dogmush's point of, "don't bring the Army in unless you want us to kill and break stuff", the only way to handle a mob like this, that has already shown it will get violent, is with an overwhelming show of force.
They might not even need to do anything. Enough scary assets present might give the mob second thoughts. Seems like less people would be hurt that way than with playing paddy cake with them.
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Tear gas, water cannons, rubber bullets...
I wonder if you could rig up a fire fighter air tanker to drop tank loads of pepper spray...
http://www.boldmethod.com/blog/lists/2016/03/19-aerial-firefighting-aircraft/ (http://www.boldmethod.com/blog/lists/2016/03/19-aerial-firefighting-aircraft/)
The old stand-byes of course can be employed...
https://www.businessinsider.com/the-8-most-painful-non-lethal-weapons-2015-10 (https://www.businessinsider.com/the-8-most-painful-non-lethal-weapons-2015-10)
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Doesn’t the military have those non-lethal and less lethal tools to control mobs?
Securing our borders is whose responsibility?
Obviously Border Patrol and Homeland Security but at some point isn’t it the US military that bears the burden of securing the border?
This shouldn’t even be controversial.
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They might not even need to do anything. Enough scary assets present might give the mob second thoughts. Seems like less people would be hurt that way than with playing paddy cake with them.
They will need to hurt somebody, and likely a number of somebodies. There are too many young and dumb males in that caravan, and there has been too much precedent. They will assume that any assets on the border are there for show, and they WILL try to force their way through.
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The old stand-byes of course can be employed...
https://www.businessinsider.com/the-8-most-painful-non-lethal-weapons-2015-10 (https://www.businessinsider.com/the-8-most-painful-non-lethal-weapons-2015-10)
Can't read -- paywall.
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They will need to hurt somebody, and likely a number of somebodies. There are too many young and dumb males in that caravan, and there has been too much precedent. They will assume that any assets on the border are there for show, and they WILL try to force their way through.
I'm afraid you'll end up being right here. Up till now, everyone (Mexico), has made a show, then stepped aside when the mob got violent.
Honestly, I believe defensive violence will be the only way to stop them*, but the optics played out in the MSM are going to be terrible.
*By "them" I absolutely believe that there are hired elements in this group to cause trouble and keep the "sheep" in the mob going.
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I would be lining the border with these (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonic_weapon) for starters, or who knows, they may already be in place.
bob
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I'm afraid you'll end up being right here. Up till now, everyone (Mexico), has made a show, then stepped aside when the mob got violent.
Honestly, I believe defensive violence will be the only way to stop them*, but the optics played out in the MSM are going to be terrible.
*By "them" I absolutely believe that there are hired elements in this group to cause trouble and keep the "sheep" in the mob going.
I am not sure how much we should fear the MSM and whatever interpretation they make. At the least, I think letting fear of their reaction stop you from making the right decision the wrong way to go. I think that sort of attitude is why people support Trump in the first place.
That said, I don't know what options we have to stop them while they are still deep in Mexico and what has been done to find out who is paying for this.
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I am sick of our country being transformed slowly transformed into a left wing $&^hole by immigration.
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Where's Black Jack Pershing when we need him ??
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Trump needs to make this Mexico’s problem, before they get to the border.
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Trump needs to make this Mexico’s problem, before they get to the border.
I think, but not sure, that was already on the table and Mexico folded like a cheap suit. =|
bob
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3rd Cavalry is at Ft. Hood. We'd have to bring in the 11th ACR from Ft. Irwin and then we could recreate 1916...
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Contact Trump here and let him know what you think.
Only takes minute if you are short and sweet:
https://www.whitehouse.gov/contact/
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Isn't the 4th Infantry Division also at Fort Hood? Or have they been shuffled off to somewhere else ... again?
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4th ID is at Ft. Carson, CO. 1st Armored is at Ft. Bliss. 1st Cav is at Hood.
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I think, but not sure, that was already on the table and Mexico folded like a cheap suit. =|
bob
I am sure the people funding this spread plenty of bribes around.
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Australia?
Who's been trying to walk to Australia?
A bunch of guys named Jesus?
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Jokes aside, this is about to get nasty.
Whatever happens it's going to reverberate for years.
Either we're shown to be a bunch of muddle-headed soft-touches who will roll over anytime someone presents us with a sob story.
Or we're a bunch of hard-hearted bloody-handed killers (or enablers of same) who are willing to shed an enormous amount of blood to protect our borders.
Either way is going to change how the leadership of other countries view us and not so much change but set in stone the political divisions in our own country.
And what that will all lead to is impossible to predict.
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Someone said: TROOPS AT Ft HOOD TEXAS ARE BEING ISSUED RIOT GEAR AND CHARTER BUSES HAVE BEEN SEEN GOING IN THE SOUTH GATES! IT'S ON!!!
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Hopefully that's gear for stopping a riot, not starting one.
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We need to apply economic pressure on the Mexicans AND the countries of origin. Is there any way to interrupt the private remittances being sent back to these countries? Freeze/seize any financial assets we can. Close the border to ALL traffic. Deny landing rights to flights originating from these countries. Any other financial/logistical kicks to the plums we could deliver?
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We need to apply economic pressure on the Mexicans AND the countries of origin. Is there any way to interrupt the private remittances being sent back to these countries? Freeze/seize any financial assets we can. Close the border to ALL traffic. Deny landing rights to flights originating from these countries. Any other financial/logistical kicks to the plums we could deliver?
Big Bank is busy *expletive deleted*ing with 2A related stuff, you really think they'd step up for this?
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Maybe it's not Soros' behind it? ???
https://capitalresearch.org/article/the-open-border-activists-behind-the-illegal-immigrant-caravans/
But I still wonder if Pueblo Sin Fronteras gets funding and/or other kinds of support from Soros.
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But all Soros has to do is throw money around right and left. Well, left, anyhow.
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We need to apply economic pressure on the Mexicans AND the countries of origin. Is there any way to interrupt the private remittances being sent back to these countries? Freeze/seize any financial assets we can. Close the border to ALL traffic. Deny landing rights to flights originating from these countries. Any other financial/logistical kicks to the plums we could deliver?
Freeze all money transfers to Mexico.
If they completely shut down all border crossings, I am not sure what affect that would have on the US. Might be interesting to find out.
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Freeze all money transfers to Mexico.
If they completely shut down all border crossings, I am not sure what affect that would have on the US. Might be interesting to find out.
This. WHy we haven't imposed a 20-25% tax on all transfers to pay for the wall is beyond me...
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This. WHy we haven't imposed a 20-25% tax on all transfers to pay for the wall is beyond me...
