Bike Suggestions

[roo_ster]

Howdy:

I know we have some cyclists lurking & posting here'bout, so I'll toss the situation, requirements, etc. out there for y'all to chew over.


I have convinced my wife it might be feasible for my to ride to work by some route/means.  There might be, eventually, cost savings, but part of my motives are to get some more exercise in.

I have shower facilities at work to clean up with.

Requirements:
* Move my 285lb self
* Tote another 20-40 lbs of gear in rear baskets/panniers/racks/whatever
  - Laptop & gear
  - Work clothes (dressy-casual)
  - Water-proofing gear to haul it all in in case I get caught in the rain
* Be able to move along the road at decent speed (not a low-geared rock crawler)
* Be comfortable enough for a 10 mile ride, especially WRT to my backside.
* $500 is the ballpark max expenditure

Like-to-Haves:
Off-road capable for fun trail riding

Routes:
I have several options, route-wise to work.

1. All Road
To get to my work along back/less-congested roads is a 10 mile one-way trip.  There are several routes that all are about 10 miles.

2. Road/Train/Road
I live 2.5 miles from the local light-rail money pit.  I can ride that 2.5 miles, hop on the train and dismount at a station that is 2.5 miles from work.  A month pass is something less than $30.  I'll probably start this way, because I have gotten out of shape and have not ridden a bike in many a long day.

In the next year, the days I'll be able to ride to work would be 3 days/week, max, due to my wife being in nursing school and kid responsibilities.

Used/New:
I have no aversion to buying used, but do not know what to look for as signs of wear.

Bike Format:
Way back when, I owned a 12-spd Wally World Mtn bike.  That had such low gearing, it topped out at half the top speed I could make on a 20 year old Schwinn road bike.  I would consider a mtn bike, but it would have to have gearing on the top end comparable to a road bike and be able to haul stuff on the back end (rack/panniers, etc).

My Current Shape
I have put on a lot of weight, but can still walk/ruck march a decent ways.  I can do 15-min miles with a 45lb pack and boots for 5 miles without an effort.  When I put on weight, I am one of those fat guys that will surprise you with my close-in speed and/or endurance.  That is because, yes, there IS a slim, muscular, in-shape guy under the new blubber. 

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

i did the bike commute into my 40's  get a good seat! i found 10 miles a decent ride  i did as much as 19 each way but that was a bit more than i wanted. i got a decent set of panniers and a rack but found none that were truly waterproof i used trash bags inside em. for a lap top i might get a "drybag". i used tires that allowed a range of pressure  higher pressure to commute  softer for comfort. i never rode so hard that i couldn't breathe through my nose. i was 40 pounds lighter and much healthier  mentally and physically.i had a mountain bike with higher gearing. i did fenders after a while light plastic jobs reduced the grit in my teeth.

[Jamisjockey]

Fit is the most important part of the aspect.
"off road" fun isn't going to be had under $500.  However, the rest of your requirements will be easily met with a commuting hybrid.  They are all the rage with bike manufacturers right now, so your selections will be unlimited.
Wear isn't the issue used.....anyone can tell if a bike has been abused.  A good used bike will be clean, function properly, and ride smoothly.  No, your problem is going to be fit.  You need a bike that fits you properly, and this is going to be the job of a bike shop.

Before you go riding the entire 10+10 route to/from work, you're going to need to build base fitness by riding outside of your working hours.  You can also split your commute days by driving to work with the bike in the car, ride home, ride to work the next day, drive home. 
At your fitness level, a 10 mile ride might take you as much as 45 minutes if the route is flat, more if its hilly.  Break your body into it before riding to/from work every day.

Some clothing advice, if you have a place to keep it at work...drive to work on monday, deposit your week's worth of clothing.  Ride the other 4 days, next monday haul home the dirty and leave the clean stuf there.

Again, go to a bike shop and check thier selection.  Get fit by them onto a good commuting bike.
Hope that halfway helps 

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

jamis is right about the 10 miles  the first times i did it i was ready to quit. i just didn't have that as a viable option  and i got used to it after a while

[MillCreek]

I second the suggestion for a hybrid.  They are also commonly called commuter, cross, urban or comfort bicycles.  You should go to your nearest Performance or REI store and tell them this list of requirements.  

At REI, the Novara Buzz V would seem to fit the ticket: http://www.rei.com/product/760872

At Performance, the Mongoose Kaldi double commuter, http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=25076&subcategory_ID=3060 would seem to meet your needs.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

wait till kids find out about trailers. thats a real workout

[mtnbkr]

Fit is important, don't ignore fit for a good price.

