Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => The Roundtable => Topic started by: MillCreek on November 19, 2019, 05:38:26 PM
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https://www.nhpr.org/post/sig-sauer-faces-more-lawsuits-over-p320-pistol?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social&utm_term=nprnews&fbclid=IwAR1UqGKm1PhBxbsvvPJNiYjkqyzjKKwavAexuIJJbg2MGuFrHNy8O_zHvZs#stream/0
I have not really kept up on the P320, but aren't these problems fixed now?
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https://www.nhpr.org/post/sig-sauer-faces-more-lawsuits-over-p320-pistol?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social&utm_term=nprnews&fbclid=IwAR1UqGKm1PhBxbsvvPJNiYjkqyzjKKwavAexuIJJbg2MGuFrHNy8O_zHvZs#stream/0
I have not really kept up on the P320, but aren't these problems fixed now?
The past issue had to do with the guns not being drop safe and it was fixed from every thing I've ever read.
In these more current cases they're claiming the guns just went off completely on their own while in a holster.
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Doesn’t surprise me. Sig’s quality is *expletive deleted*it these days.
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Doesn’t surprise me. Sig’s quality is *expletive deleted*it these days.
The same guy who ran Kimber into the ground, has been running Sig for awhile.
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I would say "quality control". Not really much difference I guess.
I am trying to figure what would allow a gun to fire while in a decent holster. That sounds like something happened with the internal safeties. Should that be possible? I wonder if the guns had any upgrades?
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Thread veer: Is the Sig quality control issue on everything? I am seriously considering splurging on a Canebrake Rattler/Suppressor combo (Merry Xmas to me!), and I have not seen any negative reviews yet.
Wondering if it's more on the pistol side, as I understand they have significant EBR sales to the military. Though I have to say that the Sig 1911 I bought earlier this year has been flawless.
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Or, and bear with me here...…
The sear didn't fail at the same time as the firing pin block failed, but rather two police officers were not quite as professional as they would like to believe and gave themselves Glock Leg with a Sig.
You can decide which is more likely.
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Wondering if it's more on the pistol side, as I understand they have significant EBR sales to the military. Though I have to say that the Sig 1911 I bought earlier this year has been flawless.
The 2 I bought (1911 and P238) in the last 5 years, have been pretty good. The 1911 had a lot fo misfeeds with the factory mags, Zero problems with Metalform or Chip McCormick mags.
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The 2 I bought (1911 and P238) in the last 5 years, have been pretty good. The 1911 had a lot fo misfeeds with the factory mags, Zero problems with Metalform or Chip McCormick mags.
Funny, my Sig has zero problems with the factory mags, which look like your run of the mill mags. Though I immediately switch out to Wilson Elite mags for any gun I'm going to carry.
On the other hand, my S&W 1911 wouldn't work well with an older Wilson 7 round mag. No problem with the Wilson 8 rd Elite. I actually carry that one with the factory mag (no buttpad), and the Elite (thin buttpad) as the spare.
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Or, and bear with me here...…
The sear didn't fail at the same time as the firing pin block failed, but rather two police officers were not quite as professional as they would like to believe and gave themselves Glock Leg with a Sig.
You can decide which is more likely.
A striker block is a pretty simple thing. I'm going to go with busy fingers, brain fart, or foreign material in the holster.
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Thread veer: Is the Sig quality control issue on everything? I am seriously considering splurging on a Canebrake Rattler/Suppressor combo (Merry Xmas to me!), and I have not seen any negative reviews yet.
Wondering if it's more on the pistol side, as I understand they have significant EBR sales to the military. Though I have to say that the Sig 1911 I bought earlier this year has been flawless.
Well, I bought one of those "Canebrake Rattlers" a few months ago .... no issues. Nicely made . I'm not into suppressors so mine retains that linear flash hider .... "bloop tube?" thingie that says "inert training device" on the side. It weighs the snout down a bit, but you don't want to remove it unless you need to fry your support hand for some reason. And I suppose it helps with muzzle-rise.