I agree. And we should have done that long ago irrespective of paying for the wall. The illegals (and some of the legals) have been siphoning money out of the U.S. economy and infusing it into the Mexican (primarily) economy for at least ten or fifteen years. Why else would Western Union have had one form to send money to anywhere in the world, and a second form (called "Dinero en Minuto" -- "Money in one Minute") for sending money to Mexico?
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Absolutely. The .gov should heavily tax any money they don't like how it's being used. It's not like you earned it, it still belongs to the .gov after all.
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Hey, look: Ocasio-Cortez has joined the battle:
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2018/10/26/socialist-alexandria-ocasio-cortez-caravan-migrants-are-refugees-with-legal-right-to-asylum-in-u-s/
They're not "immigrants," they're "refugees." And she claims they ALL intend to enter the U.S. legally ... which conveniently ignores the fact they have stated their intentions, which are the opposite. And also ignores the fact that they broke down the border fence to enter Mexico.
This is a person who supposedly has a college education. Where and when did she pawn her brain?
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Hawkmoon, you're assuming she had one to pawn
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Hawkmoon, you're assuming she had one to pawn
True. Shame on me for assuming a fact not in evidence.
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Good they can all crash at this dumb bitches house then
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This. WHy we haven't imposed a 20-25% tax on all transfers to pay for the wall is beyond me...
The state of OK charges 1% on money wire transfers out of the state... the kicker is, if you pay your state taxes, they refund the money to you....
96% of the money is never claimed, meaning it is being paid by persons who illegally avoid OK state taxes.
This is a perfect solution... honest people get their money back... tax cheats don't...
https://cis.org/North/Oklahoma-Again-Reports-Increase-Taxes-Wired-Remittances
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https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/world-news/739010/migrant-caravan-refuse-mexico-housing-jobs-donald-trump
The purported "refugees" have refused to accept refuge (and housing, and jobs) in Mexico. So much for just wanting to make a better life.
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Wasn't there a guy that said there were criminals in the hoard approaching from the south...
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2018/10/28/bold-strategy-fox-news-interviews-caravan-member-whos-hoping-trump-pardons-his-attempted-murder-conviction/
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I didn't want to start a separate thread, but Harry Reid lies about being a liar.
https://twitchy.com/sarahd-313035/2018/10/31/doh-harry-reid-gets-royally-busted-by-himself-for-lying-about-his-illegal-immigration-stance/
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I didn't want to start a separate thread, but Harry Reid lies about being a liar.
https://twitchy.com/sarahd-313035/2018/10/31/doh-harry-reid-gets-royally-busted-by-himself-for-lying-about-his-illegal-immigration-stance/
Man, that guy is a skunk.
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https://www.foxnews.com/us/border-patrol-warns-texas-landowners-about-possible-armed-civilians-in-area-due-to-caravan-report
The U.S. Border Patrol this week reportedly told Texas landowners along the U.S.-Mexico border to prepare for a possible influx of "armed civilians" on their property as the migrant caravan moves closer to the U.S., a report said.
The Associated Press reported that these civilians say they intend to support the National Guard and Border Patrol to prevent the illegal migrants from crossing into the U.S.
Aren't the folks in south Texas usually armed?
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Ummm, Objection your Honor. How do they even have standing when they are neither citizens, nor residents, nor even physically present in the US. Therefore, they are NOT subject to US law.
https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2018/11/01/wait-what-group-of-migrants-in-caravan-file-lawsuit-against-trump-alleging-shockingly-unconstitutional-border-policies/
And what moron(s), deserving of disbarment filed this craptastic case.
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And there are at least 270 convicted (not just charged) criminals. And people over 20 different countries make up the caravan per DHS.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/dhs-caravan-migrants-from-20-countries-include-270-convicted-criminals
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Who is paying their legal bills?
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Who is paying their legal bills?
Don't know, but I'm guessing the attorney fees would give the six adults (per the article I read, 12 are suing - six adults, six children) a comfortable middle class life in Mexico. But of course asylum is not the goal.
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Oh, also, for funding: How about Beto?
https://twitchy.com/dougp-3137/2018/11/02/uh-oh-latest-project-veritas-videos-look-bad-for-the-beto-orourke-campaign/
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There is also this to consider:
Individuals generally must make their claim for asylum in the first country they enter after fleeing persecution if that country is considered a “safe third country.” If a country has not been designated a safe third country, an asylum seeker may pass through it and apply for asylum in the next country.
http://immigrationimpact.com/2018/06/01/asylum-seekers-mexico-safe-third-country/
In cursory searching, I couldn't find anything definitive on it. Or more precisely, what would legally allow asylum seekers to say FU to Mexico and continue on to the US? The article indicates "some" countries feel that Mexico is not safe, hence the caravan can legally continue to the US. Nevermind that like most countries, there are specific "dangerous areas" in Mexico while most of the country lives a normal life. Also note the blurb where Canada considers the US "not a safe asylum country".
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Caravan is up to 12,000 now. Wouldn't that mean that these "asylum seeking refugees", this far into Mexico, and this far from Mexico's Southern border, now have lots of Mexicans joining them to get across? Mexicans don't need asylum from Mexico.
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Who is paying their legal bills?
An organization local to me called Nexus services is running the lawsuit, always wondered where they made their money, I guess Soros is a likely answer now.
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¡Sigue el dinero!
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An interesting update. Some undisclosed group paid for "LGBT migrants" to be separately bused to the border ahead of the main caravan. Sounds to me like they want to make them a media poster child test case for asylum.
https://www.foxnews.com/world/lgbt-members-of-migrant-caravan-reach-us-border-say-they-endured-verbal-abuse-by-other-migrants
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...say they endured verbal abuse by other migrants.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: So they need asylum from the migrant caravan. :rofl:
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So the caravan is back in the news? I was just noticing how the caravan seemed to have almost completely disappeared from the news as soon as we got past election
day week.
Probably a coincidence ...
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"They are still hundreds of miles away."
When Acosta said that, I wanted to slap the living *expletive deleted*it out of him. Like they are not taking trucks, and buses, and any other form of transport. They aren't just walking. He should have had his press pass pulled, simply for being that *expletive deleted*ing stupid.
But yeah, they are out of the news. But once they show up and border and Trump's "Send 'em back, RFN !!!" order takes effect, there will be lots of news stories about the "cruelty" being inflicted upon them by the callous US policy of Donald Trump.
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I want to know what the rules of engagement are for the troops [supposedly] deployed along the border.
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I want to know what the rules of engagement are for the troops [supposedly] deployed along the border.
"Don't"
The Service Members deployed to the border are supposedly doing maintenance and logistics stuff, freeing up CBP Officers to do the actual engagements.
