Best line in the VP debate.

[grampster]

"There you go again...Say it ain't so, Joe."  ( Sarah Palin.)

The second best, loosely quoted: Joe Biden, when asked about his worst quality, his proclivity to sound off..."I'm who I am, everybody knows who I am and and look, I'm not going to change...then he went to babble about how Obama and he were all about change.

I also liked how Gov. Palin talked about how Biden/Obama/Democrats are always looking back and how she is looking forward.

In my opinion, we saw a distinct difference between a bright, experienced Washington bureaucrat spinning and twisting, nuancing and bragging about his many years wallowing in the swamp and a down home populist who sits around eating chicken salad sandwiches in the kitchen and having fun fartzing with the powers that be and the status quo, who has a lot of ability.  I  think it's time we elevate a few amateurs.  The best and the brightest have crapped in our bed.  I'll take ability over experience in government.

I also liked how she confronted questions that she didn't want to get trapped into dealing with by directly saying, loosely quoted, 'I'm not really gonna talk about that, let me just tell you some more about me and what I think about things that I bring as a strength to the ticket.' The implication, if anyone was thinking about it, was that 'I know what I know, I can do what I can do...the rest of it I'll get up to speed, watch me.'

PS:  I just love the networks parading the dumbest people in America across the world stage;  The Undecideds.  What a bunch of dolts.  Proof positive about the contempt so called news people have for our collective American intelligence.  The scary thing is these people decide elections.
__________________

[MrRezister]

The best and the brightest have crapped in our bed.

I never thought to blame Biden for that.  It seems so obvious now that you mention it though....
*washes sheets

Palin seemed likable, but evasive.  Neither one really impressed me here.  Or, in Mainstream Medianese:
"JOE BIDEN VERBALLY KILLED MCCAIN/PALIN.  THEY ARE DEAD.  ALL HAIL THE KING OF THE UNIVERSE!!!"

[longeyes]

The only thing I didn't like about Palin last night was that it was obvious she had been McCainified.  Why else would she not have identified the DEMOCRATS as the initiators of the current financial mess when Biden opened up by pinning all the blame on the GOP and Bush?  Surely, she's read by now about Barney Frank, Franklin Raines, and the CRA pushing Fannie and Freddie to write mortgages with no questions asked?  She was told to lay off the Democrats.  This woman is not "bi-partisan" by nature, and we know who is.

[grampster]

Longeyes,

That omission by the R's has been glaring.  It has to be a deliberate ploy, and I think a wrong one.  McCain is trying to show he's a nice guy in that regard and it is going to cost him the election.

McCain's mistake in not laying the historical foundation is that America wants to hear him say it, it can be done in a way that is frank, but points us toward the future.  It needs to be said.  Because Gov. Palin did not say it, tells me that she was told not to.  That was and is a mistake.

[Manedwolf]

Biden was babbling about electing Hamas in the West Bank.

Funny, that would be Gaza. Did the media catch that at all?

[HankB]

That omission by the R's has been glaring.  It has to be a deliberate ploy, and I think a wrong one.  McCain is trying to show he's a nice guy in that regard and it is going to cost him the election.

The GOP has a tendency to not go after the enemy when they should - Ann Coulter once said that she doesn't expect the GOP to become shrieking lunatics like Howard Dean, but she'd really like them to act like men for a change. (This was before Sarah.) Then, as they're cleaning out their desks and moving out, they GOP politicians who got the boot can pat themselves on the back and congratulate each other about how they campaigned as gentlemen enroute to losing the election.

[ronnyreagan]

"There you go again...Say it ain't so, Joe."  ( Sarah Palin.)

I didn't really care for that line - it sounded to me like it was told to her well before the debate, and she spit it out rather awkwardly. I also think she overdid the folksy talking crap. She should have cut back on the "you bechta" and "Dontchaknow" and all that - it looked forced and was harder to listen to than Fargo. I'm sure she has an accent and all that, but it was over the top. I wish the GOP would stop pandering to idiots.

I believe that people saw what they wanted to in that debate (as in most things.) I viewed her as a dunce before, and she still appeared that way although better coached than in previous interviews. I was surprised that she mispronounced fewer words than Biden, but she rambled worse than he did.

I  think it's time we elevate a few amateurs.

I disagree. Do you get your car repaired by amateurs? Do you try to find the least experienced doctor to get his "outsider" opinion? Do you think we should get some amateurs leading the military in Iraq because the experts are always wrong or corrupt? Why do you want "a few amateurs" dealing with nuclear Pakistan, North Korea, Iran, or any number of issues we are currently facing? You can complain about corruption in Washington and I'll agree that there's a lot of entrenched bureaucrats that need to go, but they need to be replaced with competent, intelligent, individuals. Given the opportunity why choose an amateur over an expert?

