Obama closes Gitmo and officially bans torture by Executive Order

[lone_gunman]

I am somewhat surprised that he has acted that boldly and swiftly. Overall, I think we are better off with both of these, but of course, most here will disagree.  Its a shame that we spent $500 million building a prison facility there, only to have it closed down a few years later.

[Manedwolf]

I am somewhat surprised that he has acted that boldly and swiftly. Overall, I think we are better off with both of these, but of course, most here will disagree.

Yes, we were better off with Gitmo and enhanced interrogation in necessary cases with known terrorists.

Maybe some of the terrorists could be resettled near you?

[lone_gunman]

Maybe some of the terrorists could be resettled near you?

They will either be kept in prisons here in the US, or in other countries, and some will likely be set free.  But I certainly would not mind them being housed in a federal prison near me.  I doubt they would last long in the general population.

These people should be either released (if they are not a threat) or executed.  There is  no reason to feed and water them for the next 50 years at Gitmo.

Yes, we were better off with Gitmo and enhanced interrogation in necessary cases with known terrorists.

Certainly you don't think the people at Gitmo still have more information to share?  Most of them have been there so long now that any information they have is outdated and useless. Al qaeda has moved on without them.

I favor executing the ones that are dangerous, and letting the rest go.  If some are brought here, that is still preferable to Gitmo, which has become a point of embarassment for the US.

[Manedwolf]

Family members of people killed on September 11, 2001, and in other terror attacks say they are outraged by President Obama's draft order calling for the suspension of war crimes trials of prisoners being held at Guantanamo Bay.

"To me it's beyond comprehension that they would take the side of the terrorists," said Peter Gadiel, whose son, James, was killed at the World Trade Center on 9/11. "Many of these people have been released and been right back killing, right back at their terrorist work again."

Obama's request on the first full day of his presidency came as a draft order was being prepared ordering the closing of the Guantanamo prison within a year. A judge responded by halting the case against a Canadian detainee accused of killing an American soldier in Afghanistan, issuing a 120-day continuance in the case.

Click here for photos.

"I see no reason why we should delay these proceedings. Let justice be served," said Jefferson Crowther, whose 24-year-old son, Welles, was killed in the Twin Towers after he saved the lives of several others.

Critics blasted Obama's decision, which they said would delay justice in cases that have already been waiting for the better part of a decade.

"There is no need to suspend [the military tribunals]. There is no reason why [Obama] can't conduct a concurrent review at the same time that the military commission process is moving forward to render justice for the terrorists that have murdered thousands of people," said former Cmdr. Kirk Lippold, who lost 17 sailors during a suicide bombing attack on the USS Cole in 2000. A suspect in the case is being held at Guantanamo.

"It demeans their deaths because we seem to be more concerned with the rights of detainees than we are with the justice that is being denied to my sailors that were killed," Lippold told FOXNews.com.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/01/21/families-outraged-obama-suspend-guantanamo-war-crimes-trials/

I see this as the first policy, the first day, the first priority of the Obama administration not being our economy, our problems...but appeasement of our enemies.

So be it. That's what he chose for his first stroke of the pen, that's what history will show. The recording is running.

[makattak]

Meh.

"Alright guys, I need a big symbolic act that will appease the people who got me the nomination.

But we need to make sure it won't come back to bite me, so we'll close it after a year so we have time to figure out where to put these guys.

Also, wasn't waterboarding already banned? Perfect. I can look compassionate but not actually do anything new."

Woohoo. Change.


Edit: Also, post 357. Very nice.

[lone_gunman]

I don't see much appeasement of our enemies.  Most are just going to be moved to a different prison.

[MicroBalrog]

Yes, we were better off with Gitmo and enhanced interrogation in necessary cases with known terrorists.

Maybe some of the terrorists could be resettled near you?

Known? They were already convicted?

[makattak]

Known? They were already convicted?

In this one I have to disagree with you.

We cannot subject enemy combatants to our court system.

If we catch them on the battlefield, that's enough for me. (I am aware some of these were given to us by countries that are, to put it lightly, less than trustworthy.)

We cannot allow information vital to national security to be given to individuals with a high likelihood of giving it to the enemy.

Thus, we should use courts where classified information can be kept that way. Kind of like these military tribunals that Obama has just suspended.

[MicroBalrog]

If we catch them on the battlefield, that's enough for me. (I am aware some of these were given to us by countries that are, to put it lightly, less than trustworthy.)

A lot of these people are NOT captured on battlefields. They need to be tried.

[ronnyreagan]

Maybe some of the terrorists could be resettled near you?

John Murtha will take them.

They need to be tried.

