Jon Stewart, War Criminals & The True Story of the Atomic Bombs

[roo_ster]

Jon Stewart claims that Truman is a war criminal for dropping two nukes on Japan and the only way he would not have been a war criminal is if we had dropped one in the ocean off the coast of Japan as a demonstration before we dropped them on Japan.

No, I am not making this ^^^ up.

Below the divider is a little video history lesson that confronts the absurdities and inanities of folks like Jon Stewart.  It is 17 minutes long, but subjectively it goes right quick.


http://www.pjtv.com/video/Afterburner_/Jon_Stewart%2C_War_Criminals_%26_The_True_Story_of_the_Atomic_Bombs/1808/

[Lee]

That is terrific.  Thanks for the post.

[HankB]

I had a debate with a history professor in college who was spouting this garbage about a "demonstration."

I told him that when we dropped the bomb on Hiroshima we killed over 80,000 Japs - quite the demonstration, one would think - AND IT WASN'T ENOUGH!!!

It took a declaration of war by the Soviet Union and a SECOND atom bomb before the Emperor ordered surrender - and even then the Jap military almost carried through a successful coup to prevent this.

So I asked the professor how he could say something so patently ridiculous - that roasting a few coconuts on some Pacific island WOULD cause a Jap surrender, when history shows that nuking a Jap city DID NOT - with a straight face.

Rather than respond, he tore into me for using the word "Japs."  :rolleyes:

(I wish I'd had a movie camera to catch his facial expression when I told him he wasn't fooling anyone about avoiding my question by laying into me for using the word "Jap.")

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

and even then the Jap military almost carried through a successful coup to prevent this.


yea?  who? when? source

[mtnbkr]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyūjō_Incident

Chris

[Monkeyleg]

Good job, HankB. Seems the history professor doesn't know his history.

[MechAg94]

I have heard of this opinion before and my only conclusion is that it comes from a serious lack of historical knowledge.  I am at a loss for any other explanation. 

Would he also declare Air Force personnel to be war criminals for fire bombing Japanese cities?  I've heard they killed more people that way. 

[HankB]

and even then the Jap military almost carried through a successful coup to prevent this.


yea?  who? when? source

Some useful links - History Channel did a documentary on this.

http://home.netcom.com/~jb29miss/index.html

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

thanks  i learned something

[grampster]

Moronishness is as moronishness does.

[Uncle Bubba]

I have heard of this opinion before and my only conclusion is that it comes from a serious lack of historical knowledge.  I am at a loss for any other explanation. 

Would he also declare Air Force personnel to be war criminals for fire bombing Japanese cities?  I've heard they killed more people that way. 

You heard right. IIRC, more people died in one firebomb attack on Tokyo than in both atomic bombings combined.

[Standing Wolf]

Seems the history professor doesn't know his history.

[sincerity] Shocking. Just shocking. [/sincerity]

[Clem]

The joy in Mudville at the dropping of the atom bomb was inversely proportional to the distance from the epicenter of the blast. I had an English teacher when I was in high school who was an 18 yr. old trooper stationed on Okinawa in August of ’45. He was there preparing for the invasion of the Japanese home islands. When they heard about the bombs and Japanese surrender, they were ecstatic. They knew they wouldn’t be killed in the invasion. The farther someone was from the epicenter, and the longer in time from the war, the greater likelihood that person could be ambivalent or actually hostile to the bombing.

[RoadKingLarry]

thanks  i learned something

Don't you just hate it when that happens?

Nothing quite like applying current/modern ethics and morality to historic events.

[HankB]

The joy in Mudville at the dropping of the atom bomb was inversely proportional to the distance from the epicenter of the blast.

My father was on a troop ship somewhere in the Pacific when word came that we'd used a secret weapon - an atom bomb - to erase an entire Japanese city. At first, the guys thought it was some sort of joke or propaganda, but when the ship's captain came on and confirmed it was for real, Dad said you never - NEVER - saw such a happy bunch of guys.

They knew they'd make it home now.

Back on the home front, similar reactions came from most folks, the majority of whom had friends and/or family in the Service.

The distance in time seems to be dimming the joy, as newer generations are farther and farther removed from WWII - many  may never have even spoken to a WWII vet . . . or, thanks to publik skool, even studied it in any depth. (A few years back I saw that my little cousin's 20th century American History textbook had less than 2 pages on WWII, but about 20 pages each on the Women's Movement and the Civil Rights Struggle.  )

[MechAg94]

Most of my grade school history classes usually ended after WWII with a brief overview of the 50's-70's before the year ended.  It was probably for the best.

[roo_ster]

Not only were folks cheering in the streets, after a a while they got mad...at the US Gov't.

Why?  Because of Okinawa.  Nearly 13000 Americans dead by the time it was over on 23JUN1945...less than two months before the end of the war in the Pacific.

Folks were angry at the loss that they thought could be avoided by using nukes (in retrospect) earlier & oftener.  I think their ire misplaced, as there was no way to know beforehand if the Japanese would be brought to surrender or even if the nukes would work as expected.

[agricola]

The whole "atomic bombs were a war crime" argument is one which, sadly, appears to be gaining in prominence the further we get from the event.  As has been pointed out, "conventional" bombing of Tokyo killed more people, the Japanese even after two bombings had a serious coup attempt to continue the war, and the alternatives would have caused even more deaths than actually occured.