[Boomhauer]

She should have cut back on the "you bechta" and "Dontchaknow" and all that - it looked forced and was harder to listen to than Fargo. I'm sure she has an accent and all that, but it was over the top. I wish the GOP would stop pandering to idiots.

I believe that people saw what they wanted to in that debate (as in most things.) I viewed her as a dunce before, and she still appeared that way although better coached than in previous interviews.

Don't make the mistake that many do and assume a person is stupid because of the way they talk. Northerners and others frequently stereotype Southerners as stupid because of the way we talk.

[Manedwolf]

I didn't really care for that line - it sounded to me like it was told to her well before the debate, and she spit it out rather awkwardly. I also think she overdid the folksy talking crap. She should have cut back on the "you bechta" and "Dontchaknow" and all that - it looked forced and was harder to listen to than Fargo. I'm sure she has an accent and all that, but it was over the top. I wish the GOP would stop pandering to idiots.

So a whole hell of a lot of people I've met from Minnesota and Wisconsin WHO REALLY TALK LIKE THAT ALL THE TIME are idiots?

Nice.

Oh, yeah. They probably cling to guns and religion, too. Elitist much?

[ronnyreagan]

So a whole hell of a lot of people I've met from Minnesota and Wisconsin WHO REALLY TALK LIKE THAT ALL THE TIME are idiots?

Nice.

Oh, yeah. They probably cling to guns and religion, too. Elitist much?

Sorry, but I was born in Wisconsin and have lived here my entire life. She sounded fake.

[Manedwolf]

I've met people from Utah, too, who say "Oh my heck".

Some people have strong regional accents and colloquialisms. You make fun of that, you alienate people.

[ronnyreagan]

I'm not making fun of it. I'm saying she layed it on way too thick in an obvious attempt to "relate." It's fine to have an accent when it's real, but to force it like she did is condescending.

[Rudy Kohn]

I thought one of the best parts was when Biden said the government needs to be able to change the interest rates and principals of loans.  My jaw hit the floor.  He suggested that would help keep banks afloat...

...because they sure wouldn't be loaning anything to anyone, I guess.

All in all, Biden and Palin both managed to look pretty good, and I didn't really see any bias on Ms. Ifill's part.  Biden spent too much time trying to fix blame, and Palin spent too much time going back to her energy policy.  Though there were a couple of outrageous things, like the quote above, that Biden said, there were a few places where Palin just utterly failed to point out fundamental differences in their economic outlooks, which could have been quick answers with (I think) positive results.

As a McCain/Palin supporter, I wasn't left with the notion that Palin is brilliant, but I also don't think she looked stupid.  Her policy certainly seemed better--at least, I didn't have as many "WTF?!" moments listening to her responses.

[AZAndy]

I'm not making fun of it. I'm saying she layed it on way too thick in an obvious attempt to "relate." It's fine to have an accent when it's real, but to force it like she did is condescending.

Agreed. Not to mention that it would be really, really nice to have someone in the White House who doesn't deliberately mispronounce "nuclear." It may be that she isn't doing it deliberately (and if so, it demonstrates some basic ignorance on her part), but the current president certainly does.

[ronnyreagan]

I thought one of the best parts was when Biden said the government needs to be able to change the interest rates and principals of loans.  My jaw hit the floor. 

Agreed.
I was amazed that he said that. I couldn't believe it at first.

[Perd Hapley]

I couldn't believe that Biden was bragging about voting down judicial appointees based on their politics. 

I couldn't believe that the moderator was asking insane and/or useless questions like "What will it take to make you launch a nucular missile?" or "What is your greatest weakness?" or "What will your administration be like if the President croaks?" 

I can't believe anyone cares how people pronounce "nuclear."  For some reason, this is the one word we insist must be pronounced perfectly.  No one cares if you stress the wrong syllable in "irrevocable," but heaven forbid you say "nucular."  And the ONLY reason for that is that it was a cheap shot to make Bush look stupid. 

It may be that she isn't doing it deliberately (and if so, it demonstrates some basic ignorance on her part)

More like an over-reaction on your part.

[roo_ster]

Only supercilious twits get their panties in a wad over regional accents.

There is an entire nation of Englishmen who can throw similar rocks at our best-educated (not to mention our less-so) for pronouncing the Queen's English in a manner that does not meet with their approval.

