Author Topic: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor  (Read 1192 times)

MillCreek

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vaskidmark

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2013, 01:06:57 PM »
I'm pretty sure I'm going to get some opposition to this, but that's never stopped me before and does not stop me now.  The word "hero" is thrown around way to lightly.  Most who are being labled as "hero" are IMHO just folks going about their daily job - one most of us, for varying reasons, have decided are "too hard" or "too demanding" or "too dangerous" or "too ___" for the rest of us.  Cops, firefighters, and military service members are the prime examples.

I don't doubt that society needs heroes today and is faced with a near-absolute desert of candidates.  Because of that we elevate folks that do stuff we choose not to do/are afraid to do/know is essential but below our perceived social status.

The Medal of Honor is awarded
Quote
to the individual who, while as an active member of the Army, distinguishes himself or herself conspicuously, at the risk of his or her life above and beyond the call of duty, by courage and intrepidity. The act justifying award of the medal must be performed while fighting an enemy of the United States, or while involved in conflict with an opposing/foreign force or while serving with friendly foreign forces engaged in combat against an opposing military in which the United States is not a belligerent party. The act or acts of heroism must have required a risk of life and the individual have displayed personal bravery or self-sacrifice so extraordinary as to set the individual apart from his or her comrades.


http://usmilitary.about.com/od/armymedals/ss/moh_5.htm

The citation states "When Chinese Communist Forces viciously attacked friendly elements, Chaplain Kapaun calmly walked through withering enemy fire in order to provide comfort and medical aid to his comrades. When they found themselves surrounded by the enemy, the able-bodied men were ordered to evacuate. Chaplain Kapaun, fully aware of his certain capture, elected to stay behind with the wounded."   His conduct meets the criteria noted above.

But then we have
Quote
Fellow captives said the chaplain's "most courageous acts followed in a prisoner of war camp, where Kapaun died in May 1951. They said he saved hundreds of soldiers' lives using faith and the skills honed on his family's farm near Pilsen," the newspaper reports.

The Eagle adds:  "In the prison camp, he shaped roofing tin into cooking pots so prisoners could boil water, which prevented dysentery. He picked lice off sick prisoners. He stole food from his captors and shared it with his starving comrades.

"Most of all, Kapaun rallied all of them, as they starved during subzero temperatures, to stay alive."
- which seem to fall short of the criteria for award of the MOH.  It's that "risk of life" part that seems to be missing.

Those, and other activities mentioned here http://www.frkapaun.org/frkapaunbooklet.html seem to form the basis for the drive for beatification and eventual canonization.  IIRC there are supposed to be miracles involved - need two (2) unless you are declared a martyr, in which case you need one that happened after being declared a martyr..  Have I missed the mentioning of the miracles he performed?

Don't get me wrong.  Fr. Kapuan deserves recognition for what he did in the POW camp  But what he did there does not rise to the level of MOH, and without the miracles he does not meet the criteria for saithood.  http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1916625/posts

I have no theological dog in this hunt.  From a theological standpoint I do not care if the Holy Roman Catholic Church declares this guy a saint or a pepperoni pizza.  But from the social perspective, I am greatly concerned about the relaxing of standards for declaring someone a hero or a saint.  If that trend continues, it's very likely I will be declared a hero for writing this and eligible for sainthood based on the miracles of 1) not being struck by hellfire and lightening as I wrote these words, and 2) my writing this not causing the Earth to stop spinning on its axis, let alone not causing the reversal of the directioon of rotation.

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2013, 05:45:33 PM »
Skid, I agree with your general position.  Hero is a word used too lightly.  But,, maybe that's because all too often, people don't do  what's right because it's too hard, or too dangerous, or just too darn inconvenient.

In this specific situation, I disagree.  Take it all together, first off.  The awatd is for it all, not just the POW actions.  Second, I imagine stealing food put him at risk, and you can term it heroicc because he did it for the benefit of others.  This one feels good to me, especially in an era where drone flying can get you a deccoration higher that  a Bronze Star.  Yeah, I know they are reconsidering that one, but that it was ever seriously proposed that way speaks volumes.
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2013, 09:24:46 PM »
I'm pretty sure I'm going to get some opposition to this, but that's never stopped me before and does not stop me now.  The word "hero" is thrown around way to lightly.  Most who are being labled as "hero" are IMHO just folks going about their daily job - one most of us, for varying reasons, have decided are "too hard" or "too demanding" or "too dangerous" or "too ___" for the rest of us.  Cops, firefighters, and military service members are the prime examples.

...

But then we have  - which seem to fall short of the criteria for award of the MOH.  It's that "risk of life" part that seems to be missing.

...

