DoD goes crazy with the gadget lust for HK again?

[Angel Eyes]

I'll bet it runs Windows Vista.   

When the computer boots up, does it play a pre-recorded "You suck and we hate you"?

[RevDisk]

Nothing like a bullpup full of multi-directional explody things to make the user feel comfortable.

Any way I can order it in notebook form for my users?   

"You have violated the Acceptable Use Policy.  Airbursting all onboard 25mm rounds.  Have a nice day."

Closest thing I got is the exploding batteries from a Dell recall.  No way to get them to command detonate, tho.

[Stetson]

"Time out while I reboot my gun"?

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

For that price it should have a built in Satellite phone and call HK itself. 

don't laugh but one of the earliest "new septic" systems i had installed had its own phone line and a lil computer. it periodically called the manufacturer and sent in reports. they used the info from this unit as kinda a beta test.  the homeowner got fubar by his new improved phone company and thought he could use the extra phone line for the 2 days while he waitedd for the phone company to fi his "new and improved". it worked  sorta   when the tank needed to call home it disconnected him.  he still says that really let him know his place in the world.  behind the septic tank

[freakazoid]

I'll bet it runs Windows Vista.   shocked

When the computer boots up, does it play a pre-recorded "You suck and we hate you"?

LOL, if it had that when you go to shoot it it would give a warning about not enough RAM. Vista is so bad that I have seen new computer games come with two system specks, one is specifically for Vista.

[seeker_two]

I'm still in wonder about how HK can think a 4.8mm bullet can make a bigger wound channel than a 5.7mm bullet.... 

[roo_ster]

I'm still in wonder about how HK can think a 4.8mm bullet can make a bigger wound channel than a 5.7mm bullet.... 

It uses sheer arrogance to push the tissues aside.

[HankB]

I'm still in wonder about how HK can think a 4.8mm bullet can make a bigger wound channel than a 5.7mm bullet.... 

The same way our brass thinks a 5.56mm bullet makes a bigger wound channel than a 7.62mm bullet . . . through post-impact tumbling and fragmentation.

(Which is of course then reduced via changes to the weapon system and ammunition.)

[AJ Dual]

I'm still in wonder about how HK can think a 4.8mm bullet can make a bigger wound channel than a 5.7mm bullet.... 

Sheer German discipline, as compared to the lazy Belgian one, which is really much more interested in wine, cheese, and buggery, than superior terminal ballistics. 


 

[Harold Tuttle]

I wonder if you could develop a smart spin counting round that would launch from a low tech platform

some times you just want the earth shattering kaboom

laze and fire is neato but quite complex

[MicroBalrog]

That is all.

[41magsnub]

That is all.

I thought that was just a prop they made up for Commando  apparently not...

[yesitsloaded]

I wonder if you could develop a smart spin counting round that would launch from a low tech platform

IIRC the m203 is spin fused.

[seeker_two]

I'm still in wonder about how HK can think a 4.8mm bullet can make a bigger wound channel than a 5.7mm bullet.... 

It uses sheer arrogance to push the tissues aside.

I'm still in wonder about how HK can think a 4.8mm bullet can make a bigger wound channel than a 5.7mm bullet.... 

Sheer German discipline, as compared to the lazy Belgian one, which is really much more interested in wine, cheese, and buggery, than superior terminal ballistics. 


 

...and this is why one can find out more about ballistics on APS than any other site.... 

[Manedwolf]

What I find amazing is that the bad guys continually manage to ruin everyone's day with the 1960's era RPG-7, which, despite its simplicity, is a remarkably decent design for the purpose. The forward fins impart rotation, too.

They're dirt cheap, pretty reliable, and are used against armor, in urban warfare, and even against helicopters, with a lead sight made out of a wire coathanger. (!) They'll probably be around for a century.

Perhaps we could learn something from that?

[AJ Dual]

I wonder if you could develop a smart spin counting round that would launch from a low tech platform

IIRC the m203 is spin fused.

Yes, but the M203 40mm grenade is just a fixed number of rotations that arm it for minimum safe distance, which then releases the impact fuse.

What he's talking about is a programmable electronic spin-fuse for detonation.

The OICW grenade and it's ilk are programmed by a laser rangefinder, say to the wall in a building where a sniper is holed up. Then the shooter pushes the "+1 meter button" and an electronic signal from the rangefinder which goes to the chamber and programs the grenade to spin for "X" revolutions counted against the known ballistics of it's flight path.

The grenadier then fires the shell through a window in that wall, and the grenade counts out exactly the right number of spins to blow up in the air at a distance the laser rangefinder determined that wall to be, plus the one meter, so it blows up in midair right in the room, fragging anyone using that wall for cover.