[AZAndy]

No one cares if you stress the wrong syllable in "irrevocable," but heaven forbid you say "nucular."  And the ONLY reason for that is that it was a cheap shot to make Bush look stupid.

Nay, the President is perfectly capable of pronouncing the word correctly; he did so in his speech in England. I assume that he mispronounces it in his own country in order to seem more down-home. Just makes me wonder if Governor Palin does it because she doesn't know any better, or if she thinks it makes her seem more "average Joe."

That said, President Carter also said the word that way, and he was an actual nuclear engineer. Go figure.

[longeyes]

Debates are hopelessly archaic.

Haven't they been watching "Survivor?"

I suggest we take all four and see if they can run a small town.  Put it all on video.  Should be, well, amusing.

[Manedwolf]

Only supercilious twits get their panties in a wad over regional accents.

There is an entire nation of Englishmen who can throw similar rocks at our best-educated (not to mention our less-so) for pronouncing the Queen's English in a manner that does not meet with their approval.

Well, not really. When you hear foreign correspondents from the UK, you're hearing the Oxford sorts.

You never hear the Brummie "Oy quoit loik it" accent, or the utterly impenetrable East End London sorts.

[Paragon]

I thought one of the best parts was when Biden said the government needs to be able to change the interest rates and principals of loans.  My jaw hit the floor. 

Agreed.
I was amazed that he said that. I couldn't believe it at first.

I had to check with my wife to make sure I heard that right.  I think I'm going to vote D this year so I can change the principle on my home loan!  I'm thinking of dropping it to around $5, how's that sound?  Congress will just pass a bill to cover the rest, right?

[longeyes]

Contract law is the foundation of civil society.

At least it used to be.  Until today.

***

As someone observed, this bill is a back-door reparations package.

[ctdonath]

Do you get your car repaired by amateurs? ... Given the opportunity why choose an amateur over an expert?

It's surprising how good a job "amateurs" can do vs. the alleged "experts": all too often the amateur has the passion & knowledge & experience to do it right, and the expert is deemed such only because he gets paid. I do my own car repairs when I can, and frankly prefer a friend-of-a-friend do the work in his back yard than take it to a "professional" shop where my wallet will hemmohrage over what is really pretty straighforward stuff. ...don't get me wrong, though, when it was _me_ getting the recall repair job (artificial heart valve) I wanted the most expensive & egotistical professional in the southeast  .

Your point is valid IF the expert really is one in the canonical sense. Problem in this context is that we ARE elevating amateurs to {V}POTUS status. BHO has little experience beyond "community organizing", Biden & McCain are longtime senators but have little executive experience, and the only one with real applicable professional experience (Palin) is derided loudly as not having nearly enough. The Founding Fathers wanted amateurs to run the country, to do the work with passion then go home to their real jobs; the professionals are too darned good at emptying the treasury.

[Halo]

The McCain campaign definitely missed out on the opportunity to bring up the government mandating that lenders give loans to people who were not, by any objective standard, likely to be a good risk. The financial crisis was sparked not by greedy lenders, but by a government bent on social engineering who forced those lenders to approve mortgages for low income people.

Palin was clearly in over her head on matters of foreign and economic policy, there were just too many non-answers to convince me that she has a full grasp of those issues. But I am less concerned about her lack of experience than I am Obama's, after all she is not running for the top post like he is. What she did convince me of is that she does have the wherewithal to master those issues as she becomes more involved in national politics.

I don't really like the folksy informal language either, not from people seeking high office -- call me an elitist if you want.  In her defense though she was probably told to lay it on, since a large segment of the population is, frankly, anti-intellectual.  The Democrats do this too, like when Michelle Obama gave that speech where she conspicuously kept saying "Barack and me" and when Kerry did the "where can I get me a huntin' license?" thing for the camera.

I'll vote for Palin, in spite of these things I do have an overall positive opinion of her.  Besides, it's not like I can even entertain voting for the other side.

[MechAg94]

With all the messed up problems that can and should be addressed about our government, I find is very funny that anyone on this board would get hung up on someone's accent and manner of speaking.  Smooth talking don't mean crap.  IMO, If you base all your judgments on people by how well they speak, you are being very foolish.

Honestly, I don't care if a candidate studders, if he knows the job and will make good decisions why wouldn't he be a good choice?  It seems to me that voting for smooth talkers is what has gotten us to this point. 

Try to take a minute to look past the nice words and smooth talking and listen to the content.  Smooth talkers should be reading the news and doing commercials, not leading the country.