Author Topic: Preferred game console?  (Read 5724 times)

Manedwolf

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #25 on: December 17, 2007, 05:23:07 AM »
With consoles the hardware/software baseline is pretty much static, and that gives latency to the system. Yes, the video and other aspects will lag behind the cutting edge in the PC market, but you don't go insane trying to keep up.

And the latest graphics doesn't always equal "fun". For example, the Wii certainly lacks the graphics horsepower of the 360 and PS3, but it's adequate. It does nice dynamic water, Pixar-like hair/fur, dynamic shadows and other stuff, but more importantly, Shigeru Miyamoto has designed some FUN games for it. Tight design, zero load time, no clipping errors, and excellent, excellent play control. Your character does what you want it to, things happen as you intend, without ARRG! frustration. I like short or no load time, too. I was startled at how painfully long some of the PS3 load times were on a Motorstorm store unit. Is this 2007, or 1987 with a floppy drive?

I see too many companies focusing on the eyecandy and cutscenes, but ignoring frustratingly bad control, sloppy design, and simple replay value and outright FUN.

And to me, the latter is more why I'd want to play a game. Hollywood-epic cutscenes, but sloppy control make for a poor game.

Even with the PC (and Mac) games! A lot of copycat games have come after Diablo 2 that are more advanced, with "better" graphics, but that one is still lots more fun!

K Frame

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #26 on: December 17, 2007, 05:37:46 AM »
I never said that eye candy equals fun.

But eyecandy largely drives the PC components market for video games. Normally the most expensive component these days is the graphics card, and it's also the component most likely to be completely out of date in a year.
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Manedwolf

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #27 on: December 17, 2007, 05:40:06 AM »
I know, I was agreeing. I don't understand the constant race to keep up with "better graphics", but you can't choose not to...or you literally can't play some of the new games. If you want to PC game, you're forced to spend lots of money to chase the upgrade cycle, or you're locked outside the door. Console hardware is static. You can play a new PS2 game on an original PS2, and it will look the same as a new PS2 slim, pretty much.

I'm actually surprised that MS and Sony haven't tried to put the graphics hardware on a pull-out module, so they could have a secondary market for expensive upgrades beyond the original console purchase.

It's just that I also see the game makers trying so hard to do "better graphics" that they seem to be relegating replay value, plot, writing, fun, and even the robustness of the graphics engine to second place, at best. There's a few notable examples, like Bioshock and Portal, as well as TF2, but companies like EA seem to be scratching their heads that people aren't more enthusiastic about their latest movie tie-in game with "better effects".  smiley

I'd rather have a game with fuzzier graphics on a well-understood older graphics chip that's stable than one with eye-bleeding razor-sharp graphics on a brand-new card with buggy drivers that quits every now and then.

Firethorn

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #28 on: December 17, 2007, 05:46:24 AM »
And in five years, it'll be Salvation Army donation value.

Guess how old my old machine is?  And I'm still using it.  The only reason I bought the new one is games like Bioshock coming out that 'required' new video cards, and while I could have gotten a video card that would work in my AGP slot, the extra price for less performance was such that I just bought a new machine.

Sure, I didn't get as much eye candy, but it still played the new games just fine until a little while ago.

And if you're into retrogaming(as I occasionally am), the old machine will play all the old games just fine.

And if you look at it, the 'useful' lifespans of consoles are dropping.  They're entering a faster development scale like computers.

Though to be honest, I'm into computer gaming because you don't get many 4X games for consoles.  I happen to like turn-based wide-scale strategy.  Stuff like civilization, Masters of Orion, etc...

Manedwolf

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #29 on: December 17, 2007, 05:49:40 AM »
And if you look at it, the 'useful' lifespans of consoles are dropping.  They're entering a faster development scale like computers.

I don't know about that. Some of the most popular and highest-rated games last year were for the PS2, which is now seven years old. And I believe PS2s still outsell PS3s in Japan? That's got to be embarrassing for Sony.

I see current console successes this way at present, myself:

Sony:
PS1: Win
PS2: WIN
PS3: Fail
PSP: Would win if they'd quit crippling it

Nintendo:
NES: WIN
GB: WIN
SNES: Fail
N-64: Somewhere in between win and fail
GameCube: Fail
Wii: WIN
DS: WIN

MS:
Xbox: Sorta win, if you count Halo
360: WIN

Atari:
2600: WIN
5200: Fail
7800: Fail
Jaguar: Fail
Lynx: Fail
RIP

Sega:
Master System: Fail
Genesis: WIN
Gamegear: Fail
Saturn: Fail
Dreamcast: Fail
RIP

atomd

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #30 on: December 17, 2007, 06:05:53 AM »
Quote
And the latest graphics doesn't always equal "fun". For example, the Wii certainly lacks the graphics horsepower of the 360 and PS3, but it's adequate. It does nice dynamic water, Pixar-like hair/fur, dynamic shadows and other stuff, but more importantly, Shigeru Miyamoto has designed some FUN games for it. Tight design, zero load time, no clipping errors, and excellent, excellent play control. Your character does what you want it to, things happen as you intend, without ARRG! frustration. I like short or no load time, too.

