Author Topic: Getting my first bike  (Read 5456 times)

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Getting my first bike
« Reply #25 on: September 23, 2005, 12:21:58 AM »
And you survived those critical first 10,000 miles intact while having an interest in sport riding.

Trust me.  If you'd started with a top-grade 600 four-banger, your odds of the same thing happening would be downright grim.

What I started with was a '78 Yamaha 650 parallel twin.  A tad bigger but then again I'm bigger Sad.

Just curious: I suspect you got nearly your full original price out of the GS when you unloaded it?

atek3

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« Reply #26 on: September 23, 2005, 06:14:59 AM »
>And you survived those critical first 10,000 miles intact while having an interest in sport riding.

Barely!!!  I won't say I never went down... But I will say I'm still in one piece, if thats what you mean.  

> I suspect you got nearly your full original price out of the GS when you unloaded it?

Haven't sold it yet.  Considering it needs a new front tire, chain, and sprockets, I'll probably take a hundred or two hit, big whoop.

atek3

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« Reply #27 on: September 23, 2005, 09:24:32 AM »
Can I ask what kind of downs they were?  How many, how they happened?

It'll help us understand the risks to newbies better...

atek3

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« Reply #28 on: September 23, 2005, 04:09:35 PM »
too embarrasing.  None involved cars or traffic.  All involved stupidity of one sort or another.  

Lessons learned in no particular order.
1)  You go where you look, or said another way, you don't go where you aren't looking.  When you're cornering, "look through the turn" rather than straight ahead.
2)  Get your braking done before you start to lean in until you're advanced enough to learn about trail braking.
3)  You can't carry as much speed as you think you can around a downhill corner (gravity is working against you)
4)  Watch out on right handers, if you blow it, you'll be in oncoming traffic (which is very fatal)
5)  Watch out on left handers if some jerk blows the corner coming in the opposite direction, they've just entered your path, which is a bad scene.
6)  Don't corner aggressively at intersections for several reasons, even ignoring crazy drivers.  For starters, if you're putting around on the street, the edges of your tires probably aren't up to temp for good traction.  Secondly, slippery car fluids (oil, antifreeze, gas) tend to accumulate at intersections.  Thirdly, the painted surfaces all over intersections are very bad for traction.
7)  If it's 105, you've only had 3 hours of sleep and you're getting mad dehydrated, go into the pits rather than pushing for 'one more lap'.
Cool  When the wear bar on your tire is no longer visible, replace it post haste.
9)  Beware of gravel that is the same color as the pavement, if you do hit it, take your weight off the seat and put it on the pegs dirt bike style, Bikes are naturally self correcting, and usually you'll simply go, "whoa, oh *expletive deleted*it" but keep the shiny side up and the rubber side down.
10)  When riding desert trails, beware of ruts in the direction of travel, high siding is hilarious, unless you break something (fortunately I was fine)
11)  Riding in a mixed skill level group as a newbie is a BAD idea, unless everyones pace is the slowest persons pace.  When group riding it is VERY hard to to try and ride the pace of the person ahead of you, and trying to ride someone elses pace is just as stupid as having a few drinks before a ride Sad
12)  Protective gear is your friend.  Thankfully for my aerostich and leathers, expensive Sidi's, good gloves, back protector and shoei helmets, I'm here barely worse for it.
13)  Oh ya, "that guy" who never drops their first bike that they keep for more than a few months, I'd really really like to meet him.
14)  Seems silly, but DON'T come to a halt with the bike more than 5 or 10 degress off vertical, or you will experience the very embarrasing, "laying down a 400 pound object on its side in front of pedestrians".

Just some tips and suggestions.

atek3

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« Reply #29 on: September 23, 2005, 08:09:32 PM »
Another good tip: if you have any questions in your mind about traction issues due to a weird road, weather, whatever: drag the rubber heel of your boot through whatever you're riding in.  You'll be able to feel how much "sticky" you have available.  Shoe rubber is pretty similar in grip to your tires, close enough anyways.

Do this BEFORE cornering, so you can figure out what's available.

atek3

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« Reply #30 on: September 24, 2005, 07:09:36 PM »
Quote from: JimMarch
Another good tip: if you have any questions in your mind about traction issues due to a weird road, weather, whatever: drag the rubber heel of your boot through whatever you're riding in.  You'll be able to feel how much "sticky" you have available.  Shoe rubber is pretty similar in grip to your tires, close enough anyways.

Do this BEFORE cornering, so you can figure out what's available.
Similar tactic is to see how much rear brake pressure is required to leave a darkie.  This doesn't work overly well because usually traction isn't an issue in a straight line, its while cornering, and often evil substances (oil, debris, etc.) pops up in the corners Sad

atek3

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« Reply #31 on: September 24, 2005, 11:28:08 PM »
Dragging your boot heel gives a very "personal feel" and doesn't require slowing down.  This can be valuable in heavy traffic.

