Should tobacco be illegal?

[BridgeWalker]

 Don't poison my air,

It's not your air.  It's the property owner's air.

You can't control your addictions?  Then the law will.  Grow up.  You live in a society and there are other considerations than your own selfish desires.

I sure hope this was general and not addressed to me, the party to whose quote you were responding.  If not, what part of "ex-smoker" did you not get?

[Bigjake]

Y'all best stay on the pigfarm Bigjake, because the rest of us are using government to protect individual rights.

I haven't laughed that hard in a long time.  That coming from a Libertarian and Cail resident is priceless.

FWIT,  when the next recession/ depression, whatever you want to call it hits, I'll be eating steak and brats, and I have the weapons to keep it that way.

[Bigjake]

added, I have a fine henhouse as well, so breakfast won't be interupted either....

[Perd Hapley]

I agree with Riley.  I have a right to go into someone else's restaurant or bar and then breathe whatever sort of air I want.  While we're at it, alcoholic beverages smell gross, and cause automotive wrecks, property damage, loss of life and illegitimacy.  And illegitimacy leads to higher crime rates, drug abuse, and more illegitimacy and drinking.  Therefore, I have a right to demand that all bars and restaurants be alcohol-free. 

[Paddy]

Y'all best stay on the pigfarm Bigjake, because the rest of us are using government to protect destroy individual rights.

Fixed it for you.

One of the purposes of government is to protect the weak from predators.  If you think your 'rights' have been destroyed, maybe they needed to be.

[Paddy]

I agree with Riley.  I have a right to go into someone else's restaurant or bar and then breathe whatever sort of air I want.  While we're at it, alcoholic beverages smell gross, and cause automotive wrecks, property damage, loss of life and illegitimacy.  And illegitimacy leads to higher crime rates, drug abuse, and more illegitimacy and drinking.  Therefore, I have a right to demand that all bars and restaurants be alcohol-free. 

Yet you're using the internet, which distributes pornography, which leads to infidelity, divorce and spousal abuse and broken homes, which increases welfare costs which takes my money.   Therefore, I have a right to demand that the internet be outlawed.

[Paddy]

FWIT,  when the next recession/ depression, whatever you want to call it hits, I'll be eating steak and brats, and I have the weapons to keep it that way.

Good fer you, Bigjake. I have several acres on a hilltop in a town of 27k in an agricultural county.   I have weapons, too.  And ammunition.  I don't expect to be hurtin'.  What's yer point, anyway?

[Balog]

Washington bans smoking in "public" places; including tobacco stores.  I miss being able to go down to the Tinder Box and try out a bowl of pipe weed before buying an ounce. Remember, children and the elderly have a reasonable expectation of being able to go to a bar or tobacco store without their virginal nostrils being assaulted by the eeevvviiiillll second hand smoke.

[BridgeWalker]

I miss being able to go down to the Tinder Box and try out a bowl of pipe weed before buying an ounce.

That sounds pleasant.  I'm sorry it's gone.  There are few things more pleasant than quietly sitting and smoking and talking.  From time to time some of the older guys at the range will indulge, and I'll enjoy it vicariously, even if I do end up coughing for a couple of days now that I've gotten so sensitive. 

Ah well, I guess it's for the children...

[Tecumseh]

 Don't poison my air,

It's not your air.  It's the property owner's air.

You can't control your addictions?  Then the law will.  Grow up.  You live in a society and there are other considerations than your own selfish desires.

I sure hope this was general and not addressed to me, the party to whose quote you were responding.  If not, what part of "ex-smoker" did you not get?

What about when the smoke from the restaurants patrons drifts next door to the smoke free store?  What then?  Can you guarantee that ciggarette butts, ashes, and smoke will stay off other peoples property?

*I am not a fan of smoking bans at all.  I just want to further the discussion.

[Stetson]

Nice to see the controlling personalities here.  "*whine* My right to clean air trumps any rights you have."  Get off your high horse and go after the cars and other things that pollute as much or more than I do.  Seen the LA skyline lately?  How about the brown cloud over Denver? 

Do you drive a car?  Then you are polluting MY right to clean air.  You must stop because I demand it!!!
B.S.

I know who to stay away from now.

[Nick1911]

Nice to see the controlling personalities here.  "*whine* My right to clean air trumps any rights you have."  Get off your high horse and go after the cars and other things that pollute as much or more than I do.  Seen the LA skyline lately?  How about the brown cloud over Denver? 

Do you drive a car?  Then you are polluting MY right to clean air.  You must stop because I demand it!!!
B.S.

That's an interesting angle.  RileyMc - what do you think about the air pollution generated by automobiles, factories, and power plants?  Would you argue that the net positive effect (collective good) that comes from these institutions outweighs the air pollution costs that we all have to deal with?

[seeker_two]

Smoking bans should be determined by the person who owns the property. If any law is needed, it should be to have the owner declare the property "smoking" or "non-smoking" in the zoning declaration so the owner can have the police remove someone who violates the declaration.

You know.....Hillary & Barak also believe in "regulating" our addictions.....to liberty, free choice, personal property (including money).......

[Otherguy Overby]

Seen the LA skyline lately? 

Actually, the air around LA is better than it's been since the 40s.  They've even had to lower the requirements a time or two, so they could still declare smog emergencies.