I've even seen plans for grenades with a side-scanning IR window that sweeps as the grenade spins in flight, sees the heat of a human body hiding as it flies through a window, a door, past a wall, or the corner of a building, then detonates. So you could literaly fire it down a long hallway and it'll blow up only at the door where someone is hiding.

I'm more worried about when someone gets the bright idea (probably already has) to put a small explosive like that into cheap little spider-like robots, and they can be air-dropped en masse over a region.

Imagine a minefield, or an IED but one that crawls around looking for you. I don't know what the targeting criteria would be, 98.6 degree body heat IR spectrum? Voice recognition? The ammonia in human sweat? Perhaps certan key phrases in the enemy's language. Image recognition that picks out certain uniforms ethnotypes or weapons?  Probably for verification purposes some combination.

Friendly troops would have an RFID "passport" or some such so that the spider-mines don't attack them. Hope it works, and well.

IF "language"=Farsi AND "ImRec_weapon"=Kalashnikov OR RPG, THEN command_execute intercept/explode&

Of course, these will probably be mass produced in IndoChinaStan someday. Facial recognition is already very accurate. Even sunglasses and facial hair can't defeat it anymore. Perhaps they'll be targeted after specific people only.

Fun times.

[Manedwolf]

I've even seen plans for grenades with a side-scanning IR window that sweeps as the grenade spins in flight, sees the heat of a human body hiding as it flies through a window, a door, past a wall, or the corner of a building, then detonates. So you could literaly fire it down a long hallway and it'll blow up only at the door where someone is hiding.

Assuming there's not a single error in all the millions of lines of code for that.

A programmer at a dotcom I was at admitted to a programming error that blew up a missile on a pad in front of generals. Anything that depends on software WILL have bugs.

[AJ Dual]

I've even seen plans for grenades with a side-scanning IR window that sweeps as the grenade spins in flight, sees the heat of a human body hiding as it flies through a window, a door, past a wall, or the corner of a building, then detonates. So you could literaly fire it down a long hallway and it'll blow up only at the door where someone is hiding.

Assuming there's not a single error in all the millions of lines of code for that.

A programmer at a dotcom I was at admitted to a programming error that blew up a missile on a pad in front of generals. Anything that depends on software WILL have bugs.

That would be a pretty simple program. When the IR scanner recieves value "X", detonate. Or probably just a delta that indicates a change which means something alive is standing/hiding there. That's a few dozen lines of code. The grenade is on a ballistic trajectory, so there's no guidance to worry about, and the scanning pattern is provided by the spin.

I'm not saying it couldn't/wouldn't detonate if it's shot down a cool dark alley, then scans a wall warmed by sunlight.  But with a semi-automatic magazine fed launcher, you probably combine it to not detonate at anything less than distance "Y", then it starts scanning for IR deltas, etc. Still pretty simple stuff hard coded into a ROM.  At least as compared to an entire missile system.

And with the tiny grenades, they've already been able to test fire thousands I assume. You can't do that with multi-million/billion dollar rockets.

You are right, IIRC, some test shooters were injured in OICW grenade testing when some were bad. However, with these small grenades it's a pretty cost-effective system to make failsafe before the battlefield is reached.

[Manedwolf]

I've even seen plans for grenades with a side-scanning IR window that sweeps as the grenade spins in flight, sees the heat of a human body hiding as it flies through a window, a door, past a wall, or the corner of a building, then detonates. So you could literaly fire it down a long hallway and it'll blow up only at the door where someone is hiding.

Assuming there's not a single error in all the millions of lines of code for that.

A programmer at a dotcom I was at admitted to a programming error that blew up a missile on a pad in front of generals. Anything that depends on software WILL have bugs.

That would be a pretty simple program. When the IR scanner recieves value "X", detonate. Or probably just a delta that indicates a change which means something alive is standing/hiding there.

I'm not saying it couldn't/wouldn't detonate if it flys down a cool dark alley, then scans a wall warmed by sunlight.  But with a semi-automatic magazine fed launcher, you probably combine it to not detonate at anything less than distance "Y", then it starts scanning for IR deltas, etc. Still pretty simple stuff hard coded into a ROM.  At least as compared to an entire missile system.

And with the tiny grenades, they've already been able to test fire thousands I assume. You can't do that with multi-million/billion dollar rockets.

And then the terrorists learn to throw a road flare into the hallway during urban fighting.

See, this is the problem with the gadget-happy high-tech solutions. There's really simple, low-tech ways to defeat them that will be almost immediately found by resourceful enemies.

The most advanced ID-determining heat-tracking security camera can be defeated by a rock. You ought to think that way.

