Author Topic: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence  (Read 10674 times)

Manedwolf

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Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« on: September 09, 2008, 09:36:42 PM »
I'm sorry, you don't get to wear that unless you've earned it, IMO. And the Army AGREED to this?!

The 1st Division is now a...fashion brand.



Quote
Army, Sears clothing deal irks lawmakers
By: David Rogers
September 9, 2008 09:22 AM EST
 
From Cantigny, France, and the Argonne Forest to North Africa, Normandy, Vietnams Iron Triangle and Iraq and now hauteconcept.com?

Foreign battles arent new for the 1st Infantry Division, but this firefight is from another world, a clash between the New Army and Old over plans to commercialize the 1st Divisions historic Big Red One insignia in a sportswear line at Sears.

After days of questioning, the Army confirmed Monday the arrangement was first reached in June 2007 on the advice of an outside licensing agency, The Beanstalk Group in New York, but the full scope of the royalties to be earned has yet to be disclosed.

Im astounded, said Rep. John P. Murtha (D-Pa.), who chairs the House appropriations panel overseeing the Pentagons nearly half-trillion-dollar budget.

There is a great deal of concern among the senior Army brass about this deal, said a Defense official.

But Sears, Roebuck and Co. is already moving to market its 1st Division collection this fall, and All American Apparel Inc., a privately held New York manufacturer, told Politico on Saturday that it had license from the Pentagon to proceed.

Caught most by surprise are combat veterans of the 1st Infantry Division, who see their familiar red-and-green shoulder patch splashed across Internet websites celebrating soldier chic.

The U.S. Army launches an all-out fashion offensive, reads the headline on stylelist.com. A Sears corporate press release quotes an unnamed Army spokesman extolling the new line for melding the Armys timeless traditions with iconic styling. And following the Republican convention, the fashion blog Haute Concept added this note: Now gun-toting soccer moms like Sarah Palin [can] get all their fight gear with one stop!

Charles Horner, a retired Army officer now working for Murtha, isnt happy. He served with the 1st Division in Vietnam, as did his father in World War II, including landings in North Africa, Sicily and Normandy.

That patch is to be worn by only people who served in the 1st Division, said Horner. What right does the Army have to sell our patch?

Ed Burke, president of an association for veterans of 1st Divisions 28th Infantry  in which this reporter served in Vietnam as an infantry medic  is more philosophical. Surprise is what I hear most  and not knowing what is going on, he said of the reaction to the Armys venture. [Defense] didnt talk to anyone.

Where the money goes  and how much  is a concern for the larger House Appropriations Committee, which has pressed the Pentagon for more answers.

All American Apparel refused to discuss any financial details when questioned by Politico but said it will pay a royalty to the Army on each item sold by Sears.

Burke said there is already substantial Internet trafficking in 1st Division items not sanctioned by the military. And as part of their marketing appeal, Sears and All American emphasize that the sanctioned products will yield revenue to help the troops.


But the Pentagons own internal directives suggest that the licensing fees initially will go to a clearing account that is first used to defray the costs of the Defense Departments larger efforts to enhance its brand with future young recruits.

How this breaks down exactly is unclear. House Appropriations staffers said that the Army estimates $2.5 million has made its way into the morale and welfare account since the licensing program was authorized in 2005. But little apparently has been spent, staffers said. And a December 2007 Pentagon directive lists providing financial support to morale, welfare and recreation activities as seventh among the responsibilities assigned to the program. Higher priorities include enhancing the name, reputation and public goodwill of the DOD Components and supporting the recruitment and retention of personnel.

Strong brand identification through retail sales of products potentially can enhance the Armys recruiting efforts and the publics general goodwill towards the Army and its activities, the Army said in its statement Monday evening. The various marks can help build unit pride and esprit de corps, raise public awareness of the Army, support its recruiting effort.

In a statement Saturday attributed to its president, Bob McGuinness, All American told Politico it had been granted a license by the Army to use the Armys unique marks and insignia on apparel that is designed and sold by our company.

All American Apparel Inc. is legally registered to do business as All American Army Brand, the company said. All of our apparel is designed in the U.S. Our production is sourced globally and is manufactured in facilities that meet all required labor and workplace standards. Our efforts have resulted in a great product at a great price that people can wear, enjoy and show their support for our troops.

Robyn Kures, a Los Angeles-based spokeswoman for the fashion launch, said every tag, label, design and final product sample must be approved by the Army before it is sold.

The apparel is inspired by the rich tradition of the U.S. Army; there are no political statements, just high-quality and high-style apparel, she said. All American Army Brand will roll out several collections, consisting of a range of styles and silhouettes, from T-shirts, hoodies, henleys and denim to knits and outerwear.

Organized in 1917 as the 1st Expeditionary Division, the 1st Division was among the earliest U.S. combat units in France in World War I and, after being reorganized in 1942, fought in North Africa and Europe in World War II.

In 1965, it was sent to Vietnam and suffered an estimated 20,770 casualties before being pulled out in 1970. It has since seen combat in both the 1991 Persian Gulf War and the current Iraq war, as well as peacekeeping operations in the Balkans.

