I guess some people don't understand what their families fought for...

[Manedwolf]

Oh well. Ironic.

Their family members took the fight to the terrorists for "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", taking action to save themselves by attacking the hijackers. The hijackers, in cowardice, flew the plane into the ground as they got to the cockpit.

And now the family members want the government to seize the 275 acres from the person who owns it.

I think they're missing the point, here.

Flight 93 Families Ask Bush to OK Land Seizure for Memorial

Sunday , December 28, 2008

AP
ADVERTISEMENT

PHILADELPHIA  —
Relatives of those who died aboard United Airlines Flight 93 want the Bush Administration to seize the land needed for a memorial where the plane crashed in Shanksville, Pa., in the 9/11 terrorist attacks.

The Families of Flight 93 sent a letter earlier this month asking President George W. Bush to empower the Secretary of the Interior to take the land in dispute from a homeowner who had been in negotiations with the National Parks Service, said Patrick White, vice president of the families' organization.

The group says ground must be broken early next year in time for a memorial to be build for the 10th anniversary of the crash in 2011.

Svonavec Inc. owns one of the last large chunks of land needed for the 2,200-acre memorial, including the area where the plane crashed Sept. 11, 2001. Svonavec's treasurer Mike Svonavec has said the park service has not done enough to negotiate a deal.

White said Svonavec has not been willing to negotiate, and called that unacceptable.

"We've certainly sought to do this within in the process, following protocol as much as we possibly can," White said Saturday. "It has gotten to the point where we fear we'll lose significant momentum.

"We have an administration that has been very supportive of this effort. We just wanted to make sure the president is aware of what the circumstances are. ... We just didn't want to get lost in the shuffle."

In October, the National Park Service said it would use an independent appraiser to determine the value of 275 acres of land needed for the memorial. The NPS also said it could use eminent domain to acquire the plot if all else fails.

Construction of a $58 million permanent memorial and national park is scheduled to begin in 2009.

White, whose cousin Louis Nacke II died on Flight 93, said the group would favor Bush giving the interior secretary or director of park services the power to take the necessary steps to acquire the land before the administration leaves office in January.

He said the families understand that the outgoing president has plenty to do in his final weeks in office. But White pledged that the group would carry its fight to the Obama Administration, if needed.

"I think the rest of the family members and I feel there is no point at which we will stop," White said. "Whatever it takes. As long as it takes. Whoever it takes. To do anything less would be doing a disservice to those that we love."

Flight 93 was en route from Newark, N.J., to San Francisco on Sept. 11, 2001, when it was diverted by hijackers. The official 9/11 Commission report said the hijackers crashed the plane as passengers tried to wrest control of the cockpit.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,473404,00.html

Also:

SHANKSVILLE —  Searching for an economic boost and home to perhaps the most compelling story of 9/11, rural Somerset County is trying to pull off a balancing act: Remembering the victims of United Airlines Flight 93 in a way that encourages development and job growth without devolving into tackiness and disrespect.

A simple plaque would suffice. A $58 million dollar "crescent" designed by a nose-in-air "artiste" that seems to be of the liberal set? Too late, guys. You already jumped into tackiness and disrespect a long time ago. When does the t-shirt shop open? Maybe sell little plastic airplanes too, and copies of the movie?

County officials are focusing on both zoning and traffic issues along an 18-mile corridor from the county seat of Somerset to Shanksville, hoping to build up the area while also preserving the dignity of the approach to the memorial.

They want to be able to direct people to other attractions in the region — like the Great Allegheny Passage, a bike trail along an abandoned railroad corridor — but keep gift shops off the main route.

...

[Viking]

Eh *raises hand*. I was never good at math and such, but isn't 2,200 acres a SHITLOAD of land? How much is that really? How big would the sides be on a square that's 2,200 acres big?

[Manedwolf]

Eh *raises hand*. I was never good at math and such, but isn't 2,200 acres a SHITLOAD of land? How much is that really? How big would the sides be on a square that's 2,200 acres big?

Huge. This is what's there now.

I think that's perfect. Leave it like that.

This is what they plan to build.




A big, clunky concrete...thing that looks like someone left a Cold War installation there.

