Author Topic: a stimulus i'd support  (Read 2450 times)

cassandra and sara's daddy

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a stimulus i'd support
« on: November 17, 2009, 06:29:32 AM »
By Al Horne
Tuesday, November 17, 2009

With Congress tied up over health reform -- legislation whose initial, much-discussed goal was to extend health insurance to as many as 47 million uninsured Americans -- this may be as good a time as any to propose another, less divisive reform.
This Story

    *
      A modest proposal
    *
      What D.C. Needs Least: More Guns on the Streets
    *
      The State of Guns

The FBI and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms estimated in 2008 that more than 250 million guns were owned by U.S. citizens. Since President Obama's election last November, newspapers and electronic media have reported a sharp increase in U.S. gun sales, spurred by rumors that the new administration had secret plans to block gun sales to law-abiding Americans. Normally, about 4.5 million guns are sold in the United States each year, so this surge in sales means that Americans own roughly 260 million guns, in a population of nearly 309 million.

Surveys indicate that gun ownership is not spread evenly across U.S. households. In fact, chances are that a substantial proportion of U.S. gun owners have more than one weapon, so it's quite possible that fewer than 200 million Americans own those 260 million guns. That means there may be more than 100 million citizens left unprotected against their gun-owning fellow citizens.

Surely everyone can agree that this is an outrage. Moreover, it is an outrage that Congress can easily fix, without months of committee meetings, town halls or tea parties. All that is required is a bipartisan, pro-constitutional bill to extend the Second Amendment's protection of gun ownership to all Americans, whether they like it or not.
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Under such legislation -- let's call it the Gun Insurance Act of 2009 -- every American would be required to buy some kind of gun. Those who cannot afford even the simplest weapon -- say, those whose 2009 annual income is less than twice the federal poverty level -- could be issued $500 vouchers that would be valid only at gun shops or gun shows, and would have to be used before the 2010 Census. (Just think: What a stimulus to private enterprise all these gun sales would provide, and how many new gun-selling jobs would be created!)

How would the law be enforced? Census takers could verify that everyone they count has a weapon in working condition, and those census takers who survive could report all non-complying Americans to the FBI so it could notify local police departments, which would issue citations for whatever fines Congress chooses to impose. (Note that this proposed legislation would not require creating any new bureaucracy, public option or death panels.) Of course, illegal immigrants would not receive vouchers, would not be required to buy guns and would not be counted in the Census.

So there it is: a modest proposal even Max Baucus and Chuck Grassley can agree on. If we're willing to require people to buy health insurance, why not require them to buy guns? Sure, maybe the Congressional Budget Office could overestimate its cost, and some wimpy liberals could file a court challenge, but the Supreme Court would slap it down on a clear 5-to-4 vote. Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, here's one issue where you can count on at least a couple of Republican votes.

The writer, a former Post reporter and editor, lives in Alexandria.
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


by someone older and wiser than I

vaskidmark

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #1 on: November 17, 2009, 06:44:52 AM »
Do you have a source for that?

I am also in support of the plan.  I'd like to a) contact the author & express my appreciation, and b) ask for permission to distribute.

stay safe.

skidmark
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They keep making this eternal vigilance thing harder and harder.  Protecting the 2nd amendment is like playing PACMAN - there's no pause button so you can go to the bathroom.

Regolith

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2009, 07:12:39 AM »
The gun industry has already received a huge stimulus.

The price of freedom is eternal vigilance. - Thomas Jefferson

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves. - William Pitt the Younger

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zahc

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2009, 09:41:11 AM »
I know it's a funny, but I wouldn't support it. I think people should be free to NOT own guns if they so choose, just as I think I should be free TO own them.
Maybe a rare occurence, but then you only have to get murdered once to ruin your whole day.
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Nick1911

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2009, 09:43:58 AM »
I know it's a funny, but I wouldn't support it. I think people should be free to NOT own guns if they so choose, just as I think I should be free TO own them.

I agree.  Freedom is about not having someone in a position of authority make decisions or limit options for your own good.

cassandra and sara's daddy

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #5 on: November 17, 2009, 04:25:42 PM »
article was in yesterdays washington post online
It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #6 on: November 17, 2009, 04:30:51 PM »
I know it's a funny, but I wouldn't support it. I think people should be free to NOT own guns if they so choose, just as I think I should be free TO own them.

i think the point is that it is funny as well as thought provoking. i doubt the writer truely intends to support measures that would require all americans to have a gun.
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richyoung

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #7 on: November 17, 2009, 05:02:35 PM »
i think the point is that it is funny as well as thought provoking. i doubt the writer truely intends to support measures that would require all americans to have a gun.

