MSF course is highly worthwhile

[MillCreek]

I took and passed the Basic Rider Course from the Motorcycle Safety Foundation this last weekend. The weather was notable for being about 52 degrees and raining for the entire weekend. Typical Seattle weather in the fall.

We had 12 people in the class and all 12 of us passed. The instructor said that we were an unusual class in that all of us had previous riding experience. There were several people who had ridden for years and never bothered to get their endorsement, a few people like me who had ridden a lot in the past, had resumed riding in the past year and were renewing the endorsement, and some people who had last ridden 10-20 years ago, but had bought a new motorcycle and wanted to get back in the game. Eight men and four women. Interestingly enough, all the women had far distant riding experience, but had already bought, or were planning to buy soon, new Harleys, and wanted to take the course to get their endorsement. According to the instructor, the typical class was evenly divided between people with current or previous riding experience and people who had never ridden at all.

The practice bikes were Honda CB125s that were in OK shape. Some of us had the worst problems in finding neutral, and you really had to bang the transmissions a good lick to get them to upshift. I thought it was interesting that for most of the bikes, the friction zone only started to activate when the clutch was almost all the way out.

I passed the written at 100% (the only student to get 100%) and got 10 points off the practical exam for not going through the sweeper corner fast enough and failing to accelerate enough through the turn. Only two people in the class got more than 90 points on the practical, and most of the scores were in the low 80's, but you only needed 80% on the written and the practical to pass. Having taken both the MSF practical and the Washington state practical to get an endorsement, the MSF exam was more difficult. In my class, the nemesis for most of the students was the U-turn and figure eight in the 20 foot box.

Taking the MSF course will save me a whopping $ 16 per year on my motorcycle insurance, so the $ 125 of the course will be made up in a mere 7.8 years. My broker said that for someone like me who already has a lot of riding experience, the insurance companies provide only a tiny discount. For younger riders, they can save 25% or so of the first year's premium.

But it was 20 hours well spent and I learned a few new tricks. It did make me realize how much I miss shifting for the control over the bike.  My 04 Aprilia Scarabeo 500 has a CVT and does not require shifting.  Kawasaki is coming back with the Super Sherpa this new model year, and when the dealers get them in April, I may have to go take a look. A small dual-sport to putter around with may be just the ticket.

[Firethorn]

The practice bikes were Honda CB125s that were in OK shape. Some of us had the worst problems in finding neutral, and you really had to bang the transmissions a good lick to get them to upshift. I thought it was interesting that for most of the bikes, the friction zone only started to activate when the clutch was almost all the way out.

We had a couple of 250's for our class.  Don't remember the exact model.  I'd rate them as 'good shape, some scrapes'.  A couple bikes got dropped during the course.

Interestingly, my class was about 50% female.

In my class, the nemesis for most of the students was the U-turn and figure eight in the 20 foot box.

After doing that correctly 80% of the time, I screwed that one up in the test.  Also lost points for the turn.  Of course, my prior experience was 'zero'.

Taking the MSF course will save me a whopping $ 16 per year on my motorcycle insurance. My broker said that for someone like me who already has a lot of riding experience, the insurance companies provide only a tiny discount. For younger riders, they can save 25% or so of the first year's premium.

Saved me quite a bit of money.  Of course, the USAF paid me the $50 it cost for me to take the course.  After all, they require it for all riders.

I've been communting on my bike quite a bit.  I really notice the difference in my bill.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

"Of course, the USAF paid me the $50 it cost for me to take the course."

one of the more practical things i've heard of    how did such a good idea make it through the chain of command intact

[Marnoot]

In my class, the nemesis for most of the students was the U-turn and figure eight in the 20 foot box.

The figure-8 is where I lost my points, the only place actually. I was even on a little Rebel 250, I ended up outside of the lines on the last turn of the 8 though.

[roo_ster]

"Of course, the USAF paid me the $50 it cost for me to take the course."

one of the more practical things i've heard of    how did such a good idea make it through the chain of command intact

It was labeled a "Kick Joe* in the jimmy, one more time," initiative.



