Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: Ben on February 01, 2022, 09:17:24 AM
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This is a Subscription only story, but I've attached a relevant snippet. This is ONLY what they collected via out of business firearms dealers. I've linked to the ATF letter as well.
The U.S. federal government has amassed records comprising over 920 million gun sales from the records of firearms dealers who went out of business, amid concerns alleging the Biden administration is seeking to create a federal gun registry, which would be unlawful.
In a letter (pdf), the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms (ATF) told Rep. Michael Cloud (R-Texas) that as of November 2021, it was holding a database of 920,664,765 firearm purchase records. The letter was obtained and first reported by the Washington Free Beacon.
“This includes digital and an estimated number of hard copy records that are awaiting image conversion. It is currently estimated that 865,787,086 of those records are in digitalized format,” Daniel Board, the ATF’s assistant director of public and governmental affairs, told the congressman.
The latest report reveals the ATF is overseeing a number of gun owners records far higher than previously disclosed—the Washington Free Beacon previously reported in November 2021 that in fiscal year 2021, the ATF processed 54.7 million firearms purchase records—53.8 million in paper copies, and 887,000 more in electronic format.
https://www.theepochtimes.com/federal-government-has-records-of-over-920-million-gun-sales-report_4248720.html
https://freebeacon.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/01/Letter-Response-Rep.-Michael-Cloud-R-TX-51-x-GOP-co-signers_Federal-Gun-Registry-signed-letter.pdf
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That isn't enough. Americans need to buy more guns. Maybe more 80% receivers also.
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And yet... a Federal gun registry is illegal. I know I have some guns in those records.
But boy- that is a lot of guns! I am sure a fair number of guns are listed multiple times, or are lost or destroyed... but it makes you wonder how many guns are in the USA....
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That isn't enough. Americans need to buy more guns. Maybe more 80% receivers also.
Biden is is planning to declare anything "intended" to be made in a gun receiver is a firearm, requiring a background check.
Get your 80% receivers now.
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I am sure a fair number of guns are listed multiple times, or are lost or destroyed... but it makes you wonder how many guns are in the USA....
Your comment got me to thinking, and I'm pretty sure half the dealers I've bought from over the years are out of business now. I should categorize my guns so that the ones in this database are out and available to authorities when the ATF turns these records over to the CCP when they take over America, and the rest are "somewhere else". =D
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Biden is is planning to declare anything "intended" to be made in a gun receiver is a firearm, requiring a background check.
Get your 80% receivers now.
Which brings the question to my mind: If a manufacturer has blocks of aluminum that are meant to be forged into receivers, do those blocks have to be pre-serial numbered and protected as "firearms"? What if someone steals one?
They are trying to stretch the law to allow them to get their fingers into all gun manufacturing, but they are warping the law to the point even judges will be confused (more than they already are).
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Your comment got me to thinking, and I'm pretty sure half the dealers I've bought from over the years are out of business now. I should categorize my guns so that the ones in this database are out and available to authorities when the ATF turns these records over to the CCP when they take over America, and the rest are "somewhere else". =D
Probably need that 3rd category of guns bought from individuals that shouldn't be on any record.
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That isn't enough. Americans need to buy more guns. Maybe more 80% receivers also.
Read somewhere where they said they started grouping guns with scratched off serial numbers in with "ghost guns" which is why we suddenly have a "ghost gun crime explosion" according the the Ds and MSM.
Basically they're not only trying to drum up the numbers but paint any gun without a serial number (80%) as a crime gun.
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https://www.foxnews.com/media/rep-jim-jordan-second-amendment-under-attack-by-biden-administration (https://www.foxnews.com/media/rep-jim-jordan-second-amendment-under-attack-by-biden-administration)
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"The U.S. federal government has amassed records comprising over 920 million gun sales from the records of firearms dealers who went out of business, amid concerns alleging the Biden administration is seeking to create a federal gun registry, which would be unlawful."
Uhm...
That's been the law since the Federal purchase forms came into being decades ago.
Gun sellers hold those forms, but if they go out of business, those forms are to be transferred to BATF.
Given how far back those records go it's very likely that much of the information is obsolete.
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"The U.S. federal government has amassed records comprising over 920 million gun sales from the records of firearms dealers who went out of business, amid concerns alleging the Biden administration is seeking to create a federal gun registry, which would be unlawful."
Uhm...
That's been the law since the Federal purchase forms came into being decades ago.
Gun sellers hold those forms, but if they go out of business, those forms are to be transferred to BATF.
Given how far back those records go it's very likely that much of the information is obsolete.
I guess the story is that the AFT is scanning those documents into a searchable database they can access.
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I guess the story is that the AFT is scanning those documents into a searchable database they can access.
Also, part of it that was mentioned further down in the Epoch Times story, is that the records that the ATF previously stated they had, was a couple of orders of magnitude smaller than this number.
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I remember when I gave up my kitchen-table FFL of sending my records off somewhere back East. The scanning issue reminds me of a story I read just last week: citizenship applications are being delayed because the records are on paper, the paper is stored in an uncerground Federal records archive in Kansas, and because of COVID, the archive employees cannot go to the archive to retrieve the records. People are calling for the citizenship application process to go paperless, as has many other Federal operations.
https://www.kansascity.com/news/local/article257744998.html
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and because of COVID, the archive employees cannot go to the archive to retrieve the records.
Veering my own thread again, I don't know how standardized the covid rules are across fed.gov, but some of these remote work rules are getting ridiculous. I talked to a friend who told me her entire division is still on mandatory telework, and they have actually made it "permanent". No more than five people allowed in any of their buildings at the same time, and only if you have sufficient cause, and with supervisor approval.
I know for a fact a large portion of the jobs there can't simply be done from home, and my friend even said that a lot of people's jobs for the last several months has been "administrative" stuff like organizing their emails or taking fed.gov online "work improvement" courses. I suspect that a very large portion of fed.gov is just being paid (jokes aside) to be on leave.
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Between this, vax records, and the million other data the government is beginning to keep track of, one might wish for all those records to be somehow destroyed.
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And almost everyone of us carry one or more tracking devices on us.
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And most newer cars/trucks also have tracking. I have an app that let's me locate my wife's Explorer, annoys the hell out of her when I call her and say "since you are at "such & such" location pick something up for me.".
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Isn't there a retention schedule? I thought FFLs were allowed to discard those 4473s after 'X' number of years. Is that correct, or is that another factoid my over-active imagination conjured up?
[Edit to add] Well, there is a time period -- but it's longer than I thought.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/how-long-are-licensees-required-maintain-atf-forms-4473
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I've long thought that, because FFL's have to turn their records over to the ATF when they go out of business, the fed.gov has already had a database.
They're just making it easier to search by going digital.
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If I'm hearing this right FFLs will have 24 hours to respond to a trace request or their FFL will be revoked thus, according to the presenter, creating a way to increase the number of out of business FFLs the ATF can collect records from. Sneakly
Breaking News: ATF Looking To Revoke FFLs & Find More Out-Of-Business Records
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbrJ2Djcqhk
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Who else is wondering how many were new, versus how many were resells...?
And... Since 1968.
327,000,000 population...