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The Service Members deployed to the border are supposedly doing maintenance and logistics stuff, freeing up CBP Officers to do the actual engagements.
That's my understanding, too -- and I do not approve. This isn't a bunch of smugglers trying to sneak a dozen or two illegals across at a time -- this is an organized invasion, and the mob has already shown that they will engage in violence to cross a national border. A violent invasion should be repelled with more violence than the invaders ever knew existed.
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If they were *really* seeking asylum wouldn't they do so at the American embassy in Mexico City?
I don't think under international treaties they are legally refugees because they didn't seek asylum in Mexico but are continuing on to USA, but they could still seek asylum if/when they get here. We are not obligated to grant asylum, but we might be obligated to allow them to apply.
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I like this take on the LGBT maneuver:
Um, if this is true, why would the U.S. grant asylum to members of the caravan who are attacking other members of the caravan because of their sexual identity?
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I like this take on the LGBT maneuver:
I have to agree it is a really good maneuver.
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If they were *really* seeking asylum wouldn't they do so at the American embassy in Mexico City?
I don't think under international treaties they are legally refugees because they didn't seek asylum in Mexico but are continuing on to USA, but they could still seek asylum if/when they get here. We are not obligated to grant asylum, but we might be obligated to allow them to apply.
And Mexico offered them housing and jobs. Sounds to me like asylum is not what they are after.
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That's my understanding, too -- and I do not approve. This isn't a bunch of smugglers trying to sneak a dozen or two illegals across at a time -- this is an organized invasion, and the mob has already shown that they will engage in violence to cross a national border. A violent invasion should be repelled with more violence than the invaders ever knew existed.
I tend to agree, but I'm too cowardly to actually suggest quad M2s every half mile.
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I tend to agree, but I'm too cowardly to actually suggest quad M2s every half mile.
A-10s and napalm?
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A-10s and napalm?
Warthog jelly?
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Re the LGBTLSFRJLG "point squad":
I have to agree it is a really good maneuver.
For decades* I've been bitching about the fact that the folks who are directing all left-wing stuff are expert, hard-nosed military-grade full-time salaried strategists and tacticians, worthy of being on General Patton's staff.
So what did you expect?
Terry, 230RN
* I mean it. I finally became "woke" to the long term efforts of the anti-gunners after I started to research it with GCA68. At the time, the NRA directorship was mostly "go along to get along."
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Let "Puff" fly the boarder...
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Hawkmoon spake thusly:
A violent invasion should be repelled with more violence than the invaders ever knew existed.
Reminds me of Jeff Cooper's answer to the question about what he would do if violence were directed at him. Something like: "I would endeavor to provide more violence in return than he can possibly enjoy."
:rofl:
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Let "Puff" fly the boarder...
I wonder if any still exist. There are still lots of DC-3s and C47s, but I wonder if there are any in "Puff" configuration.
Man, they were awesome. They flew missions within view of where I was in the central highlands a few times. At night it was just a stream of fire coming out of that bird. We heard that the rate of fire was so great that the planes were displaced sideways in the air. We all called BS on that .... until we saw it. But I think the Warthog is ultimately even more effective and more intimidating.
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Yup, on the BS and warthog
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Magic dragon gunship:
https://youtu.be/uKOrpyO0z48 (3:37)
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The modern version, the AC-130:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=AC-130
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Let "Puff" fly the boarder...
Magic dragon gunship:
https://youtu.be/uKOrpyO0z48 (3:37)
HA! Different kind of PUFF than what I was thinking apparently. :facepalm: :rofl:
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So we seem to have a caravan, but no troops:
https://fox5sandiego.com/2018/11/13/video-shows-group-climbing-on-border-fence/
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https://saraacarter.com/trump-signs-executive-proclamation-no-asylum-for-illegal-entry/#.W-mBSvxOkZ0%23
Trump Signs Executive Proclamation: No Asylum for Illegal Entry
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https://saraacarter.com/trump-signs-executive-proclamation-no-asylum-for-illegal-entry/#.W-mBSvxOkZ0%23
Trump Signs Executive Proclamation: No Asylum for Illegal Entry
GO TRUMP!
[ar15] [ar15] [ar15] [ar15] [ar15]
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https://keepandbear.com/products/build-the-wall
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So as of now it appears at least 7000 "asylum seekers" will be queued up in Tijuana?
https://www.foxnews.com/world/as-migrant-caravan-reaches-tijuana-overwhelmed-city-asks-mexican-government-for-4-million
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NPR did a story on this, I can't remember if it was yesterday or earlier this week.
Basically if the members of the caravan wait in line at the border, go through the interview process and pass, they will be granted asylum.
What it sounds like is that the members of this caravan have been told all along the way that this isn't going to happen, so many have been trying to run across the borders in groups at the car crossings, they get caught and detained. The news person also said, in the past about 91% of the people in previous caravans passed the initial screening and were granted asylum.
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Basically if the members of the caravan wait in line at the border, go through the interview process and pass, they will be granted asylum.
I don't understand how every one of these people would qualify for asylum. We already have documented evidence of criminals who were booted out of the country once already trying to get back in.
Plus I'm probably biased from stories my mom told from when she was a refugee. They were lucky to have any kind of clothes or shoes at all. My mom walked from Hungary to Austria in men's boots way too big for her and jacket sewn together from an old blanket. Pictures of these "asylum seekers" show a lot of well dressed people with smart phones.
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The extra military personnel are slated to leave the border region no later than December 15. It sounds like they weren't really serious about augmenting border security after all.
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Plus I'm probably biased from stories my mom told from when she was a refugee. They were lucky to have any kind of clothes or shoes at all. My mom walked from Hungary to Austria in men's boots way too big for her and jacket sewn together from an old blanket. Pictures of these "asylum seekers" show a lot of well dressed people with smart phones.
I imagine if Central America had just finished up being the epicenter of World War and two different allied powers fighting over who gets to divide up what, they would be dressed in rags. Well dressed I am not surprised, Americans donate a lot of gently used clothes that eventually makes it way to poorer parts of the world, I'm not a fashionista so I can't tell of if they are wearing this fall's fashion for pants or something from 20 years ago. Basic clothing really hasn't changed much in 30 years, not like they are wearing polyester leisure suits. Outside the US, smart phones are basic and cheap, so seeing those it doesn't surprise me.
I've been trying to figure out why they are coming here, seems from normal news sources its 50/50, some are escaping crime/corruption ridden areas and others are wanting a better life, with a better wages. Of course there is always going to be a certain percentage of any group that tries to criminally game the system, like most groups, this is probably a very low percentage.