I totally agree. My wife shows very little interest in most of the 360 games but her eyes lit up when she got to try out our nephew's Nintendo Wii a while back. The Wii is like a backlash against all these convoluted and fancy graphics-based games. I'll admit I'm a sucker for some of them but the Wii is just a smart design. I hear they lost about a billion in sales because they couldn't make enough to meet the demand for this Christmas. People are shelling out big bucks for them on ebay right now.

GeoJAP

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #31 on: December 17, 2007, 06:11:01 AM »
It is true that PC gaming requires more from the gamer.  But PC gaming offers more to the gamer than console gaming.

1. The gamer needs to understand the technology.  This includes how to build a PC and get the most performance for the dollar spent.  Knowing how to optimize the operating system for faster performance, as well as knowing how to trouble shoot drivers, other software and hardware is very important.  
2. The gamer will need to replace the PC every 2-4 years, depending on various factors.  
3. The gamer will need to spend more on PC hardware than a console gamer.  Now-a-days you can buy an awesome gaming PC for less than $1000 (assuming you already have a good monitor, which can cost $600-800 for a good 24" 1920x1200 LCD).

The benefits of PC gaming are:
1. You have a much richer gaming experience, as the games are more detailed and complex.  Other programs are available to the gamer that may be needed for gaming, like VOIP software.
2. A gaming computer is a very fast PC which can be used very well for other kinds of applications like multi-media and IT development.

I have had my PC for about 2.5 years and will be replacing it with a Intel Penryn-based CPU rig next spring.  So it will have given me three years of solid gaming.  I can still use the retired PC as a wonderful secondary PC.  Since I'm a programmer/database administrator, this is very useful to me.

SteveS

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #32 on: December 17, 2007, 06:56:09 AM »
Quote
And the latest graphics doesn't always equal "fun". For example, the Wii certainly lacks the graphics horsepower of the 360 and PS3, but it's adequate. It does nice dynamic water, Pixar-like hair/fur, dynamic shadows and other stuff, but more importantly, Shigeru Miyamoto has designed some FUN games for it. Tight design, zero load time, no clipping errors, and excellent, excellent play control. Your character does what you want it to, things happen as you intend, without ARRG! frustration. I like short or no load time, too.

I totally agree. My wife shows very little interest in most of the 360 games but her eyes lit up when she got to try out our nephew's Nintendo Wii a while back. The Wii is like a backlash against all these convoluted and fancy graphics-based games. I'll admit I'm a sucker for some of them but the Wii is just a smart design. I hear they lost about a billion in sales because they couldn't make enough to meet the demand for this Christmas. People are shelling out big bucks for them on ebay right now.

It basically comes down to what games you are interested in.  Graphics won't make up for a poor experience or a lame story.  That being said, Mario, Metroid Prime and Dragon Ball Z just don't interest me. 
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Manedwolf

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2007, 07:04:49 AM »
Did you look at the trailer for "No More Heroes" I posted earlier? That's going to be Wii-exclusive, and is only for adults. Kill Bill-esque sandbox game.


SteveS

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2007, 07:17:31 AM »
Did you look at the trailer for "No More Heroes" I posted earlier? That's going to be Wii-exclusive, and is only for adults. Kill Bill-esque sandbox game.



That does look pretty cool.  I may eventually get a Wii, but I need to be convinced that they will release more stuff like that and not just kid games.  For now, I am happy with the PS3 and they have some good stuff coming out:  Haze, FF XIII, God of War 3, MGS 4, and Turning Point (a FPS set in the Nazi occupied US in the 1950's). 

Personally, I don't see any reason that all three systems can't thrive.  The PS3 and the 360 are similar, but the Wii is tapping into a somewhat different market.  I hope they all make it, as I think that encourages innovation and good design.
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K Frame

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2007, 08:50:56 AM »
"And if you look at it, the 'useful' lifespans of consoles are dropping.  They're entering a faster development scale like computers."

Not to any appreciable degree when compared to the advancements in computer components.

The original XBox came on the market when... 2001?

XBox 360 came out in 2006.

5 years is a pretty good run.

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grislyatoms

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Re: Preferred game console?
« Reply #36 on: December 17, 2007, 09:05:29 AM »
Mike, your new sig reminds of "Steppenwolf" by Hesse.
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