Author Topic: Holster help needed  (Read 6294 times)

T.O.M.

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Holster help needed
« on: November 17, 2010, 03:40:29 PM »
Long story, still under investigation.  Struggle in my courthouse between subject and security officer.  Security officer's M&P .40 cal takes a tumble out of his Blackhowk SERPA holster, and holster has a belt loop broken in the ordeal as well.  No one hurt, gun recovered, subject in custody.

Head of security (good friend and shooting buddy) wants to change policy on guns and holsters.  Officers and bailiffs must supply their own approved .40 caliber handgun, mags, belts and gear.  Court provides cuffs, ammo, and OC spray.  Only requirement for the holster (old policy before my buddy took over) is that the holster must have "some type of retention device."  My buddy wants to require Level II or higher holsters.  The problem is that the uniform is blazer, trousers, shirt and tie, for which each officer gets a stipend.  Everyone wears a narrow belt (1.25") and matching holster, or a shoulder rig of some kind.  before he changes policy, he wants to know what options are available for a concealable security hlster.  Only one I know of is the Safariland.  Any others out there you all know of?  Budget is in the toilet, so buying a special order run with narrow loops for all officer is probably out of the question, and these guys aren't paid enough to require that they spend a fortune on a holster.
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dogmush

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2010, 04:16:45 PM »

Boomhauer

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2010, 06:41:54 PM »
Currently Safariland is probably the only "security" type holsters I'd trust (as in other than the standard thumbbreak)

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dogmush

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2010, 07:28:59 PM »
My time in Iraq made me not a huge fan of SERPA's (clunky, not that secure, leads to finger on trigger draws).  Which is the only "retention" holster I'm familiar with.

Avenger, what makes you not like the rest?

FWIW, my tactical rig is a Kydex molded (snaps in) with thumb-break, and Fas-Tex buckle if needed. But it's not concealable at all, so no help for this.  (Demon on sholder whispers "Go for the thigh rig.)

vaskidmark

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2010, 07:31:38 PM »
Are we talking "concealed" concealed or merely something covered by a suit coat/sports jacket/blazer?

And regarding shoulder holsters - I'm not one of those bothered by it, but apparent;y there are a large number of folks out there that their panties in a wad about the muzzle sweeping 2/3rds of the known universe during the draw stroke.  Will that be a problem?

Of course you could always call the nearest US Marshall's office and ask what they use, and tell everyone if it's good enough for them it's good enough for you. =D

stay safe.
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Boomhauer

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2010, 07:52:26 PM »
Avenger, what makes you not like the rest?



Mainly durability/reliability. From cheap injection molded holsters to retention locks failing (like how Serpas tend to get clogged with grit and such)...

Safariland is the brand that's been known for quality when it comes to holsters with security.

Quote from: Ben
Holy hell. It's like giving a loaded gun to a chimpanzee...

Quote from: bluestarlizzard
the last thing you need is rabies. You're already angry enough as it is.

OTOH, there wouldn't be a tweeker left in Georgia...

Quote from: Balog
BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD! SKULLS FOR THE SKULL THRONE! AND THROW SOME STEAK ON THE GRILL!

T.O.M.

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2010, 10:34:04 PM »
Skid,

It's casual concealment.  Everyone knows they're armed.
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Ryan in Maine

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2010, 11:22:32 PM »
Hm. Not sure. I'd say step 1 ought to be wider belts though.

vaskidmark

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2010, 11:45:39 PM »
Hm. Not sure. I'd say step 1 ought to be wider belts though.

Not sure wider is necessary.  Maybe just swap current belt for a "true" gun belt - thicker, stiffer, made to hold up a holster and some bat-belt stuff.

And as for holsters, I'd say they would be better served with OWB holsters if not actual duty holsters/

stay safe.
If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of a constitutional privilege.

Hey you kids!! Get off my lawn!!!

They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2010, 11:50:35 PM »
Safariland. They make very good stuff. Nary a bad word about them - can't say the same for Blackhawk! at all.

Ken Null's SMZ shoulder rig is a very secure shoulder rig. Will function even if the snap fails, but I don't know if he makes one for the M&P. He ships it out extremely fast, too.

seeker_two

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2010, 06:11:20 AM »
Not sure wider is necessary.  Maybe just swap current belt for a "true" gun belt - thicker, stiffer, made to hold up a holster and some bat-belt stuff.