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Why would anyone want to deny these proto US citizens the freedom from want, fear and the right to vote for the Democrats?
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I've been trying to figure out why they are coming here, seems from normal news sources its 50/50, some are escaping crime/corruption ridden areas and others are wanting a better life, with a better wages. Of course there is always going to be a certain percentage of any group that tries to criminally game the system, like most groups, this is probably a very low percentage.
While some of them are most certainly hoping to "live the American dream" of being able to work their way to prosperity, I think far too many are coming for the handouts. For those that want to escape crime and corruption, Mexico gave them an option, but it seems nobody wanted it. They could have settled in a land with similar cultural attributes and language, where despite all the negative news, there are large "middle class" areas not dissimilar to Anytown USA.
If nothing else, they could initially accept Mexico's offer and then apply to legally immigrate into the US if this is what they really want to shoot for. I still argue that 95% of this group does not qualify for asylum status, which to me generally means there is an immediate need to leave due to danger to life. In that case again, as per international agreement, you accept asylum in the first safe State you enter, which in this case is Mexico. When they said "no thanks" to the asylum offer, to me, at that point, they just became emigrants.
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Why would anyone want to deny these proto US citizens the freedom from want, fear and the right to vote for the Democrats?
Most legal/former illegal immigrants I know, aren't fans of the democrat party. Might be a Iowa thing.
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Most legal/former illegal immigrants I know, aren't fans of the democrat party. Might be a Iowa thing.
I suspect even in CA a large/predominate portion of LEGAL immigrants tend R. Perhaps less so the legal immigrants from South of the border, but legal immigrants from other countries seem to tend conservative and hate illegal immigration. Which kinda makes sense, because nobody likes line-cutters.
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The racial breakdown of voting patterns is not a state secret.
There isn’t a single immigrant population of any other race that is even evenly split 50/50 let alone being natural conservatives.
That doesn’t mean they are bad people, that I don’t like them or I hate them.
More immigrants, even white Europeans I suspect, equals more Democrat control.
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For those that want to escape crime and corruption, Mexico gave them an option, but it seems nobody wanted it. They could have settled in a land with similar cultural attributes and language, where despite all the negative news, there are large "middle class" areas not dissimilar to Anytown USA.
News seems to tell us there is no safe place in Mexico either, perhaps the members of the caravan think the same way.
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News seems to tell us there is no safe place in Mexico either, perhaps the members of the caravan think the same way.
Large swaths of the world are unsafe.
They all cannot come here.
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Large swaths of the world are unsafe.
They all cannot come here.
I would agree with you but with the ultra low unemployment in some areas, there is a need to for folks wanting a better life. Hell there is at least 2000 unfilled positions in the area where I live, granted most of them don't pay much more than $10-12 and are hard work, but someone needs to fill those jobs.
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I would agree with you but with the ultra low unemployment in some areas, there is a need to for folks wanting a better life. Hell there is at least 2000 unfilled positions in the area where I live, granted most of them don't pay much more than $10-12 and are hard work, but someone needs to fill those jobs.
They need to raise the pay scale to attract workers.
If it’s hard work it is worth more than $12 an hour in this economy.
Gas station attendants make that in some areas.
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They need to raise the pay scale to attract workers.
If it’s hard work it is worth more than $12 an hour in this economy.
Gas station attendants make that in some areas.
I know, McD's and warehouse jobs up here pay the same. No one want to pay more for goods and services, so unskilled wages don't raise much.
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Don't forget that the millions of illegals in the U.S. are a major factor in keeping those wages low.
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I know, McD's and warehouse jobs up here pay the same. No one want to pay more for goods and services, so unskilled wages don't raise much.
Of course they don't want to pay more. No one ever wants to spend more than the minimum. But in order to stay in business you need things like employees. Importing a cheap labor source isn't a particularly good way to get around having to pay decent rates to attract decent workers.
Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
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Of course they don't want to pay more. No one ever wants to spend more than the minimum. But in order to stay in business you need things like employees. Importing a cheap labor source isn't a particularly good way to get around having to pay decent rates to attract decent workers.
Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk
I doubt they are going to either, too much of the Birkshire Hathaway mindset, where employees are liabilities and easily replaced or made to work harder for same/less money, be thankful they have a job, and get a expected rate of return year in and year out with the company.
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Importing a cheap labor source isn't a particularly good way to get around having to pay decent rates to attract decent workers.
It is if there's an endless supply of them. If one doesn't work out, you just fire him/her and hire the next one.
Illegals are especially useful in hazardous occupations like asbestos abatement. The employer doesn't have to waste spend money on annoying legalities like training or personal protective equipment because in the unlikely event the workers find out they're supposed to have training and PPE ... who are they going to complain to?
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I would agree with you but with the ultra low unemployment in some areas, there is a need to for folks wanting a better life. Hell there is at least 2000 unfilled positions in the area where I live, granted most of them don't pay much more than $10-12 and are hard work, but someone needs to fill those jobs.
Why not jut bring back slavery instead??
(https://i.redd.it/lyveckqfrzr11.png)
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Why not jut bring back slavery instead??
(https://i.redd.it/lyveckqfrzr11.png)
They are. Along with Communism, where the government owns the means of production.
Ponder that for a second.
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Why not jut bring back slavery instead??
I still don't know why the government doesn't go after those employee undocumented workers, fine them into bankruptcy by not playing by the rules. Seize assets, they do it when they break other federal laws like manufacturing/distribution on a controlled substance, wire fraud, illegal business practices (like Tyco or Bernie Madoff).
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This unskilled labor argument will be interesting in 20 years when robots are running McDonalds and are the main labor force in commercial agriculture.
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I still don't know why the government doesn't go after those employee undocumented workers, fine them into bankruptcy by not playing by the rules. Seize assets, they do it when they break other federal laws like manufacturing/distribution on a controlled substance, wire fraud, illegal business practices (like Tyco or Bernie Madoff).
They give a lot of money to politicians. Big Business likes cheap commodity labor. They don't want to have to deal with competition in the labor market especially for hourly employees.
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I still don't know why the government doesn't go after those employee undocumented workers, fine them into bankruptcy by not playing by the rules. Seize assets, they do it when they break other federal laws like manufacturing/distribution on a controlled substance, wire fraud, illegal business practices (like Tyco or Bernie Madoff).
Fine them, yes. Into Bankruptcy, No. I have no problem with that. But at the same time, eliminate the minimum wage. The economic ladder needs to have bottom rungs.
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For the businesses that hire illegal aliens
Unwitting hire, be sure, or be spanked: $5000 fine for each illegal alien/month of employment.
