Author Topic: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash  (Read 3245 times)

MechAg94

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http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/18/twa-flight-800-investigators-break-silence-in-new-documentary-claim-original/

Quote
The investigators, who claim in a new documentary that new evidence points to the often-discounted theory that a missile strike may have downed the jumbo jet, leveled their charges in a news conference on Wednesday that was followed by the filing of a petition to have the probe reopened

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/06/18/twa-flight-800-investigators-break-silence-in-new-documentary-claim-original/#ixzz2WgwpCcNJ

I thought this was interesting.  I do seem to recall that the Clinton Administration was very slow to label anything as terrorism.  I can't remember if there were any other theories.

As for any other cause, I don't know. 
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MillCreek

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2013, 04:23:59 PM »
At the time, there was some speculation that an US Aegis cruiser launched a Standard missile by mistake, and this downed Flight 800.
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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2013, 04:33:56 PM »
At the time, there was some speculation that an US Aegis cruiser launched a Standard missile by mistake, and this downed Flight 800.

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griz

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2013, 06:02:53 PM »
You may call me a skeptic about the "new" claims, but I don't see any new evidence.  Strikes me as a media blitz to sell their video.
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cassandra and sara's daddy

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Too many folks would know about a middle launch to cover it up

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It is much more powerful to seek Truth for one's self.  Seeing and hearing that others seem to have found it can be a motivation.  With me, I was drawn because of much error and bad judgment on my part. Confronting one's own errors and bad judgment is a very life altering situation.  Confronting the errors and bad judgment of others is usually hypocrisy.


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dogmush

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Too many folks would know about a middle launch to cover it up

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What if it came from the fore or aft launchers?

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What if it came from the fore or aft launchers?

That's a stern comeback.

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lupinus

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2013, 08:17:38 PM »
That's a stern comeback.

I bow to your wit.
No need to make waves
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RoadKingLarry

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Too many folks would know about a middle launch to cover it up

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That's the big problem with conspiricies. If they are as big as the serious tinfoil hat crowd wants us to believe, the number of people involved get huge.
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That's the big problem with conspiricies. If they are as big as the serious tinfoil hat crowd wants us to believe, the number of people involved get huge.
3 can keep a secret if 2 are dead.

So you're saying it was a submarine that launched the missile rather than a cruiser?
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AJ Dual

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #10 on: June 19, 2013, 10:56:25 PM »
Yes, it's pretty much 99.9999999% impossible that every last enlisted rate and jr. officer aboard such a vessel would keep their mouth shut forever once they realized that the missile launch, test, accident, or whatever had happened right at the time of the TWA 800 disappearance/crash.

Average human eye separation for our stereoscopic vision means the highest resolution/smallest thing we can resolve is generally one arc-minute of our field of view.

What any eye witnesses think they saw, well they're just full of it.

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Northwoods

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2013, 01:50:18 AM »
I never bought the missile theory for reasons already stated.  BUT, the fuel tank explosion due toa short never made sense to me either.  Jet fuel tanks are vented.  That keeps the fuel/air mixture too lean to ever be explosive.
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CNYCacher

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #12 on: June 20, 2013, 08:24:41 AM »
I never bought the missile theory for reasons already stated.  BUT, the fuel tank explosion due toa short never made sense to me either.  Jet fuel tanks are vented.  That keeps the fuel/air mixture too lean to ever be explosive.

Even so, isn't jet fuel more similar to diesel/kerosene than gasoline?  I didn't think it *could* explode.
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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #13 on: June 20, 2013, 08:52:30 AM »
Even so, isn't jet fuel more similar to diesel/kerosene than gasoline?  I didn't think it *could* explode.

The fumes can be under circumstances. The more finely you divide something, the better it burns. Needs to be in sufficient concentration to allow for a big boom.


I never bought the missile theory for reasons already stated.  BUT, the fuel tank explosion due toa short never made sense to me either.  Jet fuel tanks are vented.  That keeps the fuel/air mixture too lean to ever be explosive.

Not sure of the specifics, but from what I understood, they were supposed to be vented but where not appropriately vented properly?
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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #14 on: June 20, 2013, 09:44:16 AM »
Even so, isn't jet fuel more similar to diesel/kerosene than gasoline?  I didn't think it *could* explode.

Nope.  Aviation fuel is quite combustible.  BTDT. 

Not sure of the specifics, but from what I understood, they were supposed to be vented but where not appropriately vented properly?

IIRC that was the problem. Design flaw of some kind.

Yes, it's pretty much 99.9999999% impossible that every last enlisted rate and jr. officer aboard such a vessel would keep their mouth shut forever once they realized that the missile launch, test, accident, or whatever had happened right at the time of the TWA 800 disappearance/crash.

Average human eye separation for our stereoscopic vision means the highest resolution/smallest thing we can resolve is generally one arc-minute of our field of view.