* Common term for enlisted men.

[Nitrogen]

It's only $50 to take the class?

I should take it just to annoy my wife and let her know I'm serious about the MC thing...

[Firethorn]

It's only $50 to take the class?

It depends on what state you're in.  ND is $50 - part of the fee for every motorcycle license goes towards the course.  They also got smart and managed to get the bikes donated, believe it or not.  They used to even rebate the $50 if you passed the course.  Then some laws got changed, the fund raided for other things.  One thing that happened is that they went from volunteer instructors to actually paying them some minimum due to a new law.

It can be $100-200 in other states.

I'd recommend taking it, it's a very good course and I had fun.

[brimic]

Its $350-400 in my state

[MillCreek]

In Washington, the unsubsidized courses cost $ 240.  Those courses partially subsidized by the Department of Licensing cost $ 125.  If you are under 18, the course costs $ 50. 

[Ryan in Maine]

Thanks for the recommendation (and the heads up on Kawasaki releasing 2009 models). I'm getting more serious about a motorcycle and the safety course is only available at random times around here (hopefully that changes). I can't ignore motorcycles any more knowing everything I'm looking at will get 50-100mpg all summer long and into the fall. That will save me a load of money come time to buy a home (or at least rent a nice home).

BUT... What's so difficult about the figure eight and the u-turn? Someone give me a heads up on that so I can mentally prepare (side note: they use light cruiser-style bikes for the safety class here almost exclusively).

[Nitrogen]

ahh, around $200 here.

That makes it a bit harder, but hey, I gotta save up for this anyway.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

some dealers offer it with new bikes   money well spent  wish i had been around for me

[Gewehr98]

"Of course, the USAF paid me the $50 it cost for me to take the course."

one of the more practical things i've heard of    how did such a good idea make it through the chain of command intact

How?

Let me tell you how.

Too many AF troops were getting schmeared in motorcycle wrecks, that's how.

The story played out with alarming regularity.

Take your re-enlistment bonus, buy a 900cc crotch rocket, and get hosed off the pavement in a few days.

They had to do something, and the MSF course was better than a sharp stick in the eye, or just plain banning military members from riding motorcycles.  (Don't laugh, that was a consideration.)

I had my MSF course paid for by the Air Force, too.  They wouldn't let me ride my bike onto the base without that card in my wallet.

I consider it one of the better classes out there for the novice motorcycle rider, and money well spent.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

glad to see a good idea make it through channels successfully. i was working at clinton cycle when the kz 1300's came out got to watch an airman with 0 experience plunk down his cash (bonus) and make it less than 125 yards second or third telephone pole to be exact. he lived but was in a coma a while made me wish for a graduated license system for bikes

[Firethorn]

Too many AF troops were getting schmeared in motorcycle wrecks, that's how.

The story played out with alarming regularity.

Take your re-enlistment bonus, buy a 900cc crotch rocket, and get hosed off the pavement in a few days.

Motorcycle accidents are still up there with suicide and car accidents for the top 3 killers of military members. 

They had to do something, and the MSF course was better than a sharp stick in the eye, or just plain banning military members from riding motorcycles.  (Don't laugh, that was a consideration.)

I figure about the only thing that prevented this is that there are plenty of chiefs and commanders who ride as well.

I had my MSF course paid for by the Air Force, too.  They wouldn't let me ride my bike onto the base without that card in my wallet.

Today, as an active duty USAF member, in order to ride a motorcycle period, not just on base, you MUST take the MSF or equivalent course overseas and have a chat with your commander.  Also, you are required to wear a helmet and reflective/high contrast top/jacket.

Me, I'm avoiding the crotch rockets(all the ones I tested sat too high anyways), and got myself a V-Star 650.  It might look a bit odd on a cruiser, but I wear a full face snell cert helmet as well.  I've been using it to commute to work.