Knowingly hire, Welcome to pauperdom: All financial assets are forfeit and disbursed to any legal employees except executives and officers as compensation for their unemployment. All physical assets are forfeit and crushed to dust. All IP assets are cast into the public domain. All assets of all company executives & officers are seized at a 75% penalty and the proceeds dispersed to the rest of the legal employees. All executives and officers are forever barred from holding such positions again.
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Haisoos Aitch Christ, are you guys listening to yourselves? Talk about leftie-commie gooberment domination.
Here's a starting point:
Firmly block illegals, allow documented migrants in to fill in during harvests, etc, let the wages settle to an arm's length negotiated natural level*, get them back home when done.
Let the free enterprise system work within the parameters of legal immigration, or work permits for the temporary help needed.
They are supposed to be migrants.
Maybe I need more coffee, but that business of overwhelming punishment seems pretty unwise and fraught with unintended consequences all by itself.
Let not your outrage destroy your wisdom.
Terry
* Meaning no mandated lower level.
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Here's a starting point:
Firmly block illegals, allow documented migrants in to fill in during harvests, etc, let the wages settle to an arm's length negotiated natural level*, get them back home when done.
We have a program for doing just that. Many (dare I say "most"?) of these (and many other) illegals aren't interested in participating because of that whole "get them back home when done" part.
Maybe I need more coffee, but that business of overwhelming punishment seems pretty unwise and fraught with unintended consequences all by itself.
I have to disagree. There's a reason why the usual suspects prefer to call illegal aliens "undocumented immigrants." Two reasons, in fact, both contained in the simple phrase. One is that the illegals are immigrants, they are not migrants. They don't want to go back home seasonally, and they don't. They want to stay here, taking jobs away from people who are here legally, and siphoning money out of the U.S. economy to send back to their native country. Second, anyone who is here legally has a document to prove that they're here legally. Birth certificate, passport, green card ... something. For every job I've taken or been in the final cut for over the past fifteen (maybe more) years, I have either had to show proof that I'm legally entitled to work in the U.S., or I've been alerted that I will have to produce such documentation if hired.
In fact, that's the law. I don't see how any employer today can possibly claim they "unknowingly" hired an illegal, unless the said illegal had a very well executed counterfeit birth certificate, passport, or green card. Consequently, I'm fully in favor of punishing employers who hire illegals. Those who do often pay them under the table, at less than minimum wage, so they not only prevent legal citizens and legal residents from finding work, they also drive down the prevailing wage for the area.
Maybe it's just sour grapes on my part. When I married my late wife, we jumped through all the hoops to be sure that she would be 100 percent legal when she got here. That kept us apart for six months after the marriage, because I was in the U.S. working and she had to wait in South America until her green card application was processed and approved. To see hordes of illegals who think they have a "right" to skip the system, ignore the laws, and just walk in really [irritates me].
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Fine them, yes. Into Bankruptcy, No. I have no problem with that. But at the same time, eliminate the minimum wage. The economic ladder needs to have bottom rungs.
If we eliminate the minimum wage, then every employee gets a individual contract with a terms on wage/benefits for the duration of the contract, contracts need to be a minimum of 6 months, maximum 12 months if the job is continuous employment type position. That way an employer can't drop wages on their employees whenever they want, need to wait until contract renewal time.
Salary only to 40 hours, anything over 40 hours must be paid at a minimum of 1.5 the rate per hour in the contract, either by money or by paid leave. Any unused leave has to be paid out in US currency at end of employment.
Layoff would result in 100% several pay of the remainder of the contract.
Then we can get ride of minimum wage laws.
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For the businesses that hire illegal aliens
Unwitting hire, be sure, or be spanked: $5000 fine for each illegal alien/month of employment.
Knowingly hire, Welcome to pauperdom: All financial assets are forfeit and disbursed to any legal employees except executives and officers as compensation for their unemployment. All physical assets are forfeit and crushed to dust. All IP assets are cast into the public domain. All assets of all company executives & officers are seized at a 75% penalty and the proceeds dispersed to the rest of the legal employees. All executives and officers are forever barred from holding such positions again.
I'm a bigger fan of $1000 per day employed per illegal, so 100 days is going to cost you $100k per illegal employee.
Don't crush assets, sell them, legal employees get the proceeds after debts paid.
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Haisoos Aitch Christ, are you guys listening to yourselves? Talk about leftie-commie gooberment domination.
No, those who engage in the practice of hiring illegal aliens are defrauding the government and citizens of the US. Let them be burned.
I have seen too much of that crap here in Iowa with the agricultural segment. DeCoster Farms, Agriprocessors, etc. You can Google them.
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If we eliminate the minimum wage, then every employee gets a individual contract with a terms on wage/benefits for the duration of the contract, contracts need to be a minimum of 6 months, maximum 12 months if the job is continuous employment type position. That way an employer can't drop wages on their employees whenever they want, need to wait until contract renewal time.
Salary only to 40 hours, anything over 40 hours must be paid at a minimum of 1.5 the rate per hour in the contract, either by money or by paid leave. Any unused leave has to be paid out in US currency at end of employment.
Layoff would result in 100% several pay of the remainder of the contract.
Then we can get ride of minimum wage laws.
Here I am trying to get the .gov OUT of the labor market, and you are trying to jam more IN.
I never worked somewhere that I had a contract. I was always an "At Will" employee, meaning that I could leave anytime I felt or they could get rid of me anytime they felt. Keep in mind your contract runs both ways. If the employer can't drop wages or terminate me, then I can't demand higher wages or leave for a better offer until the end of the contract.
How about the employer and employee decide wages, hours, and working conditions. If any of those change to the employee's dis-satisfaction, he/she is free to leave and move on to bigger and better things. Same if the employer decides that the employee is not meeting whatever the job requirements are, and yes, the job can change as the market changes.
You sound like someone is afraid to take a risk or be vulnerable. You seem to demand safety and security. There is usually little reward in hiding in safety, those who take risks usually reap the greatest rewards.
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I still don't know why the government doesn't go after those employee undocumented workers, fine them into bankruptcy by not playing by the rules. Seize assets, they do it when they break other federal laws like manufacturing/distribution on a controlled substance, wire fraud, illegal business practices (like Tyco or Bernie Madoff).
You really don't know? Republican elites *love* illegal aliens because they drive wages down. Democrat elites love illegals for the illegal votes (and to a lesser extent, the low wages) Both sides give the ol' middle finger to American workers; the Republicans just give a little lip service to opposing illegals.
Trump is upsetting the apple cart... but he's not upsetting it very much because his party doesn't want him to.
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They give a lot of money to politicians. Big Business likes cheap commodity labor. They don't want to have to deal with competition in the labor market especially for hourly employees.
