Armed Polite Society
Main Forums => Politics => Topic started by: MillCreek on April 09, 2023, 10:07:31 AM
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The Senate just passed the bill and the Governor will sign it.
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/assault-weapon-ban-clears-wa-state-senate/
HB 1240 bans the sale, transfer, distribution, manufacture and importation of assault-style weapons, as distinguished by their military-style features.
It specifically lists more than 50 gun models that would be prohibited, including AR-15s, AK-47s and M-16s. It also bans guns with certain features, such as semiautomatic rifles shorter than 30 inches, those that have detachable magazines or fixed magazines with a capacity of 10 rounds or more, and those with detachable magazines that are also equipped with flash suppressors or shrouded barrels
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Murder rate should fall to zero by morning.
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It specifically lists more than 50 gun models that would be prohibited, including AR-15s, AK-47s and M-16s. It also bans guns with certain features, such as semiautomatic rifles shorter than 30 inches, those that have detachable magazines or fixed magazines with a capacity of 10 rounds or more, and those with detachable magazines that are also equipped with flash suppressors or shrouded barrels[/i]
Concerning these bans, the bolded part is what always scares me the most. It's just SO open to interpretation, and we know that the benefit of the doubt on that interpretation will always benefit the DA and LE, and not the citizen.
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Ruger is going to sell a lot of Mini-14s and Mini-30s in Washington state starting in 5 - 4 - 3 - 2 ...
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Interesting to note that they banned the SKS by name. I haven't seen the fixed, ten round SKS banned before. They also banned any semi-auto centerfire rifle with a "Forward pistol, vertical, angled, or other grip designed for use by the nonfiring hand to improve control". I thought the purpose of a forearm, at least for the last couple centuries, was to improve control by holding the gun with the nonfiring hand. So how does that not mean any normal rifle with a forearm? Also, normal semi-auto shotguns are banned if they have a thumbhole stock.
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Ruger is going to sell a lot of Mini-14s and Mini-30s in Washington state starting in 5 - 4 - 3 - 2 ...
No. Although the Ruger 14 is not mentioned by name, it comes under the banned features items in the legislation.
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Interesting to note that they banned the SKS by name. I haven't seen the fixed, ten round SKS banned before. They also banned any semi-auto centerfire rifle with a "Forward pistol, vertical, angled, or other grip designed for use by the nonfiring hand to improve control". I thought the purpose of a forearm, at least for the last couple centuries, was to improve control by holding the gun with the nonfiring hand. So how does that not mean any normal rifle with a forearm? Also, normal semi-auto shotguns are banned if they have a thumbhole stock.
I'm guessing that besides the standard vertical grip, they are wanting to target these:
https://www.sportsmans.com/shooting-gear-gun-supplies/gun-parts-magazines/rifle-parts/rifle-grips/magpul-m-lok-afg-angled-fore-grip-compatible-with-the-m-lok-slot-system/p/p40164
(https://www.sportsmans.com/medias/magpul-mloktrade-afgreg-angled-fore-grip-compatible-with-the-mlok-slot-system-1404784-1.jpg?context=bWFzdGVyfGltYWdlc3wzMjY4MnxpbWFnZS9qcGVnfGltYWdlcy9oYzQvaDE4Lzg4Mjg3NDE3MTM5NTAuanBnfGQ0MmIyMGQ4NzY2Y2FlOTlmNDQxY2IwZThhMmQ1NjQ0NTI1ZTMzY2Q5Y2ZjNWIwNjY3MzY5MGMwNzg0MDAwYzE)
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Looks like it's even worse than California's ban. At least Cali allows the SKS and Ruger Mini.
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Looks like it's even worse than California's ban. At least Cali allows the SKS and Ruger Mini.
OR and WA have been making CA look like a purple state as of late.
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Here is the full text: https://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2023-24/Pdf/Bills/House%20Bills/1240-S.pdf?q=20230409095903
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A Washington law (SHB 1639) a couple of years ago mandated a 10 day waiting period and passing a safety course before acquiring a semi-automatic rifle. A new law also just passed extends those requirements to handguns as well. So this was a bad year for firearms law in Washington state.
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(ii) A semiautomatic rifle that has an overall length of less30
than 30 inches;
Pretty much covers most bullpups
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WA has been taken over by the leftists, Executive, Legislative and Judicial branches, Media, and Billionaire Money.
And the voting public, of whom the vast majority live in the city hive. Essentially, like everywhere, the cities rule the whole state, thank you USSC https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reynolds_v._Sims
So they will be doing whatever they want, end of story.
WA was a really good place to live in 1975.
VDH said it best, "anarchotyranny", where the criminals run free and the force of the state is used to suppress the normals.
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This has been in the works for WA state for a few years now. I used to make pilgrimages to Olympia every year, at least twice a year, to attend the 2A rally on the Capitol grounds and then try to get on the docket to speak against the ban. From what I understand they don't allow guns at protests/rallies anymore but I am not sure since I no longer attend.
@MillCreek , did they do rallies this session and were they well attended? Were there masses of people trying to get into the legislative session either in the gallery or to speak?