Exactly. They need to be tried fairly and as quickly as possible. Ignoring the torture issues, the problem with Gitmo is that they got all these people and then spent years trying to figuring out what they even are accused of. If these people are indeed "the worst of the worst" then there should be something to try them on. If not they need to be released - I don't see what's so unreasonable about that.

[wquay]

I agree with the President on this one. Way to deliver on a promise, Obama.

[buzz_knox]

They never should have been in Gitmo.  They should have been turned over to the gov'ts of the nations in which they were taken, treated in accordance with the SOPs of said country, with the resulting intel coming back to us.  A few would have escaped/been released to go back to terrorism, a few would have gotten out, and the majority would never have been seen again.   

Basically, just return to the Clinton way of doing things.

[taurusowner]

He hasn't delivered anything at all.  So far he's shown he's a politician who can sign his name on some paper as well as any other politician.  Let's see how reality pans out.  I'm gonna wait to see if gitmo actually closes. 

As for the prisoners, release them back to their home countries and let it be known that they helped the Americans big time.  The problem solves itself.


If we were going back to the Clinton way of doing things, BHO should have waited til he was caught having an affair, then bluster about closing Gitmo for a few weeks as a distraction.  And then not actually do it.

[Josh Aston]

They never should have been in Gitmo.  They should have been turned over to the gov'ts of the nations in which they were taken, treated in accordance with the SOPs of said country, with the resulting intel coming back to us.  A few would have escaped/been released to go back to terrorism, a few would have gotten out, and the majority would never have been seen again.   

Basically, just return to the Clinton way of doing things.

Right, and I'm going to trust intel received from Saudi or Iraq.

[buzz_knox]

Right, and I'm going to trust intel received from Saudi or Iraq.

My point was to remind people who suffer from Bush Derangement Syndrome what went on before Gitmo was dreamed of, back in the day when our hands were "clean" and the interrogations were lethal.

[HankB]

As for the prisoners, release them back to their home countries and let it be known that they helped the Americans big time.  The problem solves itself.

Problem solved - they're gone from Gitmo, and back where we caught them!

I'm sure the other clansmen will welcome home men who helped Uncle Sam. 

[buzz_knox]

We need to make sure that they go home on American transports at times that are classified but, unfortunately, leaked.  Thus, their compatriots can see them "sneaking" back in along with their payment (goats, whatever) and being thanked by the infidels.

[Nitrogen]

Yes, we were better off with Gitmo and enhanced interrogation in necessary cases with known terrorists.

Maybe some of the terrorists could be resettled near you?

I'm not scared of terrorists.

[Manedwolf]

I'm not scared of terrorists.

Really. Hardened killers from some ickystan.

Well, then I suppose you'd not mind if they had at your family?

[Josh Aston]

We need to make sure that they go home on American transports at times that are classified but, unfortunately, leaked.  Thus, their compatriots can see them "sneaking" back in along with their payment (goats, whatever) and being thanked by the infidels.

So they can shoot down American planes with American aircews?  No thanks.  I say we surgically implant explosives and gps trackers in them and release them.  When they get back to their little terrorist cell, we detonate the explosives. 

[Waitone]

The new president's first tasks will be to throw bones to pressure groups that got him elected.  Gitmo is just another example.  Carter took a principled stand against so-called intelligence abuses outlawing a number of practices.  He thought he eliminated the practice.  In reality he merely drove it further underground effectively reducing whatever oversight there was.  Rendition is a creation of Clinton, not Bush.  Bush applied and refined the practice.  The new president looks like he is going back to the future.  If he completely bans rendition and closes places like Gitmo he will merely drive the practices from the public.

The man is a master politican.  Never forget it!

[Nick1911]

Like the CIA doesn't do worse things on a regular basis for intel?

This is called "Throwing a bone."

[jamz]

Good.  I'm glad Gitmo is closed.  I hope fewer people are held without cause.  Yes, I realize it is less "safe".

[lupinus]

The fatal flaw has always been that people expect military prisoners to be treated with civilian rights and privileges.  If they are caught in the middle of a battlefield with a gun, or on a raid with sufficient evidence to convince the military they were a combatant, they need to be held.  When the war is over, they get released.  How many Germans did we release in the middle of WW2 again?  How many had trials?  The really bad guys had trials afterwards, the average foot soldier was allowed home after the war was over.

It's a battlefield.  Not the place evidence is corrected or people are read their rights.

[lone_gunman]

When the war is over, they get released.

Having prisoners you don't know what to do with is an unintended consequence of a never-ending undelared war. 

Are you saying we should hold them til the War on Terror is over?  I don't think it will ever end, and holding someone in captivity for the next 50 years is expensive and less humane than simply executing them now.