And the dot coms/high tech love the H1B visa: take a paycut or train your replacement from India.
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I would agree with you but with the ultra low unemployment in some areas, there is a need to for folks wanting a better life. Hell there is at least 2000 unfilled positions in the area where I live, granted most of them don't pay much more than $10-12 and are hard work, but someone needs to fill those jobs.
I agree! What this country needs more than anything is a low income, low education, non-English speaking underclass that can be exploited.
If there is a job to be done and the prospective employer cannot find anyone to hire then maybe the employer needs to raise the starting wage rather than importing poverty.
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Here I am trying to get the .gov OUT of the labor market, and you are trying to jam more IN.
I never worked somewhere that I had a contract. I was always an "At Will" employee, meaning that I could leave anytime I felt or they could get rid of me anytime they felt. Keep in mind your contract runs both ways. If the employer can't drop wages or terminate me, then I can't demand higher wages or leave for a better offer until the end of the contract.
How about the employer and employee decide wages, hours, and working conditions. If any of those change to the employee's dis-satisfaction, he/she is free to leave and move on to bigger and better things. Same if the employer decides that the employee is not meeting whatever the job requirements are, and yes, the job can change as the market changes.
You sound like someone is afraid to take a risk or be vulnerable. You seem to demand safety and security. There is usually little reward in hiding in safety, those who take risks usually reap the greatest rewards.
I read your argument for less .gov and I see this
(https://imagesvc.timeincapp.com/v3/mm/image?url=https%3A%2F%2Ftimedotcom.files.wordpress.com%2F2016%2F06%2Flabor.jpeg&w=800&q=85)
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I read your argument for less .gov and I see this
(https://imagesvc.timeincapp.com/v3/mm/image?url=https%3A%2F%2Ftimedotcom.files.wordpress.com%2F2016%2F06%2Flabor.jpeg&w=800&q=85)
You mean like this?
(https://reesephoto.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/amish-youth-hoe.jpg)
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It’s funny how when someone calls for less .gov bullshit governing employment the response is always “butbutbut you want child labor!” Or less environmental regs then it’s “but you want rivers on fire!”
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You mean like this?
(https://reesephoto.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/amish-youth-hoe.jpg)
That is family farm labor. Religious even.
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It’s funny how when someone calls for less .gov bullshit governing employment the response is always “butbutbut you want child labor!” Or less environmental regs then it’s “but you want rivers on fire!”
Because some people understand why some regulations were created in the first place. Someone or someones was wrongfully exploiting people or the common good.
Here is an example why we have minimum wage laws.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/03/09/us/the-boys-in-the-bunkhouse.html
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The above doesn't justify the minimum wage. Minimum wage came about in 1938, as part of Roosevelt's "New Deal" The above is about exploiting the mentally handicapped. They were failed by their families and the person(s) put in charge to take care of them. It has nothing to do with minimum wage.
People who are able to negotiate their wages should be allowed to do so. Your story is about families that washed their hands of members who needed their care and protection.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQj1qlsjVoM
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It also shows that despite all you beloved regulations, these people were still allowed to be exploited for over 30 years as "the system" turned are blind eye to them.
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The above doesn't justify the minimum wage. Minimum wage came about in 1938, as part of Roosevelt's "New Deal" The above is about exploiting the mentally handicapped. They were failed by their families and the person(s) put in charge to take care of them. It has nothing to do with minimum wage.
People who are able to negotiate their wages should be allowed to do so. Your story is about families that washed their hands of members who needed their care and protection.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rQj1qlsjVoM
You and I are not going to agree on this subject. I've seen too many shenanigans pulled by business owners/management to even think about deregulating labor laws. Day in court takes too long, so to me that isn't an option either.
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Looks like it might start getting sporty today. A group made a rush to overwhelm the border and apparently tear gas has been deployed.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/mexico-denies-deal-with-white-house-on-migrants-as-trump-threatens-to-close-entire-border
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San Ysidro port of entry has been closed:
https://fox5sandiego.com/2018/11/25/cbp-suspends-all-traffic-at-the-san-ysidro-port-of-entry/
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Again, are we just our of AC 130s and A10s? Literal invasion, happening now.
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And a Senator has to allude to tear gas as chemical warfare... ;/
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2018/11/25/sen-brian-schatz-deletes-dopey-tweet-accusing-border-patrol-of-using-chemical-weapons-on-migrant-rock-throwers/
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Again, are we just our of AC 130s and A10s? Literal invasion, happening now.
If that happened, I'm pretty sure a lot of nations would declare war on the US, World War III would in North America.
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The military being there is probably mostly theater.
Trump is squeezing Mexico to make them deal with the problem on their side.
Shutting down the border as he threatened will cost a lot of people money. Powerful people who will also put pressure on Mexico.
Trump is pretty sly.
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If that happened, I'm pretty sure a lot of nations would declare war on the US, World War III would in North America.
I doubt that. There would be lots of bluster, UN resolutions, etc. But nothing would really happen with foreign governments. The next caravan would likely stop in its tracks. The biggest problem would be that the left in this country would collectively lose it's *expletive deleted*it and we would have riots in the bigger cities, congressional hearings until the cows come home, and the House would probably impeach Trump.
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I doubt that. There would be lots of bluster, UN resolutions, etc. But nothing would really happen with foreign governments.
Exactly. Other nations (including Russia and China) have done worse and nothing has come of it.
The biggest problem would be that the left in this country would collectively lose it's *expletive deleted*it and we would have riots in the bigger cities
Maybe. Maybe they'll settle down because they don't want to be targeted.
and the House would probably impeach Trump.
They're going to try that anyway.
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the left in this country would collectively lose it's *expletive deleted*it and we would have riots in the bigger cities, congressional hearings until the cows come home, and the House would probably impeach Trump.
So...pretty much status quo.
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If that happened, I'm pretty sure a lot of nations would declare war on the US, World War III would in North America.
I absolutely disagree, did you even think that out ;/?
The border needs to be more than some magic line that you cross to get free *expletive deleted*it.
And Mexico is welcome to bring it on, apparently they need reminded about once a century.
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So...pretty much status quo.
yep.
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Impeachment is the congressional equivalent of a grand jury bringing charges. The next step is a "trial," which is held before the Senate. Unlikely that the Senate would convict Trump.
Remember, Bill Clinton was impeached ... but he wasn't convicted, so he remained in office.
I don't think the Ds would really impeach. What would happen if they succeeded in getting Trump out of office? President Pence, that's what, and he's more of a true conservative Christian than Trump could ever dream of being. President Pence would be the Democrats' worst nightmare. I don't think they really want that, but all the bluster makes for good theater, and rakes in the money.
