Arizona Man Arrested After Guns Found in Truck at National Mall

[Sawdust]

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/11/04/arizona-man-arrested-guns-truck-national-mall/

What the heck is "unregistered ammunition"?!

Sawdust

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

dc is a very peculiar place

in this case i suspect the reporter shoulda said unregistered  gun charges  plus if i remember right in dc ammo has to be kept seperate from gun in some "special " way so theres likely some ammo charge that would make my 9 year old go wtf?

[HankB]

Maybe it's a case of Arizona Plates = Probable Cause to search?

[vaskidmark]

It's bad reporterology-speak.  Unregistered firearms - even assuming his camper is his home for purposes of DC law.  Don't know how they are going to deal with the charges re: the ammo as Heller said guns could be loaded inside the home.

The point being this is the second jerk who brought his guns with him to DC.  They let the preacher off, but I'll bet this guy gets a vacation in deepest SE Wahington, D.C. http://doc.dc.gov/doc/cwp/view,a,3,q,491403.asp   The question is, how many locals will they let out so as to be able to keep him for the full term?

Again - why are folks bringing guns to DC?  I mean, besides the fact that they are probably needed.

stay safe.

[Fly320s]

Maybe he is passing through on vacation.

In any case, he wasn't harming anyone, so there is no need to arrest him.

[MechAg94]

So you think it would be well known by now that if you bring guns to D.C., KEEP THEM HIDDEN!!

[mtnbkr]

Maybe he is passing through on vacation.

Where he was caught is quite a ways from thru-traveler lanes.  Either he was lost or there on purpose.  That said, a lost tourist was my first thought as well.

In any case, he wasn't harming anyone, so there is no need to arrest him.

No arguments there. 

Chris

[Sawdust]

I would really like to know what it was that the cop saw that made a search justified.

Sawdust

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

i wonder if it was the camper with all the "interesting" signs plastered all over it. the one channeling alex jones

[GigaBuist]

Again - why are folks bringing guns to DC?

I'd imagine that somewhere between 1 and 5% of the general population has any idea what DC's gun laws are and it probably overlaps heavily with the licensed CCW population.

Keeping a firearm in your mobile home, which is your home when parked, would be a no-brainer in most parts of the country.

[freakazoid]

Maybe he thought that with the Heller ruling it was now ok?

[mtnbkr]

i wonder if it was the camper with all the "interesting" signs plastered all over it. the one channeling alex jones

The camper they showed on the TV last night didn't appear to have any stickers on it.

I'd imagine that somewhere between 1 and 5% of the general population has any idea what DC's gun laws are and it probably overlaps heavily with the licensed CCW population.

Considering many people think it's illegal to have guns in many places, I would say the number is higher than that.  DC being what it is, folks think any SD tool is illegal (or should be).

Maybe he thought that with the Heller ruling it was now ok?

Most likely reason assuming he wasn't merely a lost tourist.

Chris

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

well one thing i do know.  if he drove in there and parked he knows how to drive. i drove cab in dc and have a lotta miles towing and the only way i'd drive a trailer into dc and try to park would be for the second coming

[230RN]

Schlosser says the unidentified man would be charged with unregistered ammunition and firearms offenses.

What the heck is "unregistered ammunition"?!

Sawdust

That was my first question.  Maybe it should have been written, "unregistered firearms and ammuniton offenses."

The truck was parked along the National Mall near the National Air and Space Museum Wednesday afternoon, when an officer noticed something suspicious inside.

I would really like to know what it was that the cop saw that made a search justified.

Sawdust

That was my second question.  If it was an "articulable probable cause," then "articulate" it.

Them damned Country Hicks (from Arizona in this case) ought to know that when they visit our great big highly sophisticated cities, they have to bring a great big highly sophisticated lawyer with them.

I think that poor guy (assuming nothing malicious was being contemplated) is going to be railroaded.

I hear the train a comin'
It's rollin' 'round the bend...

And now his truck and camper trailer are going to be impounded somewhere at daily charges, plus the cost of towing both of them...

Some vacation, huh? Poor SOB.

Terry, 230RN

[Scout26]

IIRC, DC has a requirement that each round of ammunition must also be registered, much like registering your firearm.