I just visited the Spokane Gun Trader forum where I used to do a lot of lurking.posting/etc and read through the Firearms law section. Holy crap, in the slightly less than 3 years since I left there things have gone straight to crap. Magazine capacity laws and they can't even sell standard capacity magazines on the forum anymore. Now the AWB. A few other laws or proposed laws for "public safety" because they "will save lives".
I have never been happier to be away from that place.
bob
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OR and WA have been making CA look like a purple state as of late.
Don't limit it to those states. IL-ANNOY went nuts in January with a badly worded law that is making (at last count) over 170 firearms illegal. This includes the Ruger 10/22, the Remington 870, and any rifle with a removable magazine where the magazine can be "altered".
Check out this thread.
https://armedpolitesociety.com/index.php?topic=68250.0
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@MillCreek , did they do rallies this session and were they well attended? Were there masses of people trying to get into the legislative session either in the gallery or to speak?
The number of speakers against the AWB far outnumbered the speakers in favor of the AWB, but now both houses of the legislature are dominated by urban Democrats whose constituents are overwhelmingly in favor of more firearms laws. None of my representatives in this area were in favor of it. My next door neighbor is a gunsmith who recently opened his own shop in town. Business has dropped so much that he is now selling off his machine tools with an eye to closing the shop. I am one of the few remaining Seattle-area natives, and the politics have certainly changed a lot since I was a kid.
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I'm guessing that besides the standard vertical grip, they are wanting to target these:
https://www.sportsmans.com/shooting-gear-gun-supplies/gun-parts-magazines/rifle-parts/rifle-grips/magpul-m-lok-afg-angled-fore-grip-compatible-with-the-m-lok-slot-system/p/p40164
(https://www.sportsmans.com/medias/magpul-mloktrade-afgreg-angled-fore-grip-compatible-with-the-mlok-slot-system-1404784-1.jpg?context=bWFzdGVyfGltYWdlc3wzMjY4MnxpbWFnZS9qcGVnfGltYWdlcy9oYzQvaDE4Lzg4Mjg3NDE3MTM5NTAuanBnfGQ0MmIyMGQ4NzY2Y2FlOTlmNDQxY2IwZThhMmQ1NjQ0NTI1ZTMzY2Q5Y2ZjNWIwNjY3MzY5MGMwNzg0MDAwYzE)
I'm sure that's the ultra-deadly fore grip they are trying to ban. It's just the actual language seems to say anything other than a barrel with no forearm at all. So if you had, say a Remington 740, it would be banned because the wooden forearm is designed to be held by the non-firing hand just like the legislation says. True, they may not interpret it that way. But a prosecutor eager to make a statement might take that view.
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Once my wife’s family are gone I hope she’ll be amenable to leaving this ridiculous state.
Sucks. Probably the nicest place to live in the country in terms of geography and climate.
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Are groups going to challenge this under Bruen? If I recall correctly the lower court decision upholding Maryland's similar ban was vacated and the case remanded back after SCOTUS dropped Bruen on us.
I think these various AWBs at the state level are going to end up legalizing M4s when it's all said and done.
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Are groups going to challenge this under Bruen? If I recall correctly the lower court decision upholding Maryland's similar ban was vacated and the case remanded back after SCOTUS dropped Bruen on us.
I think these various AWBs at the state level are going to end up legalizing M4s when it's all said and done.
This is already being discussed at the state 2A level. Lots of people are pinning their hopes on this to reverse the magazine and AWB bans. We will see, I guess.
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Any idea how long it might take these cases to reach the Supreme Court? They blatantly contradict Bruen.
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Any idea how long it might take these cases to reach the Supreme Court? They blatantly contradict Bruen.
Usually several years.
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I'm sure that's the ultra-deadly fore grip they are trying to ban. It's just the actual language seems to say anything other than a barrel with no forearm at all. So if you had, say a Remington 740, it would be banned because the wooden forearm is designed to be held by the non-firing hand just like the legislation says. True, they may not interpret it that way. But a prosecutor eager to make a statement might take that view.
Believe me, I'm right there with you on potential misuse of nebulous language, made nebulous on purpose.
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I'm sure that's the ultra-deadly fore grip they are trying to ban. It's just the actual language seems to say anything other than a barrel with no forearm at all. So if you had, say a Remington 740, it would be banned because the wooden forearm is designed to be held by the non-firing hand just like the legislation says. True, they may not interpret it that way. But a prosecutor eager to make a statement might take that view.
Do you know how the forend on an M-1 is in 2 pieces? the lower part is the stock but the upper part is to help protect some of the inner workings of the rifle. It is that "nebulous language" that is getting the M-1 BANNED in IL-ANNOY.
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At the top of bill
The legislature finds and declares that
gun violence is a threat to the public health and safety of
Washingtonians. Assault weapons are civilian versions of weapons
created for the military and are designed to kill humans quickly and
efficiently. For this reason the legislature finds that assault
weapons are "like" "M-16 rifles" and thus are "weapons most useful in
military service."