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I don't like this situation at all.... it makes the US look like that bad guy and we are essentially the land of plenty for these people. They just need to follow the rules and most of them would get in.
I am not familiar with the various visas, but a work visa easily obtained would be very good start. The problem is that many of these people essentially disappear into our cities and even if they are issued some sort of SS, it doesn't mean they will pay any taxes. Try tracking them down?
The "wall" is part of the answer in controlling our border with Mexico. Mexico needs to make it more difficult for these people to form "caravans". The problem there is that political forces in the US are at work and there is a lot of money behind those forces to "help" these people.
It is time for Congress to get off their butts and apply some common sense to this issue. The Democrats will win the voter registration race. The sad part of that equation is that Republicans have historically been more effective with dealing with social issues. But the Democrats somehow always come out smelling like a rose.
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I don't like this situation at all.... it makes the US look like that bad guy and we are essentially the land of plenty for these people. They just need to follow the rules and most of them would get in.
I agree that they should follow the rules, but I don't agree that most of them would get in. There are criteria for being granted asylum, and I seriously doubt many of them satisfy those criteria. There are also quotas for immigrant visas, and there are people ahead of this rabble in the queue. They aren't interested in playing y the rules, because they want to jump the line.
I have zero sympathy for them.
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/11/invasion-honduran-migrant-says-20000-will-march-through-vehicle-lanes-at-border-says-applying-for-asylum-is-waste-of-time/
Gómez and several others told the Epoch Times that they plan to enter illegally and are unlikely to apply for asylum.
“It’s a waste of time. It’s a process that takes months and years—it’s a long time,” Gómez said.
Another migrant, Frank Martinez, had a similar plan.
“I personally, and I know many people will attempt to do the same thing—it’s to cross illegally. I will enter illegally,” Martinez said. “Because we want a better life, and I’m in a hurry.”
Though the migrants were offered asylum in Mexico, they have no plans to take them up on their offer. Instead, they hope to storm the border to the US.
“It’s not my intention, to stay here, in this country. My intention is the United States,” Martinez said.
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Looks like Mexico is doing a little something about it, http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/mexico-deporting-nearly-500-migrants-after-california-border-blitz/ar-BBQ5K1h?ocid=ientp
It also mentions that Mexico also closed down their side of the port of entry, I had thought only the US closed down.
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I don't like this situation at all.... it makes the US look like that bad guy and we are essentially the land of plenty for these people. They just need to follow the rules and most of them would get in.
I am not familiar with the various visas, but a work visa easily obtained would be very good start. The problem is that many of these people essentially disappear into our cities and even if they are issued some sort of SS, it doesn't mean they will pay any taxes. Try tracking them down?
The "wall" is part of the answer in controlling our border with Mexico. Mexico needs to make it more difficult for these people to form "caravans". The problem there is that political forces in the US are at work and there is a lot of money behind those forces to "help" these people.
It is time for Congress to get off their butts and apply some common sense to this issue. The Democrats will win the voter registration race. The sad part of that equation is that Republicans have historically been more effective with dealing with social issues. But the Democrats somehow always come out smelling like a rose.
Makes us look bad to who? Anyone we really care about? That really isn't a good reason to set policy.
And who is really trying to make us look bad? That would be our Main Stream Media organizations.
The immigration laws have been screwed up for decades. It will be a major fight to get any changes. Lots of businesses want Congress to treat those laws like the tax code. Full of loopholes for their use.
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Makes us look bad to who? Anyone we really care about? That really isn't a good reason to set policy.
And who is really trying to make us look bad? That would be our Main Stream Media organizations.
The immigration laws have been screwed up for decades. It will be a major fight to get any changes. Lots of businesses want Congress to treat those laws like the tax code. Full of loopholes for their use.
My liberal coworkers are absolutely appalled and embarrassed by Trump, they are absolutely concerned about what “the world” thinks of us.
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My liberal coworkers are absolutely appalled and embarrassed by Trump, they are absolutely concerned about what “the world” thinks of us.
It continues to be of interest to me that the left complains so loudly about our "Machiavellian" immigration policy when it is much, much more liberal than that of Australia, New Zealand, Canada, MEXICO, etc.
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It continues to be of interest to me that the left complains so loudly about our "Machiavellian" immigration policy when it is much, much more liberal than that of Australia, New Zealand, Canada, MEXICO, etc.
Absolutely (couldn’t figure out how to get that third “absolutely” into my previous post).
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I agree that they should follow the rules, but I don't agree that most of them would get in. There are criteria for being granted asylum, and I seriously doubt many of them satisfy those criteria. There are also quotas for immigrant visas, and there are people ahead of this rabble in the queue. They aren't interested in playing y the rules, because they want to jump the line.
I have zero sympathy for them.
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2018/11/invasion-honduran-migrant-says-20000-will-march-through-vehicle-lanes-at-border-says-applying-for-asylum-is-waste-of-time/
The rules for asylum are fairly stringent. It is the proof of such that is the problem. I suspect in most cases we have been giving many the benefit of the doubt but that has stopped with this wave. I do have sympathy for them as I understand that they simply want jobs to feed their families. A lot of the money gets sent back to their families south of the border as I understand it. The central American countries like this as it feeds their economies.
We need a wall of sorts with enforcement. We shouldn't have to keep these people in the US feeding and caring for them while they wait for some sort of court resolution. I doubt Mexico wants them either.... So, part of the solution is rigorous border enforcement along the Southern Mexico border. The US has to enforce its borders or we have no country at all. Kind of like the fence wars years ago when folks were migrating west and setting up farms in the open grazing portions of the west. Led to a lot of trouble. The farmers won, but we can't loose the border fight.
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The rules for asylum are fairly stringent. It is the proof of such that is the problem. I suspect in most cases we have been giving many the benefit of the doubt but that has stopped with this wave. I do have sympathy for them as I understand that they simply want jobs to feed their families. A lot of the money gets sent back to their families south of the border as I understand it. The central American countries like this as it feeds their economies.
We need a wall of sorts with enforcement. We shouldn't have to keep these people in the US feeding and caring for them while they wait for some sort of court resolution. I doubt Mexico wants them either.... So, part of the solution is rigorous border enforcement along the Southern Mexico border. The US has to enforce its borders or we have no country at all. Kind of like the fence wars years ago when folks were migrating west and setting up farms in the open grazing portions of the west. Led to a lot of trouble. The farmers won, but we can't loose the border fight.
I have heard discussions lately about the cost of illegally entering the US. It costs a lot of money. The cartells and others try to control that sort of access and charge a lot. It is actually not the "starving poor" that are traveling from South America. Now I am not sure if that is who is in these caravans since someone else paid for these people to move North.