[Viking]

 
That is the ugliest thing I've seen in a loooong time.
 Someone needs to be hit, repeatedly with the clue-stick bat crowbar...

[robear]

Eh *raises hand*. I was never good at math and such, but isn't 2,200 acres a SHITLOAD of land? How much is that really? How big would the sides be on a square that's 2,200 acres big?

Rough number:  2,200 acres would form a square with each side measuring approximately 1.85 miles.

[Viking]

Thanks, robear. Well gee, I can think of classier ways to honour the dead. Ways that doesn't cost (initially) $58 million...want to bet the cost of this will skyrocket before anyone can say "huh?"?

Also, I found this, for your enjoyment (thank you, Wikipedia). The architect, obviously schooled in East Germany back in it's heydays, who designed this abominable monument. http://www.paulmurdocharchitects.com/projects/flt93.htm

[Firethorn]

And I'm willing to bet the actual numbers of visitors would be in the single digit thousands per year, perhaps even hundreds - basically, just the families of those killed on the plane.

To put it in perspective, Yellowstone gets somewhere around 3 million a year.

I mean, if I was to go visit a 9/11 memorial, the one to the people who fought back would be the one I'd visit.

Still, the Twin Towers can be experienced while touring the Big Apple otherwise.  The Pentagon(whatever they're doing there), while hitting all the other DC sites.

Compared to DC and NYC, the flight 93 memorial would be out in the middle of nowhere.

Finally.  I wanna know WHO'S PAYING FOR ALL THAT CONCRETE!!!

I'd go for a marble tomb around the size of the unknown soldier exhibit.  Be nice and put a maintainable/replaceable weather building over it.  The proposed installation is...  Tacky.

[Viking]

And I'm willing to bet the actual numbers of visitors would be in the single digit thousands per year, perhaps even hundreds - basically, just the families of those killed on the plane.

To put it in perspective, Yellowstone gets somewhere around 3 million a year.

I mean, if I was to go visit a 9/11 memorial, the one to the people who fought back would be the one I'd visit.

Still, the Twin Towers can be experienced while touring the Big Apple otherwise.  The Pentagon(whatever they're doing there), while hitting all the other DC sites.

Compared to DC and NYC, the flight 93 memorial would be out in the middle of nowhere.

Finally.  I wanna know WHO'S PAYING FOR ALL THAT CONCRETE!!!

I'd go for a marble tomb around the size of the unknown soldier exhibit.  Be nice and put a maintainable/replaceable weather building over it.  The proposed installation is...  Tacky.

My guess is...You! Don't you feel just GLORIOUS, being able to help paying for bringing the absolutely worst of Com-Bloc architecture to the US?

[Manedwolf]

Thanks, robear. Well gee, I can think of classier ways to honour the dead. Ways that doesn't cost (initially) $58 million...want to bet the cost of this will skyrocket before anyone can say "huh?"?

Also, I found this, for your enjoyment (thank you, Wikipedia). The architect, obviously schooled in East Germany back in it's heydays, who designed this abominable monument. http://www.paulmurdocharchitects.com/projects/flt93.htm

I hate neo-brutalist "monuments" that make people feel like ants walking around near a curb. The sleek black Wall is how you do a wall memorial. Elegantly. And in general, I much prefer evocative bronze statues that show elevating emotions such as fighting spirit. The Iwo Jima flag statue is one.

[Viking]

I hate neo-brutalist "monuments" that make people feel like ants walking around near a curb. The sleek black Wall is how you do a wall memorial. Elegantly. And in general, I much prefer evocative bronze statues that show elevating emotions such as fighting spirit. The Imo Jima flag statue is one.

Totally agree.
Know what else this reminds me of? 1984. Big Brother would be very pleased.

[KD5NRH]

Is it just me, or does that look way too much like the Hopey-Changey logo?

[Manedwolf]

This is the only "modern art" memorial I've ever liked, and you don't understand what it's saying till you walk up to it, and then it's appropriate. It's the Challenger memorial in Miami.



It's only when you walk up to it that you get it.



Like cathedrals, it makes you look up, following it to where that last angled point vanishes to infinity against the sky. And that, to me, is nicely done.

[Bogie]

I like that...
 