$500 is kind of low for a new bike, but deals can be found (last year's model on clearance, for example).

For your needs, I'd go with a hybrid, used touring bike, or a mountain bike with slicks.  You can get mountain bikes with a wide enough gear range to handle road and dirt.

As for waterproof paniers, they exist, but are expensive.  Don't bother looking at bike shops for them though, cruise the serious touring related websites.

This might fit your needs: http://www.rei.com/product/760872  Dunno if it'll handle racks or not, but it has the other features you wanted.

A bit more pricey, but closer to your needs: http://www.rei.com/product/744803

Chris

[mtnbkr]

Oh yeah, bikes seem expensive, but will last a decade or more if cared for.  An extra couple hundred dollars now to get the bike best suited to your needs will be forgotten before you wear out the bike.

Chris

[Jamisjockey]

Agreed!!
This is one of those things that cheap usually does mean cheap.  Especially for the componentry of the bicycle itself.  Frames are frames, some are just lighter and sturdier....but the big price point is components. 

This might fit your needs: http://www.rei.com/product/760872  Dunno if it'll handle racks or not, but it has the other features you wanted.

It looks like its equipped for rear panniers. 
I'd consider a local bike shop, though, before REI.....I think he'd get better help in determining how a bike fits him properly.

jfruser, being in the Dallas suburbs, you seem to have a nearly unlimited supply of bike shops.  You even have a performance shop nearby.
Richardson, TX bike shops

If you do go the used bike route, your best bet will be a touring or cyclocross bike.  Make sure its got the braze ons for racks.  Check your local shops, sometimes shops broker used bikes they get on trade or consignment.  Also look for a local bicycle touring club, alot of times they have a classifieds section in thier newsletter or website.  Fit is hard to judge for the inexperienced eye, though, so buying used can be scary.  Nothing like hurting yourself on the bike due to improper fit.

[mtnbkr]

Agreed!!
This is one of those things that cheap usually does mean cheap.  Especially for the componentry of the bicycle itself.  Frames are frames, some are just lighter and sturdier....but the big price point is components. 

Yes and no.  Pretty much anything from the major "real" bike brand is going to suit a beginner.  If a particular model fits your needs, don't obsess over the price point.

This might fit your needs: http://www.rei.com/product/760872  Dunno if it'll handle racks or not, but it has the other features you wanted.

It looks like its equipped for rear panniers. 
I'd consider a local bike shop, though, before REI.....I think he'd get better help in determining how a bike fits him properly.

If there's an REI near him (haven't looked), the would be a "local bike shop".  I've heard good things about the bike service at the Fairfax, Va REI (and the one in Cary, NC for that matter).

Regarding "fit", if the shop you go to considers a bike to fit ONLY by "standover" height, find another shop.  Standover is actually one of the less important parameters assuming you're not mashing the twig and berries.  BTW, a taller frame will reduce the seat to handlebar "drop", making the bike more comfortable for a beginner (me too for that matter).

Chris

[Jamisjockey]

True.  A good shop should be willing to adjust your seat position, handlebar position, and even swap out your cranks and handlebar stem if the position isn't right. 


Also, try a few seats.  Again, a good shop should let you demo a few.  Cushy seats are generally going to seem more comfy, until you spend an hour on them...then your junk will go numb!  Mtnbkr rides a hard leather Brooks saddle, and he's not the first person I've had tell me they rock.  Me I like a narrow "racing" style saddle with a cutout in the middle.

[MillCreek]

I would have to chime in on getting good service at the local REI bicycle departments up here.  Although I have only bought one of my five bicycles there, I did get one last year for Ms. MillCreek, who had not ridden in years.  They were very patient with her, put her on a number of different bicycles, and did a reasonable fitting and pre-purchase tuneup in my view, all during the 20% off sale. 

[roo_ster]

First Pass Report:

We* hit REI first, as we know & love REI.  I saw both the Novara bikes, the Buzz V ($450) & the Fusion ($750).  The Fusion was a turn-key package (fenders, racks, etc.) with a few extra features, to include an integral light generator in the front hub.  It had the skinny road tires and seemed a very solid, finished system.  The Buzz V was a step lower in solidity/integration of its parts, but was nothing to sneeze at.  The problem was, this was the first time I have ever had a difficult time getting customer service at REI.  I hovered about, but didn't learn too much.

