Random thought: is Russia actually more corrupt than the US?

[Balog]

So, bear with me a second and try not to just reflexively shout Murica! as the answer to any question regarding US vs the rest of the world.

Looking strictly at the federal government and not at the lower levels as there is not a good way to compare regions, and taking the definition of corruption as any form of bribery or malfeasance even if technically "legal" I think we may actually lose in that comparison. My thought process.

Russia is a corrupt oligarchy, where a couple dozen men have become billionaires because of sweetheart (illegal) deals. Compared to America, there are far more blatant and egregious violations of laws. But actually look at the American system for a second. Insider trading laws don't apply to Congress, so they can make millions and millions of dollars buying/selling/shorting stocks based on advance knowledge of their own laws/regulations etc. Completely legal. They can funnel billions to contractors, then leave office and get seven figure sinecure jobs with those contractors. Completely legal. Hell, the ability to syphon off millions or billions in tax dollars for your constituents in pork is a well known measure of how "effective" a politician is, and is in no significant way different than Putin skimming billions for his buddies.

Is scamming hundreds of millions or billions of dollars for your "associates" to build a ridiculous (car/solar project/pointless bridge etc etc) really any different than scamming money for your friends who don't bother to go through the pretense? Is making a few dozen billionaires better or worse than making many thousands of millionaires with wasted tax dollars? What's the difference between "Give me $10 million and I'll send you $100 million" and "I'll give you $100 million to 'research' this 'new tech' wink wink nudge nudge if you'll give me a $10 million salary at your company after I leave office"? Sure one is technically legal and one isn't, but are they actually different in any real sense of the word?

As far as I can tell, the main difference between the US and RU fed.govs is that one pretends there is no corruption and the other just went ahead and legalized it.

[Sergeant Bob]

As far as I can tell, the main difference between the US and RU fed.govs is that one pretends there is no corruption and the other just went ahead and legalized it.

Nailed it.

[zahc]

Obvious thread is obvious. You have independently discovered "the blinders".

I always liked how when MSM refer to other governments, they use the term "regime". When they refer to ours, they used the term "administration".

[Ned Hamford]

Winner winner chicken dinner

[cordex]

As far as I can tell, the main difference between the US and RU fed.govs is that one pretends there is no corruption and the other just went ahead and legalized it.

Yep.

However, I do think that legitimizing corruption is a step beyond tolerating corruption that is more-or-less out of sight.

[Perd Hapley]

I always liked how when MSM refer to other governments, they use the term "regime". When they refer to ours, they used the term "administration".

Not really. "Regime" has become a popular way of referring to governments of which one strongly disapproves. E.g., Rush Limbaugh refers to the Obama administration as "the regime." Governments which one views more or less favorably (that of the U.K., or Germany, for example) are referred to as, well, "governments." Or "administrations," or the like.

[Ron]

All governments human institutions tend toward corruption.

That is why government should be shackled head to toe and only allowed one function; protecting the individuals liberty as understood in a natural rights framework.

[White Horseradish]

The main difference between US and Russian corruption is that in US corruption generally resides in the levels above the average guy and everyday life.  Congress and Duma are not that different, although US policritters are less blatant about it, keeping at least a pretense. However, you as a regular person on the street don't come in contact with those guys very often, if ever.

The government you deal with is the DMV, the city inspectors, the police. And those are different. In US the "user interface" of government is a lot friendlier. You are not going to be hit up for a "expedited processing fee" to get your drivers license faster, a cop will not offer you a paid service of delivering you home rather than to the drunk tank. These public-facing layers of government in US function better and have remedies available. The higher up you go, though, the more similar things look.

[Tallpine]

A government is a body of people, usually, notably ungoverned.

[fifth_column]

My Russian bureaucrats' work might be illegal, but at least it's honest. 

[Jocassee]

My Russian bureaucrats' work might be illegal, but at least it's honest. 

This was my thought as well. Revdisk may be along to correct me, but the Russians are actually getting something for their money instead of Solyndra, failed auto companies, and electric cars that catch fire.

[Ned Hamford]

Have much experience with building inspectors and planning boards?  Results may vary wildly. 

[White Horseradish]

Russians are actually getting something for their money instead of Solyndra, failed auto companies, and electric cars that catch fire.

Actually, they are getting failed auto companies galore. AutoVAZ has been government-subsidized forever and still makes cars of craptasticality unimaginable to Americans. Yo-mobile and Marussia turned out to be vaporware. They get high import tariffs on everything else. They are also getting sour cream banned for being too gay (rainbow on a label, dont'cha know), people driving around who bought their licenses outright, Chechens and Dagestanis who are high enough above the law to publicly take pictures with gold-plated pistols, while handguns are banned for everyone else...

So yeah. They are getting something. The knowledge that they still make rockets and have decent ballet troupes.

[Blakenzy]

In the US corruption is systematically standardized... there is a school of corruption. In Russia it's a free-for-all improv act.

That doesn't mean one is better than the other. Kill it. Kill it with fire.