The other side of that is there are poor and starving people all over the world. We cannot take them all. We don't have the room. I have heard it said that we get away with liberal immigration policies because countries like India or Pakistan are an ocean away. Otherwise, we would be flooded with a lot more illegal immigrants than we have now.
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Translated to meme, since it seems we have to revisit how asylum actually works...
(https://i.redd.it/3k80oac56k021.png)
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https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/nov/26/obama-administration-used-tear-gas-border-once-mon/
Tear gas used once a month at southern border during Obama administration.
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https://www.redstate.com/brandon_morse/2018/11/26/theres-good-reason-believe-viral-photo-border-agents-gassing-migrant-mother-children-staged/
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ds8CqcnU4AMTySV.jpg:large)
Not sure about this, but it is interesting. There is only that one smoke canister in the picture.
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Interesting. I hadn't noticed the cameramen before, with leisurely tripods setup no less.
If there was just the one canister in the vicinity, it looks like she's running in the wrong direction.
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Interesting report I heard on this morning's news that said that many " freedom seeker paragons of colored virtue!" are now giving up and returning to their homelands because they fully expected to be able to crash the border and did NOT expect an organized resistance from us officials.
That tells me that asylum is, for some of them at least, a bullshit cover story.
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Long, but an interesting read.
https://www.npr.org/2018/11/27/670807343/fact-check-whats-happening-on-the-u-s-mexico-border?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_term=nprnews&utm_content=2056
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Interesting report I heard on this morning's news that said that many " freedom seeker paragons of colored virtue!" are now giving up and returning to their homelands because they fully expected to be able to crash the border and did NOT expect an organized resistance from us officials.
That tells me that asylum is, for some of them at least, a bullshit cover story.
Possible that Pueblos Sin Fronteras sold the caravanees a load of BS as well. Since for them this has nothing to do with individuals and everything to do with shaping US policy for the next 20 years.
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I found this interesting on a personal level. When my parents immigrated, Ellis Island was still online. My dad has a heart murmur, and when they got to the island, he was separated (SEPARATED!!!) from my mom and sister for medical evaluation. At the time, they did pre-entry medical screenings because they didn't want immigrants coming in and immediately sucking up medical resources that they weren't able to pay for. My dad passed of course, but if he hadn't, they would have simply been turned around and denied entry.
Now it appears there is practically a plague at the border. I have no idea what the current regs are regarding medical conditions and entry.
https://www.foxnews.com/world/caravan-migrants-suffer-from-respiratory-infections-tuberculosis-chickenpox-other-health-issues-tijuana-government-says
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Well, those sick freedom seekers are only sick because Trump Nazi Racism.
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Now it appears there is practically a plague at the border. I have no idea what the current regs are regarding medical conditions and entry.
We let in people with AIDS and other serious STDs.
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We might as well fling open the borders and speed up the collapse of the USA Empire.
The empire has been wearing the skin suit of the Nation of America for decades now.
Myself ? I’m not confident the empire is going to hold together much longer. Maybe it will last my lifetime but I don’t have confidence for much beyond 50-100 years.
Check out this data on voting patterns.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/what-if-only-men-voted-only-women-only-nonwhite-voters/
If you believe multiethnic socialists and third world labor from around the world can keep this thing going then you have nothing to fear.
But it won’t be America.
From what I can gather nations are a people, a people who share a common culture, mores and religion.
The Nation of America is long long gone. Long live the multiethnic USA Empire!
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(https://armedpolitesociety.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fherohog.com%2Fimages%2Fpolitics%2FFB_IMG_1543423202128.jpg&hash=59604f2024c906ddf9b0bb9796d1694fbf4ee60f) :old:
and, YES, I can legitimately make that claim of my family.
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(https://66.media.tumblr.com/3fa339023f70aceab199acede252a822/tumblr_piwvd3mryr1u1w3aqo1_1280.jpg)
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Interesting link to me because I was thinking about this just the other day. It's around 2000 miles as the crow flies to the California border. Taking that 2000 miles in other directions leads you not only to Panama, but Belize, Costa Rica, Peru, Ecuador, Brazil, and several other countries that are much better than Guatemala, and much closer than the US. In fact most of those countries have big American and European expat populations of retirees, etc. because of the good living conditions and relatively low cost of living.
Just more evidence that there's a political motivation behind the "caravan".
https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/deroy-murdock-central-american-migrants-should-caravan-to-panama
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https://twitter.com/TrollasaurusRx/status/1068354475428143106
OK, Drive by but funny as hell.
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Well, there it is: "Give us $50,000 each and we'll go back home."
Yup, "asylum seekers". ;/
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/caravan-migrants-in-mexico-demand-trump-either-let-them-in-u-s-or-pay-them-50000-each-to-go-back-home
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Yup, "asylum seekers". ;/
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/caravan-migrants-in-mexico-demand-trump-either-let-them-in-u-s-or-pay-them-50000-each-to-go-back-home
Among other demands were that deportations be halted and that asylum seekers be processed faster and in greater numbers, the San Diego Union-Tribune reported.
Okay, then.
"Gomez, Roberto. Asylum denied. Next!"
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Whelp, looks like it would have been cheaper to pay the $50K per person extortion:
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/us-pledges-more-than-10b-in-aid-for-central-america-southern-mexico-so-migrants-can-stay-put
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Man, I thought California representatives were whack. I guess Illinois has them beat. It's funny to watch it to the end where he gets up and walks out like a petulant child.
https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2018/12/20/dude-is-nuts-rep-luis-gutierrez-loses-it-over-the-word-christmas-babbles-something-about-trump-killing-baby-jesus-watch/
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Man, I thought California representatives were whack. I guess Illinois has them beat. It's funny to watch it to the end where he gets up and walks out like a petulant child.
https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2018/12/20/dude-is-nuts-rep-luis-gutierrez-loses-it-over-the-word-christmas-babbles-something-about-trump-killing-baby-jesus-watch/
I didn't go to "Bible school" either, but I still know that Herod's rampage (so far as is known) was confined to the Bethlehem area, so an Egyptian border wall would not have been certain death. Besides, it was an angel who told them to go to Egypt. An angel. Does he think Egyptian Border Patrol is going to outsmart a divine escape plan? They tried that once.
It's a good thing that guy is in Congress. Imagine how badly he would fail if he tried doing a real job.
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My news feeds must be deficient. I haven't read a single report of our Border Patrol or ICE killing children under 2 years of age.
How could I have missed it? Or is Mr. Guttierez confused> If we are killing the children, wouldn't that be safer staying on their own side of the wall?