Actually, they already are - IF they are not a politician or already in the military, and if they do not belong to a religion that forbids bearing arms, they are in the militia, and are supposed to have their own weapon and ammunition ready for use.  When the Sherrif was "forming a posse", he was actually...


...calling up the militia.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #8 on: November 17, 2009, 05:02:59 PM »
Can't they mandate that all Americans must have a sense of humor? 
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French G.

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #9 on: November 17, 2009, 05:57:27 PM »
Quote
How would the law be enforced? Census takers could verify that everyone they count has a weapon in working condition, and those census takers who survive could report all non-complying Americans to the FBI so it could notify local police departments, which would issue citations for whatever fines Congress chooses to impose. (Note that this proposed legislation would not require creating any new bureaucracy, public option or death panels.) Of course, illegal immigrants would not receive vouchers, would not be required to buy guns and would not be counted in the Census.

There the plan unravels as too many Americans creatively show census dude their gun. Everyone in the country of age ought to be issued an automatic rifle, service handgun, several cases of ammunition, a few hand grenades, and a couple of blocks of demo. The first 6 months you might want to stay home while things sort themselves out, but after that I think we'd live in quite a nice place.
AKA Navy Joe   

I'm so contrarian that I didn't respond to the thread.

MechAg94

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #10 on: November 17, 2009, 06:10:23 PM »
1.  I don't want Census workers asking me if I own a gun or not.  

2.  Remember, this is the GOVT.  You will end up with the Govt ordering 100 Million Hi-Point and Jennings pistols to supply to the non-gun owning public and all supplied with Indian and Pakistani ammo.    =(
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Marnoot

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #11 on: November 17, 2009, 06:40:05 PM »
1.  I don't want Census workers asking me if I own a gun or not.  

2.  Remember, this is the GOVT.  You will end up with the Govt ordering 100 Million Hi-Point and Jennings pistols to supply to the non-gun owning public and all supplied with Indian and Pakistani ammo.    =(

But Pakistani ammo gives you a moment to reconsider firing at your target. You can quickly point to another target if you change your mind. Click.................BOOM!

Phantom Warrior

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2009, 06:54:05 PM »
Actually, they already are - IF they are not a politician or already in the military, and if they do not belong to a religion that forbids bearing arms, they are in the militia, and are supposed to have their own weapon and ammunition ready for use. 

How do you figure that?  The Second Amendment only states that "the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."  Nowhere does it say anything about being required to possess a firearm.

MicroBalrog

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2009, 07:02:53 PM »
How do you figure that?  The Second Amendment only states that "the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."  Nowhere does it say anything about being required to possess a firearm.

True, but the Constitution empowers Congress to provide for the arming of the militia. So it is actually constitutional for them to buy guns and distribute them to the public.
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Phantom Warrior

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2009, 07:28:21 PM »
Which is still not the same thing as requiring people to have their own weapon and ammunition ready to use.

Physics

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #15 on: November 17, 2009, 07:29:14 PM »
Call me silly here, but I don't think every American has the right to own a gun.  Nor should they.  Of course, the only people I'm referring to here are violent criminals.  Everyone else should have the right IMO, but should not be required.  Some people I know don't own guns because they don't trust themselves with guns, which I can understand.  If you are depressed and suicidal, I don't think being forced to purchase a gun is a great idea.  

ETA: I do of course realize hope the article was a joke. 
« Last Edit: November 17, 2009, 10:34:41 PM by Physics »
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MicroBalrog

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #16 on: November 17, 2009, 07:29:38 PM »
Which is still not the same thing as requiring people to have their own weapon and ammunition ready to use.

Well, true. But it's not like anybody is seriously suggesting that.
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Perd Hapley

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #17 on: November 17, 2009, 07:30:48 PM »
Can we add a bang-head smiley? 
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Balog

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #18 on: November 17, 2009, 07:34:48 PM »
Wow, I better not post any Swift or people will be indignant about eating babies...
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BlueStarLizzard

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #19 on: November 17, 2009, 07:35:13 PM »
Can we add a bang-head smiley? 

it would require a sense of humor.
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Phantom Warrior

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Re: a stimulus i'd support
« Reply #20 on: November 17, 2009, 07:39:56 PM »
My comments were directed at richyoung's post, not the original article.  (I got the Modest Proposal joke...)