The full reach of this history is illustrated by the 28th Infantry, which earned the name The Black Lions of Cantigny in France in 1918. A half-century later, units of the same 28th were still wearing Black Lions patches and assigned to fight communist forces in the old French colonial-era Michelin rubber plantation region of Vietnam.


http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0908/13276.html

wmenorr67

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2008, 09:47:23 PM »
I am speechless.
There are five things, above all else, that make life worth living: a good relationship with God, a good woman, good health, good friends, and a good cigar.

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Standing Wolf

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2008, 11:05:59 PM »
I'm waiting for the Lincoln Memorial to become the Coke Memorial, the Statue of Liberty to become the IBM Statue, and the White House to become the Ford House.
No tyrant should ever be allowed to die of natural causes.

Leatherneck

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2008, 12:05:07 AM »
There are pinheads in every walk of life. The Army is not immune. This is stupid and disrespectful.

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Perd Hapley

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2008, 02:30:48 AM »
WHAT?  The First Cav emblem is way cooler.  Should have gone with that one.  I hope they do that next. 
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HankB

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2008, 03:26:19 AM »
You know, it's one thing to wear something like a milsurp USGI field jacket (I got one for <$15) or BDUs or camo or boots for hunting . . . I mean, it's just CLOTHING.

But to wear insignia for an outfit you were never a part of is just wrong.* * 


* *  - (unless you're 8 years old and wearing Daddy's gear)
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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2008, 03:35:26 AM »
Money says the Corps would never commit such blasphemy.
JD

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MicroBalrog

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2008, 03:55:18 AM »
I've already seen WHITE WEDDING JACKETS marketed with US Army insignia stitched onto the front.
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Antibubba

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2008, 04:46:35 AM »
How tacky.
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41magsnub

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2008, 05:11:17 AM »
WHAT?  The First Cav emblem is way cooler.  Should have gone with that one.  I hope they do that next. 

Bite your tongue.. though my 3 years at Ft. Riley were about the most boring of my life.  Did the 1st Cav get a movie staring Mark Hamil and Lee Marvin?  Huh?

K Frame

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2008, 05:22:56 AM »
The Bloody Bucket is still the best.




I won't even wear military fatigues. I didn't earn the right to wear them.
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wmenorr67

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2008, 05:24:49 AM »
WHAT?  The First Cav emblem is way cooler.  Should have gone with that one.  I hope they do that next. 

Yea right, who wants to wear the shoulder sleeve insignia of a unit that the insignia stands for the color of the stripe down their back, the line they didn't cross and the horse they didn't ride. laugh

WHAT?  The First Cav emblem is way cooler.  Should have gone with that one.  I hope they do that next. 

Bite your tongue.. though my 3 years at Ft. Riley were about the most boring of my life.  Did the 1st Cav get a movie staring Mark Hamil and Lee Marvin?  Huh?

No, but the 1st Cav had a movie staring Mel Gibson and Sam Elliot that was a true story.
There are five things, above all else, that make life worth living: a good relationship with God, a good woman, good health, good friends, and a good cigar.

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Bacon is the candy bar of meats!

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Manedwolf

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2008, 05:28:13 AM »
I won't even wear military fatigues. I didn't earn the right to wear them.

Fatigues, no. Formal uniforms, definitely not.

I do have a Swiss military greatcoat, though. It's neutral.

K Frame

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2008, 05:30:05 AM »
Yeah, I'll wear the foreign stuff.

They're not really militaries, at least not in the sense of being an effective fighting force. More like Euroweenie social clubs with guns.  laugh

I WILL, however, modify my statement a little bit. I have a pair of Army surplus winter gloves that are the schnizzle.
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MicroBalrog

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2008, 05:31:43 AM »
Quote
I won't even wear military fatigues. I didn't earn the right to wear them.

You would not wear a camo jacket?
Destroy The Enemy in Hand-to-Hand Combat.

"...tradition and custom becomes intertwined and are a strong coercion which directs the society upon fixed lines, and strangles liberty. " ~ William Graham Sumner

Manedwolf

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #15 on: September 10, 2008, 05:31:48 AM »
I will also add to that the traditional peacoat.

When it's -30 windchill and the wind is like an icy blade, you learn to appreciate that seeming five pounds of heavy black wool, and become unsatisfied with any consumer market alternative. It stops the wind. It just stops it. I've not found anything else that does that.

41magsnub

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #16 on: September 10, 2008, 05:40:26 AM »
WHAT?  The First Cav emblem is way cooler.  Should have gone with that one.  I hope they do that next. 

Yea right, who wants to wear the shoulder sleeve insignia of a unit that the insignia stands for the color of the stripe down their back, the line they didn't cross and the horse they didn't ride. laugh

WHAT?  The First Cav emblem is way cooler.  Should have gone with that one.  I hope they do that next. 

Bite your tongue.. though my 3 years at Ft. Riley were about the most boring of my life.  Did the 1st Cav get a movie staring Mark Hamil and Lee Marvin?  Huh?

