Maryland becomes the 18th state to abolish the death penalty

[MillCreek]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/15/maryland-death-penalty/1989977/

We have discussed this before, and I still think that as time goes on, more and more states will end the death penalty due to cost, if nothing else.  Given the typical legal costs associated with a capital case and the appeals, it is much cheaper to imprison someone for life.

[makattak]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/15/maryland-death-penalty/1989977/

We have discussed this before, and I still think that as time goes on, more and more states will end the death penalty due to cost, if nothing else.  Given the typical legal costs associated with a capital case and the appeals, it is much cheaper to imprison someone for life.

That may very well be the case... until some damnfool state decides to let out those criminals who were sentenced to "life without parole" and the pendulum of the populace swings back to "kill 'em, if the state won't keep up their end of the justice bargain."

[lupinus]

The fact it is cheaper and easier to just warehouse someone for life, living (even if just on some small way) on the dime of the loved ones of their victim, than it is to end them is a major failing.

Personally, I'd rather that be fixed.

[MechAg94]

IMO, this just lets the politicians off the hook of having to fix problems in the judicial system.  After all, we don't care if the judge was biased, the prosecutor hid evidence, or the defense attorney gave up as long as the victim is not dead. 

[lupinus]

IMO, this just lets the politicians off the hook of having to fix problems in the judicial system.  After all, we don't care if the judge was biased, the prosecutor hid evidence, or the defense attorney gave up as long as the victim is not dead. 

Exactly.

Because years on death row is fine and dandy living.

[T.O.M.]

IMHO, as an insider of the justice system, the real problem with capital punishment is that it is misapplied.  Guy who kills someone in a robbery, or a drug deal gone bad, or shoots a cop who walks in on a stic-up...these are guys who can live the rest of their lives and never kill again, because those circumstances ay ever occur again.  Yet we see capital punishmment applied to these kinda of cases.  Serial child rapists?  Nope.  Not even life here in Ohio, unless the state proves force waas used on the child.  Can't fix that kind of sick, IMHO.  Well, a proper lead injection would cure it, I guess.

[lupinus]

IMHO, as an insider of the justice system, the real problem with capital punishment is that it is misapplied.  Guy who kills someone in a robbery, or a drug deal gone bad, or shoots a cop who walks in on a stic-up...these are guys who can live the rest of their lives and never kill again, because those circumstances ay ever occur again.  Yet we see capital punishmment applied to these kinda of cases.  Serial child rapists?  Nope.  Not even life here in Ohio, unless the state proves force waas used on the child.  Can't fix that kind of sick, IMHO.  Well, a proper lead injection would cure it, I guess.

This is kind of my line of thinking. I suppose I'm an oddball in that I think that we both don't use the death penalty enough but that when we do, there isn't always a high enough standard.

Death penalty should not just be beyond a reasonable doubt, it should be beyond any doubt. Concrete DNA evidence? Video footage? An overwhelming amount of eyewitness testimony? Etc.? I am fine with the death penalty so long as there can be no doubt at all of guilt.

Combine that with I think we don't use it on nearly a wide enough range of crimes. Violent rape, especially repeat or multi offenders? Child predators? Violent carrier criminals? Screw ware housing such people. If convicted with solid concrete evidence? Take um out back 24 hours after conviction and put a bullet in their head.

[kgbsquirrel]

I'd like to see the unrepentant recidivists start getting cleared out of gen-pop. Okay, you effed up and got tossed in the can for 15 to 25. So now you're going to start acting out, inciting/extorting other short-term inmates into committing crimes, or attacking/murdering other inmates and guards? Screw keeping you locked in there for life while you keep doing these things, to the front of the line on death-row with you.

[MechAg94]

IMHO, as an insider of the justice system, the real problem with capital punishment is that it is misapplied.  Guy who kills someone in a robbery, or a drug deal gone bad, or shoots a cop who walks in on a stic-up...these are guys who can live the rest of their lives and never kill again, because those circumstances ay ever occur again.  Yet we see capital punishmment applied to these kinda of cases.  Serial child rapists?  Nope.  Not even life here in Ohio, unless the state proves force waas used on the child.  Can't fix that kind of sick, IMHO.  Well, a proper lead injection would cure it, I guess.

Wasn't that our friendly neighborhood liberal SC justices that ruled on that?   

I could accept a higher standard evidence for death penalty cases (I thought we already did in Texas, but I could be wrong), But "No doubt" is impossible and should not be adopted.  I don't see how a prosecutor could try any cases at all beyond Unreasonable Doubt, which is after all unreasonable.  IMO, "beyond a reasonable doubt" essentially is "beyond doubt" as you would expect a jury to reasonably judge the evidence and apply it to the case. 

[Waitone]

You can tell what a society values by how it punishes those who attack those value.  Yeah, the capital punishment gig is fraught with screwups.  Yeah, screw ups occur.  The fix is not to abandon the ultimate punishment.  The solution is to figger out what when wrong and why and then figger out what can be done to fix it.  If a wrongful death penalty is applied or implemented based on incompetence or malfeasance, the solution is not to abandon CP but rather go after the malefactors with a holy vengeance. DNA is a pretty good investigative tool.  Problem is it gets lost in the system of incompetence.  Those responsible for diddling results to keep the DA happy (Duke rape case) should suffer the same legal consequences as if they were found guilty of the supposed crime.  At no point should those operating the system receive a pass from their malfeasance. 

[kgbsquirrel]

You can tell what a society values by how it punishes those who attack those value.  Yeah, the capital punishment gig is fraught with screwups.  Yeah, screw ups occur.  The fix is not to abandon the ultimate punishment.  The solution is to figger out what when wrong and why and then figger out what can be done to fix it.  If a wrongful death penalty is applied or implemented based on incompetence or malfeasance, the solution is not to abandon CP but rather go after the malefactors with a holy vengeance. DNA is a pretty good investigative tool.  Problem is it gets lost in the system of incompetence.  Those responsible for diddling results to keep the DA happy (Duke rape case) should suffer the same legal consequences as if they were found guilty of the supposed crime.  At no point should those operating the system receive a pass from their malfeasance. 

[whine] But without immunity police, prosecutors and judges can't do their jobs! [/whine]