So now "assault" weapons are civilian versions of weapons created for the military.
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US V. Miller is still case law, right? It didn't get overturned when I wasn't paying attention?
I only ask because the MAIN holding in Miller was:
Only weapons that have a reasonable relationship to the effectiveness of a well-regulated militia under the Second Amendment are free from government regulation.
IIRC most other AWB's go the route of "these weapons are extra dangerous, and as such can be regulated". By going for the "These weapons are most useful to a military" Washington state may have stepped on their crank a little.
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At the top of bill
So now "assault" weapons are civilian versions of weapons created for the military.
Wasn’t the ruling from Miller that only guns suitable to military service were protected by the 2A? This would be in direct violation of Miller.
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Wasn’t the ruling from Miller that only guns suitable to military service were protected by the 2A? This would be in direct violation of Miller.
Yes, that is what Miller says. This is what most courts in the USA said up until Miller. A few courts thought all weapons were protected. Most said only military weapons were protected. Nobody even suggested that military weapons weren't covered.
However, it looks like the current court probably considers semi-automatic rifles protected under the Second, and not actual military machine guns, due to the absurd "dangerous and unusual" fantasy they have concocted. English common law said there was no right to carry dangerous and usual weapons "to the terror of the public"- ie, brandish them... the courts recently twisted this to imply that there is no right to own "dangerous or unusual weapons"... even if the only reason they are unusual is that they are heavily regulated/banned already.
It is an absurd circular argument, but they aren't going to let us own machine guns.
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I thought this was a nice reminder of how silly it is to ban extra-scary guns.
https://twitchy.com/samj-3930/2023/04/14/amy-swearer-schools-and-reality-checks-whiny-gun-grabber-al-franken-in-epic-thread-on-weapons-of-war/
Just one example:
I always bring up "you can give a mass shooter a lever-action rifle and lots of people still die" and historically it's more true than you realize. In 1928, a drugged-out Chinese cook killed 11 Chinese immigrants in California using a Winchester rifle.https://t.co/6KsMkUs5ly
— Amy Swearer (@AmySwearer) April 14, 2023
Nearly 100 years later, also in California, a Chinese immigrant would again try to kill as many people of Chinese descent as possible.
Instead of a lever-action rifle, he'd use a literal "assault pistol" to fire into a dance hall on the Lunar New Year.
He'd also kill 11.
— Amy Swearer (@AmySwearer) April 14, 2023
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At the top of bill
So now "assault" weapons are civilian versions of weapons created for the military.
Which ironically, are the exact weapons protected in US v. Miller
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Signed and in effect
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I wonder how many lawsuits will be filed by end of day? Any bets on how long the injunction takes?
Brad
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The Ninth Circuit includes Washington... and similar cases are already in front of an excellent judge.
Pardon the moronic leftist twaddle in the article.
https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2023-03-07/thanks-to-supreme-court-california-gun-laws-hinge-on-absurd-historical-analysis
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An article I read said that WA is the tenth state to do this. I actually didn't know it was up to ten now.
As an aside, where guns are concerned, it sure looks like the dividing up of red vs blue states is AR bans for the blue, and permitless carry for the red. On that front, we are certainly winning, but best not get complacent.
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What? The conservatives already have their guns and we will never catch up says to left. Oh well,tough shyte, file it under unintended consequences. :rofl:
https://www.vice.com/en/article/xgwxkq/washington-gun-ban
bob
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An article I read said that WA is the tenth state to do this. I actually didn't know it was up to ten now.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assault_weapons_legislation_in_the_United_States#State_assault_weapon_bans
Eleven if one includes D.C.
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I'm glad that in at least one state that the murder rate has now dropped to zero because no deadly weapons are available to us commoners.
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Aero Precision has filed suit (with others)
https://www.aeroprecisionusa.com/the-hangar/aero-precision-files-lawsuit-against-washington-assault-weapons-ban/
Kinda want to go buy some lowers from them now. Not that I need more, but still.....
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^^^One of my best builds is with Aero Precision. I toured through the Tacoma factory once, and it was very impressive. They started off making parts for Boeing.
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US V. Miller is still case law, right? It didn't get overturned when I wasn't paying attention?
I only ask because the MAIN holding in Miller was:
IIRC most other AWB's go the route of "these weapons are extra dangerous, and as such can be regulated". By going for the "These weapons are most useful to a military" Washington state may have stepped on their crank a little.
Didn't either the Heller or McDonald decisions address Miller? I don't remember what they said.
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Heads-up for our Idaho members: a friend of mine works at the Boise Cabela's. They just took delivery of 400 "assault weapons" from the WA stores. For reasons unclear to me, they have to be sold as "used", so there might some deals to be had.
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What? The conservatives already have their guns and we will never catch up says to left. Oh well,tough shyte, file it under unintended consequences. :rofl:
https://www.vice.com/en/article/xgwxkq/washington-gun-ban
bob
Yet by left-wing "logic" that just means the righties will die more.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/zm5xvy/guns-make-you-and-your-family-less-safe-not-more