Don't get me wrong.  Fr. Kapuan deserves recognition for what he did in the POW camp  But what he did there does not rise to the level of MOH, and without the miracles he does not meet the criteria for saithood.  http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/1916625/posts

I have no theological dog in this hunt.  From a theological standpoint I do not care if the Holy Roman Catholic Church declares this guy a saint or a pepperoni pizza.  But from the social perspective, I am greatly concerned about the relaxing of standards for declaring someone a hero or a saint.  If that trend continues, it's very likely I will be declared a hero for writing this and eligible for sainthood based on the miracles of 1) not being struck by hellfire and lightening as I wrote these words, and 2) my writing this not causing the Earth to stop spinning on its axis, let alone not causing the reversal of the directioon of rotation.


I like your ideas and I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

Yes, agreed completely. It seems anybody who does anything out of the ordinary these days must be declared a "hero" by/in the mass media. All this accomplishes is the devaluation of heroism. Once everyone is a hero just for waking up and getting out of bed, how do we adequately describe and honor those few who do things that formerly would have been described as "heroic"?
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wmenorr67

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2013, 09:32:05 PM »
My take, being a current member of our Armed Forces, is that I agree all too often the word "hero" is thrown around way too much today.  I know I have been referred to as a hero but I know that I am not.

A few times I have had a meal or drink bought for me because I was in uniform.  I do my best to turn it down but only once did I win out.  I appreciate all the thanks I get from people for my service.

Now that is out of the way, Chaplain Kapuan IMHO did serve above and beyond and if one were to ever deserve the MOH he is one that does.
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Lee

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #5 on: April 13, 2013, 12:48:38 PM »
Is the term abused...yes.  In this instance...no.
Not only did he put his life at risk- he did it with plenty of forethought and on multiple occasions.
Plenty of deserving heroes become "heroic" only under the influence of adrenaline and in chaotic one time circumstances.

French G.

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #6 on: April 13, 2013, 01:54:06 PM »
He gave away his food in a starvation camp, pretty much a guaranteed sacrificial death there. By defying the guards in performing mass and easter services he most likely saved more than a few lives through the hope he instilled. I've read a lot about him and think he certainly deserves the MoH.

As far as "hero" yes, I agree it is too lightly used. I always get itchy when people thank me for my service. My position is that it's a job and they already thanked me by footing the bill for compensation greater than what I'd get in the civvy sector. But everyone wants to be a hero, and when you have sorry sods in the Air Force and Navy giving out bronze stars as end of tour awards, what do you expect? Meanwhile over in the USMC LCPL Timmy still has to get f'ing blown up to maybe rate the same decoration.
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birdman

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #7 on: April 13, 2013, 01:59:44 PM »
He gave away his food in a starvation camp, pretty much a guaranteed sacrificial death there. By defying the guards in performing mass and easter services he most likely saved more than a few lives through the hope he instilled. I've read a lot about him and think he certainly deserves the MoH.

As far as "hero" yes, I agree it is too lightly used. I always get itchy when people thank me for my service. My position is that it's a job and they already thanked me by footing the bill for compensation greater than what I'd get in the civvy sector. But everyone wants to be a hero, and when you have sorry sods in the Air Force and Navy giving out bronze stars as end of tour awards, what do you expect? Meanwhile over in the USMC LCPL Timmy still has to get f'ing blown up to maybe rate the same decoration.

This reminds me of a question I had a while back.
Given that the MSM provides a substitute for the non-valor/heroism award reasons for the bronze star, why is the V-device still necessary, other than as a de facto intermediate between the bronze and silver star w.r.t. Valorous/heroic actions in combat.

French G.

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Re: Army chaplain to get Medal of Honor
« Reply #8 on: April 13, 2013, 04:01:01 PM »
Probably because the MSM is a good medal to give O-5 and up for doing nothing but their job, can't give it out to the troops. Looks like the bronze star cut-off, at least in the Navy was O-4 or E-8/9. Bronze star needs to be modified for only actions in the face of the enemy.

Awards are politics. I didn't like writing end of tour/end of cruise awards for my guys because I'm iffy on awards for doing my job. But if I don't do it they go to a selection board and lose out to an equal peer that got the same award. Likewise, I ran a 40 person mixed service division for a very successful cruise and got jack because the XO had a strict awards quota system, they needed my number for an E-5 who was transferring and they figured they would get me when I transferred in a year. Now, guess how that looked in a set of evals for a 120 person E-6 competitive peer group an at the selection board for E-7? And I have 5 NAMs, all for doing my job.

You see a navy E-5 or less with a Navy Com and you know they damn near died or saved someone else to get it. E-6?, probably good with under desk politics. E-7 and up just need to fog a mirror.
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