No, but the 1st Cav had a movie staring Mel Gibson and Sam Elliot that was a true story.

Luke Skywalker is greater than Mel Gibson and Sam Elliot, to deny that is unAmerican.

Devonai

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #17 on: September 10, 2008, 05:43:42 AM »
I like to think I'm very polite to strangers, and if I see somebody wearing a patch and have an opportunity to ask about it, I do.  So far, nobody has told me "it's just a fashion statement."  If they did, I would just roll my eyes, reserving any stronger language due to the possibility of getting into a fistfight while carrying.
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41magsnub

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #18 on: September 10, 2008, 05:47:07 AM »
All kidding about movies aside...

I don't have any really strong feelings about it after serving in the Big Red one other than bemusement that people would actually buy this crap and that the Army did not just dismiss it for being ridiculous.  If I had actually deployed to a war zone I might feel differently though.  My service snuck in neatly between GW1 and GW2 with my ready reserve time ending a few weeks after 9/11.

Manedwolf

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #19 on: September 10, 2008, 05:48:53 AM »
All kidding about movies aside...

I don't have any really strong feelings about it after serving in the Big Red one other than bemusement that people would actually buy this crap and that the Army did not just dismiss it for being ridiculous.  If I had actually deployed to a war zone I might feel differently though.  My service snuck in neatly between GW1 and GW2 with my ready reserve time ending a few weeks after 9/11.

Would you want to see your unit patch on fashion clothing worn by a liberal pseudohippie along with their Che shirt?

I can also guarantee that the clothing won't be dignified, it'll probably have lots of "ironic imagery" like soldiers and peace signs and crap on it.

wmenorr67

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #20 on: September 10, 2008, 05:52:01 AM »
Well maybe the biggest hope is that the Army has to approve any and all items before they can be sold. rolleyes
There are five things, above all else, that make life worth living: a good relationship with God, a good woman, good health, good friends, and a good cigar.

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Bacon is the candy bar of meats!

Only the dead have seen the end of war!

41magsnub

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #21 on: September 10, 2008, 05:57:33 AM »
All kidding about movies aside...

I don't have any really strong feelings about it after serving in the Big Red one other than bemusement that people would actually buy this crap and that the Army did not just dismiss it for being ridiculous.  If I had actually deployed to a war zone I might feel differently though.  My service snuck in neatly between GW1 and GW2 with my ready reserve time ending a few weeks after 9/11.

Would you want to see your unit patch on fashion clothing worn by a liberal pseudohippie along with their Che shirt?

I can also guarantee that the clothing won't be dignified, it'll probably have lots of "ironic imagery" like soldiers and peace signs and crap on it.

I'm not too worked up over it to be honest, it should be different than some non-military poseur fully decked out in BDU's or ACU's or whatever they are called now with unit and rack insignia on everything.

I can also think of it as being a sort of fan gear as well, families and friends wearing the unit patch to support their team just like somebody might wear football team logo gear.

Uncle Bubba

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #22 on: September 10, 2008, 06:05:55 AM »
I like to think I'm very polite to strangers, and if I see somebody wearing a patch and have an opportunity to ask about it, I do.  So far, nobody has told me "it's just a fashion statement."  If they did, I would just roll my eyes, reserving any stronger language due to the possibility of getting into a fistfight while carrying.

A young woman said nearly that to me once.

Near twenty years ago, I was working Security for a large distribution center. One of the office types, all of twenty or so years old, came in one day in brown ankle-high boots with the 101st Division patch on the back just below the top. Patch had the rocker on top but not the word "Airborne" on it. When I asked her why she had that on her boots she said, "It's just fashion." When I asked her if she understood that men had died wearing that patch, for their country and for others who wore it, she looked at me like I'd just sprouted an ear on my forehead and walked away.

Now that I think of her, I recall that this was the same bimbo who, having gone to see Schindler's List and discussing it with a couple of other women in the office, said, "It couldn't have been that bad." I couldn't stop myself from telling her that it was worse than what she'd seen on screen, and the reason it happened then, and will happen again, is people like her.
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Perd Hapley

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #23 on: September 10, 2008, 08:24:27 AM »
You can already buy lots and lots of Corps, Airborne, Ranger, Sniper, Seal T-shirts and coffee cups.  I assume most of the people buying it are just doing so because they think these units are neat-o, not because they actually served with them.  I would never wear "colors" from an outfit I wasn't part of, but I'm not sure this Big Red One thing is any different than what's already going on.

OK, OK, I'll admit that I do wear the yard sale T-shirt my wife got me, that says Air Force Combat Arms Instructor.  But hey, I was infantry, so I really could teach those Air Force pukes a thing or two about shootin'.  Tongue   grin
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Gewehr98

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Re: Taking faux military fashion to new levels of irreverence
« Reply #24 on: September 10, 2008, 08:57:34 AM »
As somebody who spent a lot of time working with and for CATM, I'd be glad to take that T-Shirt off your hands, Fistful. 
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