On the brighter side, was the rock wall was open for business and my 3YO managed to get 3/4 the way up the wall before he had had enough and said, "Scary."  He didn't flip out though, as was able to follow instructions enough to get in a decent rappel down the face.  He was willing to get after it, again, and was really jazzed, but Mommie & I were willing to call it "good, 'nuff." 

Next, we went to Performance Bicycle.  I think I found the most gregarious & enthusiastic bike salesman the planet has yet to produce.  Dude was into the whole commute to work thing, with an emphasis on doing so here in DFW.  He was really helpful and willing to listen.  I had printed out my original post and read him off my requirements and expected use.  He took me directly to the Mongoose Kaldi Double Commuter Bike linked above.

He explained his reasoning and how it related to my requirements.  First was that the Mongoose was essentially a mtn bike mildly modified to perform the commuter role (fat street slicks, fenders, brazed points for carry hardware, etc).  And that for larger guys like me & him (he was 6"2"-6'4" ~240lbs) a mtn bike-derivative was more likely to hold up when smacking into curbs or having to dump it in ditch when faced with the ditch vs death by auto collision decision.  We looked at a few others, but nothing really fit the requirements and price point the way the Mongoose did, as its lower price would allow picking up the accessories that would make it into a gear-hauling commuter.

Also, the other employees treated my wife well and goofed around with the kiddos when not helping other customers.  Sales folk & businesses who treat my wife well surely get preference when it comes to my business.

Anyways, I had had my heart set on a S&W M19 snubbie for my belated Father's Day present, but I am considering dropping the cash on the Mongoose & accoutrements and picking up a M19 at a later date in time.

The sale on the 'Goose is on until 29JUN, so I am going to sniff out a few other bike shops before making the decision.

He also pointed me to runmuki.com/commute and dorba.org > dorba forums > The Commuter Channel (he said the latter group, while being serious into the commuting thing, are pretty much communists)

One last thing: I think my wife is taking a shine to the recreational side of biking.  Neither one of us like to keep the kids cooped up and this would give us more range when we get out to parks & rural/nature-type destinations, be they local or otherwise.  I may end up having to pick up her a bike, too, and getting gear that will allow us to cart the kiddos about.







* Self, wife, 3YO son, 2YO daughter

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

I was all ready to chime in and repeat all of the biking wisdom you'd need, but that's already been posted so far.  It sounds you have thing well in hand, between the Performance Bike dude and the local REI (try again, I've always received great service in their stores).

Mtnbkr rides a hard leather Brooks saddle, and he's not the first person I've had tell me they rock. 

I ride a Brooks too, and it does indeed rock.  For whatever that's worth...

[roo_ster]

Second Pass Report:

We have an embarrassment of riches when it comes to dedicated bike stores in DFW.  I stopped at two more shops to do my due diligence.  It really pays to talk with several sales guys at different shops.  I have learned different things from them all.  I landed at Richardson Bike Mart and spent some time there.

I have added two bikes to consideration:

Specialized Hardrock
http://www.specialized.com/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?spid=32576

Or this hybrid ($60 more than above):
Specialized Globe
http://www.specialized.com/bc/SBCBkModel.jsp?spid=33079

I rode a couple of mtn bikes yesterday and a 17" size of the Hardrock was the preferred.  I went in today and spoke with a different guy, who thought I ought to try a 20" size hybrid Globe, as it didn't require as much energy to go the same distance as with the mtn bike, due to skinnier tires, lighter weight, higher top gears, etc.

At first blush, dude was right.  The 20" Globe was easier to get from A to B.  Then, the sales guy said the 17" Hardrock looked small for me and that with my long back, I ought to use a larger framed mtn bike than a 17".  So, off I rode with a 19" sized Hardrock.  I'll be dipped in apple butter if the sales guy wasn't right.  I had a much easier time making distance and top end required effort similar to the Globe hybrid.

Like I said, top end (highest gear) required similar effort with both 20" hybrid and 19" mtn.  Looking at their front & rear gear sets, the top end gear ratios seem higher with the hybrid.  Also, the hybrid's wheels are 27" vs the mtn's 26".  Looks the me that the hybrid would toast the mtn on top end.

Anyways, I have a decision to make.  In favor of the Hardrock:
1. It is already at my pain threshold, money-wise (recall I have zero bike gear to start out with).
2. I worry I would more easily bust the hybrid, as it is considerably lighter, and I have a tendency to be hard on gear by way of overloading it.
3. This will be my sole bike, and a mtn bike seems versatile.

OTOH, the hybrid has theoretical top-speed advantage.