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I have a bunch of Sigs, although one (or 2 depending on how you count) is "new". Both have been great guns. The P238 works well, and while I was a late adopter, so I got the "new" recoil springs, mine has never hiccuped. My 229 Legion is a superb gun. Not only is the base 229 a pretty damn good gun, the Legion stuff, despite cringy marketing, is well done and worth the added money.
I've seen the pictures of bad QC on the internet, but my experience has been really positive.
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I own a P320 that was sent back for the upgrade a while back. Reliability is great. I am not as accurate with it as my favorite guns, but it isn't far off. The X-series grip frames are a big improvement. I have no idea how the gun could go off in the holster unless something was broken.
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Or, and bear with me here...…
The sear didn't fail at the same time as the firing pin block failed, but rather two police officers were not quite as professional as they would like to believe and gave themselves Glock Leg with a Sig.
You can decide which is more likely.
This.
The striker in the 320 is not cocked and released until the trigger is fully pulled. These aren't 1911s with light triggers.
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https://www.nhpr.org/post/sig-sauer-faces-more-lawsuits-over-p320-pistol?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social&utm_term=nprnews&fbclid=IwAR1UqGKm1PhBxbsvvPJNiYjkqyzjKKwavAexuIJJbg2MGuFrHNy8O_zHvZs#stream/0
I have not really kept up on the P320, but aren't these problems fixed now?
The problem of firing when dropped has been fixed. At least in new guns. The older versions need to be returned to Sig to fix.
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Doesn’t surprise me. Sig’s quality is *expletive deleted*it these days.
I don't think their quality is *expletive deleted*it, but Sig certainly promises much more than they deliver. It seems that they are always trying to do too much at once and not finishing any of it. Because of that, some quality does slip, but not all of their stuff sucks.
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I don't think their quality is *expletive deleted*it, but Sig certainly promises much more than they deliver. It seems that they are always trying to do too much at once and not finishing any of it. Because of that, some quality does slip, but not all of their stuff sucks.
That is why I said quality control. MAC did a review of their P365 SAS. The gun functioned just fine, but he found the sights to be off at pretty short distance. He was upset someone dropped the ball on that pistol and the Meprolight sight wasn't sighted in and he felt the guns should be test fired which he figured they didn't do.
Other companies have had issues, but Sig hasn't publicly acknowledged theirs or told anyone what changes they have made. Perhaps that is because of these lawsuits. I doubt it would help their case if they were publicly acknowledging issues with other pistol models.
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So I am going out today to look at a private transfer of a Sig P320-M17. Comes with two mags and a rail light and the asking price is $ 460. We'll see if it strikes my fancy.
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So I am going out today to look at a private transfer of a Sig P320-M17. Comes with two mags and a rail light and the asking price is $ 460. We'll see if it strikes my fancy.
For a bit more, cabelas had the 320 RX on sale right now
https://www.cabelas.com/product/shooting/firearms/handguns/semiautomatic-pistols/pc/104792580/c/553829580/sc/105526980/i/105529680/sig-sauer-p-pistols/2358450.uts?slotId=1
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IMO, the P320 is a very reliable gun. I think the X-series grip module is a good investment if you get one. The stock grip is a too rounded for my taste. The X-series grip is more flat sided with a larger beaver tail. Big improvement over stock IMO.
https://www.sigsauer.com/store/p320-carry-x-series-grip-module-coyote.html
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So I bought it, and it is now sitting in the safe at the gunshop for the ten day waiting period. A very nice pistol, and with two magazines and a Streamlight module, this was a good deal for $ 460 and $ 25 transfer fee. It is going to be my new nightstand gun. While I was at the gunshop, I handled a S&W M&P 2.0 9 mm, and the Sig fit my hand better and I liked the grip angle.
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So I bought it, and it is now sitting in the safe at the gunshop for the ten day waiting period. A very nice pistol, and with two magazines and a Streamlight module, this was a good deal for $ 460 and $ 25 transfer fee. It is going to be my new nightstand gun. While I was at the gunshop, I handled a S&W M&P 2.0 9 mm, and the Sig fit my hand better and I liked the grip angle.
