Author Topic: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops  (Read 3239 times)

MicroBalrog

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Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« on: September 17, 2008, 09:09:52 AM »
WASHINGTON - The ATF lost 76 weapons and hundreds of laptops over five years, the Justice Department reported Wednesday, blaming carelessness and sloppy record-keeping.

Thirty-five of the missing handguns, rifles, Tasers and other weapons were stolen, as were 50 laptops, the internal audit found. Two of the stolen weapons were used in crimes.

The audit by Justice Department Inspector General Glenn A. Fine found "inadequate" oversight of weapons and laptops resulted in "significant rates of losses" at the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives.

"It is especially troubling that that ATF's rate of loss for weapons was nearly double that of the FBI and DEA, and that ATF did not even know whether most of its lost, stolen, or missing laptop computers contained sensitive or classified information," he added.

In a Sept. 10 letter responding to the audit, ATF acting Director Michael J. Sullivan said his agency "agrees or partially agrees with most of the recommendations."

"We are revising our procedures of reporting losses of weapons or laptops," Sullivan said.

The audit looked at ATF's inventory of weapons, laptops, ammunition and explosives between Oct. 1, 2002 and Aug. 31, 2007.

It found that ATF lost three times more weapons each month than it had in a similar 2002 audit by the Treasury Department, which used to oversee the agency. It also lost 50 times as many laptops as reported in the earlier audit.

Of the 76 weapons, 35 were reported stolen, 19 lost and 12 missing from inventories, investigators found. Of the 418 missing laptops, 50 were stolen, 8 lost and 274 could not be found during inventory. Another 86 laptops were unaccounted for because ATF had either destroyed or lost documents showing where they were, the audit concluded.

Two weapons reported stolen were used to commit crimes. In one instance, a gun was stolen from an ATF car parked outside the agent's home and later used to shoot through the window of another residence, the audit found. In the other, a stolen ATF gun was taken from a burglary suspect.

Additionally, ATF employees did not report 13 of the 76 lost weapons, or 365 of the 418 missing laptops, to internal affairs as required. ATF officials also did not report much of the lost equipment to the Justice Department.

Investigators could not conclude what was on 398 of 418 missing laptops  except that few were encrypted. That means any sensitive material on the laptops could have been exposed.

Moreover, "we found that ATF did not regularly attempt to determine whether the lost, stolen or missing laptop computers contained sensitive or classified information," the audit said.

But few  only 18 of 7,500  ATF laptops were authorized to hold classified information.

Compared to weapons loss rates for the FBI and Drug Enforcement Administration, the ATF misplaced almost twice as many guns. The audit found that the ATF lost .52 weapons per 1,000 employees, compared to .29 at the FBI and .28 at the DEA.

Fine's investigators concluded there were proper controls and oversight of explosives in ATF's possession, and good security for ammunition. However, nine of 20 ATF field offices surveyed did not have proper accounting methods for ammunition.

In a statement responding to the audit, ATF Assistant Director W. Larry Ford said the agency disciplined employees whose carelessness or improper handling of equipment resulted in losses.

"ATF is committed to safeguarding its inventory of weapons and laptop computers in the interest of public safety," Ford said. "ATF agrees that rigorous and thorough internal controls will enhance its ability to account for, and most importantly prevent, thefts and losses of weapons and laptop computers."

Source
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AZRedhawk44

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2008, 09:26:58 AM »
Always Think Forfeiture.

Heck, the ATF "forfeited" its own property to agents, sounds like. rolleyes
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roo_ster

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2008, 09:46:34 AM »
Quote
But few  only 18 of 7,500  ATF laptops were authorized to hold classified information.

Only 18 classified laptops.

That would have been enough to ruin my career, result in ruinous fines and likely land my *expletive deleted*ss in jail.
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roo_ster

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The Annoyed Man

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2008, 09:56:12 AM »
Does this mean you guys can shut down the ATF just like they do with gun dealers who can't account for inventory?

AZRedhawk44

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2008, 10:00:32 AM »
Does this mean you guys can shut down the ATF just like they do with gun dealers who can't account for inventory?

No... some pigs are MORE equal.
"But whether the Constitution really be one thing, or another, this much is certain - that it has either authorized such a government as we have had, or has been powerless to prevent it. In either case, it is unfit to exist."
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The Annoyed Man

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2008, 10:03:33 AM »
Does this mean you guys can shut down the ATF just like they do with gun dealers who can't account for inventory?

No... some pigs are MORE equal.
Ah, forgot that one. Silly me.