The hairiest ride I've ever done was across Donner Pass on I80 (Reno to Sacramento) in a February snowstorm in '97.  I was able to find enough traction in the "slush ruts" left by car tires but I was checking traction becore every corner.  Slowing down in those conditions with traffic behind me wasn't an option; the bootheel trick was utterly critical.

You can also use it to see just how slick various "transitory patches" are - sealed road cracks, big white crosswalk strips in urban areas, etc.

If you check different road surfaces with your boot under different conditions, you'll soon get a "feel" for it.  Literally.

Smith

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« Reply #32 on: September 25, 2005, 05:13:34 PM »
Sorry I've been absent from this thread.  I'v ehad Strep throat for a week!  Ok, I'm back...finally took my bike out to a local road and got up to a moderate speed.  I need to spend more time doing slow speed maneuvers, but at least I'm expanding.  I want to learn so much...I wish it came faster!

CatsDieNow

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« Reply #33 on: September 26, 2005, 09:44:34 AM »
I'm just a newbie myself, but dragging your feet at speed seems somewhat dangerous.  Sounds like a great way to end up eating the tank (at best) if your heel catches on something.  

I definitly agree about setting your cornering speed before the turn.  A very minimal amount of braking should be done in a turn, and straighten up if you absolutly must use brakes.   Front brake + corner = low side.  Rear brake + corner = high side.

cfabe

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« Reply #34 on: September 26, 2005, 09:46:53 AM »
Smith, make sure you do concentrate on low-speed manuvering, it helps your riding more than you might think. Go find an empty parking lot and use the parking lines as a course.

atek3

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« Reply #35 on: September 26, 2005, 12:43:38 PM »
pro's brake on the way into corners, even while leaned.  However, that's an 'advanced technique'.  As a novice I use and recommend the MSF-style "brake before turning"...  

I'm pretty sure Jim means dragging the heel, which is a lot safer than dragging the toe.  If you look at supermotard riders they drag heel seemingly without incident.

atek3

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« Reply #36 on: September 27, 2005, 05:01:16 PM »
CatsDieNow: as long as you bend your knee while dragging heel, it's perfectly safe.  Your heel should be right around the same point lengthwise on the bike as your butt, or a bit further back is OK.  I've bounced my heel off of Botz Dots at 80mph without incident just to make sure...bit of a jolt but nothing nasty.

If you were dumb enough to do it with your leg dead straight locked ahead of you, yeah, that would be BAD.

Second, a bit of "feathering" of the rear brake in the corner is possible.  A lot of people into going very fast deliberately weaken their rear brakes so there's no "unanticipated grab".

I'm also a fan of Metzler tires over the more common Dunlops.  I find they're consistently easier to recover if they start to slide and then hook up again.  They tend to have that little bit of extra flex right out there at the edge.

Situations where you slide and then hook back up can be the worst...that's high-side territory.  The solution is to be able to feel that first slip and extend your legs with it, and then when it hooks up again absorb the extra jolt of energy with your legs versus letting the bike radically upset.  Hanging off can actually help as your legs are already taking up extra weight because your butt isn't on the seat anymore.

You're literally part of the bike.  When the bike jolts, shudders or does anything else squirrelly, usually it means too much energy is making it's way to the frame without being controlled by the suspension.  YOU can absorb that energy into your body and stabilize the situation.

CatsDieNow

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« Reply #37 on: September 27, 2005, 05:25:55 PM »
Well, I'll take your word for it, I'm not tall enough to touch my heel to the ground unless I am leaned over.  Smiley  I just try to anticipate such nastiness, if I would feel the need to bootheel test an area then I should probably just slow down anyway.

Supermotard is a controlled surface condition, on a track using race tires.

atek3

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« Reply #38 on: September 27, 2005, 07:08:29 PM »
>Supermotard is a controlled surface condition, on a track using race tires.

tell that to the 'tards on 'tards I see railing up on grizzly peak Smiley


atek3

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« Reply #39 on: September 27, 2005, 07:59:33 PM »
Maybe I should mention that I'm 6'4" and laying a heel down is EASY even when fully vertical Smiley.

Anyways.  I like *knowing* what my traction situation is.

CatsDieNow

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« Reply #40 on: September 28, 2005, 04:16:15 AM »
I need to figure out how to get my bike to California.   The roads here are exciting for all the wrong reasons.

atek3

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« Reply #41 on: September 30, 2005, 07:46:34 PM »
Quote from: CatsDieNow
I need to figure out how to get my bike to California.   The roads here are exciting for all the wrong reasons.
Great roads... within an hour and a half of san francisco there are more fantastic motorcycle roads than you can shake a stick at... THANK YOU TECTONIC ANOMALIES.

atek3

Smith

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« Reply #42 on: October 02, 2005, 05:16:57 AM »
I went out yesterday and practiced a lot of slow speed stuff.  I need to get my homework done so I can get out and ride today!