Author Topic: Murder charges dropped  (Read 595 times)

JTHunter

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Murder charges dropped
« on: October 12, 2024, 12:37:59 AM »
Remember the recent unprovoked attack of a female college student by another female student?  Well, they have dropped two of the charges, one of which was the "attempted murder" charge.
Take a good look at the picture of the attacker.  Weird !
  :facepalm:  [barf]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/arizona-college-student-accused-random-080050686.html
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K Frame

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #1 on: October 12, 2024, 07:36:13 AM »
Yeah, really don't understand that choice at all. Not seen anything explaining why they dropped the top charges.

Maybe they're down with the theory that the stabbing was for... reparations?
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #2 on: October 12, 2024, 12:01:16 PM »
I, too, find it inexplicable that they dropped the attempted murder charge. I sure if the perp had been a POADC (Person Of A Different Color) that charge would not have been dropped.

I wonder if, after the hero tackled and disarmed the perp, she remembered to utter the now-obligatory "I can't breathe" mantra.
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230RN

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #3 on: October 12, 2024, 01:45:54 PM »
What the hell was she doing on campus with an unregistered knife anyway?
« Last Edit: October 12, 2024, 06:47:23 PM by 230RN »

HankB

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #4 on: October 12, 2024, 04:56:57 PM »
What the hell was she doing on campus with an unregistered knife anyway?
Isn't it obvious - she was cutting class.

Hawkmoon's comment can be expanded on. Considerably. But I'm not going to do it.
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230RN

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #5 on: October 12, 2024, 06:36:13 PM »
I wonder if was dropped because of "premeditation" issues?  Don't know how that premeditation thing works.  Yet the victim appears to have been "targeted" somehow.

I wonder what electronic things might be (have been) found...

One thing comes to mind WRT this case is if for some reason they're taking a mug shot of you, at least try to look pleasant.  <wry grin> (If that was a mug shot.)

dogmush

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #6 on: October 12, 2024, 06:45:07 PM »
The victim doesn't appear to have been targeted really.  In the post attack interview with attacker she said she picked that girl because she looked like an easy target.

But there was also a not in the attackers bag saying she planned to do something after class, which would seem to fulfill any premeditation requirements.

I'm not sure I buy that the charges were dropped because she's black.  The criminal justice system has no problem prosecuting that particular minority any given day. If it were the college going easy, sure I could buy that, but there's plenty of black folk in jail.

I suspect there is some part of this story we are not privy to.

T.O.M.

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #7 on: October 13, 2024, 07:04:17 PM »
I wonder if was dropped because of "premeditation" issues?  Don't know how that premeditation thing works.  Yet the victim appears to have been "targeted" somehow.

I wonder what electronic things might be (have been) found...

One thing comes to mind WRT this case is if for some reason they're taking a mug shot of you, at least try to look pleasant.  <wry grin> (If that was a mug shot.)

Motive is generally developed from extrinsic pr circumstantial evidence.  Yes, electronics do play a big part here.  In most jurisdictions, a murder charge requires that the state prove the actor had the intent to kill.  Sometimes, the circumstances surrounding the incident can prove this (yelling "Die!" as the attack occurs).  This is where you occasionally hear people recommend avoiding things like hollow point ammo because it shows an intent to kill (it doesn't).

Many times, prosecutors will file the higher (murder) charge at the outset. As the investigation continues, might reduce to a homicide of manslaughter charge where the intent to kill is not an element of the offense.
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Hawkmoon

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2024, 09:40:28 PM »
Are you suggesting that sticking a knife into someone -- multiple times -- is not prima facie evidence of intent to kill?
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230RN

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2024, 10:13:23 PM »
^ Who's "you?"  Me? I'm not "suggesting" anything, just trying to mind-read the motivation for dropping the big charges.  I guess (guess) a lot would depend on the type of knife and where it was kept, which I don't know, but I'm thinking about the implications of it being a folder, which requires a deliberate manual action a period of time before the attack, or just something she routinely had for some reason or another --perhaps a screwdriver or sharp ball point pen or a steak knife carried for self-defense purposes in a "tough" gun-free zone.  Some of us  in Brooklyn carried a length of coathanger wire with a loop on one end for grasping.  A "Brooklyn Bullwhip."  Hidable, easily discardable, would not hold fingerprints.  Not much, but not zero, either.

"I suspect there is some part of this story we are not privy to" --dogmush.

Of course, but every time there's an incident like this, our speculation is a legitimate and engaging pursuit.  Could have just been a throw the book case to start with a high negotiating level, per T.O.M...

Motive is generally developed from extrinsic or circumstantial evidence.  Yes, electronics do play a big part here.  In most jurisdictions, a murder charge requires that the state prove the actor had the intent to kill.  Sometimes, the circumstances surrounding the incident can prove this (yelling "Die!" as the attack occurs).  This is where you occasionally hear people recommend avoiding things like hollow point ammo because it shows an intent to kill (it doesn't).

Many times, prosecutors will file the higher (murder) charge at the outset. As the investigation continues, might reduce to a homicide of manslaughter charge where the intent to kill is not an element of the offense.