Very cool. Enjoy it!
10 day waiting period though? =(
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Very cool. Enjoy it!
10 day waiting period though? =(
It was a combination of two things: the Bloomberg-financed initiatives 594 and 1639 in Washington state mandating that all sales and private transfers go through a FFL and that a background check be conducted for all transfers, amongst many other restrictions. For many years, if you held a Washington Concealed Pistol License, and you bought at a LGS, you had the phone NICS instant background check done at the point of sale, and could walk out with your new handgun. Private sales/transfers had no background check or paperwork requirement: you exchanged money and walked away with your new firearm. Effective 1 July 2019, the FBI decided they could no longer participate in the instant background check for the state, so it now falls to local law enforcement to do it and having a CPL means nothing in terms of the waiting period. State law gives them 10 business days to either clear or deny the transfer. The typical handgun transfer fee in this area is $ 25, although I have seen a range of $ 15 to $ 50.
For this purchase via Armslist, I went to the LGS, bought the pistol from the seller, we both filled out the sales/transfer paperwork, I filled out the 4473 and background check paperwork, paid a $ 27.19 transfer fee ($25 plus local sales tax) we shook hands and he drove away. The LGS now has to store the pistol in their safe and I have to drive back there in 10 days to pick it up. One trip to the seller and two trips to the buyer. So it is a real pain in the tuchis, and I have not heard of any significant upsurge in denied purchases as a result of the new requirements.
The same requirements now apply to the gun shows. I am a member of Washington Arms Collectors, which does a large show in Monroe or Puyallup every month. Since the change in state laws, the shows are now a ghost town. No one wants to drive 100 miles in Seattle-area traffic to go to the show, buy a handgun, and then have to make another long drive 10 days later to pick up the pistol from the FFL. The only ones making a profit at the shows now are the FFLs doing a transfer. If I am driving 85 miles to the Puyallup show and making a purchase, if there is not a FFL local to me at the show for the transfer, so I can drive locally to pick it up, I am not making any purchases at the show.
So Washington went from having amongst the best set of gun laws in the country to having some of the most strict, thanks in large part to financing from the Bloomberg group. The progressives of Seattle and King County keep trying more state legislation on modern sporting rifles, magazine capacity, ammunition sales, and a registry.
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Big lawsuit filed
20 people suing claiming over 100 incidences of the gun firing on it's own
BREAKING: Major Lawsuit Filed Against Sig Sauer
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3TsYporsnE
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This should be good.
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My initial thoughts were "user error", but now with these many new complaints I'm beginning to wonder. Though it still could just be a bunch of knuckleheads vs anything wrong with the gun. Yet if it's all knuckleheads, you'd expect to see it with several other popular striker fire handguns.
Still, this would make me think twice about appendix carry with the 320. =)
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I would tend to favor the side that says more people are stupid.
Judging by the timing, it appears all the incidents are from before Sig modified the trigger design. However, at least some of those sounded like they were not Sig's fault based on the short description. I would be curious to see the video/proof other than just owner claims.
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I would tend to favor the side that says more people are stupid.
Judging by the timing, it appears all the incidents are from before Sig modified the trigger design. However, at least some of those sounded like they were not Sig's fault based on the short description. I would be curious to see the video/proof other than just owner claims.
Oh, I did not catch that these latest suits were for the "pre-fix" 320s.
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Oh, I did not catch that these latest suits were for the "pre-fix" 320s.
The incidents he highlighted in the video were. I took a glance at the lawsuit and a number of incidents 2019 to 2022 are listed as well. I guess it will just depend on what evidence they can show. I would also be curious if there are reports on examination of the guns that "went off". Does someone still have the guns? I am kind of curious how all that would go in court.
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Sig Sauer Found NOT LIABLE In P320 Lawsuit!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-PEY2zXoWc
I don't think this is that big lawsuit.