[Perd Hapley]

I agree with Riley.  I have a right to go into someone else's restaurant or bar and then breathe whatever sort of air I want.  While we're at it, alcoholic beverages smell gross, and cause automotive wrecks, property damage, loss of life and illegitimacy.  And illegitimacy leads to higher crime rates, drug abuse, and more illegitimacy and drinking.  Therefore, I have a right to demand that all bars and restaurants be alcohol-free. 

Yet you're using the internet, which distributes pornography, which leads to infidelity, divorce and spousal abuse and broken homes, which increases welfare costs which takes my money.   Therefore, I have a right to demand that the internet be outlawed.

Thank you for proving my point.  Which is that your idea of rights is all screwed up.   

[grampster]

I think they should allow pot smoking in restaurants.  That would end the recession in the restaurant bidness.

[Sindawe]

I think they should allow pot smoking in restaurants.  That would end the recession in the restaurant bidness.

Hmmm...works for me.  I've observed that stoners are are lot less noisy than drunks.  I'd support the bar near my home becoming an "Amsterdamn style" coffee shop over it becoming a dress shop as one owner here would like.  Far better to have a group of teen slackers grooving on the wind than a horde of middle aged matrons brawling in the parking lot over the latest fashions from Paris.

But on tobacco being illegal.  We TRIED that with EtOH last century and look what it got us.

[jefnvk]

What about when the smoke from the restaurants patrons drifts next door to the smoke free store?  What then?  Can you guarantee that ciggarette butts, ashes, and smoke will stay off other peoples property?

If the smoke is crossing property lines, then I don't see it being any different than a neighbor who refuses to cut their grass or who has too many carson blocks in the front yard.  Take it to local court, if it is a real problem, than that one place gets a smoking prohibition.

If butts and ashes are a problem, fine the individual offenders for littering.

I see no reason for bans because in a bar of 20 people, there is one person that thinks they are entitled to demand smoking stops.  Heck, I see no reason for bans because in a bar of 20 people, 19 think they have the right to be there without smoke.  If 19 out of 20 people demand smoking stops, either owner will cave to what the market wants, or he will find 19 new patrons.  If he chooses neither, he will go out of business, paving way for someone who will privide a smoke free bar.

[CAnnoneer]

Smoking should be illegal only in premises where second-hand smoking is unavoidable and objectionable. So, ok in a private residence or tobacco parlor or personal vehicle. Not ok in public buildings and at the workplace. Not ok for pregnant or nursing women.

[Perd Hapley]

Smoking should be illegal only in premises where second-hand smoking is unavoidable and objectionable. Not ok in...the workplace. 

How is the workplace unavoidable? 

[Tecumseh]

Smoking bans should be determined by the person who owns the property. If any law is needed, it should be to have the owner declare the property "smoking" or "non-smoking" in the zoning declaration so the owner can have the police remove someone who violates the declaration.

You know.....Hillary & Barak also believe in "regulating" our addictions.....to liberty, free choice, personal property (including money).......

Usually it is the Republicans who want to control what we do with our bodies and what we put into our bodies.  It seems both parties are becoming the same.

[CAnnoneer]

How is the workplace unavoidable? 

Clearly, there are many workplaces in the world. For most people, the workplace involves common premises with a ranging number of coworkers. If the smoker is allowed to smoke on the premises, then the coworkers cannot avoid second-hand smoking because they have to remain in the premises to conduct their professional functions.

[stephpd]

Funny the question is even asked in a pro rights, anti more laws to control the masses, gun rights type forum. How can so many here be against any government intrusion in to private life think one way about something as deadly as guns and want to intrude on others lives and use some lame excuse.
 Hate to tell you but that car you drive puts more toxic gasses into the air in a week then any cigarette. You should give up driving before telling someone else how to live their life(splinter in someone elses eye). Read an article about the removal of lead from gas, heavy metal, falls to the ground quickly, and replaced it with benzene and other carcinogens. Making gasoline more unhealthy then before.

The burning of fossil fuels is way worse then any forest fire on the air quality and health of animals.Living on the East Coast the quality of the air is deemed dangerous. Don't think it's from the smokers spending more time outdoors and puffing tuff. Low lying ozone filled with unburnt hydrocarbons and the nitric oxides from catylitic converters has made it impossible to breath clean air in the summer, not that it's very clean in the winter.

And as far as individual rights to not have to breath the stench and smoke from cigarettes do those of us who believe in less government intrusion think that more intrusion is good for us as a whole. Would any of us like not being able to shoot because of the pollutants from gunpowder? Or have to trash compact our fishing boats because of the pollutants it gives off and the oil slick left behind by a 2 stroke engine. Or maybe we should ban grass cutting and make lawn movers illegal to own.


And don't even get me started on alcohol and drinking. No one should benefit from that drug. Bars should be totally illegal. Shouldn't even be able to buy that poison since it cause my health insurance and auto insurance to be so high to cover the costs of others.

Sure we don't mind intruding on others rights as long as the bad things we do aren't regulated into non existence.

[The Rabbi]

On every drug discussion that has come up the typical argument has run "well X is even worse and we don't regulate X so why should we regulate Y?"
It is an idiotic argument.
I have started asking "yes, X is bad.  But is your solution to make it even worse?"  Some things can and should be regulated.  The fact that not everything can or should be regulated doesn't negate the need to regulate some things.

[El Tejon]

Tobacco illegal?

The hills are alive with the sound of music!!!

What a wonderful world that would be.  Make it a felony, make it a federal and state crime.  *tears of joy and happiness*