Random sword thought

[Balog]

I've been watching Merlin with my wife and rereading Game of Thrones, and it has me thinking about swords. I'll preface this by saying I am not an expert so feel free to correct my mistakes.

Let's say you were in a world with arms and armor tech roughly equivalent to the late medieval period (full plate that cannot be reliably defeated with long bows available but uncommon) but without the advent of gun powder and firearms. Most feudal armies ie agricultural areas are a small coterie of heavy cavalry in plate and mail on destriers with barding, and large ranks of peasent levies. Most open source armies ie trade based city states are sellsword pikemen akin to Swiss mercenary groups or Landsknecht.

You are a young man looking to earn a living in the martial trades. You're not of noble birth so you can't be a knight in the feudal armies. You don't want to enlist in the city-state militias as they're mostly defensive or used in internecine warfare with low amounts of plunder. So what arms would you carry and train with for general purpose mercenary work against a variety of enemies (massed pike, heavy cavalry, peasent levies, primitive hordes, marauding sea reavers etc)? I'm thinking a pole arm like a halberd or glaive, but not a pike as that's more of a specialized formation weapon. Even a spear would work, simpler manual of arms so perhaps less time needed to master and maintain the needed skills. For hand to hand in spaces that make that impractical (storming a city the walls have been breached for example) I think a short cut and thrust sword with a simple guard and either a small shield or something like a main gauche or sword breaker in the off hand. This is a bit lacking in being able to directly defeat heavy plate and mail, but really I'd say using a polearm vs the war horse to unseat the knight and then attacking while he's down would be better than trying to use an armor penetrating weapon. For armor I'd say the best combination of protection with agility would be a cuirass, greaves, bracers, boiled leather or chain skirts, and some sort of light helm with good visibility. Half helm with a  nasal perhaps?

Anyway, just some random thoughts after too much fantasy tv and books. :)

[roo_ster]

"Dude better move his face before I run into it."

Random sword thought ^^^.


Kinda depends. 

A random warrior in the shield wall can get by with relatively inexpensive battle axes (long & short), spears/javelins, shield, helmet, and whatever armor he can afford or kill someone for & loot.  The spear can go after chinks in armor as well as any other pointy weapon.  A purpose-built knight-buster weapon like a mace, war hammer, or military pick ought to be pretty cheap.  IIRC, the Welsh archers at Agincourt used lead-headed sledge hammers on knights that got into their defenses.  Or was that Crecy?

A specialty pole arm would likely be issued purefleet in the mercenary band: glaives, fouchard-fork, halberd, ranseur, whatever.  Lots of similarities between them, with variations on stabby, choppy, and hooky functions.  As a (currently) unemployed mercenary, I would be loth to drag one of them around until I had work.  Probably a moderate-length spear at most, pole-arm-wise, while unemployed.

OTOH, pikes and pole axes stand out a bit as a bit different.  Pikes for being mother-loving LONG and necessitating close formation and the pole axe as being the other end, with a manual of arms more similar to a quarterstaff than most pole arms.

If one had the proper background, archers or combat engineers would tote other implements.

[drewtam]

I used to be an adventurer like you, but then I took an arrow to my knee.


I'll also note that plate armor continued to develop after guns were introduced into war, even into the 1600s. The small arms back then, after all, did suck. So there is this overlap of halberds, primitive firearms, crossbow, longbow, swiss phalanx, and full plate armor kenigits of nearly 300yrs.


Finally, I would suggest that an adventurer is not going to negotiate a contract on his own. He will be part of the group and will take up whatever arms the group he is attached to uses.

[AZRedhawk44]

I would have a magic sword that grants me the equivalent of Star Trek TNG's Deus ex Machina solution any time I needed it or just kinda wanted it.

[tokugawa]

You will be a hell of a lot more valuable if you train as a healer- how did you feel about your corpsman?

To destroy is always easier than to create or heal.
 

[Balog]

You guys are taking a lot of the fun out of window shopping for swords. 