IMHO, someone needs to open a good BBQ stand in Shanksville...

[Sawdust]

The design is ugly, and 2200 acres is way too much.

But, by far the most disturbing thing is the suggestion that private land should be seized from the legal owner for the memorial site. 

Sawdust

[BlueStarLizzard]

i don't get why they can't just leave the thingy they already have. it seems nicer. besides all they need is a tiny chunk of land were it happened and access, which i bet the owner would volenteer on his own. but 2,200 acres is way too much. especially considering that they maybe need 2 or 3.

and i don't get the design from above. it doesn't fit the landscape and its ugly. 

[Tallpine]

I think a good memorial "sculpture" would be the rear half and tail of a 757 fuselage mounted vertically

Shouldn't take more than a couple acres including parking.

[MillCreek]

That Challenger memorial is interesting.  From just looking at the posted picture, I thought that was supposed to be a DNA helix.

[Hawkmoon]

2,200 acres? How many acres did the plane actually crash into, one? Maybe two or three if you take into account parts that separated from the main wreckage?

And they need 2,200 acres and $58 million dollars to build a "memorial" to it -- on land they want to steal from a private owner? And the county wants to use the memorial to jump-start the entire region. Isn't that delightfully respectful of the dead!

[Expletive deleted] that.

[HankB]

What a grotesque conglomeration of concrete that "memorial" is . . . it looks like it came from the same people who designed those all-concrete housing blocks and Kim Il Sung tributes you see in pictures from North Korea. Blech!

. . . Finally.  I wanna know WHO'S PAYING FOR ALL THAT CONCRETE!!!

Firethorn, that's the wrong question; the RIGHT question is, "Who is GETTING PAID for all that concrete?"

If one adheres to the old proverb or maxim "Always Follow The Money" I'll wager you'll find some bureaucrat or politician's extended family is heavy into construction in that area . . . if I had the resources, I'd start looking at the likely bidders and their relationships to the local Congressional delegation and - though it's probably not nice to put it this way - the relationship of local construction firms, landscapers, architects, etc., to the most vocal supporters of this unconscionable "taking" of private land, even if they're the next-of-kin of Flight 93's victims . . .

[RocketMan]

Is it just me, or does that look way too much like the Hopey-Changey logo?

Hopey-Changey logo.  I like that description.  It's appropriate somehow.    

In addition to the Hopey-Changey logo, it reminds me of that crop circle nonsense.

[Zardozimo Oprah Bannedalas]

I would suggest a memorial of this kind:

No gift shops needed. No towers, wind chimes, or reflecting pools needed.

[cassandra and sara's daddy]

don't just follow the cash  look for land transactions  involving connected folks and their families.  lots of money to be made

[Boomhauer]

Holy *expletive deleted*it, that's twice as big as the NPS site I work for! And we're big enough at slightly over 1,000 acres!


(Not to mention the NPS is corrupt as all get out...)

[roo_ster]

I despise almost all modern memorials.

The best memorial for them is a row of jihadi heads on pikes running to the vanishing point.

[Viking]

What a grotesque conglomeration of concrete that "memorial" is . . . it looks like it came from the same people who designed those all-concrete housing blocks and Kim Il Sung tributes you see in pictures from North Korea. Blech!
Firethorn, that's the wrong question; the RIGHT question is, "Who is GETTING PAID for all that concrete?"

If one adheres to the old proverb or maxim "Always Follow The Money" I'll wager you'll find some bureaucrat or politician's extended family is heavy into construction in that area . . . if I had the resources, I'd start looking at the likely bidders and their relationships to the local Congressional delegation and - though it's probably not nice to put it this way - the relationship of local construction firms, landscapers, architects, etc., to the most vocal supporters of this unconscionable "taking" of private land, even if they're the next-of-kin of Flight 93's victims . . .

The architect is easy - they took the most untalented clown they could find to design it. Isn't that fun, really, how suddenly *expletive deleted*it turns to gold in the eyes of some people only because the blueprints has a famous name attached to it? If I had submitted that design, it would've been transferred to the round archive immedietly (as is appropriate though). Now OTOH, people cheer and lick the asses of untalented clowns who suggest Com-Bloc styled architecture...