Well, Good.

[Leatherneck]

From Strategy Page, via Instapundit:

In North Waziristan, a section of Pakistan’s tribal territories that borders Afghanistan, there is growing fear among the Islamic militants who have long used the area as a base area and refuge. So far this year, there has been at least one missile attack a week, leaving more al Qaeda or Taliban, usually leaders, dead. American UAVs, often operating in pairs, or packs of four, roam the skies almost constantly. Terrorist leaders are now terrorized, and have cut back on travel, and use of satellite phones. When terrorist leaders do travel, they use public transport, surrounded by women and children. The terrorists know that American ROE (Rules of Engagement) discourage “collateral damage” (civilian casualties), so the terrorists try to have women and children around at all times. But the locals know that the ROE doesn’t absolutely forbid civilian casualties, and either refuse to rent rooms in their compounds to al Qaeda or Taliban leaders, or flee if the terrorists insist on staying. . . . While the terrorist groups are concerned about the losses, especially among the leadership, what alarms them the most is how frequently the American UAVs are finding their key people. The real problem the terrorists have is that someone is ratting them out.

Insty labels it "A climate of Fear." 

TC

[RevDisk]

So after X years, we're finally getting our intel act together and able to strike over the border?   Uhm, yay?   

[vaskidmark]

While the terrorist groups are concerned about the losses, especially among the leadership, what alarms them the most is how frequently the American UAVs are finding their key people. The real problem the terrorists have is that someone is ratting them out.

Insty labels it "A climate of Fear." 

And the problem with either case is ?

As RevDisk said: "Yay!"

stay safe.

skidmark

[MillCreek]

An excellent use of our tax dollars, in my view.

[S. Williamson]

So after X years, we're finally getting our intel act together and able to strike over the border?   Uhm, yay?   

Not an issue of intel.  The issue's a political one.

[Balog]

We used to get mortared a good bit from hastily set up mortar tubes in people's backyards. The Army across the canal had A. a battery a Paladins & B. echo-location gear that could precisely pin point where the incoming rounds originated. It always pissed me off that they refused to fire counter battery. I bet after the first few people had their house reduced to rubble no one would let a mortar position be set up in their back yard anymore...

[Tallpine]

Coming soon to a neighborhood near you ...?   

[Balog]

I believe certain fed.gov agencies use UAV's for recon purposes vs American citizens in CONUS. But if things ever get to the point that missiles are being fired at Americans in America, well.... I think UAV's will be the least of our problems...

[kgbsquirrel]

So after X years, we're finally getting our intel act together and able to strike over the border?   Uhm, yay?   

More like, after X years the politicians and flag officers grew a pair and decided to start hitting them where they sleep after X years of intel telling them that they were "right there!" *point*

You have no idea how p-o'd we in the S2 shop got when we were watching the bastages pull off an attack and then slip right back over the border where we weren't allowed to touch them and Pakistan not doing a darned thing about it (except for one time where we managed to drop some A-10's on the twerps when they were within sight of the Paki border, hehe ).

And yes, the hiding behind human shields thing is annoying as all get out. I recall one instance in 2006 where we had eyes on the little <insert excessive explicative here> responsible for killing some  11 SEALs, 8 Rangers and a CH-47 aircrew. Needless to say we wanted to wax this guy something aweful. We saw him, knew exactly where he was and that he wasn't going anywhere any time soon and were more than ready to drop a 2,000 lb Mk-84 on his noggin.... except we couldn't, because he was sitting smack dab in the middle of a compound loaded to the gills with women and children (and FYI, they don't usually hang out with these creeps willingly, generally they are forced to at gun point, so try to refrain from blaming them for consorting with Taliban). Welcome to the world of MI.

[/rant]

[MillCreek]

I believe certain fed.gov agencies use UAV's for recon purposes vs American citizens in CONUS.

I read an article in the Seattle Times a few months ago, about how our local Border Patrol is using UAVs, some with IR and FLIR, to patrol the wilderness areas of the US/Canadian border.  They have apparently made a number of pot smuggling busts as a result.

[Tallpine]

I read an article in the Seattle Times a few months ago, about how our local Border Patrol is using UAVs, some with IR and FLIR, to patrol the wilderness areas of the US/Canadian border.  They have apparently made a number of pot smuggling busts as a result.

And I bet they've caught a lot of deer, elk, and bears sneaking back and forth across the border 

[Jamisjockey]

I believe certain fed.gov agencies use UAV's for recon purposes vs American citizens in CONUS. But if things ever get to the point that missiles are being fired at Americans in America, well.... I think UAV's will be the least of our problems...

I can verify that UAVs are used over CONUS in the "war on drugs", plus in the current counter terrorisim role. 


After the Marine Corps got rid of the OV10 Bronco, several dozen were bought by the ATF, and then they got mixed into the State department and other .gov agecies.  The Bronco has a pretty serious offensive capability...

[Leatherneck]

I believe certain fed.gov agencies use UAV's for recon purposes vs American citizens in CONUS.

Not so much. It's really hard to get the FAA to clear UAV ops outside of restricted areas.

ou have no idea how p-o'd we in the S2 shop got when we were watching the bastages pull off an attack and then slip right back over the border where we weren't allowed to touch them

welcome to Vietnam air war redux, Grasshopper. In our case it was various borders, but similar ROE.

I bet after the first few people had their house reduced to rubble no one would let a mortar position be set up in their back yard anymore...

My sentiments exactly. What are you, some savage Marine?

After the Marine Corps got rid of the OV10 Bronco,

A sad, sad day; I loved flying that bird, and we could so be using it today.

TC

[Jamisjockey]

Not so much. It's really hard to get the FAA to clear UAV ops outside of restricted areas.


TC

There are certain restricted areas and MOAs they are being used in the war on terror and on drugs. 

[Ben]

Not so much. It's really hard to get the FAA to clear UAV ops outside of restricted areas.

TC

It's getting a little better, but still a major pain. In my own experience, Restricted Areas are easy, Whiskeys are pretty easy if you work well with the airspace owner, and COAs to get to them via civilian airspace (mostly over inhabited areas at lower altitudes) are an Excedrin headache and a half.

We were doing work in the Pacific Missile Test Range a few years ago basing out of Edwards AFB, and in order to satisfy the FAA COA, we had to have a Predator escorted through the civilian airspace between Edwards and the Range by two NASA guys in a Cessna 172. :)

[kgbsquirrel]

welcome to Vietnam air war redux, Grasshopper. In our case it was various borders, but similar ROE.

Oh, we had already drawn that parallel four years ago in Afghanistan while sitting around and spying on the people we couldn't touch. Another fun headache was the two ROE cards I was issued. Both were for the same area and same time frame. One said you MUST use warning shots. The other said you must NOT use warning shots. 

[makattak]

Oh, we had already drawn that parallel four years ago in Afghanistan while sitting around and spying on the people we couldn't touch. Another fun headache was the two ROE cards I was issued. Both were for the same area and same time frame. One said you MUST use warning shots. The other said you must NOT use warning shots. 

I sure hope you burned the warning shots one.

[MicroBalrog]

I'm reminded of that Starship Troopers moment.

"It's AFRAID! IT'S AFRAID!"