[SADShooter]

The period source texts (e.g. Lichtenauer, Fiore, Mair, Talhoffer, et al.) generally emphasize interchangeability of weapons based on standardized techniques and biomechanical principles. So, the question "which is best" is dependent on local conditions.

In your scenario, the landsknecht model of a zweihander greatsword and katzbalger short for close-in work offers a lot of versatility: half-swording attacks against plate; swath-cutting to break into pike formations; and the general benefits of a longsword/polearm against cavalry or mixed infantry. This, their effectiveness at the time. Armor would vary depending on available tech and cost. I would be inclined to go fairly light, putting a premium on mobility and endurance. In most cases, your primary weapon is also your primary defense, obviously excepting missiles, etc.

[Scout26]

You don't want to enlist in the city-state militias as they're mostly defensive or used in internecine warfare with low amounts of plunder.

Generally, this is where you started out.  Your lord and master would provide (or make you provide, depending on his wealth) with whatever arms you will have (Things haven't changed much in a well over 2000 years).  Should you desert before, you will simply have whatever arms provided.  If you should be lucky and  survive your first action, then generally you got whatever the person(s) you personally vanquished were carrying or if there were many, many, many vanquished lying about the field, then you might be able to pick and choose some better implements.  So keep in mind that unless you were of "rank", generally you carried everything you owned.  Only those of "nobility" had baggage carts and wagons.

And generally, the more actions you survived the greater your rank (simply because all your original mates are getting their bones bleached on various fields), So initially as a solo practitioner, you might be "impressed" into either the local prince's military or whatever band of ne'er-do-wells wanders into the tavern you happen to be hanging out in, or along the road to said tavern.

Having said all that.  I like Cavalry Sabers.     

[tokugawa]

OK- if you want to window shop for swords-  check this one at my armoury  Sword candy time. - the guy made the blade, the mount',everything, using old techniques.  The pattern welding is amazing, as is the hilt inlaid with carnelian etc.  Then look around at the rest of the site. You should be able to get through it in a few months.  It is very interesting.  Also, check the Czech site- of the guy that made the sword pictured- he refined his own ore from iron sand to make Japanese weapons........!

  http://www.myarmoury.com/review_tmpl_suthoo.html

[freakazoid]

Lady Vivamus.
 

OK- if you want to window shop for swords-  check this one at my armoury  Sword candy time. - the guy made the blade, the mount',everything, using old techniques.  The pattern welding is amazing, as is the hilt inlaid with carnelian etc.  Then look around at the rest of the site. You should be able to get through it in a few months.  grin It is very interesting.  Also, check the Czech site- of the guy that made the sword pictured- he refined his own ore from iron sand to make Japanese weapons........!

  http://www.myarmoury.com/review_tmpl_suthoo.html

Amazing!! 

[Pharmacology]

Another great site (more affordable, too)  is Lutel.
http://www.lutel.eu/?p=productsList&iCategory=17&sName=WEAPONS

I've always wanted to order some stuff from them.

[T.O.M.]

Personally, I think I would have studies the art of the longbow.  Distance from an enemy means more of an opportunity to stay alive, especially in the age of swords.  That said, I'd still need some type of sword or other personal weapon, because even the best archer will eventually run out of arrows, or have too many opponents to put an arrow in each before they get too close.  I'm thinking something like this...

http://www.starfireswords.com//products/steel/detail/ls28.php

I have one of these...a wall hanger that was a gift from a girlfriend who was into the whole Renaissance Fair thing, and was trying to get me into it as well.  the sword isn't so long as to be in the way, and light enough not to slow you down.  Handle makes it a hand and a half sword.  A long bow, quiver of arrows, this sword, and a couple of knives for utility work/last line of defense and I'd be about as well armed as I could.

[brimic]

You will be a hell of a lot more valuable if you train as a healer- how did you feel about your corpsman?

To destroy is always easier than to create or heal.
 

But destroying is a lot more fun