Take a good look at the Wilderness Tactical  ring belts...esp. the Frequent Flier 5-stitch belts. I love mine....

http://www.thewilderness.com/storepinnacle/index.php?p=product&id=2503&parent=142

http://www.thewilderness.com/storepinnacle/index.php?p=product&id=2504&parent=142
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Fly320s

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2010, 09:20:35 AM »
If belt size is a concern, several companies make thick, wide gun belts that taper to becomea thin dress belt in front.

As for the holster, Safariland and Bianchi both make what you want. Avoid Blackhawk.
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T.O.M.

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2010, 09:29:33 AM »
My buddy has a true gunbelt cut in 1.25" width, which is the same size as the belt loops in his holster.  He wears an now-discontinued Don Hume Level 2+ holster, and he has a second in storage for when he wears this one out (bought a gently used one from an officer that left for another job.)  The biggest problem I see is that the officers must wear Docker-type pants, most of which will not accomodate a really wide belt.  Most of the security holsters have belt loops for 1.5" and up belts.  No one wants the holster shifting around on the belt, and with some of the securoty rigs, you really need a good holster to belt fit to get a consistent and smooth draw.  And, wearing a duty belt kind of defeats the purpose of having them dressed in jackets and ties.  The judges don't want security looking like uniformed cops.

A couple of the females wear shoulder rigs, so that they can wear the more fashionable short jackets and not expose their weapons all the time.

I'll do more research on the holsters, and the Safariland especially.
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Matthew Carberry

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2010, 12:41:20 AM »
Take a good look at the Wilderness Tactical  ring belts...esp. the Frequent Flier 5-stitch belts. I love mine....

http://www.thewilderness.com/storepinnacle/index.php?p=product&id=2503&parent=142

http://www.thewilderness.com/storepinnacle/index.php?p=product&id=2504&parent=142

The problem with Wilderness belts, the "rigger belt" type anyway, is they aren't appropriate for any trousers but jeans and then not in a professional capacity.

Gotta have leather.
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seeker_two

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #14 on: November 19, 2010, 05:34:41 AM »
The problem with Wilderness belts, the "rigger belt" type anyway, is they aren't appropriate for any trousers but jeans and then not in a professional capacity.

Gotta have leather.

Odd....I wear nothing but trousers (not jeans), and the FF belt works just fine in my profession (educational setting). And it's a lot more comfortable than the leather gunbelts I've tried.

What's the normal dress code for your people?....
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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2010, 10:11:12 AM »
The problem with Wilderness belts, the "rigger belt" type anyway, is they aren't appropriate for any trousers but jeans and then not in a professional capacity.

Gotta have leather.

If you're in a capacity that requires you to wear a gun, I'd say that making that slight wardrobe adjustment would be worth the fashion faux pa.

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Matthew Carberry

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #16 on: November 19, 2010, 03:29:02 PM »
In banking or marketing you need dress slacks and shirts/jacket if not a suit, dress leather belts and shoes.  Even on "casual days" it's khakis, collared shirt and leather shoes. 

Maybe it's just me but my belt needs to match my shoes in material and color.  Rigger's belts are for non-office work or "The Wilderness".

And JJ, there's no excuse for a fashion faux pas if it can be avoided.  =D
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"As for affecting your movement, your Rascal should be able to achieve the the same speeds no matter what holster rig you are wearing."

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2010, 03:55:34 PM »
In banking or marketing you need dress slacks and shirts/jacket if not a suit, dress leather belts and shoes.  Even on "casual days" it's khakis, collared shirt and leather shoes. 

Maybe it's just me but my belt needs to match my shoes in material and color.  Rigger's belts are for non-office work or "The Wilderness".

And JJ, there's no excuse for a fashion faux pas if it can be avoided.  =D
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SADShooter

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #18 on: November 19, 2010, 04:01:20 PM »
If we can't expect proper attire from professionals in a court of law, we might as well open the gates and have tickertape and a brass band ready for the barbarians.
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seeker_two

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #19 on: November 19, 2010, 09:36:08 PM »
Impressed yet befogged, they grasped at his vivid leading phrases, seeing only their surface meaning, and missing the deeper current of his thought.

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gunsmith

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Re: Holster help needed
« Reply #21 on: November 21, 2010, 07:16:06 PM »
I am always surprised that people will carry a gun that cost 4 to 700 bucks but balk at spending over 20 for a holster. I wasn't making bank as an armed security guard but I still
got the best retention holster I could find-now, years and years later it still works great.
Cant they take all that stuff off for taxes?

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