Hooray for Deforestation!

[MechAg94]

Strange Geoglyphs Discovered Beneath Clearcut Amazon
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2009/12/strange-geoglyphs-discovered-beneath-clearcut-amazon.php

With the aid of satellite imagery from Google Earth, soon archeologists in Brazil will be finding more and more large geometric designs carved into the ground in the Amazon rainforest. The geoglyphs are believed to have been sculpted by ancient people from the Amazon region around 700 years ago, though their purpose is still unknown. So far, nearly 300 geoglyphs have been identified, but with advances in satellite imaging--and increased clearing of the jungle coverage--scientists are hoping to discover many more of these strange, geometric designs.

One of the factors that contributed to so many geoglyphs being undetected prior to the aid of satallites is their enormous size. According to leading geoglyph scientist Alceu Ranzi, his latest discoveries--five sets of geometric shapes, with circles, squares and lines--can measure more than a mile from one extreme to another.

    You do not see them in field. There is a difference in the color of grass but is very thin. If there were no satellite images, there would be no possibility [of making these new discoveries].

Because they've been so hard to find, the first geoglyphs weren't discovered until the 1970s. Since then, scientists have been trying to piece together what significance they may have had to ancient Amazonians. What ever the purpose may have been, there's one thing that is certain: the ancient civilizations of the rainforest were more numerous and sophisticated than previously imagined.

According to a report from Globo, the new marks were only discovered because the jungle coverage had been removed to due to deforestation in the Amazon. These structures are deep, with grooves are as large as 12 meters wide and four deep, but it is believed that they were built when jungle abounded--which would make their construction all the more difficult.

Ranzi seems open to other possibilities:

    Was it really forest [when the drawings were built] or did they occupy this area at a time of climate crisis, like that of 2005?

The world may never know what drove these ancient civilizations to carve the enormous geoglyphs, like the ones found recently using Google Earth. But, if it takes more clear-cutting in the Amazon rainforest to find out the answer, hopefully it will always remain a mystery.

The title is tongue in cheek obviously.  I seem to remember hearing that there have been old ruins found in the Amazon, but I have never read much about it.  It is an interesting find though. 

[Harold Tuttle]

Wait WHAT?
the original natives deforested the amazon 700 years ago?

but i thought they were all Fern Gully & stuff?

[Tallpine]

So the current "old growth" forest is less than 700 years old?   

[Declaration Day]

So the current "old growth" forest is less than 700 years old?  

".......but it is believed that they were built when jungle abounded--which would make their construction all the more difficult."

(Then again, coming from a website called Treehugger, they might not want to spread the notion that forests can recover after they've been cut down.  )

[brimic]

The native Brazillians lived in perfect harmony with Gaia dontchaknow. That means they would never harm a tree.

The geoglyphs are believed to have been sculpted by ancient people from the Amazon region around 700 years ago, though their purpose is still unknown.

I'd LOL uncontrollably if archaeologists figured out that these lines were fencelines from some sort of ancient mega- veal/hog farming complex.

[just Warren]

According to this book I read called 1491, which is a history of the Americas before Columbus "discovered" America, Large parts of The Amazon may have been a cultivated forest. That is fruit and nut trees and other useful plants were grown on purpose, these were created along with game habitats and villages. So it does not surprise me that these glyphs have been found.

At some point that civilization vanished and the jungle took over as you would expect.

[Balog]

The native Brazillians lived in perfect harmony with Gaia dontchaknow. That means they would never harm a tree.
 
I'd LOL uncontrollably if archaeologists figured out that these lines were fencelines from some sort of ancient mega- veal/hog farming complex.

That is the greatest thing I have ever heard.

[De Selby]

According to this book I read called 1491, which is a history of the Americas before Columbus "discovered" America, Large parts of The Amazon may have been a cultivated forest. That is fruit and nut trees and other useful plants were grown on purpose, these were created along with game habitats and villages. So it does not surprise me that these glyphs have been found.

At some point that civilization vanished and the jungle took over as you would expect.

Wouldn't be surprising.  American natives were as or more advanced in some technologies than Europeans.  The Aztecs knew how to farm on the water, for example.

[MechAg94]

Wouldn't be surprising.  American natives were as or more advanced in some technologies than Europeans.  The Aztecs knew how to farm on the water, for example.

Was that the Aztecs or the Mayans?  I was thinking that was the basic origin of Mexico City.

I remember back in the 90's hearing about someone who was taking soil samples all over South America and they could find any part of the rain forest that hadn't been burned or cut down before in recent times.  I think someone said the Incas cut down huge sections of the forests in their areas a few times over due to some demand for the wood or something.

[geronimotwo]

sorry, but i don't see any signs of this being recently logged off (no stumps).  any idea on the time frame involved, or scale of the picture?

with grooves are as large as 12 meters wide and four deep

 i would highly doubt that these where unnoticable before clearing.  anyone walking through this forest would have seen them like flashing neon .

[Tallpine]

sorry, but i don't see any signs of this being recently logged off (no stumps).  any idea on the time frame involved, or scale of the picture?

 i would highly doubt that these where unnoticable before clearing.  anyone walking through this forest would have seen them like flashing neon .

It's a satellite picture 

[AZRedhawk44]

I don't think that could be made, with the trees in place.  Way too precise.  Straight lines, smaller diamond is parallel to the larger one on all 4 sides.

I interpret it as evidence that the forest was clear-cut before, and then re-grew.

[mtnbkr]

According to this book I read called 1491, which is a history of the Americas before Columbus "discovered" America, Large parts of The Amazon may have been a cultivated forest. That is fruit and nut trees and other useful plants were grown on purpose, these were created along with game habitats and villages.

AKA Permaculture.

Chris

[brimic]

sorry, but i don't see any signs of this being recently logged off (no stumps).  any idea on the time frame involved, or scale of the picture?

 i would highly doubt that these where unnoticable before clearing.  anyone walking through this forest would have seen them like flashing neon .


It's a satellite picture 

It should be pretty obvious at ground level as well. The field in the picture is clearcut.

[Sergeant Bob]

Crap! At first glance I thought the thread title was "Hooray for Defenestration" I had visions of politicians attempting human powered flight.

[Racehorse]

Was that the Aztecs or the Mayans?  I was thinking that was the basic origin of Mexico City.

Aztecs. Mexico City (Tenochtitlan) was an Aztec city. The Mayans didn't have much influence by the time Tenochtitlan got big if I remember correctly. I also believe Mayan territory is more in the Yucatan/Guatemala region.

[De Selby]

Aztecs. Mexico City (Tenochtitlan) was an Aztec city. The Mayans didn't have much influence by the time Tenochtitlan got big if I remember correctly. I also believe Mayan territory is more in the Yucatan/Guatemala region.

Yep.  Tenochtitlan, the city on a lake...supported by medieval aquaculture, in a sense.

[just Warren]

AKA Permaculture.

Chris

It's all that citified booklearnin' that leads to words like that there.