 

[Phantom Warrior]

In any case, he wasn't harming anyone, so there is no need to arrest him.

But, but, the firearms WEREN'T REGISTERED!  Don't you get it!?

Yeah, DC can pretty much have a slice... 

[Hawkmoon]

That was my second question.  If it was an "articulable probable cause," then "articulate" it.

You are mixing your metaphors.

"Articulable" comes from Terry, and Terry does not require probable cause. It requires "reasonable suspicion, based on clearly articulable facts, that a crime has been committed, is being committed, or is about to be committed."

In this case, based on what little the article gives us, the officer saw something he thought was suspicious and called for a bomb-sniffing dog. The dog alerted on the smell of the gun (or the ammo). That's the probable cause for the search, right there: the trained sniffer alerted.

[230RN]

OK.

But

reasonable suspicion, based on clearly articulable facts, that a crime has been committed, is being committed, or is about to be committed

the officer saw something he thought was suspicious

So what was the basis for the suspicion?

Let me rephrase that:

That was my second question.  If it was a they were "articulable," then let's hear them "articulated."

Better, no?

Terry, 230RN

http://library.thinkquest.org/J0112392/metaphor.html

[vaskidmark]

Seems a generator, wires, batteries & propane tanks all in close proximity may be the RAS we were wondering about.  Not completely sure, because of bad syntax again.  Were the wires hooked to the generator, as the sentence structure seems to imply, or were the wires hooked to the batteries and propane tanks?  Everybody's third grade teacher wants to know.

http://www.azcentral.com/12news/news/articles/2010/11/04/20101104washington-dc-marana-man-guns.html#ixzz14SCxq8ch
Associated Press - November 4, 2010 6:34 PM ET

WASHINGTON (AP) - U.S. Park Police say propane tanks wired to car batteries on a trailer parked on the National Mall led to an hourslong closure of traffic through the area.

Charging documents released Thursday state that an officer called in the bomb squad to the National Mall on Wednesday after he spotted the tanks, batteries and a generator with wires attached to it in the bed of the truck towing the trailer.

Police say truck owner 66-year-old James Patock of Marana, Ariz., who said he had been in the area for about two weeks, told them he had visited the NRA building and had guns in the trailer. Inside, police say they found firearms, ammunition, identification with different names, a laptop and cameras.

Patock is charged with carrying a pistol without a license and unregistered ammunition and firearms offenses.

*********
The Metropolitan Police Department bomb squad was called in to investigate the truck and trailer. Shortly after, Patock told officers he had guns in the trailer, but it was home and stated he had a right to possess guns in his home.
No bombs were found in the trailer, but a search found a .223 caliber rifle, a .243 caliber rifle barrel, a .22 caliber rifle, a .357 caliber pistol, and boxes of ammunition of various calibers. Patock did not have a license to carry the pistol in the District of Columbia, and none of the firearms were registered to him in D.C.


 See also:
http://www.azcentral.com/12news/news/articles/2010/11/04/20101104washington-dc-marana-man-guns.html

http://www.kgun9.com/Global/story.asp?S=13448240


Too bad he does not have contacts:  http://www.johnsoncitypress.com/News/article.php?ID=80252

stay safe.

*edited to fix link

[Grandpa Shooter]

There has always been, and will continue to be, stupid people, some of whom own guns.  As far as I know, there are no laws prohibiting stupidity, YET.

[HeroHog]

He had a good point though. That trailer WAS his home and guns are allowed in your HOME. It would be interesting to see what a Good lawyer could do with that.

[Hawkmoon]

OK.

But
 

So what was the basis for the suspicion?

I am not the captain of the LEO cheerleading squad by any means, but I have to acknowledge that if I were a patrol officer on the National Mall in D.C. and I spotted a truck parked ... unoccupied ... with a bunch of wires connecting a battery to some propane tanks, I might be inclined to at least harbor some suspicion that it might be a bomb. I could articulate that suspicion pretty clearly, I think. And I anticipate that a judge would probably be inclined to agree that such suspicion just might be "reasonable," especially considering that for the past few days the news has been dominated (aside from the elections) by news of bombs here, there and everywhere.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

statist!