[Balog]

Simple, effective low tech things don't bring in massive budgets that look good on your resume. Past a certain level most officers are just politicians in uniform.

[ctdonath]

A programmer at a dotcom I was at admitted to a programming error that blew up a missile...

Oh, there's several super-spectacular programming failures. The two greatest:

- An Arianne rocket self-destructed in flight because the control unit was only programmed & tested for the northern hemisphere. Reusing a piece of old software from a previous (and smaller) rocket, a large number was produced when a small number was expected ... perceived as an error in horizontal velocity ... causing the computer to shut down and transfer control to a backup computer ... which did exactly the same thing ... which failed to issue a correction ... which caused the rocket to start going where it shouldn't ... which caused automatic initiation of the "oh crap blow it up now before something really bad happens" subsystem. $500M in uninsured cargo was destroyed.

- A Mars probe went through its entire landing process perfectly, shutting off its re-entry retrorockets when determined to be zero meters above the surface ... except it wasn't ... and proceeded to fall several miles. Someone got the "meters" and "feet" units mixed up in the software.

[AJ Dual]

And then the terrorists learn to throw a road flare into the hallway during urban fighting.

See, this is the problem with the gadget-happy high-tech solutions. There's really simple, low-tech ways to defeat them that will be almost immediately found by resourceful enemies.

The most advanced ID-determining heat-tracking security camera can be defeated by a rock. You ought to think that way.

The IR spectrum of a road-flare is nothing like a human's.

It's certainly possible it could blind such a drone completely though. However, it might have accoustic, mili-wave radar or LIDAR, or inertial navigation abilities to get past that point.

Of course, if there's dozens, hundreds more in the area, attracted to the commotion you've just set off... Or if they run a Wi-Fi like mesh network and act as a smart-swarm, it gets ugly.

The military is already developing area-denial grenade launchers, and anti-armor missiles that communicate in a network. And there already is that BLU-108 smart anti-armor cluster bomb.

The little "skeets" or hockey pucks are already only about 5" in diameter and 1-2 inches thick, and have a little IR scanner on the side which sweeps for armor as it spins. Then detonates forming a self-forging metal spike to punch through tanks and IFV's.  They travel and scan/detonate independantly once the carrier bus spins up to spread them out. The scanning sensor for that already looks as though it's smaller than a tube of lipstick.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/blu-108.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1QvyodEwg0

And those who keep crowing on about high-profile technical disasters, what about all the stuff that goes right and works well? And again, comparing multi-million/billion dollar rockets and space probes is a strawman argument. When you're talking grenades or munitions that cost somewhere $100-1000, you can afford to keep trying until it's right.

The problem is that in 10-20 years is what if smart munitions or kamakaze-bot/IED's get mass produced at $19.95/ea in countries that aren't friendly to us?  Think how much computing power is in your cellphone/PDA that fits in the palm of your hand. Where was that made? How small would it be if it didn't need a screen, or buttons, and wasn't designed to be re-used?

When you say that the "ID-determining heat-tracking security camera" can get wrecked with a rock, the paradigim you're thinking is one big expensive system, which is true today. You're not thinking ahead to when those cameras are $.50 each, and there's dozens, hundreds watching you. That first one you smashed just gave away your presence to the other ninety-nine...

When I see the research being done on little collective-intelligence "swarmbots" flashing LED's and playing a game of soccer cooperatively on some ping-pong table at MIT, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjAGhYOfZag I see them in 10-20 years time of Moore's law, manufacturing economies of scale, and an extra couple ounces of C4 or Semtex put in them, and turned loose on the battlefield.

High tech helps the rich western nations maintain supremacy now. When that technology commoditizes (and it will), the tables are turned, and it works against us because we value individual life too much to walk into a meat grinder like that.

[Manedwolf]

The IR spectrum of a road-flare is nothing like a human's.

So they bring some human shields along, kids even, and tie them up near the possible entry vectors of grenades.

Remember whom we're fighting.

[roo_ster]

MW:

Yes, any technology can be foiled.

Doesn't mean we ought to go back to sharp sticks and rocks.

[AJ Dual]

The IR spectrum of a road-flare is nothing like a human's.

So they bring some human shields along, kids even, and tie them up near the possible entry vectors of grenades.

Remember whom we're fighting.

Yep. It gets ugly. There are cases of them trying to enlist the mentally challenged for suicide bombings already.

I guess the point is that our best high-tech weaponry is already 'scary good'. In the case of the BLU-108 it's already cooler than anything I've seen in Sci-Fi. Wait until this technology level is commoditized and turned back on us. I sincerely hope we have an even higher level.