What any eye witnesses think they saw, well they're just full of it.



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Northwoods

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #15 on: June 20, 2013, 09:56:00 AM »
Even so, isn't jet fuel more similar to diesel/kerosene than gasoline?  I didn't think it *could* explode.

Jet fuel is basically a type of kerosene.  Diesel is not, but is still very similar.

Gasoline is far more volitile, so gas tanks are sealed which allows a fuel/air mix that too rich to explode to develop in seconds.

Jet/kerosene/diesel certainly can explode.  Wouldn't work very well as a fuel if it didn't.  They just need to be volatized and pressurized for an explosion to occur.
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HankB

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2013, 10:44:33 AM »
Yes, it's pretty much 99.9999999% impossible that every last enlisted rate and jr. officer aboard such a vessel would keep their mouth shut forever once they realized that the missile launch, test, accident, or whatever had happened right at the time of the TWA 800 disappearance/crash.

Average human eye separation for our stereoscopic vision means the highest resolution/smallest thing we can resolve is generally one arc-minute of our field of view.

What any eye witnesses think they saw, well they're just full of it.
I agree that if TWA 800 had been brought down by a U.S. military missile launch of ANY sort, it's virtually certain that military personnel could NOT have been silenced; a shipboard missile launch is a big deal, and kind of hard to overlook. Shutting up 100 or more sailors once they know a U.S. commercial aircraft was downed? Nope - "We shot it down ourselves" is an explanation I just don't buy into.

In terms of human eye resolution, seeing something isn't the same as resolving it. For example at night you can see stars and planets in a clear sky - no detail, but you know they're there - and the size is under 1 MOA. Same thing with planes and missiles - you may not be able to see what kind of missile is out there, but your eye will pick up on the exhaust plume. In regard to TWA 800, there were too many people who saw something headed towards the aircraft to discount out of hand - as .gov seemed stubbornly determined to do. This doesn't prove there was a missile - but .gov wasn't interested in hearing anything other than "accident." And their ever-changing explanations undermined their credibility.

I'm interested in hearing what these retired investigators have to say, now that there's nobody holding job termination over their heads.
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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2013, 01:47:09 PM »
IIRC, the wiring sheath used on the aircraft had previously been used on .mil aircraft, but when it was discovered to be cracking and "melting" (for lack of a better word) when in contact with Aviation fuel, the military replaced all the wiring running trough the in-wing fuel tanks.

Remember there are three things needed for fires/explosions:  Fuel, Oxygen, and an Ignition Source.  Fuel Tanks aren't vacuums, when the fuel goes out air goes in.  The fuel will vaporize in the presence of air.   Get to the right ratio, add either shorting or sparking wires and you get a nice big boom. 

Robert and I still make film canister cannons.  A little alcohol (cheap perfume or hairspray) for fuel, a way to make two wires spark and "Pop" !!

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Stand_watie

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2013, 01:58:40 PM »
Jet fuel is basically a type of kerosene.  Diesel is not, but is still very similar.

Gasoline is far more volitile, so gas tanks are sealed which allows a fuel/air mix that too rich to explode to develop in seconds.

Jet/kerosene/diesel certainly can explode.  Wouldn't work very well as a fuel if it didn't.  They just need to be volatized and pressurized for an explosion to occur.

http://www.toad.net/~jsmeenen/fuel.html
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MechAg94

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #19 on: June 20, 2013, 09:58:40 PM »
Not just stars and planets.  You can see satellites in clear conditions. 
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Jamisjockey

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Re: Investigators want missile theory probed in '96 TWA Flight 800 crash
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2013, 10:03:34 AM »
I agree that if TWA 800 had been brought down by a U.S. military missile launch of ANY sort, it's virtually certain that military personnel could NOT have been silenced; a shipboard missile launch is a big deal, and kind of hard to overlook. Shutting up 100 or more sailors once they know a U.S. commercial aircraft was downed? Nope - "We shot it down ourselves" is an explanation I just don't buy into.

In terms of human eye resolution, seeing something isn't the same as resolving it. For example at night you can see stars and planets in a clear sky - no detail, but you know they're there - and the size is under 1 MOA. Same thing with planes and missiles - you may not be able to see what kind of missile is out there, but your eye will pick up on the exhaust plume. In regard to TWA 800, there were too many people who saw something headed towards the aircraft to discount out of hand - as .gov seemed stubbornly determined to do. This doesn't prove there was a missile - but .gov wasn't interested in hearing anything other than "accident." And their ever-changing explanations undermined their credibility.

I'm interested in hearing what these retired investigators have to say, now that there's nobody holding job termination over their heads.

If it really was a cover up, and they waited until they retired from their government jobs to speak up, they've already lost credibility in my book. 
JD

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