Boomhauer

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2008, 10:08:52 AM »
Does this mean you guys can shut down the ATF just like they do with gun dealers who can't account for inventory?

Don't be silly, peasant.

The State does not punish itself for mere infractions like this.

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MicroBalrog

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2008, 10:14:24 AM »
Does this mean you guys can shut down the ATF just like they do with gun dealers who can't account for inventory?

Experiment. Start a thread on a pro-gun forum advocating shutting down BATF on a serious note. You'll be shouted down.
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280plus

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #8 on: September 17, 2008, 10:25:37 AM »
And they worry about us and our guns?  rolleyes
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The Annoyed Man

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #9 on: September 17, 2008, 07:12:44 PM »
You know, I can excuse the guns stolen during a burglary of an agent's home.  I can forgive the one's stolen from an agent's car, though not as much.  But lost?  How do you lose a gun in any excusable manner?  Anyone here ever lose a gun?

My favorite ATF story was years back, when I was still prosecuting cases.  Had a meth maker with an AR that had a 12 inch barrel.  One of those uppers you could get at a gun show back in the day...Anyways, the agent is in my office with some narcs I worked with, the gun on my desk, and someone asked agent a question about the gun, something I don't remember, except that it necessitated stripping the gun.  Agent says he doesn't know how to take the gun apart, even though he's alredy bragged about shooting expert with the M4 he was issued.  i pick it up and break it down in under a minute.  He looked at me and asked if I was some militia or NRA type.  Everyone but the agent laughed when I said it was something I lerned as a plebe at West Point.  He even asked what a plebe was.... cheesy

MicroBalrog

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2008, 06:34:02 AM »
How can a man not know how to break down an M4? It's just one pin...
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HankB

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #11 on: October 13, 2008, 08:42:00 AM »
How can a man not know how to break down an M4? It's just one pin...
When I use the term "break down" I include removal of the upper . . . that's two pins.  :laugh:
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seeker_two

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #12 on: October 13, 2008, 04:38:44 PM »
When I use the term "break down" I include removal of the upper . . . that's two pins.  :laugh:

From what I hear many on TFL say, the M16/M4 has no problem breaking down all by itself....  :laugh:
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Manedwolf

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #13 on: October 13, 2008, 04:47:57 PM »
How can a man not know how to break down an M4? It's just one pin...

You should try breaking down a Daewoo. You get confused as to what you're taking apart if you're used to several weapons systems.

Unlock and push in recoil spring block, break receiver like a shotgun. Pull out AK recoil spring, AR bolt carrier with locking lugs and AR firing pin and bolt, AK gas piston. Push out front AR pin, separate upper and lower. :lol:

MicroBalrog

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2008, 12:04:23 PM »
Quote
You should try breaking down a Daewoo. You get confused as to what you're taking apart if you're used to several weapons systems.

I know six or seven. Sort of.

I've been trained extensively to perform maintenance, disassemble, etc, on the Galil (and the stuff would mostly apply to AKs), M16 series, M203, and Uzis of all three mods. I can break down an M2, a Browning .30, and an M204, but I can't actually fix anything that's broken with them apart from swapping barrels.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Manedwolf

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2008, 12:21:12 PM »
I know six or seven. Sort of.

I've been trained extensively to perform maintenance, disassemble, etc, on the Galil (and the stuff would mostly apply to AKs), M16 series, M203, and Uzis of all three mods. I can break down an M2, a Browning .30, and an M204, but I can't actually fix anything that's broken with them apart from swapping barrels.

You would perhaps want one of these for a non-evil rifle, then.



Receiver look familiar?

MicroBalrog

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2008, 12:27:34 PM »
Why would I want a non-evil rifle? =D

And I don't like my rear sights being on an AK-style gas cover.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

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Manedwolf

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Re: Audit: ATF lost 76 weapons, hundreds of laptops
« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2008, 12:31:13 PM »
Why would I want a non-evil rifle? =D

And I don't like my rear sights being on an AK-style gas cover.

You don't need to use them. That's a Norinco Hunter, only the Type 1 had the peep sights. I meant the fact that the receiver is basically a milled Galil. A lot of people convert them with Galil furniture.

The pedigree is convoluted. Valmet did a lot of the original design on the Galil, hence the Galil and Valmet Hunter have the same receiver design with the sharp tuck up to the handguard. Norinco copied the Valmet, but curiously did it as a high-quality milled gun produced by Factory 386, also known as Polytech.

So they're basically really high quality milled 7.62x39 Galils that take any AK mag. Go figure.