Terry, 230RN
   
« Last Edit: October 13, 2024, 11:27:02 PM by 230RN »

JTHunter

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2024, 01:05:45 PM »
Thanks Terry for another suggestion for my "unconventional weapons" array !  :rofl:

The one that I don't have in that picture is the shaft and ground stake for an old solar walkway light.  The stake is like a WW1 German bayonet (4 ribs) and about 7" long.  With the shaft that the spike screws into, overall length is about 14".  The spike is either cast aluminum or die-cast zinc as it is non-magnetic ad rather soft metal.  I was able to use hand files to put a good point and fair edges on the spike.  I keep it in my car - JIC.


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Hawkmoon

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2024, 04:18:16 PM »
^ Who's "you?"  Me? I'm not "suggesting" anything, just trying to mind-read the motivation for dropping the big charges. 

Did you consider reading comments in chronological order, and consider the possibility that I might have been responding to the post immediately preceding mine? The post in which T.O.M. wrote:

Quote
Many times, prosecutors will file the higher (murder) charge at the outset. As the investigation continues, might reduce to a homicide of manslaughter charge where the intent to kill is not an element of the offense.
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T.O.M.

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2024, 06:08:47 PM »
Again, it allowed depends on the facts of the specific situation.  Making up situations for the example...police respond to stabbing.  Find dead guy with multiple stab wounds.  Arrest woman with bloody knife.  Later find evidence that dead guy had attacked the woman who was out jogging.  Her intent to kill now looks a whole lot like defensive actions, not intent to kill.  I know this is kind of a ridiculous example, but it's the best I can do on pain meds (had a little outpatient work done this morning).

And, keep this in mind...a lot of prosecutor's offices base promotion and pay raises on "case clearance" rates.  Guilty pleas and convictions at trial are good.  Not guilty verdicts are bad.  The right thing happening?  🤣🤣🤣
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230RN

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2024, 03:57:49 PM »
Hawkmoon said,

"Did you consider reading comments in chronological order, and consider the possibility that I might have been responding to the post immediately preceding mine? The post in which T.O.M. wrote:"

Right, sorry.

Hasty hurry quicky baddy.

:(

Terry

JTHunter

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2024, 10:47:20 PM »
Again, it allowed depends on the facts of the specific situation.  Making up situations for the example...police respond to stabbing.  Find dead guy with multiple stab wounds.  Arrest woman with bloody knife.  Later find evidence that dead guy had attacked the woman who was out jogging.  Her intent to kill now looks a whole lot like defensive actions, not intent to kill.  I know this is kind of a ridiculous example, but it's the best I can do on pain meds (had a little outpatient work done this morning).

And, keep this in mind...a lot of prosecutor's offices base promotion and pay raises on "case clearance" rates.  Guilty pleas and convictions at trial are good.  Not guilty verdicts are bad.  The right thing happening?  🤣🤣🤣

OH, so you finally had that "plastic surgery" done?  Did they change your appearance enough so the Feds don't recognize you?  >:D  :rofl:
“I have little patience with people who take the Bill of Rights for granted.  The Bill of Rights, contained in the first ten amendments to the Constitution, is every American’s guarantee of freedom.” - - President Harry S. Truman, “Years of Trial and Hope”

T.O.M.

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #15 on: October 17, 2024, 07:16:47 AM »
OH, so you finally had that "plastic surgery" done?  Did they change your appearance enough so the Feds don't recognize you?  >:D  :rofl:

Nice.  Truth is I've been in witness protection for a long time.  Don't tell anyone.  😁
No, I'm not mtnbkr.  ;)

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230RN

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #16 on: October 18, 2024, 05:08:02 PM »
So they gave you a new "soash?"  How will they handle your retirement benefits when the time comes?

T.O.M.

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #17 on: October 18, 2024, 08:16:35 PM »
Now that I know, I had a.. thing...one my left thigh.  Wanna call it a growth, but doc had a different name.  They took it off.  Got the call today confirming it was NOT cancer, which was a concern.

So, now I'm good with calling me a half trans or whatever. 😂😂😂
No, I'm not mtnbkr.  ;)

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230RN

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #18 on: October 23, 2024, 04:04:08 AM »
Now that I know, I had a.. thing...on my left thigh.  Wanna call it a growth, but doc had a different name.  They took it off.  Got the call today confirming it was NOT cancer, which was a concern.

So, now I'm good with calling me a half trans or whatever. 😂😂😂

A cyst?  (There are several types.)

My brother had one on his wrist which the MD cured by smacking it hard with a medical book.

I had one on my wrist which I had removed when I had to have an unrelated tendon nearby repaired.  I believe it was specifically called a "ganglionic" cyst.

In neither case did anyone mention cancer that I knew about.

My boss had one on her wrist which I never mentioned, but one day I noticed it was gone.  No comments one way or the other about it.  Was there and then it was gone.

I don't get the part about half-trans unless it was close to your baby-making parts...?

Terry. 230RN
« Last Edit: October 23, 2024, 04:29:17 AM by 230RN »

230RN

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Re: Murder charges dropped
« Reply #19 on: October 23, 2024, 04:11:51 AM »
^ Double post, see above. ^