They pay for the course because buried somewhere in the regulations we have to pay for any safety training we require.  Even if the course was $400, they'd pay for it.

[MillCreek]

BUT... What's so difficult about the figure eight and the u-turn? Someone give me a heads up on that so I can mentally prepare (side note: they use light cruiser-style bikes for the safety class here almost exclusively).

Where people fail the u-turn and figure eight is four fold:

**They go too slowly and cannot balance and the engine starts to lug on them and the bike starts jerking.  Keep your speed up a bit.  I did it in second gear and used the clutch to control my speed.
**They use the brake, especially the front brake to control their speed.  If you do this during a turn, and apply the brakes too much, you will likely dump the bike or have to drop a foot to keep your balance.
**They do not counterweight; i.e.: when making a tight turn to the left, they do not shift their weight to the right side of the bike
**They are looking at the pavement in front of them and start jerking the handlebars to keep their balance.  You need to keep your head up and look over your shoulder to where you want to turn to.

Also, in this area, the MSF courses book up months in advance.  I don't know about your area, but you may want to make a reservation now.

[MillCreek]

glad to see a good idea make it through channels successfully. i was working at clinton cycle when the kz 1300's came out got to watch an airman with 0 experience plunk down his cash (bonus) and make it less than 125 yards second or third telephone pole to be exact. he lived but was in a coma a while made me wish for a graduated license system for bikes

The graduated license system is very common in Europe and Asia.  Most of the license schemes restrict a new rider to 200 or 250 cc or less for the first six to 12 months of riding.  This is an important reason as to why you can buy scads of good smaller displacement bikes in Europe or Asia that are not sold here.  If I wanted a 250 or 500 cc street bike in Europe, I would have several models and manufacturers to choose from.  Here, not so much.

[Firethorn]

The graduated license system is very common in Europe and Asia.  Most of the license schemes restrict a new rider to 200 or 250 cc or less for the first six to 12 months of riding.  This is an important reason as to why you can buy scads of good smaller displacement bikes in Europe or Asia that are not sold here.  If I wanted a 250 or 500 cc street bike in Europe, I would have several models and manufacturers to choose from.  Here, not so much.

Going by the power of my 650 - a 250 wouldn't meet my needs (extended highway cruising).  A slightly more aggressive 400 probably would.  Still, from what I remember of European laws, adults aren't restricted quite that low even off the bat.

[Matthew Carberry]

And in Europe you barely have time to get out of 2nd before you have to stop to go through customs so top end is less important.

(That "customs" joke, one of my favorites, was made obsolete by the damn EU)

[MillCreek]

Going by the power of my 650 - a 250 wouldn't meet my needs (extended highway cruising).  A slightly more aggressive 400 probably would.  Still, from what I remember of European laws, adults aren't restricted quite that low even off the bat.

I think you are probably spot on.  I did some Googling, and I see that a lot of the graduated motorcycle license programs in Europe phase out entirely for a rider 24 years of age and older.  Most of them seem to apply only to younger riders up to age 18 or so.

[LadySmith]

Thank you very much for this info, Millcreek.
I'm taking the class next month, booked it last month as they fill up fast.
It costs $250 here.

[bedlamite]

Its $350-400 in my state

Only if you take it through the Harley dealers. It's $160 at LTC and it's gone up in the past few years.

[roo_ster]

Its $350-400 in my state

Only if you take it through the Harley dealers. It's $160 at LTC and it's gone up in the past few years.

Does the $400 certificate come with "Harley Davidson" slathered across the top?  If so, I would not be surprised if Harley buyers would prefer it to the identical cert without it.

[MillCreek]

A friend of mine took the Harley MSF course.  They used the Buell Blast as the trainer bikes.  He said he was surprised at how the Blast was kind of crudely put together, had quite the vibration and did not have the same sort of fit and finish as Japanese bikes.  I don't see very many of the Blast models on the road up here.

[Tallpine]

Just curious, are you going to ride up I-5 on a bike ?