Here is an image of the spreadsheet I have used to estimate costs, etc.:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3018/2611453001_852c588394_o.png
(Front basket probably won't happen becasue the front suspension)
It is what I am using as a guide when I finally slap down my cash.


Question:
In an earlier post, I mentioned the Mongoose Kaldi Double Commuter Bike:
http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=25076&subcategory_ID=3060

When I was a kid, "Mongoose" meant a high-end bike.  But, I think I recall seeing a Mongoose in [gasp!]Walmart[/gasp!].  I have no idea if it is competitive with all the bike makers I have seen recently: Specialized, Trek, etc. 

Is is a quality manufacturer or a turd-polisher?

I ask, because that one at Performance Bike is set up almost the way I would set up the bike I will purchase & equip...and it is $80 cheaper on sale ($30 higher retail). 

Thanks.

[Headless Thompson Gunner]

You can put skinny slick tires onto the Hardrock, making it just as fast and efficient as the hybrid (well, more or less).  That sounds like the best of both worlds.

I'm not familiar with the old Mongoose name, but the current Wally World Mongoose bikes amount to oats that have already been though the horse.  On the other hand, I'd trust the guys at a Performance Bike shop to not sell you a turd.  So, I dunno.

[mtnbkr]

Mongoose has whored themselves out lately (so has Schwinn and a few other companies), but the ones sold in regular bike shops should be ok.  The specs on that 'goose are kind of low, but so is the price.  If the 'goose fits and suits you, I'd go with it.  Use the savings to get the proper gear to go along with it.

Chris

[mtnbkr]

BTW, a mtb with slicks can be pretty fast on the road.  Prior to last year, that's all I had for the road.  I've even done century rides on a mtb with slicks.  Heck, my Surly LHT is practically an mtb in construction.

Chris

[mtnbkr]

Giving it some more thought...

I don't like that Mongoose for you.  I think it would be fine for cruising the 'hood or rec riding with the family on bike paths, but I think it's a bit lacking for commuting and longer distance riding (the 10 mile commute you mention).  The fork is "hi-ten", which is just plain old steel (you want chromoly).  The components are Alivio, which is barely a step above Wal-Mart.  It'll work and I understand you have a budget, but I don't think it's a bike for the long haul, either in distance or lifespan. 

I like the Globe or Hardrock better.  If you think you'll be going offroad, get the Hardrock and get semi-slick tires rather than full knobbies (http://www.performancebike.com/shop/profile.cfm?SKU=2307&subcategory_ID=5425).  If you don't plan on going offroad, the Globe will be more efficient.  Top speed will be a wash between the two and more due to your fitness and tires. 

Chris

[41magsnub]

I use my MTN bike with slicks, it is close enough to a commuting bike that I don't care on the very rare occasion I use it that way.  Plus, I have changing tires down to a science so now when I swap back and forth to the knobbies for off road it is routine.  The bike is an older Cannodale from the days when shocks were a big deal and I got the fanciest model that did not have them.  Sure glad I saved that $100 or whatever now!   

For the clothes bag, I use a dry bag I bought for canoing strapped to the bike rack.

[cosine]

Mtnbkr rides a hard leather Brooks saddle, and he's not the first person I've had tell me they rock.  Me I like a narrow "racing" style saddle with a cutout in the middle.

I ride on a Brooks B17... yep, it rocks. That makes three of us here that think so...

[MillCreek]

Can you mount fenders and a rack on the Hardrock?  Many MTB don't have the eyelets to mount these.  Of all your choices so far, and bearing in mind your budget, I am still leaning towards the Novara Buzz V as being the closest to a 'turnkey commuting' solution.   The two Specialized bikes will still require you to spend extra cash to equip them as commuters.

[Jamisjockey]

There are fenders and racks for bikes without eyelets, made by sks

http://www.performancebike.com/shop/Profile.cfm?SKU=5997&item=40-0469&slitrk=search&slisearch=true
http://www.performancebike.com/shop/Profile.cfm?SKU=5998&item=40-0470&slitrk=search&slisearch=true
Of course if you're running a rear rack, you probably can get away without a rear fender.  Oh and here's a rack
http://www.performancebike.com/shop/Profile.cfm?SKU=19330&item=20-1982&slitrk=search&slisearch=true
However, I don't find the MTB to be a good road, bike path, and commuting solution.  Mountain bikes are heavier and ruggedly built for off road use.  A good commuting bike, cyclocross bike or touring bike is more of a "swiss army" option to me then a pure mountain bike, which is what the hardrock is.

[roo_ster]

Continued elsewhere.